Re: [gentoo-user] Python 2.7 removal : problem with Firefox + Spidermonkey
On Fri, Jul 31, 2020 at 06:09:53PM -0400, james wrote > and it builds, robustly and without errors, but is still dependent on > python 2.7. > > > so your details do result in palemoon 28.11.0 without python 2.7 > attendances? Python 2.7 is still a build-time dependency. But rather than being provided by Portage, it's provided by the manually installed version. The manually installed version won't be touched by Portage. I have another idea. We already have firefox-bin and libreoffice-bin ebuilds where the compiled tarball is pulled down from upstream, and untarred. Would this work on Pale Moon? I guess it comes down to whether or not python 2.7 is a run-time dependancy as well as a build time dependency. I'll ask on the Pale Moon forum. If you want to go 100% manual you can actually pull down the tarball from http://linux.palemoon.org/download/mainline/ and extract it. Nice part is that you can pull down the tarball to say $HOME/pm/ and extract it, without root permissions. Point your program launcher to $HOME/pm/palemoon/palemoon (correct) and away you go. You can get fancy with multiple profiles. It doesn't splatter libs all over, so "uninstalling" consists of... rm -rf $HOME/pm/palemoon -- Walter Dnes I don't run "desktop environments"; I run useful applications
[gentoo-user] hplip network scanning port
I used to be able to scan on my gentoo box from an HP officejet pro on the network. This is now failing and i can see that the gentoo box is attempting to connect to TCP/6566 on the HP, but the HP is not listening on that port. Test command is; hp-scan -dhpaio:/net/HP_Officejet_Pro_8620?ip= Is 6566 scan attempt using the correct port? Nmap of the printer; PORT STATE SERVICE 80/tcpopen http 139/tcp open netbios-ssn 443/tcp open https 445/tcp open microsoft-ds 515/tcp open printer 631/tcp open ipp 3910/tcp open prnrequest 3911/tcp open prnstatus 6839/tcp open unknown 7435/tcp open unknown 8080/tcp open http-proxy 9100/tcp open jetdirect 9220/tcp open unknown 53048/tcp open unknown
[gentoo-user] kinda tight on time, what versions are good?
Kinda short on time to F with my system rn... Is GCC 10.2 any good or should I stay on 9.3? A few months ago I was in a squeeze play between the sound drivers and the video drivers on kernel 5.6. I even RMA'd my motherboard though there is a chance that it was only insability in the sound drivers that was the root problem, the thing is really tricky to configure, you need to make sure you have alsamixer pointed to the actual device and not the pulseaudio top... Symptom = wasn't setting volume on left channel audio out, couldn't find a way to fix it with alsamixer at the time. What is the latest kernel you can use with the current nvidia-drivers? If I can bump my kernel version to something on a stable branch just below that version, I'd like to version freeze for 6-8 months The kernel penguins like removing API calls that Nvidia drivers use because they don't like binary drivers. They had scored a pretty serious hit with version 5.7, so I'm not sure if nvidia was able to find a workaround. -- The vaccine is a LIE. #TheHonklerIsReal Powers are not rights.
Re: [gentoo-user] Python 2.7 removal : problem with Firefox + Spidermonkey
On 7/31/20 9:40 AM, Walter Dnes wrote: On Wed, Jul 29, 2020 at 08:01:33PM -0400, james wrote Me, palemoon is my fav browser and it seems to be long term stuck on python 2.7.. Any suggests on a more secure, feature rich browser other than palemoon would be interesting to me to at least test. Pale Moon is a Firefox fork and has inherited this dependancy from it. I used to build Pale Moon manually on an older 32-bit CentOS chroot. That CentOS version only went up to python 2.4, which did not work. I had to download a python 2.7 tarball and build it in the home dir (yes, it works). The Pale Moon build toolchain found it and it built OK. The steps are... # # Name it whatever you want mkdir pysource cd pysource wget https://www.python.org/ftp/python/2.7.18/Python-2.7.18.tar.xz tar xf Py* cd Python-2.7.18 # # Name it whatever you want ./configure --prefix=$HOME/py27 make # # "su" or "sudo" is not required in the next step. You have write # permission to your home directory. make install The "make" command may take while to build, depending on RAM and CPU in your machine. Afterwards you probably have to include... I just use this: /var/lib/layman/palemoon/www-client/palemoon and www-client/palemoon 28.11.0 installs without issue. Your method makes palemoon.28.11.0 install without any dependence on python.2_7 ? The package build/install for palemoon will not be part of portage.? (if I'm understanding what you have written). James
Re: [gentoo-user] Python 2.7 removal : problem with Firefox + Spidermonkey
On 7/31/20 9:50 AM, Walter Dnes wrote:
On Wed, Jul 29, 2020 at 08:01:33PM -0400, james wrote
Me, palemoon is my fav browser and it seems to be long term stuck on
python 2.7.. Any suggests on a more secure, feature rich browser
other than palemoon would be interesting to me to at least test.
