Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Fragmentation of my drives. Curious mostly
On Friday 28 November 2008 20:24:38 Nikos Chantziaras wrote: Alan McKinnon wrote: On Friday 28 November 2008 13:14:42 Dale wrote: If this is a little high, what would be the best way to defrag it? By not defragging it. It's not Windows. Windows boxes needs defragging not because fragmentation is a huge problem in itself, but because windows filesystems are a steaming mess of [EMAIL PROTECTED] that do little right and most things wrong. Defrag treats the symptom, not the cause :-) I don't buy into that argument and never did. Every few months I copy the whole HD to another one and then back to counter fragmentation (ext3) and the system becomes noticeably faster after doing it (speed increase in emerge --sync for example.) Maybe it's not fragmentation but rather related files being more closely together after I do this. Only a proper analysis of your files will tell you this. It's easy enough to check for individual file fragmentation and get stats on that before you do the copy-off/copy-back. -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] Fragmentation of my drives. Curious mostly
On Friday 28 November 2008 18:09:37 Joshua Murphy wrote: On Fri, Nov 28, 2008 at 6:46 AM, Alan McKinnon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Friday 28 November 2008 13:14:42 Dale wrote: If this is a little high, what would be the best way to defrag it? By not defragging it. It's not Windows. Windows boxes needs defragging not because fragmentation is a huge problem in itself, but because windows filesystems are a steaming mess of [EMAIL PROTECTED] that do little right and most things wrong. Defrag treats the symptom, not the cause :-) Reiser tends to self-balance itself out. What is especially noteworthy is that none of the general purpose Linux filesystems provide a defrag utility. Theodore 'Tso and Hans Reiser are both exceptional programmers, if there was a need for such a tool they would assuredly have written one. They did not, so there probably isn't. Any Linux defrag tool you encounter will have been written by a third party separate from the developers. It will move blocks around and update superblocks, the drive will have to be unmounted for that to work and a slight misunderstanding of how to do it will ruin data. Are you willing to take the very real risk of data corruption? Is there a best way? I do have a second hard drive that I back up too. Both Drives are 80Gbs and I do have a set of DVD back ups as well. I can update those pretty quick. -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com While not trying to incite flames here... xfs isn't general purpose? xfs_fsr defrags xfs partitions while they're mounted and is designed to be used from cron (it's in xfsdump, not xfsprogs). File fragmentation, while a fact of life on any filesystem that sees any real use, does slow access times, as the drive head has to jump from one place to another, so a lot of fragmentation is a bad thing... On a proper multi-user multitasking OS like Unixes, the heads are going to be moving around all over the disk partition anyway just in general usage, even with zero file fragmentation. How much extra movement does fragmentation introduce? I've been waiting for a proper statistical analysis of this question for years. I'm still waiting :-) Besides, modern storage presents an extra wrinkle. Defrag as most of the world knows it originated in DOS, where disk sectors were guaranteed to be laid out on disk in the order of their sector number. These days we have no such guarantee, and you cannot really be sure if blocks are laid out contiguously on-disk just by looking at the blocks numbers. I don't know of any filesystem tool that knows how to interrogate a drive's firmware and get it right for every storage type out there. but as you say, we're not dealing with FAT based FS's here, so severe fragmentation only shows itself on very full filesystems. I very rarely see over 80% usage of my filesystems and have never consistently checked fragmentation levels, though, so I can't say whether xfs's being the exception on having a tool for the job means it particularly needed one... -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] Fragmentation of my drives. Curious mostly
On Friday 28 November 2008 17:08:03 Stroller wrote: I understood that ReiserFS's trees could become out-of-balance, resulting in performance loss, and that the way to deal with this was to tar the contents of the drive to another file-system and then untar them back. That's what I tell people to do. My purely anecdotal evidence: I observe that to get a Windows disk to reliably defrag, it should be taken off-line (otherwise it constantly restarts the process). A huge NTFS disk takes ages to defrag, the time involved seems about the same order as simply move the files off, copy them back. One day I may even test this with a stop watch :-) As someone else said elsewhere, it's the user's problem to do the right thing with sparse files, symlinks and to remember which files are actually hard links. -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] Fragmentation of my drives. Curious mostly
