Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 12:56:09 -0500
From: Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Honda to Stop Making Insights
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That's not a media hysterics thing. Airbags going off on a child seat
are pretty dangerous, even fatal. There have even been cases of truly
gruesome child fatalities in accidents which were not particularly
serious collisions to begin with.
It's safe for millions of miles as long as you don't have an airbag
deployment. Then things get bad in a millisecond.
Danny
damon henry wrote:
> Ahhh what lawyers and sensationalized news stories have done to us...
> I still fondly remember laying down on the shelf behind the back seat
> (in the window) of my parents old Pontiac as a youngster. The only
> way to ride...
>
> Now people are scared to put a child in a child seat in the passenger
> side of a Honda Insight because there is an air bag there.
>
> I heard a child once choked to death on a piece of food, perhaps I
> should stop feeding my children :-)
>
> BTW - there is even a hook for the new fangled child seats with
> tethers built into the Insight, so it was designed with the idea that
> a child seat could be used, but of course the lawyers force Honda to
> put the big yellow warning on the visor advising against using a child
> seat.
>
> All 4 of my kids have logged plenty of miles in my Honda Insight and I
> haven't lost one yet. Of course that may change soon as my oldest is
> 15 going on 16 and will be driving solo starting next April. Talk
> about scary.
>
> damon
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 14:07:10 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: RE: Trojan T-1275 VS T-875 Batteries
From: "Tim Humphrey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
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How about the US EV-145. Kinda big, might not work for you.
http://www.usbattery.com/pages/12vsweeper.htm
--
Stay Charged!
Hump
"Ignorance is treatable, with a good prognosis. However, if left
untreated, it develops into Arrogance, which is often
fatal. :-)" -- Lee Hart
Get your own FREE evgrin.com email address;
send a request to ryan at evsourcecom
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Mike Chancey
> Sent: Thursday, June 08, 2006 1:48 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: RE: Trojan T-1275 VS T-875 Batteries
>
> Jonathan Smith wrote:
>><SNIP>
>>
>>Not to say it isn't so, I just have not heard of a T-1275 8V. Sounds
>>more like a model number for a Douglas.
>
> The T-1275 is a 12 Volt battery. It appears to basically be a modified
> version of the J150.
>
>
>>If cost is an issue, the US Battery 8V is cost competitive.
>
> This issue isn't so much cost as fitting them in the car. Despite
> the larger size it might be easier to fit 13 T-1275s than 18
> T-875s. Also, the T-1275's or J150s would allow me to keep my 156
> Volt nominal system, though everything is adaptable enough to drop to
> 144, though the Zivan would have to be reprogrammed either way.
>
> I know some folks have done small front drive conversions like my
> Civic and retained the back seat and installed 18 8 Volters, but I
> don't think that is a good way to get a car that corners well and
> stops safely. I removed the rear seat and built a CRX like deck to
> hide the batteries which are sunk though the floor in a well where
> the gas tank originally was. Even with original 1144 pound pack of
> Delphi AGMs in it it still handled extremely well. 13 T-1275s would
> be 1066 pounds, 13 J150s would be 1092 pounds, and 18 T-875s would be
> 1134 pounds. All of these would apparently do well, but because they
> cannot be mounted on end like the current Dynasty AGMs, some will
> have to go behind the rear axle.
>
> The goal of all this is getting at least 35-45 mile range and to
> switch to a more forgiving battery type so I can get some real
> service life, without turning the car into a pig. AGMs are fun, but
> frankly I don't seem to have good luck with them. I want something
> more forgiving, even if it does increase the maintenance. Watering
> the batteries every couple of months or so is an acceptable
> burden. If I get real picky I guess I could add one of the automated
> watering systems.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Mike Chancey,
> '88 Civic EV
> Kansas City, Missouri
> EV Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
> My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
> Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
> Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
>
> In medio stat virtus - Virtue is in the moderate, not the extreme
> position. (Horace)
>
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 14:15:43 EDT
Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News!!!!!!
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
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In a message dated 6/8/06 10:51:21 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: Current Eliminator News!!!!!!
Date: 6/8/06 10:51:21 AM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Can you give the website where the points are posted? I google searched
but
didn't find it...
I work at a TV station. Thought I would see if they would do a story.
Ken >>
Hi Ken,You can find my points standing at http://speedworldmotorplex.comand
then look at Team Speedworld current standings. Thanks Dennis
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 18:19:25 -0000
From: "Mike Phillips" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Edward Ang" <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Nimh meltdown
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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>
> 1) You can't recharge Nimh with a CV curve.
