Armies do commit atrocities. All armies. Even Canadian armies. Yes, even
those armies in countries without a free press. Because Israel is a democracy
with a relatively free press that these atrocities are made public. Other
countries in the mid east have similar stories to tell as do most armies in the
world.
So go ahead and show righteous indignation. It is only possible because of the
relatively open society that is Israel. Anyone for looking at what is going on
elsewhere in the mid east?
arthur
________________________________
From: Darryl or Natalia [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Fri 10/26/2007 6:11 PM
To: Cordell, Arthur: ECOM
Cc: futurework
Subject: Re: [Futurework] Universal soldier?
Arthur,
You are discouraging a discussion of the future of work in the military. Is it
less important than the future of the auto sector, agriculture, or any other
industry for that matter? That I find its near future to be grim has
substantial relevance to this site's mandate. That you feel emotionally charged
by my opinion should not preclude its relevance given that the military is the
primary focus of the US (and Israeli) economies and more increasingly their
cultural well-being. In case you've forgotten, the US is the most frequently
discussed economy on this site, and its economy and activities directly affect
Canada and the global markets.
This was no slam of Israel, Arthur. You're hyper-sensitive beyond the call of
loyalty. I was targeting chiefly US military and the elite who control them,
but you're saying I overstepped my boundaries regarding Israel for similar
behaviour/unspoken policies. The article was shocking to me, and reminded me of
Abu Graib stories very actively discussed on this site with most everyone's
participation, including your own, without any objections from you. Don't tell
me that your recent submission of crime activities and their related illegal
economies is anymore relevant to this site. If anything, both organizations are
swindling the people. The difference is that people are legally employed by the
military; most of the US treasury is being wasted upon it, and yet its
institution accomplishes little, but destroys so much. It's a huge sector that
you are saying is off-topic because I'm stating that as an employer, its future
is costly, bleak and without meaningful direction?
I realize that most men currently contributing to this site are WWII Vets, or
are still tied to the military. As a Vet, one would think that the future of
such a significant sector would be of concern. When we envision an ideal future
of work, are you suggesting that the military are to be exempt from criticism
or are to be off-topic altogether? I'm someone who would prefer a peace corps,
but let's not squash a valid discussion because you can't deal with my opinions
in this respect.
You can't say this is irrelevant. It's hugely relevant, just as war-related
industries are hugely relevant. The US military is stationed in 130 nations,
and is the largest nuke peddler on the planet. Since when does such economic
activity bear no relation to the future of work?
Natalia Kuzmyn
Cordell, Arthur: ECOM wrote:
This article has no place on FW. What does it have to do with the
future of work? If you wish to slam armies and the concept of war then go to
another site. If you want to slam Israel then, again, go to another site.
Arthur
________________________________
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Darryl
or Natalia
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 9:05 PM
To: futurework
Subject: [Futurework] Universal soldier?
What is the future of work in the military to be? Most now fail to see
a future force of peace keepers, since it's pretty obvious that controlling the
oil industry and acquiring oil for the US are the reasons for most budget
allocations. But where does that leave those who would otherwise have enlisted
for a career of defense training, when the actual reason for their services is
merely one of overcoming and overpowering?
Billions are spent on military technological improvements that result
in more destruction, deaths and displacement than conventional combat ever did.
An emphasis on killing, rather than actual defense, could account for the most
obvious failures.
In World Wars I and II, soldiers and citizens alike believed they were
defending our freedom. Far fewer came back from these wars so damaged
psychologically. For Viet Nam, Korea, the Gulf and Iraq wars there has been a
deployment of so-called freedom fighters with little to defend but the
psychotic egos of the ruling elite. Add to it that the instruments of
destruction are now much more sophisticated, and far more harmful to all life
forms. Today's soldiers are alarmingly more disassociated from the human
targets upon whom misery is inflicted because of this sophistication of
weaponry.
When an army recruits its troops, what checks are in place to prevent
Joe/Jill Psycho from joining the ranks of "defenders"? How many different
qualifying tests does he/she take? And once enlisted, what restraints are
ensuring that defense, rather than offense, be the primary motivator for
staying in the ranks? It's rather a silly question, isn't it, because civilians
aren't usually being protected in these current wars, as evidenced by the high
casualties, costly mercenary protection for officials only, and Iraq's billion
dollar "Green Zone", isolated from any civilian interaction.