Alan McKinnon wrote: I've been waiting for a proper statistical analysis of this question for years. I'm still waiting :-) Besides, modern storage presents an extra wrinkle. Defrag as most of the world knows it originated in DOS, where disk sectors were guaranteed to be laid out on disk in the order of their sector number. These days we have no such guarantee, and you cannot really be sure if blocks are laid out contiguously on-disk just by looking at the blocks numbers. I don't know of any filesystem tool that knows how to interrogate a drive's firmware and get it right for every storage type out there. I never thought about the blocks and how they are laid out on the drive. If you think about it, they can have those things anywhere. Even if they are laid out by a defrag tool in proper sequence, they may not be laid out that way on the platter(s). Sort of makes one wonder if some file systems can really even be defragged below a certain amount. Dale scratches his chin and thinks Dale :-) :-)
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT] Fragmentation of my drives. Curious mostly
On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 13:46:01 +0200 Alan McKinnon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Friday 28 November 2008 13:14:42 Dale wrote: If this is a little high, what would be the best way to defrag it? By not defragging it. I beg to defer. The simplest way to defrag a partition is to make backup and restore. If it's worth the effort is another story. It's not Windows. Windows boxes needs defragging not because fragmentation is a huge problem in itself, but because windows filesystems are a steaming mess of [EMAIL PROTECTED] that do little right and most things wrong. Defrag treats the symptom, not the cause :-) Personally I think NTFS is one of the things MS have done right. It is fast, stable and has the features of the Linux FSes and even more. It has journal, quotas, permissions, mount points, symbolic links. Does any of ext, reiserfs or xfs have compression and/or encryption capabilities? I don't think so. I have some experience with MS Windows and I've never seen data corruption after a system crash or power loss, a thing I can't say about ReiserFS or ext3 (when not mounted with data=journal). Reiser tends to self-balance itself out. What is especially noteworthy is that none of the general purpose Linux filesystems provide a defrag utility. Theodore 'Tso and Hans Reiser are both exceptional programmers, if there was a need for such a tool they would assuredly have written one. They did not, so there probably isn't. It would be just as easy to pull the exactly opposite argument out: since they like to experiment and to boldly go where no man has gone before, they won't bother to write a defrag tool, because it would be too trivial and no fun. (just an example speculation on my part). Now let's put the assumptions aside and do a test. [EMAIL PROTECTED] # test $ cat /usr/portage/packages/All/* test1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] # test $ cp test1 test2 [EMAIL PROTECTED] # test $ ls -lah total 2.3G drwxr-xr-x 2 root users 4.0K 2008-11-29 01:38 . drwxr-xr-x 44 root users 4.0K 2008-11-29 01:36 .. -rw-r--r-- 1 root users 1.2G 2008-11-29 01:38 test1 -rw-r--r-- 1 root users 1.2G 2008-11-29 01:40 test2 localhost test # filefrag * test1: 1125 extents found, perfection would be 10 extents test2: 1923 extents found, perfection would be 10 extents localhost test # time cat test1 /dev/null real0m26.747s user0m2.110s sys 0m1.450s localhost test # time cat test2 /dev/null real0m29.825s user0m1.780s sys 0m1.690s All this with ext3 (rw,noatime,nodiratime,data=journal,commit=1) on a partition with 84% free space. It took 29.825-26.747=3.078 seconds more to read the same data, when the file has 1923-1125=798 additional fragments. So, the fragmentation led to ~10% performance decrease in this case and it appears the dogma Linux FS-es are smart and don't need to be de-fragmented is not quite true, right? Unfortunately I have no Windows at hand to make a similar test for comparison, but I believe the results won't be quite different. BTW fiflefrag is written by Mr T'so. Any Linux defrag tool you encounter will have been written by a third party separate from the developers. It will move blocks around and update superblocks, the drive will have to be unmounted for that to work and a slight misunderstanding of how to do it will ruin data. Are you willing to take the very real risk of data corruption? Who says it has to work that way? :) I have seen on the Net a defrag tool written by Mr Con Kolivas [1]. It was just a bash script which basically only copies the file into a new one, checks the number of fragments of both files and deletes the one that has more extents. :) [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Con_Kolivas -- Best regards, Daniel