In a Prius they are not following any curve at all. They charge and
discharge at any rate needed to stay between 40-80% soc. It is
documented that the Prius can put well over 120 amps back into the
pack on demand. As Lee has mentioned, the peak voltage for Nimh is
very shallow and hard to detect. Even harder with parallel packs. I am
not trying to peak detect these packs. I have monitored this curve for
countless hours. I set the charger to run below the peak of this curve
to keep the packs at something like 90% charged, similar to the Prius.
>
> 2) You can't expect parallel packs to share charging or discharging
current equally.
I individually monitored their charging current. It was very close to
the same going into each pack. Each pack was equalized a couple times
just for good measure. The entire array was very close in soc when it
nuked.
>
> 3) These are made worse when you have packs of different ages.
Only if the impedance was different in each pack. During charging it
appeared very that each pack had very similar impedance based on the
individual charging amps going in and the temperature response.
>
> 4) You are not actively tracking the status of each pack.
Each pack has thermal sense ciruitry on it, to adjust the fan flow as
needed. I just had shut it off. I do monitor the current into each
pack during charging.
>
> 5) Your charger does not have a temperature safety shut off.
Correct. But it will shortly. I left extra room on each thermal sense
board for just such a requirement. I have the circuit breadboarded now.
>
> 6) Your charger does not have a timeout safety shut off.
It does, but it's still set for the old lead acid pack. So it needs to
be reset. Since the charger is poorly documented at best, it will take
me a bit to find the constant that needs to be changed.
The whole point of this exercise is to see if these batts can provide
long cycle life in an EV. Bonehead moves aside. Since there are relays
connecting each pack to the array it's a simple matter to disconnect a
pack to charge or recharge it separately.
Mike
>
>
>
> On 6/6/06, Mike Phillips <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Sunday morning I had 3 of the 5 nimh packs totally go up in smoke, two
> > with unknown damage.
> >
> > It's a very complicated process using nimh AND paralleling them. But I
> > need facts so I'm giving it a try.
> >
> > For some reason after many successful charge/discharge cycles the nimh
> > array decided not to reach it's normal final charge voltage overnight.
> > So the charger kept putting in a couple amps and the array just got
> > hotter and hotter until 114 of the 190 modules cracked open and spewed
> > gasious KoH all over the place. The built in vent system failed 100%.
> > Instead the temperature measuring well split open.
> >
> > So I am adding a protection circuit to pull a pack out of the loop if
> > it gets too hot. That means each pack will have a thermal fan circuit,
> > a thermal relay circuit and a current monitoring circuit.
> >
> > I didn't charge the array to it's max voltage. I didn't want to mess
> > with shooting for absolute peak voltage. So I settled on 323v. The
> > peaking of 5 nimh packs has the potential disadvantage of not having
> > them all peak at the same time. From my testing 323vdc is just at the
> > very long, actual peak, not past it. Peaking the pack before 323 just
> > resulted in far less charging and an easy peak to shut off the charger
> > with, far too soon.
> >
> > After every few charge discharge cycles I would separate the packs via
> > the relays and charge each one individually. This insured that
they had
> > the same final voltage in them. After doing this once, they stayed
very
> > close on consequent charge/discharge cycles.
> >
> > I was up to 90+ miles worth of testing. Range was 19.7 miles max. I
> > hope the 5 replacements are in as good of condition.
> >
> > All in the name of research.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Here's to the crazy ones.
> > The misfits.
> > The rebels.
> > The troublemakers.
> > The round pegs in the square holes.
> > The ones who see things differently
> > The ones that change the world!!
> >
> > www.RotorDesign.com
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Edward Ang
> AirLab
>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 11:24:12 -0700
From: "Stefan T. Peters" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Electric/EV basic knowledge
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Steve Condie wrote:
> I thought Lee Hart **was** Electricity for Dummies! If you can't
understand it after he explains it, you really ought to pack it in...
>
> Speaking of which - I think the reason Lee didn't get any takers on
his $10 reg offer is that the Hart Z-reg is the perfect "beginner's project
kit" for EV newbies. I know I treated it that way, and it was a great
introduction. Find the parts, solder this, epoxy that, learn to understand
the (very basic) circuit and why it does what it does. You get to build
something from scratch which will actually improve the performance of your
EV, learn some basic electronics, scope out sources for things like lugs and
zeners, and most importantly, you get to let a (tiny) amount of smoke out
when you hook one up backwards! It's a basic beginner's A to Z of the
Hombrewed EV experience - and all at a nominal cost.