My deduction, by the recent wars' outcomes and horror stories, is that
offense is the operative motivation in modern warfare. I realize the military
has some expenditures on personnel who generate beneficial human resources
studies and policies, but these outlays, retained primarily for the sake of
having public relations reps who can actually field questions, are utterly
dwarfed by egregious budgets directed at wiping out the so-called enemy at any
expense. With such a pervasive attitude, it's no wonder we have soldiers who
are either freshly enlisted or grow to be wholly dangerous.
An Israeli psychologist blames Israeli soldiers' immoral and criminal
behaviour on boredom and poor training. This is an insane explanation! She's an
apologist not only for incompetent army recruiters and top command, but for
sadistic individuals who must never be allowed to hide behind the stress of
boredom to justify relief at the expense of human life or injury of any type.
>From everything I've ever read about soldiers anywhere they're
stationed, there are always too many amongst them who believe in their right to
be brutal -- and most of them get away with it because of commanding officers'
implicit approval or fellow troops covering for them.
Israel boasts of having the most humane troops in the world in their
recruitment efforts. The article below certainly disputes that claim.
How many armies of any global significance are left that can define
their jobs as being ones which consist strictly of defense? The Pentagon's
budget, the US's most crippling, undergoes scant approval, checks or balances.
It reaps the largest share of the treasury, thereby establishing its department
(if we measure in terms of dollars) as the most revered, above health and
welfare, environment, education, etc. Yet the department does nothing
beneficially significant for anyone anywhere (excepting the elites' portfolios)
and generates more harm than could ever be imagined. One might well conclude
that waste by warring is what Americans most value, and that the future
expenditures of their nation are assuredly focused upon continued psychotic
activity, if not for the painful fact that the immoral self-serving ruling
elite actually have control of how the treasury is spent. Same goes for Israel.
The future of work, by reason of treasury allocations, is in killing or
overcoming, first and foremost. Yet there's no money in it but for the elite
and the mercenaries. So, national troops are either initially misled into
believing they are developing a career defending their nation, are being
recruited against their will, or are being selected specifically because they
possess criminal and immoral minds. You can't train that many troops to become
immoral, can you? But you can recruit those who are potentially volatile, such
as the many sickos and criminals recruited thus far, and then expose them to
stressors the individuals might never have anticipated -- such as boredom,
extreme heat, extreme vigilance, DU, abhorrence by civilians, and realization
of the fact that their lives mean nothing to those really in command. This is
the state of the military today. Its future is even more bleak, with projected
urban wars. Perhaps that's where it will itself be overcome and forever
disbanded.
Until voters recognize they are being chronically manipulated into
voting for yet another hawkish leader, the future of being a legal bully looks
just "Bully".
Natalia Kuzmyn
Israel shaken by troops' tales of brutality against Palestinians
A psychologist blames assaults on civilians in the 1990s on soldiers'
bad training, boredom and poor supervision
Conal Urquhart in Jerusalem
Sunday October 21, 2007
The Observer <http://www.observer.co.uk/>
A study by an Israeli psychologist into the violent behaviour of the
country's soldiers is provoking bitter controversy and has awakened urgent
questions about the way the army conducts itself in the Gaza Strip and West
Bank.
Nufar Yishai-Karin, a clinical psychologist at the Hebrew University in
Jerusalem, interviewed 21 Israeli soldiers and heard confessions of frequent
brutal assaults against Palestinians, aggravated by poor training and
discipline. In her recently published report, co-authored by Professor Yoel
Elizur, Yishai-Karin details a series of violent incidents, including the
beating of a four-year-old boy by an officer.
The report, although dealing with the experience of soldiers in the
1990s, has triggered an impassioned debate in Israel, where it was published in
an abbreviated form in the newspaper Haaretz last month. According to Yishai
Karin: 'At one point or another of their service, the majority of the
interviewees enjoyed violence. They enjoyed the violence because it broke the
routine and they liked the destruction and the chaos. They also enjoyed the
feeling of power in the violence and the sense of danger.'
In the words of one soldier: 'The truth? When there is chaos, I like
it. That's when I enjoy it. It's like a drug. If I don't go into Rafah, and if
there isn't some kind of riot once in some weeks, I go nuts.'