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT] Fragmentation of my drives. Curious mostly
On Sat, 29 Nov 2008 11:19:47 +0200, Daniel Iliev wrote: Personally I think NTFS is one of the things MS have done right. It is fast, stable and has the features of the Linux FSes and even more. It has journal, quotas, permissions, mount points, symbolic links. Does any of ext, reiserfs or xfs have compression and/or encryption capabilities? I don't think so. No, and nor should they. Each filesystem implementing its own encryption layer would be a nightmare. A separate encryption layer on which you create any filesystem you like is much more sensible. -- Neil Bothwick COBOL: (n.) an old computer language, designed to be read and not run. Unfortunately, it is often run anyway. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Fragmentation of my drives. Curious mostly
On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 11:24:08 -0600, Dale wrote: Given my experience with XFS, I won't be switching anytime soon. I used that once on a in-laws system. After each crash, power failure, I had to reinstall. Let's just say it left a bad taste in my mouth. ;-) I'm not saying it is a bad file system for someone but certainly not for me. You're absolutely right with the last comment, XFS is intended for use in environments that have stable power supplies. I use it on my desktop, because it has a UPS, and my laptop. -- Neil Bothwick The gene pool could use a little chlorine. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT] Fragmentation of my drives. Curious mostly
On Saturday 29 November 2008 11:19:47 Daniel Iliev wrote: Now let's put the assumptions aside and do a test. [EMAIL PROTECTED] # test $ cat /usr/portage/packages/All/* test1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] # test $ cp test1 test2 [EMAIL PROTECTED] # test $ ls -lah total 2.3G drwxr-xr-x 2 root users 4.0K 2008-11-29 01:38 . drwxr-xr-x 44 root users 4.0K 2008-11-29 01:36 .. -rw-r--r-- 1 root users 1.2G 2008-11-29 01:38 test1 -rw-r--r-- 1 root users 1.2G 2008-11-29 01:40 test2 localhost test # filefrag * test1: 1125 extents found, perfection would be 10 extents test2: 1923 extents found, perfection would be 10 extents localhost test # time cat test1 /dev/null real 0m26.747s user 0m2.110s sys 0m1.450s localhost test # time cat test2 /dev/null real 0m29.825s user 0m1.780s sys 0m1.690s This is not a test unfortunately. You did one run on one file and one run on another file. We do not know what else the machine was doing at that time, and that unknown is a considerable one. Repeat your test eliminating this factor. Preferably, remount the filesystems after each run and repeat 1000 times. Then analyze the statistical distribution of your results. This should eliminate most random factors and give a more realistic real-world view. -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [OT] filesystems
Jorge Peixoto de Morais Neto schrieb: On Wed, Nov 26, 2008 at 12:26 PM, Florian Philipp [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As for my photos, I can back all the collection to a single DVD (and to a second one, since I keep hearing that DVD-Rs are unreliable), and since I don't take new photos every week, this solution is fine. A second DVD-R won't solve the problem because optical disks degrade over time and the second one will degrade just as fast as the first. What you need to do is to check the disks periodically (once a year is a good time frame). I know DVD-Rs degrade, but it is unlikely they would fail at the same time, so copying twice does significantly alleviate the problem (AFAIK) I'm not so sure in this regard. If we were talking about HDDs you were right: it is very unlikely for two of them to fail at the same time due to mechanical defects. But we are talking about optical media. They fail because of chemical reactions. That's why two disks, stored equally, bought at the same time from the same trader, produced by the same company, should degrade equally fast and therefore fail at about the same time. And since you want to check them less than once a year, at about the same time means within the same year. Once a year isn't overkill? Isn't once every two years fine? I'm not sure. I myself wouldn't trust normal CD/DVD-Rs for more than three years and CD/DVD-RWs for more than one year (cheap RWs degrade much faster than Rs). Additionally, having such long intervals between checks makes it easier to forget them completely. Can you remember whether you checked your disks last year or the year before? I know I couldn't. Sure. I am doing that since some time now. Unfortunately I didn't do so for some old backups. But data DVD-Rs have a considerable amount of correction code, and if the copy from DVD to hard disk proceeds without a single error message, there is a quite good chance that the files are good, right? I would think so.