>
$8 + S&H bag-of-parts and simple instruction booklet kit, perhaps?
~ Peanut Gallery ~
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 13:23:31 -0500
From: "Mike Ellis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: City Range (Was Conversion on eBay)
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At 15MPH you can get a long way :) But seriously, how much range are
people getting for city driving from their EVs? I always hear the
highway range quoted. What are people getting in the city?
-Mike
On 6/8/06, Michaela Merz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Claims to have a range of up to 150 Miles with 20 Trojans 125s. Now - I
> don't know if that would even be possible in theory (other then rolling
> down hill), but the buyer sure will be in for quite a suprise :( On the
> other hand: He is asking 23,000 with 'Reserve Not Met' - I doubt he/she
> will be able to sell the truck for that price anyway.
>
> Michaela
>
>
>
> > Is the seller on the list?
> >
> >
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4647644891
> >
> > A little rich for me, but I certainly like the paint scheme on that
> > expansion
> > box for battery space - a little galaxy sitting in the bed!
> >
>
>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 13:29:19 -0500
From: Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Pic stuff (was) LED Matrix (was) the Mark Brueggemann Meter
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I'm strict about code reuse efforts, but even I think the distinction
between ".pin1" and ".1" would be petty. As is using "HIGH" instead of
"1".
I noticed that there have been several followup emails now and they're
missing the real reuse/documentation issue. You don't WANT to state the
pin in the code in the first place. Just define it and say
"PIN_SDI=0;" "PIN_LED_GREEN=1;" etc.
That serves two purposes. One, it's strongly self-documenting. I do
not need to write comments that I am assigning the green LED pin a
value. This is inherently obvious. I cannot change what the line does
and forget to change the comment line either. It has guaranteed
accuracy. Lots of times you find you decided at some point that you
wanted the red LED to light instead and forgot to check that the comment
specifically said "GREEN" LED. Or you decided to change it everywhere
and did a blanket "Find... Replace" to make all reference to the green
LED's pin move to the red LED's pin. Well, the Find-Replace won't
adjust comments. Once you're not completely sure a comment is accurate
you end up hunting all over trying to verify all sorts of things anyways.
It is also often desirable to link macros to each other:
#define PIN_LED_GREEN LATA.1
#define PIN_LED_RED LATA.2
#define PIN_ALARM PIN_LED_GREEN
If you later decide red is a better color for the alarm, you need not
rewrite any of the code. Just change the #define.
Two, you can put all the stuff pertaining to what's hooked up where in
one place. Handy when you're trying to hand-wire or debug a board for
one. The documentation about pin assignments is all in one place and
more importantly there is no question that it is accurate. And if you
decide you need to move the LED to another pin, you can just change that
#define and the code will adapt. I have code I need to run on an old
and new board revision sometimes. So pin.h has
#ifdef VERSION_A
#define PIN_LED_RED LATA.1
....
#else
#define PIN_LED_GREEN LATD.2
#endif
So you can be completely flexible on pin use.
Danny
Roger Stockton wrote:
>The improved readability comes from the construct allowing one to
>manipulate each bit directly without the complication of masking off
>bits or performing logical operations to set/clear/test one bit at a
>time.
>
>Now that said, I would be of the opinion that "LatchA.pin1" does improve
>readability/understandability over "LatchA.1", since it does make it
>more explicit to the reader that the statement "LatchA.pin1 = HIGH;"
>sets pin 1 of port LatchA to the high state. This is the same reason
>why I expanded the original variable name from "LATA" to "LatchA".
>While there is not really any reason for assembly programmers to use
>short variable names, most seem to do so, while I insist on meaningful,
>descriptive variable and function names in the (primarily C) code I or
>the people working with me write.
>
>Cheers,
>
>Roger.
>
>
>
>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Peter Shabino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Honda to Stop Making Insights
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 13:38:58 -0500
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Don't most 2 seaters have a switch to turn off the airbag to use with a
carseat? I know my dads truck does.
Later,
Wire
>From: Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>Subject: Re: Honda to Stop Making Insights
>Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 12:56:09 -0500
>
>That's not a media hysterics thing. Airbags going off on a child seat
are
>pretty dangerous, even fatal. There have even been cases of truly
gruesome
>child fatalities in accidents which were not particularly serious
>collisions to begin with.
>
>It's safe for millions of miles as long as you don't have an airbag
>deployment. Then things get bad in a millisecond.
