Re: Board Commentary: Metro and Avalon
Hi, (wow, this really is the thread that just wouldn't die!) On 26 Sep 2004, at 23:48, Stephen McConnell wrote: What is in question is the openness of the Apache Software Foundation and that question is of interest to every committer at Apache. Sure, fine, I think most people get that. It is my opinion the Niclas posted his initial comments to the list simply as a heads-up to each and every committer here that something happened recently that simply was not right. No problem with Niclas bringing up the question. His methodology, however, was inappropriate. you seem to agree that acceptable behaviour is defined by agreements. very well, let me spell it out: by participating in the apache projects, you are tacitly agreeing to abide by the rules behaviour the organisation considers acceptable. in case it wasn't clear, let me make it so now: one of those is if someone entrusts information to you in confidence, you DO NOT expose it unless legally required or with the permission of the source. Will the actions taken by Niclas in defending the principals of openness and community within the ASF simply lead to another statement of serious reservation concerning his role and potential contribution? You're missing the point and blowing things out of proportion. The point here, in case you missed it, is that Niclas posted private mail on a public list. This is extremely bad manners, and breaches the rules behaviour the organisation considers acceptable - organisation here not necessarily being ASF, but the general internet public-at-large. For the record - the relevant elements of the email header of the notification I received and from which I initiated a dialog with Niclas are included here: Return-Path: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 23 Sep 2004 00:53:12 -0700 From: Greg Stein [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Board Commentary: Metro and Avalon Yup, so completely private to a bunch of individuals and the Avalon PMC. So, a general discussion of how do we cope with people that don't play by the rules? would be appropriate on community@, but using a private email to kickstart such a debate is NOT appropriate. Please consider this message as my direct and immediate challenge. Yup, see you could do with rewording the challenge a little ;-) How about a more friendly how do we deal with generic situation X rather than why is Fred annoyed with Barney? If you were to start the thread again with a more polite and netiquette-friendly[1] question, I'm sure we'd get out of this flame-war we're mired in and into some sensible conversation. You'd probably stop boring the pants off most of the community, too :-) Just my 2p. [1] http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1855.html and more specifically http://www.onlinenetiquette.com/courtesy1.html point (11) Andrew. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: EU Software Patents
Hi, On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Andrew Savory wrote: Some of you may already be aware that on 1st September the European parliament will vote [1] on the issue of software patents. [1] http://swpat.ffii.org/news/03/plen0620/index.en.html Rumour has it that the McCarthy report [2] has been withdrawn from next week's European Parliament agenda. [2] http://swpat.ffii.org/papers/eubsa-swpat0202/amccarthy0206/index.en.html I'd like to think it's at least in part thanks to our protests! Thanks everyone, Andrew. -- Andrew SavoryEmail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Managing Director Tel: +44 (0)870 741 6658 Luminas Internet Applications Fax: +44 (0)700 598 1135 Orixo alliance: http://www.orixo.com/ Web:www.luminas.co.uk - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
EU Software Patents
Hi, Some of you may already be aware that on 1st September the European parliament will vote [1] on the issue of software patents. This is something that will directly affect all ASF projects, despite the care that we take in guaranteeing copyright of contributed code. Approved patents are not made public for 18 months, so there's no way we can know in advance what code will infringe patents. This is not the only reason patents are bad. This letter [2] to MEPs explains more. In protest against the directive, an online demo [3] is being co-ordinated, proposing that web sites shut [4] on 27th August. Obviously, the more sites that shut, the more impact it will have. I'd like to propose that we close (ie swap the front page for a protest page) as many of the Apache web sites as possible. Obviously, if we could get a mass turnout of ASF people to the demo in Brussels [5], that would be even better! [1] http://swpat.ffii.org/news/03/plen0620/index.en.html [2] http://www.compsoc.com/~coriordan/docs/dear_mep/dear_mep.html [3] http://swpat.ffii.org/group/demo/index.en.html [4] http://swpat.ffii.org/group/demo/demo.en.html [5] http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/32457.html Thanks for listening, Andrew. -- Andrew SavoryEmail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Managing Director Tel: +44 (0)870 741 6658 Luminas Internet Applications Fax: +44 (0)700 598 1135 Orixo alliance: http://www.orixo.com/ Web:www.luminas.co.uk - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Apache Wiki defaced
Hi, On Sat, 7 Jun 2003, Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote: However if we start seeing de-facings which take days to be noticed; then we'll propably need to start adding some more hurdles/login's. Changes made to the Cocoon wiki are mailed to the cocoon-docs mailing list, so inappropriate changes are spotted much more quickly. Perhaps a similar setup could be adopted for the Apache wiki? Andrew. -- Andrew SavoryEmail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Managing Director Tel: +44 (0)870 741 6658 Luminas Internet Applications Fax: +44 (0)700 598 1135 This is not an official statement or order.Web:www.luminas.co.uk - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How BSD hurts OpenSource
Hi, On Wed, 14 May 2003, Stephen McConnell wrote: 1. open-source is free and that is a problem for department managers because this means they loose budget Fair comment up to a point - but there are vendors of open source software out there, so there are ways around this (although admittedly, not nearly enough vendors yet). 2. on the pragmatic front - open-source means you have to have the resources to be able to continue independently [...] back to the question - is it better to go with a commercial solution (a.k.a. problem transference) or take responsibility (a.k.a. internal responsibility)? The fallacy in this argument is assuming that commercial software will never go in a direction that's incompatible with your requirements, and that the commercial company will always be around to support your needs. In fact, what often happens is that the commercial company (or 'proprietary software vendor') tends to release bug fixes labelled as upgraded software, stuffed with irrelevant new 'features' to entice you to buy. This software often heads in a direction you don't want to go in, but you are forced to upgrade by the need to ensure continual support (and the previous product is rapidly dropped from the commercial company's list of supported products). It's a catch-22 situation. The only difference is that the proprietary / commercial solutions tend to be wrapped up and sugar-coated in management friendly 'upgrade/new feature' lingo. I'd opt for internal responsbility every time, but I'm a massochist ;-) Andrew. -- Andrew SavoryEmail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Managing Director Tel: +44 (0)870 741 6658 Luminas Internet Applications Fax: +44 (0)700 598 1135 This is not an official statement or order.Web:www.luminas.co.uk - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