Re: [gentoo-user] Installation problems on AMD64 box
Andrey Vul schrieb: On Fri, Nov 28, 2008 at 07:29, Florian Philipp [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Iain's diagnosis seems about right. I would start with a nice 2h memtest86+ test followed with a 1h cpuburn test. I believe you mean 2d memtest86+ unless computer has DDR9-9 RAM where 100 (full) cycles could be completed in under 2 hours. Also, do cpuburn for a day or more - bad cooling could take hours to mnifest themselves. You are right. To be absolutely sure, you should take the time for a very long test. I've heard of errors which were first seem after a week of testing. But here we are talking about a problem which was visible after just one kernel compilation. I would bet that you could see it after just one test cycle of memtest and half an hour of CPUburn. One the other hand, I once had a memory error (due to too short latencies) which couldn't be found my memtest within a day but crashed Elder Scrolls Oblivion after just 5min. You can never be sure with those things. Who knows? Maybe the power supply is too weak and you need to stress RAM, CPU and hard disk at the same time (as a compilation would do).
Re: [gentoo-user] Cannot login with publickey on sshd
On Saturday 29 November 2008, Eric Martin wrote: Mick wrote: Hi All, For some reason my Gentoo rsa public key is not liked by 3.9p1-11.el4_7 sshd, which is running on a CentOS server. On the Gentoo machine I am running net-misc/openssh-5.1_p1-r1. This is what it shows: === debug1: fd 3 clearing O_NONBLOCK debug1: Connection established. debug3: timeout: 14835 ms remain after connect debug3: Not a RSA1 key file /home/michael/.ssh/id_rsa. debug2: key_type_from_name: unknown key type '-BEGIN' It sounds like you're using a pgp public key, is this on purpose? AFAIK, you need to convert pgp keys - openssh keys before you use them. Have you tried making a public key via ssh-keygen? Thanks Eric, The --BEGIN string is I believe from the private key generated using ssh-keygen. If looks like this: = -BEGIN RSA PRIVATE KEY- Proc-Type: 4,ENCRYPTED DEK-Info: DES-EDE3-CBC, X XX... etc. = where X is the hash of the key. The public key starts with: = ssh-rsa X...etc = As I mentioned the same ssh key pair seems to work fine with other servers. -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
[gentoo-user] mp3/ogg editing
Hi, I am looking for a ogg/mp3 editing softwarei (gui), which is able to cut/append such streams without loss due to reencoding. What software is worth trying ? Thank you very much for your help in advance! Kind regards, mcc -- Please don't send me any Word- or Powerpoint-Attachments unless it's absolutely neccessary. - Send simply Text. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html In a world without fences and walls nobody needs gates and windows.
Re: [gentoo-user] mp3/ogg editing
Hello, I did you try Audacity? Hi, I am looking for a ogg/mp3 editing softwarei (gui), which is able to cut/append such streams without loss due to reencoding. What software is worth trying ? Thank you very much for your help in advance! Kind regards, mcc -- Please don't send me any Word- or Powerpoint-Attachments unless it's absolutely neccessary. - Send simply Text. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html In a world without fences and walls nobody needs gates and windows. http://www.drakonix.fr
Re: [gentoo-user] mp3/ogg editing
Hello, I tought this one decodes before editing ??? Fred Elno [EMAIL PROTECTED] [08-11-29 16:21]: Hello, I did you try Audacity? Hi, I am looking for a ogg/mp3 editing softwarei (gui), which is able to cut/append such streams without loss due to reencoding. What software is worth trying ? Thank you very much for your help in advance! Kind regards, mcc -- Please don't send me any Word- or Powerpoint-Attachments unless it's absolutely neccessary. - Send simply Text. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html In a world without fences and walls nobody needs gates and windows. http://www.drakonix.fr -- Please don't send me any Word- or Powerpoint-Attachments unless it's absolutely neccessary. - Send simply Text. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html In a world without fences and walls nobody needs gates and windows.
