Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
Dear Rawat, The exact reply for your query i think is - We are not so knowledged to analyse ARR's music. AR's music is divine and we cannot judge divine power. We dont have enough knowledge to judge his music. Thats the truth. Jai Ho Jagan --- In arrahmanfans@ yahoogroups. com, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line - sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed.. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard in any other song. May be he was trying a new voice but it didn't suit my ears. all the internal aalaaps also are confusing, making it a classical song. They are not even bringing a sense of a trance. And as I already said once that JA music was a personal music and didn't reflect the lavishness of the film. I think I can describe now what I meant by that personal vs lavishness. Listen to the music between 3:40 - 4:05. That Persian sort of. Now, that is what I call a royal music, that has lavishness, that has luxury, that is group music, public music. Also the instrument that stars playing at the backdrop at about 6:10 and continues till the end of song. that single instrument is giving a royal touch to the song. That type of music is what I expected to be everywhere in JA music and background, but no, we didn't get that. Our man had different ideas about music suitable for the emperor of India. Compare the above two sounds to the sound at 1:20-1:45. Now this 1:20 sound is what I call a personal sound, lacking royal touch. It is a commoner's, a poor man's
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
Jagan I am agreeing with ur opinion...but still would say that it's a open forum and people/fans will provide their opinion. Everybody can put their thoughts in this forum that might show their knowledge or illiteracy. Arijit 2009/3/21 jagan nath guy_from_asia2...@yahoo.com Dear Rawat, The exact reply for your query i think is - We are not so knowledged to analyse ARR's music. AR's music is divine and we cannot judge divine power. We dont have enough knowledge to judge his music. Thats the truth. Jai Ho Jagan --- In arrahmanfans@ yahoogroups. comhttp://in.mc949.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=arrahmanfans%40yahoogroups.com, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not).. I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line - sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard in any other song. May be he was trying a new voice but it didn't suit my ears. all the internal aalaaps also are confusing, making it a classical song. They are not even bringing a sense of a trance. And as I already said once that JA music was a personal music and didn't reflect the lavishness of the film. I think I can describe now what I meant by that personal vs lavishness. Listen to the music between 3:40 - 4:05. That Persian sort of. Now, that is what I call a royal music, that has lavishness, that has luxury, that is group music, public music. Also the instrument that stars playing at the backdrop at about 6:10 and continues till the end of song. that
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
give him some more time, he will be back.. its Rahman's music.. Jai ho!!! AR Rahman - His music for ears for years From: Pradeepan R pradeepanisonl...@gmail.com To: arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2009 7:29:35 AM Subject: Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders) Rawat, lets understand one simple thing first: Music and its taste is very highly subjective. Its not something that everyone can objectively define as to what is good or bad. can anyone measure likability of music like blood pressure !! I can't understand why you fail to recognise this fact, instead of using terms like 'blind-faith' !! On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 4:32 AM, V S Rawat vsra...@gmail. com wrote: As I said, when someone tend to like everything, it could be that his artist is really flawlessly consistently great, or it could be that we love the artist so much that we can't make ourselves see his rare drawbacks. I am not just giving a high handed judgment rendering khwaja poor. I have elaborated point by point what I find it lacking in. Yeah, in that mail I did declare Arziyan great without going point by point why i find it great. Some day I will analyze it. Thanks. -- Rawat On 3/13/2009 7:22 AM India Time, _Chord_ wrote: Wow, Rawat, tell us how you really feel. I pretty much disagree with you completely. I love Khwaja and Arziyan both the same. --- In arrahmanfans@ yahoogroups. com, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line - sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
