John,
there's hardly a single message of yours in which I fail so find
something inappropriate.
For example this:
John Smith wrote:
On 1 September 2010 21:21, Rob Myers <r...@robmyers.org> wrote:
"The devil is in the details."
CT+ODBL has a lot of fine print...
is just unsuitable for a "debate" (your word) between grown-ups. It is
100% rhetorics and 0% content. Reading statements like these is a waste
of time.
As for debate, your point has been made and understood:
* Your No. 1 priority for OSM is to keep the data you and some of your
fellow Australians have mapped and imported.
* In your particular case, while most of that data is compatible, or
could be made compatible, with ODbL, things are more difficult with
potential future license changes (CT clause 3)
Until here, you are probably not alone and your cause is understandable.
While others in the same situation might take a more progressive stance
and try to make things work, your conclusion has been:
* You are against CT clause 3 or, depending on the situation, against
the new license altogether (being under the impression that CC-BY-SA is
good enough in Australia).
Even this is, while probably not the best option for the project
overall, something you're not alone with. You've said it, your point has
been made, no need to repeat it 20 times a week.
But here things start to go wrong. You're screaming, you're kicking,
you're accusing everyone of sinister motives, secret plans, evilness of
all kind. You're crying foul, you're writing acid comments and getting
personal on almost any mailing list you have access to. You're the no. 1
poster on legal-talk by a large margin, and your messages haven't had
anything new in them for the last four weeks.
For all I know, you joined OSM when the license change process was
already well under way [1][2], so it really is a mystery to me how you
could completely overlook that when you did your tracing and importing.
My personal impression is that you have an XXL problem with admitting
mistakes. You cannot bear to admit to yourself, and to those who may
have congratulated you on your tracing and imports, that there is a
license problem now which was forseeable, but not foreseen by you, when
you did it. So you're looking for someone else to take the blame, and
that's essentially all we're seeing here. You cannot admit a mistake, so
the others must be doing things wrong.
I also have the impression that you have an XXL problem with
competition. You're trying to make a "win or lose" situation out of
something that wasn't one, and then (publicly, loudly) fight to "win".
This is a trait commonly found in 15 year old males of our species, and
it is really very unhelpful.
In addition, but this has already been said by others, your behaviour in
our online community is bullish and obnoxious, and if made aware of your
mistakes you're just trying to make this into a new battle in which to
stand ground before your friends rather than admitting it and making amends.
JohnSmith, you may have contributed a lot of data, but that data comes
at a very high price for our community, which is having to put up with
your arrogance and general disruptive behaviour.
So you condone the actions of people committing character
assassinations, muck rack, abuse of statistics to achieve set outcomes
and all the rest of it?
I'm sad that in addition to having to put up with your messages and your
endless scorn, I now have to read "80 m" and "Jane Smith" as well, and I
think they're rather childish. I don't condone these actions but someone
who throws as much shit at a community as you do should not be surprised
to see some of it flung back.
*Despite* paying attention I haven't seen anything that substantiates your
claim of "dirty tricks" on the part of the people you don't agree with.
I have no problem with debating the issues,
Neither have I, but I won't debate them with a paranoid individual like
you who is likely to take an argument, rip it out of context, and put it
a screaming subject line on talk with my name attached to it.
Unike you, I have debated all aspects of re-licensing with various
people for the last three years, and I'm willing to continue doing so,
provided it occurs in a civilised manner - one of which, sadly, you do
not seem to be capable. For you, this is not a debate but an ego contest.
I passionately disagree with 80n over relicensing but at least I have
the impression that he is fighting for a principle, and I respect that.
You, JohnSmith, are fighting for yourself, your data, and your applause
from your audience.
Bye
Frederik
--
Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09" E008°23'33"
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