Re: [gentoo-user] mp3/ogg editing
Hello, I tought this one decodes before editing ??? This is what I found in audacity homepage: Audacity is free, open source software for recording and editing sounds. It is available for Mac OS X, Microsoft Windows, GNU/Linux, and other operating systems. So I think he is able to edit sounds, you just open your file, then apply some audio filter on it, cut a part of it tweak volume etc... But perhaps I have not well understood your question (my english is not so good ), and maybe I put you in a wrong way. Fred Elno [EMAIL PROTECTED] [08-11-29 16:21]: Hello, I did you try Audacity? Hi, I am looking for a ogg/mp3 editing softwarei (gui), which is able to cut/append such streams without loss due to reencoding. What software is worth trying ? Thank you very much for your help in advance! Kind regards, mcc -- Please don't send me any Word- or Powerpoint-Attachments unless it's absolutely neccessary. - Send simply Text. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html In a world without fences and walls nobody needs gates and windows. http://www.drakonix.fr -- Please don't send me any Word- or Powerpoint-Attachments unless it's absolutely neccessary. - Send simply Text. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html In a world without fences and walls nobody needs gates and windows. http://www.drakonix.fr
Re: [gentoo-user] mp3/ogg editing
Hi Fred, no problem...I am also no native english speaker...so, well, may be it is my english not yours what screws up things a little... :) MP3/OGG are audio codecs, which are lossy. Means: If you encode a wav-file to mp3, than decode this one again back to wav there is some sound loss. Audacity is -- as far as I understood -- only able to edit wav files. Therefore it has to decode the mp3 to wav before editing. If one wants a mp3 again from this wav file, the above has to be aplied and you will loose sound quality. There are ways to edit/cut/append mp3 files directly whitout deocding them (dont ask me for details here) therefore these editors, which are specialized in mp3/ogg editing, are able to edit/cut/apped mp3 files as often as you wish without loosing sound quality. Audacity is one to edit wav files directly but not mp3/ogg files -- as far as I know HTH Keep hacking! :) mcc Fred Elno [EMAIL PROTECTED] [08-11-29 17:11]: Hello, I tought this one decodes before editing ??? This is what I found in audacity homepage: Audacity is free, open source software for recording and editing sounds. It is available for Mac OS X, Microsoft Windows, GNU/Linux, and other operating systems. So I think he is able to edit sounds, you just open your file, then apply some audio filter on it, cut a part of it tweak volume etc... But perhaps I have not well understood your question (my english is not so good ), and maybe I put you in a wrong way. Fred Elno [EMAIL PROTECTED] [08-11-29 16:21]: Hello, I did you try Audacity? Hi, I am looking for a ogg/mp3 editing softwarei (gui), which is able to cut/append such streams without loss due to reencoding. What software is worth trying ? Thank you very much for your help in advance! Kind regards, mcc -- Please don't send me any Word- or Powerpoint-Attachments unless it's absolutely neccessary. - Send simply Text. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html In a world without fences and walls nobody needs gates and windows. http://www.drakonix.fr -- Please don't send me any Word- or Powerpoint-Attachments unless it's absolutely neccessary. - Send simply Text. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html In a world without fences and walls nobody needs gates and windows. http://www.drakonix.fr -- Please don't send me any Word- or Powerpoint-Attachments unless it's absolutely neccessary. - Send simply Text. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html In a world without fences and walls nobody needs gates and windows.