Pale Moon is a Firefox fork and has inherited this dependancy from it.
I used to build Pale Moon manually on an older 32-bit CentOS chroot.
That CentOS version only went up to python 2.4, which did not work. I
had to download a python 2.7 tarball and build it in the home dir (yes,
it works). The Pale Moon build toolchain found it and it built OK. The
steps are...
#
# Name it whatever you want
mkdir pysource
cd pysource
wget https://www.python.org/ftp/python/2.7.18/Python-2.7.18.tar.xz
tar xf Py*
cd Python-2.7.18
#
# Name it whatever you want
./configure --prefix=$HOME/py27
make
#
# "su" or "sudo" is not required in the next step. You have write
# permission to your home directory.
make install
Interesting.
The "make" command may take while to build, depending on RAM and CPU
in your machine. Afterwards you probably have to include...
Explicitly, this will result in palemoon.28.11.0 being build, only
dependant on Python 3 ?
I just added a repo via layman:
/var/lib/layman/palemoon/www-client/palemoon
www-client/palemoon
Available versions: {M}(~)27.9.4[1] {M}**27.-r2[1]
(~)28.2.2*l^m[1] (~)28.3.0*l^m[1] 28.9.0.1*l[2] 28.9.0.2*l[2]
28.9.1*l[2] 28.9.2*l[2] 28.9.3*l[2] 28.10.0*l[2] 28.11.0
via [2] "palemoon" /var/lib/layman/palemoon
and it builds, robustly and without errors, but is still dependent on
python 2.7.
so your details do result in palemoon 28.11.0 without python 2.7
attendances?
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Local mail server
On 7/30/20 4:38 PM, Ralph Seichter wrote: * Grant Edwards: Pricing is based on what people are willing to pay. People are willing to pay extra for a static IPv6 address, therefore static IPv6 addresses cost extra. Somewhere, and some people. I'd be interested to hear from users who still need to pay extra for IPv6. Here in Germany IPv6 usually comes at not extra cost (I write "usually" because I don't know every single ISP here; some only operate in a particular city.) -Ralph For where I am, if you need a static IPv4 address (which I do) IPv6 is not available at all from my ISP... it's not a matter of paying. Dan
[gentoo-user] Re: Local mail server
On 2020-07-31, Grant Taylor wrote: > On 7/29/20 9:41 AM, Peter Humphrey wrote: >> Aren't all IPv6 addresses static? > > No. > > SLAAC and DHCPv6 are as dynamic as can be. Nit: DHCPv6 can be (and usually is) dynamic, but it doesn't have to be. It's entirely possible to have a static IP address that your OS (or firewall/router) acquires via DHCPv6 (or v4). [I set up stuff like that all the time.] -- Grant
[gentoo-user] Re: Local mail server
On 2020-07-31, Grant Taylor wrote: > On 7/30/20 5:38 PM, Ralph Seichter wrote: >> I'd be interested to hear from users who still need to pay extra >> for IPv6. > > I'd be willing, if not happy, to pay a reasonable monthly fee to be able > to get native IPv6 from my ISP. > > But it's 2020 and my ISP doesn't support IPv6 at all. :-( Some posts back, somebody mentioned what a "half way decent datacenter" would do (or something like that). There may be half way decent ISPs in the US, but I haven't seen one in over 20 years since the last one I was aware of stopped dealing with residential customers. They were a victem of the "race to the bottom" when not enough residential customers were willing to pay $10 per month over what Comcast or US-West was charging for half-assed, crippled internet access). -- Grant
[gentoo-user] Re: Local mail server
On 2020-07-31, Grant Taylor wrote: > On 7/29/20 5:23 PM, james wrote: >> Free static IPs? > > Sure. > > Sign up with Hurricane Electric for an IPv6 in IPv4 tunnel and request > that they route a /56 to you. It's free. #hazFun If I had a week with nothing to do, I'd love to try to get something like that working -- but, I assume you need a static IPv4 address. -- Grant
Re: [gentoo-user] Local mail server
On 7/31/20 12:38 PM, Grant Taylor wrote: On 7/30/20 3:05 AM, antlists wrote: From what little I understand, IPv6 *enforces* CIDR. Are you talking about the lack of defined classes of network; A, B, C, D, E?? Or are you talking about hierarchical routing? There is no concept of a class of network in IPv6. Hierarchical routing is a laudable goal, but it failed 15-20 years ago. Each customer is then given one of these 64-bit address spaces for their local network. So routing tables suddenly become extremely simple - eactly the way IPv4 was intended to be. Except that things didn't work out that way. Provider Independent addresses, multi-homing, and redundant routes mean that hierarchical routing failed 15-20 years ago. Many providers try to address things so that hierarchical routing is a thing within their network.? But the reality of