AW: Natural language version of activities in Shindig
I'm glad that you see it positively Ryan.
I guess your concern is regarding the semantics of the activities, that might
vary from application to application a little bit.
However, from my perspective Shindig as a central unit should also have some
kind of harmonization role regarding semantics. I think it is helpful to have a
consistent set of well-defined activities and hide system-specifics up to a
certain amount.
I would provide a text-file with suggestions for English and German and every
administrator that uses Shindig would be free to alter them for their setup or
add those files for different languages. I can also imagine the Shindig
community providing two or three different versions of that file depending on
the application scenario like company intranets (our use case) or internet
communities (maybe semantics are different in this case).
Finally, the feature should be configurable so it can be turned on and off by
the administrator and of course it should not overwrite existing title
attributes coming from the database. With these two mechanisms in place,
everybody should be happy from my perspective. People who don't like the
feature simply turn it off. Others that have applications in place that set the
title on their own don't have to fear that the new feature will interfere with
those and all the other don't have to implement own code for creating the
natural language strings.
Please find enclosed a document that describes how we use the general
activitystrea.ms verbs in our use case. SCHub is the project acronym denoting
Social Collaboration Hub. That might further clarify things.
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: Ryan Baxter [mailto:rbaxte...@gmail.com]
Gesendet: Montag, 1. Dezember 2014 22:39
An: dev@shindig.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Natural language version of activities in Shindig
Makes sense Rene thanks. But what I don't understand is how you propose
Shindig be able to translate the activity, would the app creating the activity
provide the translation?
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 12:57 PM, René Peinl rene.pe...@hof-university.de
wrote:
Dear Ryan,
Sorry that my description was not precise enough.
What I want to achieve is: store actor, verb, object, and
target of an activity in Shindig and when retrieving the activity get a
JSON that delivers the stored values and in addition includes the title
attribute with something like {
language: en,
title:actor renamed document object into target
}
Shindig should use a lookup table that has a natural language template per
activity verb.
With real data instead of placeholders this would look like {
language: en,
title: Peter renamed document 'meeting protocol2.pdf' into 'meeting
protocol for second project review.pdf'
}
I hope that helps. If not, please try to rephrase what you understood, so
that I can see where exactly the problem with understanding is.
Regards
René
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: Ryan Baxter [mailto:rbaxte...@gmail.com]
Gesendet: Montag, 1. Dezember 2014 17:18
An: dev@shindig.apache.org
Cc: Florian Holzschuher; Christian Ochsenkühn
Betreff: Re: Natural language version of activities in Shindig
Hi Rene,
Can you provide a more concrete example of what you are trying to do?
I am having a hard time grasping your question.
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 7:47 AM, René Peinl rene.pe...@hof-university.de
wrote:
Dear Shindig community,
we are facing a challange in our project, that we are using Shindig
to collect activities from various systems and want to show
activities coming from Shindig in every system. Currently Shindig
only delivers the basic activity data like activity verb, object, target and
so on.
However, we’d like to show a natural language version of the activity
in the activity stream (full sentence) which includes multi-lingual
presentation of the contents. An example would be „actor has added
a comment to object“ or „actor renamed document object into
target“. The activitystrea.ms standard specifies the title attribute for
that purpose.
http://activitystrea.ms/specs/json/1.0/#activity
http://activitystrea.ms/specs/json/1.0/#activity
In Shindig this attribute attribute is present and handled, but only
in a pass-through manner.
In order to avoid duplication of code, our natural choice would be to
extend Shindig to generate the natural language version of the
activities in the title attribute, if title is not present in the
database. We would use files for translation and formatting templates
(only string formatting, not colouring or layout), so that every
administrator can influence both without any coding.
Would this be an interesting extension for the Shindig base system
and do you have any suggestions on how to integrate such an extension
from an architecture point of view? We are e.g. not sure whether to
deliver several translation in the same JSON as shown here
http://www.w3
Natural language version of activities in Shindig
Dear Shindig community, we are facing a challange in our project, that we are using Shindig to collect activities from various systems and want to show activities coming from Shindig in every system. Currently Shindig only delivers the basic activity data like activity verb, object, target and so on. However, wed like to show a natural language version of the activity in the activity stream (full sentence) which includes multi-lingual presentation of the contents. An example would be actor has added a comment to object or actor renamed document object into target. The activitystrea.ms standard specifies the title attribute for that purpose. http://activitystrea.ms/specs/json/1.0/#activity http://activitystrea.ms/specs/json/1.0/#activity In Shindig this attribute attribute is present and handled, but only in a pass-through manner. In order to avoid duplication of code, our natural choice would be to extend Shindig to generate the natural language version of the activities in the title attribute, if title is not present in the database. We would use files for translation and formatting templates (only string formatting, not colouring or layout), so that every administrator can influence both without any coding. Would this be an interesting extension for the Shindig base system and do you have any suggestions on how to integrate such an extension from an architecture point of view? We are e.g. not sure whether to deliver several translation in the same JSON as shown here http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/WD-activitystreams-core-20141023/#naturalLanguage Values http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/WD-activitystreams-core-20141023/#naturalLanguageV alues or use a parameter from the client to choose the language. My guess would be that other people will face similar problems. Regards René
AW: Natural language version of activities in Shindig
Dear Ryan,
Sorry that my description was not precise enough.