>
>Danny
>
>damon henry wrote:
>
>>Ahhh what lawyers and sensationalized news stories have done to us... I
>>still fondly remember laying down on the shelf behind the back seat (in
>>the window) of my parents old Pontiac as a youngster. The only way to
>>ride...
>>
>>Now people are scared to put a child in a child seat in the passenger
side
>>of a Honda Insight because there is an air bag there.
>>
>>I heard a child once choked to death on a piece of food, perhaps I
should
>>stop feeding my children :-)
>>
>>BTW - there is even a hook for the new fangled child seats with tethers
>>built into the Insight, so it was designed with the idea that a child
seat
>>could be used, but of course the lawyers force Honda to put the big
yellow
>>warning on the visor advising against using a child seat.
>>
>>All 4 of my kids have logged plenty of miles in my Honda Insight and I
>>haven't lost one yet. Of course that may change soon as my oldest is 15
>>going on 16 and will be driving solo starting next April. Talk about
>>scary.
>>
>>damon
>
>
Message-ID: <
[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 11:54:29 -0700 (GMT-07:00)
From: Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: RE: Pic stuff (was) LED Matrix (was) the Mark Brueggemann Meter
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-----Original Message-----
>From: Roger Stockton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Jun 8, 2006 10:52 AM
>To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>Subject: RE: Pic stuff (was) LED Matrix (was) the Mark Brueggemann Meter
>
>Dave wrote:
>
>>[Roger wrote:]
>>
>> >LatchA.pin1 = 1; //set pin 1 of latch A
>> >LatchA.pin3 = 0; //clear pin 1 of latch A
>> >
>> >This sort of construct can greatly improve readability,
>>
>> Roger, or is it Rodger :>},
>
>"Roger": it is actually the French version of the name ;^>
>
>> how does calling the bit pin1 to set
>> and pin3 to clear improe readability?
>
>I wasn't as clear as I should have been; it is the use of the entire
>construct "LatchA.pin1" that improves readability over something like
>"setBit(LatchA, BIT0)".
So, the c code should have been:
LatchA.pin1=0;
to clear the bit and the bit reference in the structure
doesn't change?
>
>The improved readability comes from the construct allowing one to
>manipulate each bit directly without the complication of masking off
>bits or performing logical operations to set/clear/test one bit at a
>time.
>
>Now that said, I would be of the opinion that "LatchA.pin1" does improve
>readability/understandability over "LatchA.1", since it does make it
>more explicit to the reader that the statement "LatchA.pin1 = HIGH;"
>sets pin 1 of port LatchA to the high state. This is the same reason
>why I expanded the original variable name from "LATA" to "LatchA".
>While there is not really any reason for assembly programmers to use
>short variable names, most seem to do so, while I insist on meaningful,
>descriptive variable and function names in the (primarily C) code I or
>the people working with me write.
>
>Cheers,
>
>Roger.
>
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From: Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News!!!!!!
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 12:54:03 -0600
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
On Jun 8, 2006, at 12:15 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Hi Ken,You can find my points standing at
> http://speedworldmotorplex.com and
> then look at Team Speedworld current standings.
A direct link: <http://speedworldmotorplex.com/results.htm>
Nice work, Dennis!
Is there some place on the Speedworld site where people can find out
that you're running an electric dragster?
> Thanks Dennis
>
>
--
Doug Weathers
Las Cruces, NM, USA
<http://learn-something.blogsite.org/>
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Subject: RE: Pic stuff (was) LED Matrix (was) the Mark Brueggemann Meter
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 12:16:29 -0700
Message-ID: <
[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
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Dave wrote:
> So, the c code should have been:
>
> LatchA.pin1=0;
>
> to clear the bit and the bit reference in the structure
> doesn't change?
Right, the expression "LatchA.pin1" always references the same bit in
register/port LatchA.
So:
LatchA.pin1 = 1; // sets the bit high
LatchA.pin1 = 0; // sets it low
if (LatchA.pin1 == 1) // tests if the bit is high
if (LatchA.pin1 == 0) // tests if the bit is low
Cheers,
Roger.
Message-ID: <
[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: RE: Honda to Stop Making Insights
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 12:16:14 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
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charset="iso-8859-1"
It is actually pretty simple to disconnect the Airbag squib from the
controller
to avoid the possiblity of deployment if the car has no switch.
Drawback is that the passenger loses its airbag, unless you wire
a switch in for the airbag.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Peter Shabino
Sent: Thursday, June 08, 2006 11:39 AM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Honda to Stop Making Insights
Don't most 2 seaters have a switch to turn off the airbag to use with a
carseat? I know my dads truck does.
