RE: advice needed re half-adopted cat
Thank you thank you Gloria, Janine, MaryChristine, Kat, Chris, Patti, Tonya, Belinda (with apologies if I've left anyone out) for your feedback--have compiled all your advice and sent to my friend and after I've got advice on the law in IL--I'll try Alley Cat Allies--we'll discuss our course of action over next couple of days. You guys are the best! Kerry hr IRS CIRCULAR 230 NOTICE. Any advice expressed above as to tax matters was neither written nor intended by the sender or Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity, investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other than Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP) of that transaction or matter, and (ii) such taxpayer should seek advice based on the taxpayers particular circumstances from an independent tax advisor hr This email and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail.
Re: advice needed re half-adopted cat
Hey Kerry- Chances are the kitty has *not* been microchipped by an owner who won't even let her inside when needed - and even if so I doubt if the vet would check it unless you asked him/her to. And if you take her to your vet as your cat, well... I also doubt if talking to the owner again would be useful - might even be counter productive. Sure she can help this kitty - Good luck - Gloria At 12:37 PM 12/20/2005, you wrote: Hi guys The same good friend who told me about the kitty with litterbox problems that was under threat of pts (apparently happily resolved, for now at any rate) updated me on another situation. Background: Misha is a stray that was sort of taken in by the people who work in a studio at the same business complex where my friend works. I say sort of because although two of the workers took her to the vet after she was badly attacked, and although they feed her, they don't take her home at the weekend: ie no one is actually making Misha their responsibility. In the summer and fall Misha would be found outside after they had all locked up and gone home for the weekend. When my friend, distressed by Misha's situation, offered to try to find Misha a home, the studio owner (who my friend says seems to be a reasonable, decent guy) rejected the proposal, saying that they had adopted her. Recently -- and it is really cold now--- my friend found Misha miaowing in vain at the studio door to be let in. My friend knocked on the door, and one of the other workers (not the owner) opened it. When she explained the cat needed to come in, the response to her was Haven't you got anything better to do? Q--where do we go from here? If my friend just takes Misha, there's a chance a surveillance camera will record the action as it's a business location. Also, even if she did that, when she takes her to the vet, what happens if she's been microchipped by those people? Is the vet legally/ethically prevented from removing the chip and replacing it? Obligated to contact the people? My friend would not be keeping Misha as she's allergic to cats; she'd want my help in placing her in the shelter where I have a good contact. Not ideal but she would at least be cared for there. However, I'd need to know how to resolve the chip situation first. My friend's proposal was to talk to the owner again and try to make him understand that someone needs to take proper responsibility for the cat. My feeling was that if she fails, then she will be the first person he suspects if and when she kidnaps Misha. And the scene could turn ugly. Even if I were to find and rescue the cat when I happen to be passing by at the weekend the microchip Q still arises. (We don't know if she's microchipped -- is there a way for a layperson to scan her without vet involvement?) All input/info welcome on how Misha gets the care she deserves---I've no experience in this field---yet. But I know some of you heroes do. Kerry
Re: advice needed re half-adopted cat
Kerry, I agree with Gloria - would be surprised if the cat was chipped, at least by the half-adopters. Can you lure the cat away from the building and out of site of the cameras (for instance - KFC thigh meat, esp warmed so the smell carries might make her walk right into a carrier set behind your car)Janine[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey Kerry-Chances are the kitty has *not* been microchipped by an owner who won't even let her inside when needed - and even if so I doubt if the vet would check it unless you asked him/her to. And if you take her to your vet as your cat, well...I also doubt if talking to the owner again would be useful - might even be counter productive.Sure she can help this kitty -Good luck -GloriaAt 12:37 PM 12/20/2005, you wrote:Hi guysThe same good friend who told me about the kitty with litterbox problems that was under threat of pts (apparently happily resolved, for now at any rate) updated me on another situation.Background:Misha is a stray that was sort of taken in by the people who work in a studio at the same business complex where my friend works. I say sort of because although two of the workers took her to the vet after she was badly attacked, and although they feed her, they don't take her home at the weekend: ie no one is actually making Misha their responsibility. In the summer and fall Misha would be found outside after they had all locked up and gone home for the weekend. When my friend, distressed by Misha's situation, offered to try to find Misha a home, the studio owner (who my friend says seems to be a reasonable, decent guy) rejected the proposal, saying that they had "adopted" her. Recently -- and it is really cold now--- my friend found Misha miaowing in vain at the studio door to be let in. My friend knocked on the door, and one of the other workers (not the owner) opened it. When she explained the cat needed to come in, the response to her was "Haven't you got anything better to do?"Q--where do we go from here?If my friend just takes Misha, there's a chance a surveillance camera will record the action as it's a business location. Also, even if she did that, when she takes her to the vet, what happens if she's been microchipped by those people? Is the vet legally/ethically prevented from removing the chip and replacing it? Obligated to contact the people? My friend would not be keeping Misha as she's allergic to cats; she'd want my help in placing her in the shelter where I have a good contact. Not ideal but she would at least be cared for there. However, I'd need to know how to resolve the chip situation first.My friend's proposal was to talk to the owner again and try to make him understand that someone needs to take proper responsibility for the cat. My feeling was that if she fails, then she will be the first person he suspects if and when she kidnaps Misha. And the scene could turn ugly.Even if I were to find and "rescue" the cat when I "happen to be passing by" at the weekend the microchip Q still arises. (We don't know if she's microchipped -- is there a way for a layperson to scan her without vet involvement?)All input/info welcome on how Misha gets the care she deserves---I've no experience in this field---yet. But I know some of you heroes do.Kerry