[gentoo-user] Re: pager independant of window manager
Dirk Heinrichs [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Am Samstag, 29. November 2008 07:30:03 schrieb Harry Putnam: Can anyone tell me if there is a desktop pager that can be run regardless of window manager? Browsing through portage, It appears there is not such a critter. xterm -e less filename otherwise: eix pager HTH... I think he mean a pager like this: http://fluxbox.sourceforge.net/fbpager/ regards -- Rodrigo Lazo (rlazo)
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: pager independant of window manager
Am Samstag, 29. November 2008 18:32:34 schrieb Rodrigo Lazo: I think he mean a pager like this: http://fluxbox.sourceforge.net/fbpager/ Aargh, stupid me. Yes, there's two meanings of pager. Bye... Dirk
[gentoo-user] Open Source Family Tree software?
Anyone have any recommendations of something in portage. (Or not in portage?) I found gramps in portage. I did not find Lifelines. I haven't uncovered any other project names as yet. Thanks, Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] Open Source Family Tree software?
Mark Knecht schrieb am 29.11.2008 19:34: Anyone have any recommendations of something in portage. (Or not in portage?) I found gramps in portage. I did not find Lifelines. I haven't uncovered any other project names as yet. Thanks, Mark I do not use it myself but I know there is gramps and it is in portage: Regards, Daniel signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
[gentoo-user] boot messages; vga; vesa; HDTV monitor
A few years back I installed gentoo and everything worked fine, except that the OS bootup messages were too big, and scrolled by too fast. Somewhere I found a tweak (IIRC, it involved recompiling the kernel) that handled it fine - i.e. the font was reduced dramatically after the bios was booted, right at the beginning of the OS booting. Today I replaced my monitor with an HDTV monitor which works fine during the bios boot; works fine after X is booted; but is shakey and unreliable during the OS boot. I have worked around these symptoms by adding vga=ask to lilo.conf, and then telling it to use vga. Questions: 1. Anyone aware of a wiki or other gentoo help that describes how to change the boot message size during boot? It is possible that I simply added a framebuffer, but it seems that I changed some config. somewhere as well. 2. Anyone have a workaround for using a new HDTV monitor with an older ATI graphics card? TIA
Re: [gentoo-user] boot messages; vga; vesa; HDTV monitor
On Saturday 29 November 2008, 7v5w7go9ub0o wrote: 1. Anyone aware of a wiki or other gentoo help that describes how to change the boot message size during boot? yes, it is. In /usr/src/Documentation.
Re: [gentoo-user] Open Source Family Tree software?
On 11/29/08, Mark Knecht [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone have any recommendations of something in portage. (Or not in portage?) Wikipedia has some, they've even tried to categorize a bit and made some tables of the basic features: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_genealogy_software I found gramps in portage. I did not find Lifelines. I haven't uncovered any other project names as yet. I set up my sister's old Ubuntu box to have gramps installed and (what I've heard) she has been using it successfully for her intermittent lightweight hobby genealogy studies of our relatives from previous centuries. I don't actually know much about these genealogy systems, so I don't know if such light-weight use is what you have in mind -- and whether gramps is a major beast or only usable for this kind of playtoy-use. -- Arttu V.
Re: [gentoo-user] Open Source Family Tree software?