Later,
Wire
>From: Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>Subject: Re: Honda to Stop Making Insights
>Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 12:56:09 -0500
>
>That's not a media hysterics thing. Airbags going off on a child seat
are
>pretty dangerous, even fatal. There have even been cases of truly
gruesome
>child fatalities in accidents which were not particularly serious
>collisions to begin with.
>
>It's safe for millions of miles as long as you don't have an airbag
>deployment. Then things get bad in a millisecond.
>
>Danny
>
>damon henry wrote:
>
>>Ahhh what lawyers and sensationalized news stories have done to us... I
>>still fondly remember laying down on the shelf behind the back seat (in
>>the window) of my parents old Pontiac as a youngster. The only way to
>>ride...
>>
>>Now people are scared to put a child in a child seat in the passenger
side
>>of a Honda Insight because there is an air bag there.
>>
>>I heard a child once choked to death on a piece of food, perhaps I
should
>>stop feeding my children :-)
>>
>>BTW - there is even a hook for the new fangled child seats with tethers
>>built into the Insight, so it was designed with the idea that a child
seat
>>could be used, but of course the lawyers force Honda to put the big
yellow
>>warning on the visor advising against using a child seat.
>>
>>All 4 of my kids have logged plenty of miles in my Honda Insight and I
>>haven't lost one yet. Of course that may change soon as my oldest is 15
>>going on 16 and will be driving solo starting next April. Talk about
>>scary.
>>
>>damon
>
>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 12:23:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ricky Suiter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Does any one have "Lic. Plate Envy
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
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I had it but got over it. I had originally wanted "NO GAS" for my Arizona
alternative fuel plate, but it was taken. I didn't realize for a while I
knew the person who had that plate. His name is Gene Cosmono, he's been
playing with electric for years, he's 80 some years old, a world war 2
veteran and purple heart, and has almost 120,000 miles (that's electric
miles, not total miles) on his VW pickup truck conversion..... he can have
that plate.
So instead I went for "ZEROGAS", they wouldn't let me use a space
between the two words, but everyone figures it out. I admittedly stole this
idea from a California Rav4EV driver who had the plate on his EV1 prior.
Funny thing is in Arizona you get something like a 95% discount on
registration for alternative fuel or $5 whichever is lower. By the formula
they have the registration for the Saturn with the alt fuel discount would
have been pennies because it's value is considered so low (if they only knew
what was under the hood). So in short my actual registration was $17 and
some change for two years! Then I turned around and got the custom plate for
two years at $25 a year, so it cost me over 3 times as much for that custom
plate as the actual registration. Our blue cloud alternative fuel plates
look cool though.
Later,
Ricky
02 Insight
92 Saturn SC2 EV 144 Volt
Glendale, AZ USA
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Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Advice for FIL: NEV, Hybrid, or...?
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 12:39:26 -0700
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Yup..Sure am.
If I can keep the posted price from dropping by %50 per day!!!
I am hoping to have a sample for review in days for $10K. That is
basically
plug and play.
It's my goal to make this as easy as Adding a Holley or a blower to a ICE
car.
Ummm Rich.. I rarely hassle anyone on Spelling But... this time I feel I
have to.
Manzanita Micro.... proper spelling...
Sheet metal Fabs in the PacNorthwest are kind Jammed with work right now.
I
am getting hit on the proto battery case and painfully hobbled on the PFC
charger with Amp meter modification.
Both are primary parts to the PiPrius Kit project.
I should have something on my Website.. Ryan has been doing that part for
now.
What all your PHEV potential customers should be asking is:
Large expensive battery.. Long recharge times...Or
Dirt cheap batteries.. and Really Fast recharge times??
Getting the most from your system... is going to take Cash...or a large AC
feed circuit.
I can solve the rapid recharge path.... one way or the other.
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich Long" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2006 3:24 PM
Subject: Re: Advice for FIL: NEV, Hybrid, or...?
> Stay tuned. Rich Rudman at Manzinito Micro is on the verge of coming up
> with a kit to convert your hybrid to a plug-in hybrid. Way cool and if
> my guess is right way cheaper than other current propositions.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Subject: RE: Pic stuff (was) LED Matrix (was) the Mark Brueggemann Meter
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 12:40:56 -0700
Message-ID: <
[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
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Danny Miller wrote:
> I'm strict about code reuse efforts, but even I think the distinction
> between ".pin1" and ".1" would be petty.