Rawat, I respect your openion though i dont agree to them in any line.I think this is one of the best of ARR as a singer.Theres lot of feeling in his voice. *But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar.* ** ** your main allegation agains this song was for the lyrics. I think your hatred for the lyrics is because you thought its by Javed saab.But that was a criminal mistake.when you analise the lyrics you should have make sure who the lyricist is.A glance thorough the cd cover can give the answer,'if you do have it'.. Lyrics of this song was by KASHIF if I remember right.I am away from home so i am not able to check it now. Please buy original CDs before reviewing it. regards, hashir On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 5:14 PM, V S Rawat vsra...@gmail.com wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line - sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard in any other song. May be he was trying a new voice but it didn't suit my ears. all the internal aalaaps also are confusing, making it a classical song. They are not even bringing a sense of a trance. And as I already said once that JA music was a personal music and didn't reflect the lavishness of the film. I think I can describe now what I meant by that personal vs lavishness. Listen to the music between 3:40 - 4:05. That Persian sort of. Now, that is what I call a royal music, that has lavishness, that has luxury, that is group music, public
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
I would agree with rawat partially lyrics are substandard and so is arr's vocals ... he sounds very nasal On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:59 AM, Pradeepan R pradeepanisonl...@gmail.comwrote: Rawat, lets understand one simple thing first: Music and its taste is very highly subjective. Its not something that everyone can objectively define as to what is good or bad. can anyone measure likability of music like blood pressure !! I can't understand why you fail to recognise this fact, instead of using terms like 'blind-faith' !! On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 4:32 AM, V S Rawat vsra...@gmail.com wrote: As I said, when someone tend to like everything, it could be that his artist is really flawlessly consistently great, or it could be that we love the artist so much that we can't make ourselves see his rare drawbacks. I am not just giving a high handed judgment rendering khwaja poor. I have elaborated point by point what I find it lacking in. Yeah, in that mail I did declare Arziyan great without going point by point why i find it great. Some day I will analyze it. Thanks. -- Rawat On 3/13/2009 7:22 AM India Time, _Chord_ wrote: Wow, Rawat, tell us how you really feel. I pretty much disagree with you completely. I love Khwaja and Arziyan both the same. --- In arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com arrahmanfans%40yahoogroups.com, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line - sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard
Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
Dear Rawat, You have mentioned that 'Khwaja.. is monotonous'..I say It 'must' be monotonous because it is a kind of 'Individual' Devotion.. Each of us has different approach to Religion and Devotion including Rahman..He 's already said that He's sung it from his heart and is a tribute to 'Khwaja ji'..so We DO NOT have any right to challenge or comment on his 'way of devotion'!!! Religion and Spirituality is NOT always gathering 10-50 people and singing Bhajans or Qawaalis.. You have said that its kind of introvert song so you don;t have any right to comment like this:- Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments This is Rahman's pure 'Own' approach to song..You are contradicting your own starements thereby..anyway I agree with you that 'Arziyaan' has more Powerful mass appeal bcoz it is collective prayer. -jiban jai ho --- In arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com, Pradeepan R pradeepanisonl...@... wrote: Rawat, lets understand one simple thing first: Music and its taste is very highly subjective. Its not something that everyone can objectively define as to what is good or bad. can anyone measure likability of music like blood pressure !! I can't understand why you fail to recognise this fact, instead of using terms like 'blind-faith' !! On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 4:32 AM, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: As I said, when someone tend to like everything, it could be that his artist is really flawlessly consistently great, or it could be that we love the artist so much that we can't make ourselves see his rare drawbacks. I am not just giving a high handed judgment rendering khwaja poor. I have elaborated point by point what I find it lacking in. Yeah, in that mail I did declare Arziyan great without going point by point why i find it great. Some day I will analyze it. Thanks. -- Rawat On 3/13/2009 7:22 AM India Time, _Chord_ wrote: Wow, Rawat, tell us how you really feel. I pretty much disagree with you completely. I love Khwaja and Arziyan both the same. --- In arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com arrahmanfans%40yahoogroups.com, V S Rawat vsrawat@ wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