On Sat, Nov 29, 2008 at 2:25 PM, Arttu V. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 11/29/08, Mark Knecht [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone have any recommendations of something in portage. (Or not in portage?) Wikipedia has some, they've even tried to categorize a bit and made some tables of the basic features: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_genealogy_software I found gramps in portage. I did not find Lifelines. I haven't uncovered any other project names as yet. I set up my sister's old Ubuntu box to have gramps installed and (what I've heard) she has been using it successfully for her intermittent lightweight hobby genealogy studies of our relatives from previous centuries. I don't actually know much about these genealogy systems, so I don't know if such light-weight use is what you have in mind -- and whether gramps is a major beast or only usable for this kind of playtoy-use. -- Arttu V. Thanks. I appreciate the responses. For what I've seen so far gramps looks like it might be the best for a really casual Linux user and it's likely my wife will start with that. The sort of bigger issue is once you've got your tree put together, as best you know it, then linking it up with other trees from other folks you don't know is a really valuable thing to do. The commercial software guys, like Family Tree Maker, have huge contributed databases of family trees submitted by other FTM customers. It's sort of a racket but you can subscribe to their service and then work to link yourself up with other groups from your extended family if they have made contributions. I'm told the problem is you don't really know if there's anything in their database until you start paying but you can do it for a month or two just to see how it works out. It seems that gramps is doing something sort of like this but one wonders just how large their database is. Also, I'd hate for my wife to do a lot of work entering a few hundred people only to find she cannot use the gramps data with anything but gramps. Might be best just to pay the money and take our chance with FTM longer-term but maybe she'll like playing with gramps on her Linux machine. It's really up to her. I'm just her sys-admin. Cheers, Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] Open Source Family Tree software?
Mark Knecht schrieb am 30.11.2008 00:29: It seems that gramps is doing something sort of like this but one wonders just how large their database is. Also, I'd hate for my wife to do a lot of work entering a few hundred people only to find she cannot use the gramps data with anything but gramps. Gramps has support for the GEDCOM format, which I remember was also used by another program I tried some years ago. GEDCOM is according to the gramps homepage an industry standard, so it should be possible to exchange your data with all other programs supporting this standard. http://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Features signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Open Source Family Tree software?
On Sat, Nov 29, 2008 at 3:45 PM, Daniel Pielmeier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark Knecht schrieb am 30.11.2008 00:29: It seems that gramps is doing something sort of like this but one wonders just how large their database is. Also, I'd hate for my wife to do a lot of work entering a few hundred people only to find she cannot use the gramps data with anything but gramps. Gramps has support for the GEDCOM format, which I remember was also used by another program I tried some years ago. GEDCOM is according to the gramps homepage an industry standard, so it should be possible to exchange your data with all other programs supporting this standard. http://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Features Cool. thanks. I suppose she can try entering just a few names and then see if she can talk to FTM. I'm not sure any of this is important to her. Just trying to get a bit ahead. Thanks, Mark
[gentoo-user] something is filling up the filesystem
Hi all, i noticed a strange behaviour on my macine recently. Something is continuously filling up my root partition at a speed near 1k per minute. I have just few programs running and none of them should save that much information on the disk. Now the problem is that i have absolutely no idea of where to start to investigate. Anyone have ever got a similar problem? Thanks to all, Davide
Re: [gentoo-user] something is filling up the filesystem
On Sun, 2008-11-30 at 01:15 +, Pupino wrote: Hi all, i noticed a strange behaviour on my macine recently. Something is continuously filling up my root partition at a speed near 1k per minute. I have just few programs running and none of them should save that much information on the disk. Now the problem is that i have absolutely no idea of where to start to investigate. du? Anyone have ever got a similar problem? Not here. Thanks to all, Davide
RE: [gentoo-user] something is filling up the filesystem
Hi all, i noticed a strange behaviour on my macine recently. Something is continuously filling up my root partition at a speed near 1k per minute. I have just few programs running and none of them should save that much information on the disk. Now the problem is that i have absolutely no idea of where to start to investigate. I would consider checking if something is logging a lot, I have had some programs far too verbose with its logs filling up /var/log du -h /var/log Anyone have ever got a similar problem? Thanks to all, Davide
Re: [gentoo-user] something is filling up the filesystem
Pupino schrieb am 30.11.2008 02:15: Hi all, i noticed a strange behaviour on my macine recently. Something is continuously filling up my root partition at a speed near 1k per minute. I have just few programs running and none of them should save that much information on the disk. Now the problem is that i have absolutely no idea of where to start to investigate. Anyone have ever got a similar problem? Thanks to all, Davide First I would try to search for files that have changed recently and than try to find out which program writes to them. find / -mmin -10 Lists files whose content has changed in the last ten minutes. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: [gentoo-user] something is filling up the filesystem
On Sunday 30 November 2008, Pupino wrote: Hi all, i noticed a strange behaviour on my macine recently. Something is continuously filling up my root partition at a speed near 1k per minute. I have just few programs running and none of them should save that much information on the disk. Now the problem is that i have absolutely no idea of where to start to investigate. Anyone have ever got a similar problem? Thanks to all, Davide are /var, or /tmp part of / or on their own partitions? do you use X as root?