inter-networking between providers means that things aren't as neat and tidy as this on the Internet. This may then mean that dynDNS is part of (needs to be) the IPv6 spec, because every time a client roams between networks, its IPv6 address HAS to change. Nope. It's entirely possible to have clients roam between IPv6 (and IPv4) networks without (one of) it's address(es) changing.? Mobile IP.? VPNs. Tunnels.? BGP Sure, the connection to the network changes as it moves from network to network.? But this doesn't mean that the actual IP address that's used by the system to communicate with the world changes. Take a look at IPv6 Provider Delegation.? At least as Comcast does it, means that you only have a link-local IPv6 address on the outside and a /56 on the inside of a network.? The world sees the globally routed IPv6 network on the inside and doesn't give 2? what the outside link-net IPv6 address is.? Comcast routes the /56 they delegate to you via the non-globally-routed IPv6 link-net IPv6 address. There are multiple ways to keep the same IP while changing the connecting link. I'd like to start with a basic list/brief description of these, please? James
Re: [gentoo-user] Local mail server
On 7/31/20 12:30 PM, Grant Taylor wrote: On 7/29/20 5:23 PM, james wrote: Free static IPs? Sure. Sign up with Hurricane Electric for an IPv6 in IPv4 tunnel and request that they route a /56 to you.? It's free.? #hazFun Great to know. I'll see what happens. Note:: here in the US, it may be easier and better, to just purchase an assignment, that renders them yours. Simply paying someone for IPs doesn't "render them yours" per say. agreed. I'd be shocked if you do not have to pay somebody residual fees, just like DNS. It is highly dependent on what you consider to be "residual fees". Does the circuit to connect you / your equipment to the Internet count? Usually, the circuit for connectivity and the other costs, are bundled by the ISP/bandwidth-carrier. Sure it get's more complicated with bypass, dark-fiber, IEC, and a myriad of other vendor solutions. What about the power to run said equipment? Comm gear is usually low power, but if they assign you a rack or whatever, then the accounting can tag you with hundreds per month for Air Conditioning, transport, etc etc. So I was not intending to go down that pathway of charges and fees. Does infrastructure you already have and completely paying for mean that adding a new service (DNS) to it costs (more) money? Yes, there is annual (however it works out) rental on the domain name. But you can easily host your own DNS if you have infrastructure to do so on. yep, at least (2) static IPs. Once running I'll find a similar bandwidth usage organization and swap DNS secondary services. Now days with all the issue wit CA and others similar/related issues. that might get complicated. (2) static IPs for (2) dns primary resolvers should get me going. My VPS provider offers no-additional-charge DNS services.? Does that mean that it's free?? I am paying them a monthly fee for other things. How you slice things can be quite tricky. Yep yep yep. So sense there seems to be interest from several folks, I'm all interested in how to do this, US centric. I think the simplest and most expedient is to get a Hurricane Electric IPv6-in-IPv4 tunnel. I agree, based on what you have shared. Another quesiton. If you have (2) blocks of IP6 address, can you use BGP4 (RFC 1771, 4271, 4632, 5678,5936 6198 etc ) and other RFC based standards? to manage routing and such multipath needs? Conceptually?? Sure. Minutia:? I don't recall at the moment if the same version of the BGP protocol handles both IPv4 and IPv6.? I think it does.? But I need more caffeine and to check things to say for certain.? Either way, I almost always see BGPv4 and BGPv6 neighbor sessions established independently. There is a fair bit more that needs to be done to support multi-path in addition to having a prefix. yep yep yep! Who enforces what carriers do with networking. Here in the US, I'm pretty sure it's just up to the the Carrier/ISP/bypass_Carrier/backhaul-transport company) Yep. There is what any individual carrier will do and then there's what the consensus of the Internet will do.? You can often get carriers to do more things than the Internet in general will do.? Sometimes for a fee. Sometimes for free.? It is completely dependent on the carrier. Verizon killing its email services: https://www.inquirer.com/philly/blogs/comcast-nation/Verizon-exiting-email-business.html Conglomerates with IP resources, pretty much do what they want, and they are killing the standards based networking. If I'm incorrect, please educated me, as I have not kept up in this space, since selling my ISP more than (2) decades ago. Well, it's probable not appropriate for me to "finger" specifics. But if you just learn about all the things some carriers are experimenting with, in the name of 5G, it is a wide variety experimentation, to put it mildly. Please elaborate on what you think the industry / conglomerates are doing that is killing the standards based networking. The trump-china disputes are only accelerating open standards for communications systems, including all things TCP/IP. Please elaborate. Forking the internet into 1.China & pals 2. European Member states. 