It really comes down to personal preference. ".1" is not portable to
other compilers and does not have any readability or clarity advantage
so I would avoid it in favour of the portable version.
> As is using "HIGH" instead of "1".
Nope, this one is important. "1" and "0" specify the state of the bit
in the register, but not necessarily the state of the output pin. Some
processors have registers where writing a "1" to an output bit sets the
output pin low.
> I noticed that there have been several followup emails now
> and they're missing the real reuse/documentation issue.
I didn't think the object of the thread was code reuse/documentation,
but rather whether learning assembly rather than C would be a
good/better investment of an EV hobbiest's time if they want to get into
using microcontrollers.
> You don't WANT to state the pin in the code in the first place.
> Just define it and say "PIN_SDI=0;" "PIN_LED_GREEN=1;" etc.
I agree. But, when you define the pin you will be using a cosntruct
such as:
#define PIN_SDI (LatchA.pin1)
in order to instruct the preprocessor to perform the text substitution
of "(LatchA.pin1)" every time it sees "PIN_SDI", before running the
compiler (I realise you know this, but I'm there may be others following
this thread who are less familiar with how these things work).
> It is also often desirable to link macros to each other:
> #define PIN_LED_GREEN LATA.1
> #define PIN_LED_RED LATA.2
> #define PIN_ALARM PIN_LED_GREEN
>
> If you later decide red is a better color for the alarm, you need not
> rewrite any of the code. Just change the #define.
Yes, this is the preferable approach.
I think we have gotten rather far from the original question and its
answer and doubt there are many on the list who are interested in this
level of coding practice details ;^>
Perhaps we should let this thread die out unless someone indicates that
there is still some question they'd like answered?
Cheers,
Roger.
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 12:41:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: RE: Need Advice -- Gel pack rejuvenation plan
From: "Michael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
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> This is one of those "timely" threads.
>
> I have recently opened some of those 26ah Hawkers I posted about a while
> back. The date codes on these batteries are from late 2001 to mid 2002.
> --
> Stay Charged! <<-- Finally after all these years, my sig means something
> to me.
> Hump
Isn't it amazing how much abuse/neglect that brand can take? I got my
batts (cheap) after they were pulled from the rack for excessive age. (If
I recall, they were over 2 years old.) I spent a few months abusing them,
then 4 years w/ them stuffed in the closet. Dusted them off last month...
tucked them in the lawnmower... and they came back to near-new service.
Then there are the Chinese batts they replaced. Never used, 2 years old,
and DOA w/ no warranty!
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 12:45:58 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Honda to Stop Making Insights
From: "Michael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
MIME-Version: 1.0
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That's understandable, considering what airbags can do to adults. Our
friend's airbag went off last year. It looked like she'd gone a round w/ a
professional fighter. (The Chevy horn cover nearly took her eye out.)
I wish my car allowed them to be shut off.
> That's not a media hysterics thing. Airbags going off on a child seat
> are pretty dangerous, even fatal. There have even been cases of truly
> gruesome child fatalities in accidents which were not particularly
> serious collisions to begin with.
>
> It's safe for millions of miles as long as you don't have an airbag
> deployment. Then things get bad in a millisecond.
>
> Danny
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 13:04:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mike Phillips <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Advice for FIL: NEV, Hybrid, or...?
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
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Rich's idea is awesome. It could help EV's as well for range extension.
Takes out the need for a genset.
Just kills me to see Rich giving a spelling lesson to someone else :)
Mike
--- Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yup..Sure am.
>
> If I can keep the posted price from dropping by %50 per day!!!
>
> I am hoping to have a sample for review in days for $10K. That is
> basically
> plug and play.
>
> It's my goal to make this as easy as Adding a Holley or a blower to a
> ICE
> car.
>
> Ummm Rich.. I rarely hassle anyone on Spelling But... this time I
> feel I
> have to.
>
> Manzanita Micro.... proper spelling...
>
> Sheet metal Fabs in the PacNorthwest are kind Jammed with work right
> now. I
> am getting hit on the proto battery case and painfully hobbled on the
> PFC
> charger with Amp meter modification.
> Both are primary parts to the PiPrius Kit project.
>
> I should have something on my Website.. Ryan has been doing that part
> for
> now.
>
> What all your PHEV potential customers should be asking is:
>
> Large expensive battery.. Long recharge times...Or
> Dirt cheap batteries.. and Really Fast recharge times??
>
> Getting the most from your system... is going to take Cash...or a
> large AC
> feed circuit.