Re: [gentoo-user] something is filling up the filesystem
lsof ? Il giorno dom, 30/11/2008 alle 01.15 +, Pupino ha scritto: Hi all, i noticed a strange behaviour on my macine recently. Something is continuously filling up my root partition at a speed near 1k per minute. I have just few programs running and none of them should save that much information on the disk. Now the problem is that i have absolutely no idea of where to start to investigate. Anyone have ever got a similar problem? Thanks to all, Davide signature.asc Description: Questa è una parte del messaggio firmata digitalmente
Re: [gentoo-user] something is filling up the filesystem
2008/11/30 Dio, James [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi all, i noticed a strange behaviour on my macine recently. Something is continuously filling up my root partition at a speed near 1k per minute. I have just few programs running and none of them should save that much information on the disk. Now the problem is that i have absolutely no idea of where to start to investigate. I would consider checking if something is logging a lot, I have had some programs far too verbose with its logs filling up /var/log du -h /var/log Anyone have ever got a similar problem? Thanks to all, Davide this was the right direction. i found a 13Gb /var/log/messages , really too big! The cause seems to be network related, probably fault of networkmanager or wicd as the file is full of: Nov 30 03:31:52 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: iv16=47b7 iv32=0005 Nov 30 03:31:52 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: Phase2 rc4key=47 67 b7 06 7b 87 14 96 0a ad 0a 14 af 0f 42 d5 Nov 30 03:31:53 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: data(len=56) 47 67 b8 60 05 00 00 00 a0 00 b5 3e f2 54 a3 34 11 d6 e4 db 1e 39 e5 c7 ad e3 16 fb 57 c9 3d d9 ca 8e da 49 db 8b b7 a0 e0 73 88 bc 6b e9 f2 d9 10 0f 26 01 b9 ab 3f 9c Nov 30 03:31:53 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: iv16=47b8 iv32=0005 Nov 30 03:31:53 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: Phase2 rc4key=47 67 b8 b5 2a 86 55 18 4d d4 c1 68 9c 7a 25 28 Nov 30 03:31:53 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: data(len=56) 47 67 b9 60 05 00 00 00 b1 43 0b 44 12 f8 a3 1a 4f e7 fe a2 8a 5b d9 05 32 80 ee 71 70 cc 88 63 06 70 9b b3 85 81 e2 09 36 4d 06 85 b7 24 30 a1 86 78 5a 3f 3a 31 c0 b7 Nov 30 03:31:53 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: iv16=47b9 iv32=0005 Nov 30 03:31:53 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: Phase2 rc4key=47 67 b9 fb 58 3c 31 d3 83 9c 0a 69 a8 d8 b9 7e Nov 30 03:31:53 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: data(len=56) 47 67 ba 60 05 00 00 00 00 88 96 27 61 0d ce 48 c9 32 94 45 6a 1f d9 8c ba 57 64 37 2f 12 1e 3f 34 36 c9 f9 d2 ae a7 0b a5 a8 01 8d 4e 1a ef 2d 43 21 10 6f 04 f1 f1 6e Nov 30 03:31:53 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: iv16=47ba iv32=0005 Nov 30 03:31:53 spaventapasseri TKIP decrypt: Phase2 rc4key=47 67 ba 71 d8 2c 38 80 14 ae ae bc 21 10 ad 7b So tomorrow i'll try to find out wich one is guilty and try find a remedy... (now it's 3 am, i'm a bit tired...) i'll post back. Thank you all for the quick help! Davide