ya, u have listed points that u have found lacking in the song and it doesnt necessarily need to coincide with other perceptions, always. there r innumerous people who like this song and m one among those. okay, that doesnt mean that u have to like song because innumerous people like the song. i have seen people even pointing out dozens of -ve points against ARRs vande matharam and infact, ARRs humma humma and the worst of the best being some average opinion on Roja album (remember reading it years before in tamil magazine). but majority of the people, apart from ARR fans, know that they are brilliant in their own way. there cant be anything in the world that can be appreciated by everyone. there are always some minority of the people who dislike a fact that is largely appreciated and hailed over. unfortunately, in this case, u r one among that minority! its like when the whole world hails the SDM success, some people in bollywood still tend to hate the movie that speaks about hope and optimism. its sometimes better to ignore the minority.. that's what i've been understanding in recent times. On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 1:32 AM, V S Rawat vsra...@gmail.com wrote: As I said, when someone tend to like everything, it could be that his artist is really flawlessly consistently great, or it could be that we love the artist so much that we can't make ourselves see his rare drawbacks. I am not just giving a high handed judgment rendering khwaja poor. I have elaborated point by point what I find it lacking in. Yeah, in that mail I did declare Arziyan great without going point by point why i find it great. Some day I will analyze it. Thanks. -- Rawat On 3/13/2009 7:22 AM India Time, _Chord_ wrote: Wow, Rawat, tell us how you really feel. I pretty much disagree with you completely. I love Khwaja and Arziyan both the same. --- In arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com arrahmanfans%40yahoogroups.com, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line - sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
Rawat, lets understand one simple thing first: Music and its taste is very highly subjective. Its not something that everyone can objectively define as to what is good or bad. can anyone measure likability of music like blood pressure !! I can't understand why you fail to recognise this fact, instead of using terms like 'blind-faith' !! On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 4:32 AM, V S Rawat vsra...@gmail.com wrote: As I said, when someone tend to like everything, it could be that his artist is really flawlessly consistently great, or it could be that we love the artist so much that we can't make ourselves see his rare drawbacks. I am not just giving a high handed judgment rendering khwaja poor. I have elaborated point by point what I find it lacking in. Yeah, in that mail I did declare Arziyan great without going point by point why i find it great. Some day I will analyze it. Thanks. -- Rawat On 3/13/2009 7:22 AM India Time, _Chord_ wrote: Wow, Rawat, tell us how you really feel. I pretty much disagree with you completely. I love Khwaja and Arziyan both the same. --- In arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com arrahmanfans%40yahoogroups.com, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line - sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard in any other song. May be he was trying a new voice but it didn't suit my ears. all the internal aalaaps also are confusing, making it a classical song. They are not even bringing a sense of a
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
As I said, when someone tend to like everything, it could be that his artist is really flawlessly consistently great, or it could be that we love the artist so much that we can't make ourselves see his rare drawbacks. I am not just giving a high handed judgment rendering khwaja poor. I have elaborated point by point what I find it lacking in. Yeah, in that mail I did declare Arziyan great without going point by point why i find it great. Some day I will analyze it. Thanks. -- Rawat On 3/13/2009 7:22 AM India Time, _Chord_ wrote: Wow, Rawat, tell us how you really feel. I pretty much disagree with you completely. I love Khwaja and Arziyan both the same. --- In arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line- sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard in any other song. May be he was trying a new voice but it didn't suit my ears. all the internal aalaaps also are confusing, making it a classical song. They are not even bringing a sense of a trance. And as I already said once that JA music was a personal music and didn't reflect the lavishness of the film. I think I can describe now what I meant by that personal vs lavishness. Listen to the music between 3:40 - 4:05. That Persian sort of. Now, that is what I call a royal music, that has lavishness, that has luxury, that is group music, public music. Also the instrument that stars playing at the backdrop at about 6:10 and continues till the end of song. that
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
In khwaja song, the music between 3:40 - 4:05 and then from 6:10 till the the end of song --- Could anyone mention whether this (type of) music has been used in any other ARR album, or in JA's any other song, or anywhere in JA's BGM. What an ethereal sound our man has devised. I would want him to use it more. -- Rawat