> I can solve the rapid recharge path.... one way or the other.
>
> Rich Rudman
> Manzanita Micro.
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rich Long" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2006 3:24 PM
> Subject: Re: Advice for FIL: NEV, Hybrid, or...?
>
>
> > Stay tuned. Rich Rudman at Manzinito Micro is on the verge of
> coming up
> > with a kit to convert your hybrid to a plug-in hybrid. Way cool
> and if
> > my guess is right way cheaper than other current propositions.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Here's to the crazy ones.
The misfits.
The rebels.
The troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.
The ones who see things differently
The ones that change the world!!
www.RotorDesign.com
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Subject: RE: Trojan T-1275 VS T-875 Batteries
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 13:06:43 -0700
Message-ID: <
[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
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Jonathan Smith wrote:
> Instead of six 12V 30XHS, Global Electric Motorcars now puts
> nine Trojan T875 as OEM in their six passenger model (four
> seater with a flip seat added).
If true, that's the cheapskate option ;^> (I happen to know for a fact
that the chargers in the GEM cars do *not* include an algorithm for the
large flooded batteries ;^).
The "normal" pack is six 12V DEKA 8G31 gels and the "high capacity pack"
is 9 8V DEKA gels.
> Not to say it isn't so, I just have not heard of a T-1275 8V.
The T1275 is a Trojan 12V flooded battery, not an 8V. It appears to be
a J150 with low profile SAE posts for golf-car use. If you look, you
will find both on Trojan's website. I've got a couple of T1275 packs in
our lab; I know they exist, and I know that they really do deliver their
rated 70-75Ah at the C/1 rate.
Cheers,
Roger.
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Electric Auto Association mentioned in July's Popular
Mechanics
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 12:20:59 -0700
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Keep in mind this is a wish folks...
They don't have a Kit available.. and this kit most likely would not
include
batteries.
Really cheap kits... are still to be thought out.
My hardware cost is going cost me over the $5000 mark.
This is like trying to hit a moving target.
And keep in mind that the current cost for Lithium... just the batteries
is
over a Buck a watt hour.
The BMS for Lion support is going to add about $20 cents a watt hour...
The cost per Watt hour for quality PbLa AGMS is about 33 cents a watt
hour.
The current cost with cheap PbLa AGM batteries is about 20 cents a watt
hour
for just the batteries.
Given that a Prius in EV mode ,under 35 mph may attain 200 watt hours per
mile.. and 150 miles would need 30Kw of stored power...
A Lion pack to get 150 miles would cost over $30,000 or more than the cost
of the Prius in the first place. This is without a BMS to support it, A
interlock unit and a charger, and the CAN buss controller and cables and
time to document what needs to be done.
I am getting irritated that folks are Spewing cost of Kits around like
over
Deflated Seattle Housing prices.
What one wishes to sell a Kit for and what it actually gets delivered for
are going to be two totally different things..
It's also not clear what features most folks really need and want.
I am trying to kit parts up for as cheap as I dare and still keep the
lights
on.
Without a really sharp pencil.. I can only set Not to exceed costs.
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chip Gribben" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2006 9:20 PM
Subject: Electric Auto Association mentioned in July's Popular Mechanics
> The Electric Auto Association is mentioned in the July issue of
> Popular Mechanics.
>
> On page 26 of the article "150-mpg Lithium-Ion Hybrids"
>
> The last sentence of the article says, "The nonprofit group
> CalCars.org is working with the Electric Auto Association to develop
> a do-it-yourself kit for under $5000."
>
> That's pretty cool!
>
> Chip Gribben
> Electric Auto Association of Washington DC
> http://www.evadc.org
>
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 17:01:19 EDT
Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News!!!!!!
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
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In a message dated 6/8/06 12:09:36 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: Current Eliminator News!!!!!!
Date: 6/8/06 12:09:36 PM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Doug Weathers)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
On Jun 8, 2006, at 12:15 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Hi Ken,You can find my points standing at
> http://speedworldmotorplex.com and
> then look at Team Speedworld current standings.
A direct link: <http://speedworldmotorplex.com/results.htm>
Nice work, Dennis!
Is there some place on the Speedworld site where people can find out
that you're running an electric dragster?
> Thanks Dennis
>
>
--
Doug Weathers
Las Cruces, NM, USA
<http://learn-something.blogsite.org >>
No they seem to be keeping that fact pretty quiet,but maybe at the end of
the
year. Dennis
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 15:58:20 -0500
From: "Mike Ellis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Science Central article and video (see right hand side of page)
on MIT Ultacaps
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http://www.sciencentral.com/articles/view.php3?type=article&article_id=218392803
Nothing terribly new here, except for some good pics and the video.