Re: advice needed re half-adopted cat
Chances are good that if the person who has "adopted" Misha doesn't take the cat inside on weekends or evenings, esp. in the winter, that he didn't bother to pay the extra expense to have the cat microchipped.There are two ways to proceed (as I see it), explain to the person that Misha will most likely be attacked again, poisened or hit by a car etcif left unattended. (You can always say that you overheard a few people talking about that "damn cat" and discussing how best to get rid of it.if they ask who, say you didn't know them, but overheard them describing the cat and the fact that it was urinating outside of the buildins...and the were outraged by this...) Explain that not only will this result in horrific pain and fear for the cat, but added expense for the "owner" if the cat manages to drag itself "home". Also explain that should the cat bite or scratch anyone or anyone's pet, or be perceived as having done so, even in self defense or while trying to get away from someone who just wanted to "pet the kitty", the "owner" would be held financially or (depending on which state you are in) criminally responsible, as it is unlawful in most states to let you "pets" roam. Explain that an indoor cat is less likely to bring home fleas and other diseases, and how a well fed indoor cat makes an exceptional mouser.2)Call Animal Control to complain about the loose/stray cat in your area. Reports are kept confidential if you request they be. Animal Control will pick up the cat (if it has been microchipped) the owner will be notified and fined. If it hasn't been notified, simply contact the shelter in your area that Animal Control deposits at and "adopt" the cat when it is time, then you can find a better home for it, or your friend with contacts at the shelter might be able too.Good luck."MacKenzie, Kerry N." [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi guys The same good friend who told me about the kitty with litterbox problems that was under threat of pts (apparently happily resolved, for now at any rate) updated me on another situation. Background: Misha is a stray that was sort of taken in by the people who work in a studio at the same business complex where my friend works. I say sort of because although two of the workers took her to the vet after she was badly attacked, and although they feed her, they don't take her home at the weekend: ie no one is actually making Misha their responsibility. In the summer and fall Misha would be found outside after they had all locked up and gone home for the weekend. When my friend, distressed by Misha's situation,offered to try to find Misha a home, the studio owner (who my friend saysseems to bea reasonable, decent guy) rejected the proposal, saying that they had "adopted" her. Recently -- and it is really cold now--- my friend found Misha miaowing in vain at the studio door to be let in. My friend knocked on the door, and one of the other workers (not the owner) opened it. When she explained the cat needed to come in, the response to her was "Haven't you got anything better to do?" Q--where do we go from here? If my friend justtakes Misha, there's a chance a surveillance camera will record the action as it's a business location.Also, even if she did that, when she takes her to the vet, what happens if she's been microchipped by those people? Is the vet legally/ethically prevented from removing the chip and replacing it? Obligated to contact the people? My friend would not be keeping Misha as she's allergic to cats; she'd want my help in placing her in the shelter whereI have a good contact. Not ideal but she would at least be cared for there. However, I'd need to know how to resolve the chip situation first. My friend's proposal was to talk to the owner again and try to make him understand that someone needs to take proper responsibility for the cat. My feeling was that ifshe fails, then she will be the first person he suspects if and when shekidnaps Misha. And the scene could turn ugly. Even if I were to find and"rescue" the catwhen I"happen to be passing by" at the weekend the microchip Q still arises. (We don't know if she's microchipped -- is there a way for a layperson to scan her without vet involvement?) All input/info welcome on how Misha gets the care she deserves---I've no experience in this field---yet. ButI know some of youheroes do. Kerry=00IRS CIRCULAR 230 NOTICE. Any advice expressed above as to tax matters was neither written nor intended by the sender or Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity, investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other than Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP) of that transaction
Re: advice needed re half-adopted cat
i would call around--a humane society/spca would be my first call before animal control--and find out what the laws are in your area. in some places, any outside animal is considered a stray and therefore you can pick it up and take it home. in others, however, that's not the case. in michigan, for example, if you find ANY stray cat or dog you are supposed to call the police or animal control within 48 hours of finding it--theoretically, they are supposed to come and get it from you, you are NOT allowed to keep it yourself and try to place it. in reality, those officials who even know about the law (and a lot of animal control officers in michigan do NOT!), will tell you to place ads in the paper, try to find the owner, and then let you do whatever. a friend found a roaming german shepherd, and did all the correct things--ads in the paper, on petfinder, local rescues; had the dog vetted, and then put it up for adoption. WELL turned out the dog HAD been microchipped when it was adopted from a shelter. part of the agreement with the shelter, of course, was that the dog be neutered--which it hadn't been. the previous owner, thus caught out, went and had charges pressed against my friend for theft--even tho they told the new owners they didn't want the dog and they could keep it. we aren't sure WHY they went after my friend, except maybe for being angry that probably had to pay fines because they hadn't neutered the dog in the first place. nevertheless, my friend was found guilty of not reporting finding said dog, and had to pay fines and court costs...(the dog was later found to have some major congenital illness, which the first owners MAY have known about; the new owners then tried to sue my friend for medical expenses) ie, make sure you're covered legally, then save the kitty! -- MaryChristineAIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCatsMSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]ICQ: 289856892