Another explained: 'The most important thing is that it removes the
burden of the law from you. You feel that you are the law. You are the law. You
are the one who decides... As though from the moment you leave the place that
is called Eretz Yisrael [the Land of Israel] and go through the Erez checkpoint
into the Gaza Strip, you are the law. You are God.'
The soldiers described dozens of incidents of extreme violence. One
recalled an incident when a Palestinian was shot for no reason and left on the
street. 'We were in a weapons carrier when this guy, around 25, passed by in
the street and, just like that, for no reason - he didn't throw a stone, did
nothing - bang, a bullet in the stomach, he shot him in the stomach and the guy
is dying on the pavement and we keep going, apathetic. No one gave him a second
look,' he said.
The soldiers developed a mentality in which they would use physical
violence to deter Palestinians from abusing them. One described beating women.
'With women I have no problem. With women, one threw a clog at me and I kicked
her here [pointing to the crotch], I broke everything there. She can't have
children. Next time she won't throw clogs at me. When one of them [a woman]
spat at me, I gave her the rifle butt in the face. She doesn't have what to
spit with any more.'
Yishai-Karin found that the soldiers were exposed to violence against
Palestinians from as early as their first weeks of basic training. On one
occasion, the soldiers were escorting some arrested Palestinians. The arrested
men were made to sit on the floor of the bus. They had been taken from their
beds and were barely clothed, even though the temperature was below zero. The
new recruits trampled on the Palestinians and then proceeded to beat them for
the whole of the journey. They opened the bus windows and poured water on the
arrested men.
The disclosure of the report in the Israeli media has occasioned a
remarkable response. In letters responding to the recollections, writers have
focused on both the present and past experience of Israeli soldiers to ask
troubling questions that have probed the legitimacy of the actions of the
Israeli Defence Forces.
The study and the reactions to it have marked a sharp change in the way
Israelis regard their period of military service - particularly in the occupied
territories - which has been reflected in the increasing levels of
conscientious objection and draft-dodging.
The debate has contrasted sharply with an Israeli army where new
recruits are taught that they are joining 'the most ethical army in the world'
- a refrain that is echoed throughout Israeli society. In its doctrine,
published on its website, the Israeli army emphasises human dignity. 'The
Israeli army and its soldiers are obligated to protect human dignity. Every
human being is of value regardless of his or her origin, religion, nationality,
gender, status or position.'
However, the Israeli army, like other armies, has found it difficult to
maintain these values beyond the classroom. The first intifada, which began in
1987, before the wave of suicide bombings, was markedly different to the
violence of the second intifada, and its main events were popular
demonstrations with stone-throwing.
Yishai-Karin, in an interview with Haaretz, described how her research
came out of her own experience as a soldier at an army base in Rafah in the
Gaza Strip. She interviewed 18 ordinary soldiers and three officers whom she
had served with in Gaza. The soldiers described how the violence was encouraged
by some commanders. One soldier recalled: 'After two months in Rafah, a [new]
commanding officer arrived... So we do a first patrol with him. It's 6am, Rafah
is under curfew, there isn't so much as a dog in the streets. Only a little boy
of four playing in the sand. He is building a castle in his yard. He [the
officer] suddenly starts running and we all run with him. He was from the
combat engineers.
'He grabbed the boy. I am a degenerate if I am not telling you the
truth. He broke his hand here at the wrist, broke his leg here. And started to
stomp on his stomach, three times, and left. We are all there, jaws dropping,
looking at him in shock...
'The next day I go out with him on another patrol, and the soldiers are
already starting to do the same thing."
Yishai-Karin concluded that the main reason for the soldiers' violence
was a lack of training. She found that the soldiers did not know what was
expected of them and therefore were free to develop their own way of behaviour.
The longer a unit was left in the field, the more violent it became. The
Israeli soldiers, she concluded, had a level of violence which is universal
across all nations and cultures. If they are allowed to operate in difficult
circumstances, such as in Gaza and the West Bank, without training and proper
supervision, the violence is bound to come out.
A spokeswoman for the Israeli army said that, if a soldier deviates
from the army's norms, they could be investigated by the military police or
face criminal investigation.
She said: 'It should be noted that since the events described in Nufar
Yishai-Karin's research the number of ethical violations by IDF soldiers
involving the Palestinian population has consistently dropped. This trend has
continued in the last few years.'
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