Article mentions use for (PH)EVs.
-Mike
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 17:09:15 -0400
Message-Id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News!!!!!!
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Thanks Dennis!
Just what I was looking for. I submitted the info to the News Room. Long
shot but worth a try!
Ken
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 14:15:43 EDT
Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News!!!!!!
In a message dated 6/8/06 10:51:21 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: Current Eliminator News!!!!!!
Date: 6/8/06 10:51:21 AM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Can you give the website where the points are posted? I google searched
but
didn't find it...
I work at a TV station. Thought I would see if they would do a story.
Ken >>
Hi Ken,You can find my points standing at http://speedworldmotorplex.comand
then look at Team Speedworld current standings. Thanks Dennis
________________________________________________________________________
Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and
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From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 17:28:54 EDT
Subject: Re:ZOMBIE, JOHN,TIM and FT
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
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John I sure would like too see you race the Zombie with Team PIR.Alongwith
the $ and points earned towards the NHRA Summit championship you could end
up
at the finals in Pomona.Its live TV coverge against the ICE cars.There is
at
least 1 other EV qualified to run in div.7 finals in Bakersfield its
runing in
the non electronics class(pro class where the zombie would race).EVs
should
also be represented in the motorcycle class and high school class.What a
hoot it
would be to have EVs represent every NHRA bracket class in the ET Finals!
LIVE
Come on John stop playing in the test lanes,I hear Tim can really cut a
light,thats all it takes. REALLY RACE and make some BUCKS with that ZOMBIE
Dennis
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 10:52:54 -0400
From: "Jonathan Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: evlist <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Electric/EV basic knowledge
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You could get an EE and still not know what some of the people in this
forum
do.
I'd turn back, if I were you. Really! STOP reading now. This way lies
MADNESS.
Wayland, for example.
Seriously, there is lots of information on the Internet about EV basics.
The
EV Album's "So You Want to Build an Electric Car" and EVADC guide to doing
an electric conversion are basic and informative.
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 16:46:23 -0500
From: Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Electric/EV basic knowledge
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Steve Condie wrote:
> I think the reason Lee didn't get any takers on his $10 reg offer is
> that the Hart Z-reg is the perfect "beginner's project kit" for EV
> newbies. I know I treated it that way, and it was a great introduction.
And that's fine. I'm happy with anytihng that gets people off the
computer and into actually building something!
Stefan T. Peters wrote:
> $8 + S&H bag-of-parts and simple instruction booklet kit, perhaps?
That's even easier for me. The $10 I quoted is mostly labor.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 15:18:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: Steve Powers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: PHEV - speed?
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
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I am reading a lot about PHEVs, but everything I have read says the top
speed in all electric mode is 34 MPH. To me, that means there is no such
thing as all electric mode because the minute I leave my neighborhood I am
going 40 - 50 MPH.
Is anyone working on a way to increase the max speed in all electric
mode?
What I would like as a consumer (and EV proponent) is a car that can do
50 MPH with ICE like acceleration in all electric mode for 25 miles. After
25 miles, the car can go into a hybrid mode or all gas power mode. The
hybrid mode wouldn't make much sense because the battery would be depleted
at that point and cycling it at 80% DOD would drastically shorten its
life. So, pretty much what I am looking for is a car that runs in all
electric mode up to 50 MPH for 25 miles. More than 50 MPH, gas is OK
(better if it runs as a hybrid). More than 25 miles, gas (even all gas) is
OK.
The question becomes, is anyone working on getting the speed up. Just
FYI, I heard from a friend that he ran his (classic model) out of gas and it
ran 50 MPH in all electric mode. How did he get over 34 MPH? Is it
becauuse he was already running 50 MPH when it ran out. Someone recently
stated that the car can't safely even roll at more than 34 MPH without the
engine running under gas power. Very bad for anyone planning to tow with 4
wheels on the ground.
I guess the bottom line is that I am confused. Can someone clarify the
34 MPH issue?
I posted that idea of using a powered axle or even an electric pusher
trailer, but I didn't get any comments. Has anyone tried that? I would
seriously consider the electric pusher trailer on a hybrid as a quick fix to
ge an all electric car for the first 20 miles. That means that I would put
the hybrid in neutral and push it with a trailer. Comments? What do you
think?
Steve
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