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
I like both Khwaja and Arziyan . Arziyan scores on the lyrics whereas Khwaja has ARR's voice which is a definite plus though Javed and Kailash have also done a good job. Warm Regards ~~~ Vinayak theregoesanotherday.blogspot.com On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 2:07 PM, V S Rawat vsra...@gmail.com wrote: In khwaja song, the music between 3:40 - 4:05 and then from 6:10 till the the end of song --- Could anyone mention whether this (type of) music has been used in any other ARR album, or in JA's any other song, or anywhere in JA's BGM. What an ethereal sound our man has devised. I would want him to use it more. -- Rawat
Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
There are quite a few ARR songs that I don't particularly like, but for me, Khwaja is not one of them. Oh well, to each their own. --- In arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: As I said, when someone tend to like everything, it could be that his artist is really flawlessly consistently great, or it could be that we love the artist so much that we can't make ourselves see his rare drawbacks. I am not just giving a high handed judgment rendering khwaja poor. I have elaborated point by point what I find it lacking in. Yeah, in that mail I did declare Arziyan great without going point by point why i find it great. Some day I will analyze it. Thanks. -- Rawat On 3/13/2009 7:22 AM India Time, _Chord_ wrote: Wow, Rawat, tell us how you really feel. I pretty much disagree with you completely. I love Khwaja and Arziyan both the same. --- In arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com, V S Rawat vsrawat@ wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line- sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard in any other song. May be he was trying a new voice but it didn't suit my ears. all the internal aalaaps also are confusing, making it a classical song. They are not even bringing a sense of a trance. And as I already said once that JA music was a personal music and didn't reflect the lavishness of the film. I think I can describe now what I meant by that personal vs
Re: Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
I disagree. On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 1:44 PM, V S Rawat vsra...@gmail.com wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line - sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard in any other song. May be he was trying a new voice but it didn't suit my ears. all the internal aalaaps also are confusing, making it a classical song. They are not even bringing a sense of a trance. And as I already said once that JA music was a personal music and didn't reflect the lavishness of the film. I think I can describe now what I meant by that personal vs lavishness. Listen to the music between 3:40 - 4:05. That Persian sort of. Now, that is what I call a royal music, that has lavishness, that has luxury, that is group music, public music. Also the instrument that stars playing at the backdrop at about 6:10 and continues till the end of song. that single instrument is giving a royal touch to the song. That type of music is what I expected to be everywhere in JA music and background, but no, we didn't get that. Our man had different ideas about music suitable for the emperor of India. Compare the above two sounds to the sound at 1:20-1:45. Now this 1:20 sound is what I call a personal sound, lacking royal touch. It is a commoner's, a poor man's sound, now suitable for a period film. Seeing so many members liking the song so much, mentioning it as their most fav song, etc., I tried to listen to it several times, but this is one song of ARR that I found lacking in almost each and every aspect. -- Compare that to D6's Arziyaan.
Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line- sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard in any other song. May be he was trying a new voice but it didn't suit my ears. all the internal aalaaps also are confusing, making it a classical song. They are not even bringing a sense of a trance. And as I already said once that JA music was a personal music and didn't reflect the lavishness of the film. I think I can describe now what I meant by that personal vs lavishness. Listen to the music between 3:40 - 4:05. That Persian sort of. Now, that is what I call a royal music, that has lavishness, that has luxury, that is group music, public music. Also the instrument that stars playing at the backdrop at about 6:10 and continues till the end of song. that single instrument is giving a royal touch to the song. That type of music is what I expected to be everywhere in JA music and background, but no, we didn't get that. Our man had different ideas about music suitable for the emperor of India. Compare the above two sounds to the sound at 1:20-1:45. Now this 1:20 sound is what I call a personal sound, lacking royal touch. It is a commoner's, a poor man's sound, now suitable for a period film. Seeing so many members liking the song so much, mentioning it as their most fav song, etc., I tried to listen to it several times, but this is one song of ARR that I found lacking in almost each and every aspect. -- Compare that to D6's Arziyaan. Now, Arziyaan is a prayer song that carries you with it and you forget yourself love the journey . perfect