What I want to achieve is: store actor, verb, object, and target of an
activity in Shindig and when retrieving the activity get a JSON that delivers
the stored values and in addition includes the title attribute with something
like
{
language: en,
title:actor renamed document object into target
}
Shindig should use a lookup table that has a natural language template per
activity verb.
With real data instead of placeholders this would look like
{
language: en,
title: Peter renamed document 'meeting protocol2.pdf' into 'meeting
protocol for second project review.pdf'
}
I hope that helps. If not, please try to rephrase what you understood, so that
I can see where exactly the problem with understanding is.
Regards
René
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: Ryan Baxter [mailto:rbaxte...@gmail.com]
Gesendet: Montag, 1. Dezember 2014 17:18
An: dev@shindig.apache.org
Cc: Florian Holzschuher; Christian Ochsenkühn
Betreff: Re: Natural language version of activities in Shindig
Hi Rene,
Can you provide a more concrete example of what you are trying to do?
I am having a hard time grasping your question.
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 7:47 AM, René Peinl rene.pe...@hof-university.de wrote:
Dear Shindig community,
we are facing a challange in our project, that we are using Shindig to
collect activities from various systems and want to show activities
coming from Shindig in every system. Currently Shindig only delivers
the basic activity data like activity verb, object, target and so on.
However, we’d like to show a natural language version of the activity
in the activity stream (full sentence) which includes multi-lingual
presentation of the contents. An example would be „actor has added a
comment to object“ or „actor renamed document object into
target“. The activitystrea.ms standard specifies the title attribute for
that purpose.
http://activitystrea.ms/specs/json/1.0/#activity
http://activitystrea.ms/specs/json/1.0/#activity
In Shindig this attribute attribute is present and handled, but only
in a pass-through manner.
In order to avoid duplication of code, our natural choice would be to
extend Shindig to generate the natural language version of the
activities in the title attribute, if title is not present in the
database. We would use files for translation and formatting templates
(only string formatting, not colouring or layout), so that every
administrator can influence both without any coding.
Would this be an interesting extension for the Shindig base system and
do you have any suggestions on how to integrate such an extension from
an architecture point of view? We are e.g. not sure whether to deliver
several translation in the same JSON as shown here
http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/WD-activitystreams-core-20141023/#naturalLa
nguage
Values
http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/WD-activitystreams-core-20141023/#naturalLan
guageV
alues
or use a parameter from the client to choose the language.
My guess would be that other people will face similar problems.
Regards
René
Re: Natural language version of activities in Shindig
Makes sense Rene thanks. But what I don't understand is how you
propose Shindig be able to translate the activity, would the app
creating the activity provide the translation?
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 12:57 PM, René Peinl
rene.pe...@hof-university.de wrote:
Dear Ryan,
Sorry that my description was not precise enough.
What I want to achieve is: store actor, verb, object, and target of
an activity in Shindig and when retrieving the activity get a JSON that
delivers the stored values and in addition includes the title attribute with
something like
{
language: en,
title:actor renamed document object into target
}
Shindig should use a lookup table that has a natural language template per
activity verb.
With real data instead of placeholders this would look like
{
language: en,
title: Peter renamed document 'meeting protocol2.pdf' into 'meeting
protocol for second project review.pdf'
}
I hope that helps. If not, please try to rephrase what you understood, so
that I can see where exactly the problem with understanding is.
Regards
René
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: Ryan Baxter [mailto:rbaxte...@gmail.com]
Gesendet: Montag, 1. Dezember 2014 17:18
An: dev@shindig.apache.org
Cc: Florian Holzschuher; Christian Ochsenkühn
Betreff: Re: Natural language version of activities in Shindig
Hi Rene,
Can you provide a more concrete example of what you are trying to do?
I am having a hard time grasping your question.
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 7:47 AM, René Peinl rene.pe...@hof-university.de
wrote:
Dear Shindig community,
we are facing a challange in our project, that we are using Shindig to
collect activities from various systems and want to show activities
coming from Shindig in every system. Currently Shindig only delivers
the basic activity data like activity verb, object, target and so on.
However, we’d like to show a natural language version of the activity
in the activity stream (full sentence) which includes multi-lingual
presentation of the contents. An example would be „actor has added a
comment to object“ or „actor renamed document object into
target“. The activitystrea.ms standard specifies the title attribute for
that purpose.
http://activitystrea.ms/specs/json/1.0/#activity
http://activitystrea.ms/specs/json/1.0/#activity
In Shindig this attribute attribute is present and handled, but only
in a pass-through manner.
In order to avoid duplication of code, our natural choice would be to
extend Shindig to generate the natural language version of the
activities in the title attribute, if title is not present in the
database. We would use files for translation and formatting templates
(only string formatting, not colouring or layout), so that every
administrator can influence both without any coding.
Would this be an interesting extension for the Shindig base system and
do you have any suggestions on how to integrate such an extension from
an architecture point of view? We are e.g. not sure whether to deliver
several translation in the same JSON as shown here
http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/WD-activitystreams-core-20141023/#naturalLa
nguage
Values
http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/WD-activitystreams-core-20141023/#naturalLan
guageV
alues
or use a parameter from the client to choose the language.
My guess would be that other people will face similar problems.
Regards
René