Re: advice needed re half-adopted cat
Kerry, Check with some of the animal shelters/animal control officers in the area. More and more are being equipped with scanners - so no vet need be involved just to find out if one is even there. I like the KFC suggestion - but just in case the owner makes a stink, go to http://www.alleycat.org/pdf/feral_cat_shelter.pdf to get ideas on how to build an inexpensive cat shelter to keep the kitty out of the elements. If the guy doesn't even want an outdoor shelter for the kitty - I would go with the KFC just off the property, with alot of calling/coaxing/etc. Good luck! Kat (Mew Jersey) On Tue, 20 Dec 2005, MacKenzie, Kerry N. wrote: Background: Misha is a stray that was sort of taken in by the people who work in a studio at the same business complex where my friend works. I say sort of because although two of the workers took her to the vet after she was badly attacked, and although they feed her, they don't take her home at the weekend: ie no one is actually making Misha their responsibility. In the summer and fall Misha would be found outside after they had all locked up and gone home for the weekend. When my friend, distressed by Misha's situation, offered to try to find Misha a home, the studio owner (who my friend says seems to be a reasonable, decent guy) rejected the proposal, saying that they had adopted her. Recently -- and it is really cold now--- my friend found Misha miaowing in vain at the studio door to be let in. My friend knocked on the door, and one of the other workers (not the owner) opened it. When she explained the cat needed to come in, the response to her was Haven't you got anything better to do?
RE: advice needed re half-adopted cat
Title: Message You know, when I was feeding my strays, there was a young cat that belonged to a restaurant there. The cat was always out the owner said that the cat could come in when he wanted to but sometimes just didnt want to Of course, when he closed up at night, he didnt go looking this poor cat would be out in the snow. Well, when I picked up the last of the strays, I was tempted to take the little guy as well but I thought, maybe he wont want to go out as much if none of the strays are left, theyre going to see me take him, etc. etc. I checked a couple of times with the owner after that and the cat was always out but he assured me that he brought it in at night. Months later I learned the cat had vanished soon after I left I have always regretted not taking him right then and there! People with attitude like that about their pets dont get them microchipped, they dont even notice the pets are missing! Go on a weekend and get this cat out of there. Chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of MacKenzie, Kerry N. Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 1:38 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: advice needed re half-adopted cat Hi guys The same good friend who told me about the kitty with litterbox problems that was under threat of pts (apparently happily resolved, for now at any rate) updated me on another situation. Background: Misha is a stray that was sort of taken in by the people who work in a studio at the same business complex where my friend works. I say sort of because although two of the workers took her to the vet after she was badly attacked, and although they feed her, they don't take her home at the weekend: ie no one is actually making Misha their responsibility. In the summer and fall Misha would be found outside after they had all locked up and gone home for the weekend. When my friend, distressed by Misha's situation,offered to try to find Misha a home, the studio owner (who my friend saysseems to bea reasonable, decent guy) rejected the proposal, saying that they had adopted her. Recently -- and it is really cold now--- my friend found Misha miaowing in vain at the studio door to be let in. My friend knocked on the door, and one of the other workers (not the owner) opened it. When she explained the cat needed to come in, the response to her was Haven't you got anything better to do? Q--where do we go from here? If my friend justtakes Misha, there's a chance a surveillance camera will record the action as it's a business location.Also, even if she did that, when she takes her to the vet, what happens if she's been microchipped by those people? Is the vet legally/ethically prevented from removing the chip and replacing it? Obligated to contact the people? My friend would not be keeping Misha as she's allergic to cats; she'd want my help in placing her in the shelter whereI have a good contact. Not ideal but she would at least be cared for there. However, I'd need to know how to resolve the chip situation first. My friend's proposal was to talk to the owner again and try to make him understand that someone needs to take proper responsibility for the cat. My feeling was that ifshe fails, then she will be the first person he suspects if and when shekidnaps Misha. And the scene could turn ugly. Even if I were to find andrescue the catwhen Ihappen to be passing by at the weekend the microchip Q still arises. (We don't know if she's microchipped -- is there a way for a layperson to scan her without vet involvement?) All input/info welcome on how Misha gets the care she deserves---I've no experience in this field---yet. ButI know some of youheroes do. Kerry =00IRS CIRCULAR 230 NOTICE. Any advice expressed above as to tax matters was neither written nor intended by the sender or Mayer, Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity, investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other than Mayer, Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP) of that transaction or matter, and (ii) such taxpayer should seek advice based on the taxpayers particular circumstances from an independent tax advisorThis email and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail.