Khwaja song - my impression (Re: [arr] Let's keep in mind the attitudes and exposure of the elders)
Wow, Rawat, tell us how you really feel. I pretty much disagree with you completely. I love Khwaja and Arziyan both the same. --- In arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com, V S Rawat vsra...@... wrote: On 3/12/2009 3:11 PM India Time, _Jahanzeb Farooq_ wrote: in fact we watched JA together and during Khwaja mere khwaja as I mentioned that music is by ARR, he said I did not see anything special (sadly enough. may because it was in bad quality. also we know that ARR's music grows but he does not). I am a known JA basher so I thought I can say about this song also. khwaja song might be holding additional value for muslims due to its religious connotations, and for general fans it might have got some high weightage due to the anecdotes of ARR having composed it already and then AG using it in the film. But as a song, I find khwaja song quite barren and monotonous if I can say that. It is a sort of introvert song giving a feel that a person must be singing it within his heart and mind. It is his personal pleasure. Others would not be able to connect to it. Firstly, the song has some 1:20 initial alaaps that are quire boring to say and kill the entire beauty of song that comes after that. It is more like the sounds generated when a player tunes up his instruments before starting to really play it up. Such a long wasted part is a sin in current busy time. Those ya khwaja ji, moinuddin, gareeb nawaz are without any lyrical or music value. So, I think the start itself is badly thought up. But then the song starts with lovely music BUT, BUT BUT poor lyrics. A typical lack of creativity in the monotonous, logically-built up lyrics as is usually the case with Javed Akhtar. Khwaja Mere Khwaja Dil Mein Sama ja Bebaso ki Taqdeer Tu ne hai sawari There is no rhyming, no deep devotion. All that dil mein sama ja type of phrases had been used a 1000 times in cheap ladki-pataao songs in 60s and here he comes up with that in a 21st century devotional song. I would say that the major failure of the song remains in the poor lyrics. Then, it fails in arrangements of vocals. None of the voices carry and ethos and pathos. They are just singing an any song, not a religious song for the most respected muslim personality of Indian subcontinent. pronunciations are also not clear. that bebaso ki taqdeer tu ne hai sanwari, has bebaso and tu ne pronounced so pooorly that one has to strain to hear it and make the meaning of it. Sad that it is our man himself. And then Tere darbaar mein khwaza noor ko mainne dekha has noor pronounced so poorly by our man himself, and then there are alaaps, and then the music gives the impression that the line is going to be repeated, tere darbar mein khwaja - but they drop the line unceremoniously and begin another line- sar jhukaate hain auliya. What was so great in mentioning that auliya sar jhukate hain, so what, is that why you feel respect for him? I think the respect should have come from within, not due to seeing how others are respecting him. and then tu hai khwaja - rutaba hai pyara chahne se tujhko mustafa ko paya that xxx is still not clear to my aging ears. and lastly that hai mere peer ka sadqa, tera daman hai thama, tali hai bala hamari, chhaya hai khumar tera, jitna bhi rashq karein beshaq, to ab hai XXX mere khwaja, tere kadmo ko mere rahnuma nahin chhodna gawara. I don't get what exactly is the concept. No rhyming, no poetry, just some words have got hammerred in. It must be the poorest lyrics by Javed. I would say that ARR's voice is also not as sweet enough as he is famed for, there is a rare shrillness, a hollow in ARR's voice that I don't remember having heard in any other song. May be he was trying a new voice but it didn't suit my ears. all the internal aalaaps also are confusing, making it a classical song. They are not even bringing a sense of a trance. And as I already said once that JA music was a personal music and didn't reflect the lavishness of the film. I think I can describe now what I meant by that personal vs lavishness. Listen to the music between 3:40 - 4:05. That Persian sort of. Now, that is what I call a royal music, that has lavishness, that has luxury, that is group music, public music. Also the instrument that stars playing at the backdrop at about 6:10 and continues till the end of song. that single instrument is giving a royal touch to the song. That type of music is what I expected to be everywhere in JA music and background, but no, we didn't get that. Our man had different ideas about music suitable for the emperor of India. Compare the above two sounds to the sound at 1:20-1:45. Now this 1:20 sound is what I call a personal sound, lacking royal touch. It is a commoner's, a poor man's sound, now suitable for a period film. Seeing so many members liking the song so much, mentioning it as