Re: advice needed re half-adopted cat
Darn - that's definitely a worse case senario cometrue... Gloria - Original Message - From: TenHouseCats To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 1:32 PM Subject: Re: advice needed re "half-adopted" cat i would call around--a humane society/spca would be my first call before animal control--and find out what the laws are in your area. in some places, any outside animal is considered a stray and therefore you can pick it up and take it home. in others, however, that's not the case. in michigan, for example, if you find ANY stray cat or dog you are supposed to call the police or animal control within 48 hours of finding it--theoretically, they are supposed to come and get it from you, you are NOT allowed to keep it yourself and try to place it. in reality, those officials who even know about the law (and a lot of animal control officers in michigan do NOT!), will tell you to place ads in the paper, try to find the owner, and then let you do whatever. a friend found a roaming german shepherd, and did all the correct things--ads in the paper, on petfinder, local rescues; had the dog vetted, and then put it up for adoption. WELL turned out the dog HAD been microchipped when it was adopted from a shelter. part of the agreement with the shelter, of course, was that the dog be neutered--which it hadn't been. the previous owner, thus caught out, went and had charges pressed against my friend for theft--even tho they told the new owners they didn't want the dog and they could keep it. we aren't sure WHY they went after my friend, except maybe for being angry that probably had to pay fines because they hadn't neutered the dog in the first place. nevertheless, my friend was found guilty of not reporting finding said dog, and had to pay fines and court costs...(the dog was later found to have some major congenital illness, which the first owners MAY have known about; the new owners then tried to sue my friend for medical expenses) ie, make sure you're covered legally, then save the kitty! -- MaryChristineAIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCatsMSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]ICQ: 289856892
Re: advice needed re half-adopted cat
unless the kitty came from a humane society or rescue that did chipjust cuz a cat SEEMS to be a stray, well, we all know how that goes On 12/20/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 12/20/05 3:02:21 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: People with attitude like that about their pets don't get them microchipped, they don't even notice the pets are missing! Go on a weekend and get this cat out of there…. I ditto that! Patti -- MaryChristineAIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCatsMSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]ICQ: 289856892
Re: advice needed re half-adopted cat
I agree. Your friend shouldn't go because she would be suspected. Get someone else to go, late at night. Don't get too close to the store itself, and open up the tuna/kfc. The cat should come to you. If there is a microchip I would be surprised. If there was one however, you just picked up a stray cat out freezing on the street. There's no crime in that. People don't 'own' animals that are not restricted to their property. Animals off of their own property are 'fair game' for whatever happens to them. Usually that's someone trying to hurt them, not help them.tKat [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Kerry,Check with some of the animal shelters/animal control officers in thearea. More and more are being equipped with scanners - so no vet need beinvolved just to find out if one is even there.I like the KFC suggestion - but just in case the owner makes a stink, goto http://www.alleycat.org/pdf/feral_cat_shelter.pdf to get ideas on howto build an inexpensive cat shelter to keep the kitty out of the elements.If the guy doesn't even want an outdoor shelter for the kitty - I would gowith the KFC just off the property, with alot of calling/coaxing/etc.Good luck!Kat (Mew Jersey)On Tue, 20 Dec 2005, MacKenzie, Kerry N. wrote: Background: Misha is a stray that was sort of taken in by the people who work in a studio at the same business complex where my friend works. I say sort of because although two of the workers took her to the vet after she was badly attacked, and although they feed her, they don't take her home at the weekend: ie no one is actually making Misha their responsibility. In the summer and fall Misha would be found outside after they had all locked up and gone home for the weekend. When my friend, distressed by Misha's situation, offered to try to find Misha a home, the studio owner (who my friend says seems to be a reasonable, decent guy) rejected the proposal, saying that they had "adopted" her. Recently -- and it is really cold now--- my friend found Misha miaowing in vain at the studio door to be let in. My friend knocked on the door, and one of the other workers (not the owner) opened it. When she explained the cat needed to come in, the response to her was "Haven't you got anything better to do?"