3. USA and allies. "Some" folks would argue the mess with Certificate Authority (CA) provides an enormous venue for Nefarious activities. Some would say "the feds & company" would/are choosing instability, rather than enforceable rules, which include the (US) federal authorities. Their default is "hack the planet", as long as we get backdoors and other forms of access to everything. However this list has many very smart readers. I'm not going too deep. I will say that every RF chipset is deeply comprised and it takes millions of dollars in gear to delineate that. Believe what you want. But someone like you (Grant) could help guide and document a gentoo centric collective that provides for email services, secure/limited web servers and
Re: [gentoo-user] Local mail server
On 7/30/20 3:05 AM, antlists wrote: From what little I understand, IPv6 *enforces* CIDR. Are you talking about the lack of defined classes of network; A, B, C, D, E? Or are you talking about hierarchical routing? There is no concept of a class of network in IPv6. Hierarchical routing is a laudable goal, but it failed 15-20 years ago. Each customer is then given one of these 64-bit address spaces for their local network. So routing tables suddenly become extremely simple - eactly the way IPv4 was intended to be. Except that things didn't work out that way. Provider Independent addresses, multi-homing, and redundant routes mean that hierarchical routing failed 15-20 years ago. Many providers try to address things so that hierarchical routing is a thing within their network. But the reality of inter-networking between providers means that things aren't as neat and tidy as this on the Internet. This may then mean that dynDNS is part of (needs to be) the IPv6 spec, because every time a client roams between networks, its IPv6 address HAS to change. Nope. It's entirely possible to have clients roam between IPv6 (and IPv4) networks without (one of) it's address(es) changing. Mobile IP. VPNs. Tunnels. BGP Sure, the connection to the network changes as it moves from network to network. But this doesn't mean that the actual IP address that's used by the system to communicate with the world changes. Take a look at IPv6 Provider Delegation. At least as Comcast does it, means that you only have a link-local IPv6 address on the outside and a /56 on the inside of a network. The world sees the globally routed IPv6 network on the inside and doesn't give 2¢ what the outside link-net IPv6 address is. Comcast routes the /56 they delegate to you via the non-globally-routed IPv6 link-net IPv6 address. There are multiple ways to keep the same IP while changing the connecting link. -- Grant. . . . unix || die
Re: [gentoo-user] Local mail server
On 7/29/20 5:23 PM, james wrote: Free static IPs? Sure. Sign up with Hurricane Electric for an IPv6 in IPv4 tunnel and request that they route a /56 to you. It's free. #hazFun Note:: here in the US, it may be easier and better, to just purchase an assignment, that renders them yours. Simply paying someone for IPs doesn't "render them yours" per say. I'd be shocked if you do not have to pay somebody residual fees, just like DNS. It is highly dependent on what you consider to be "residual fees". Does the circuit to connect you / your equipment to the Internet count? What about the power to run said equipment? Does infrastructure you already have and completely paying for mean that adding a new service (DNS) to it costs (more) money? Yes, there is annual (however it works out) rental on the domain name. But you can easily host your own DNS if you have infrastructure to do so on. My VPS provider offers no-additional-charge DNS services. Does that mean that it's free? I am paying them a monthly fee for other things. How you slice things can be quite tricky. So sense there seems to be interest from several folks, I'm all interested in how to do this, US centric. I think the simplest and most expedient is to get a Hurricane Electric IPv6-in-IPv4 tunnel. Another quesiton. If you have (2) blocks of IP6 address, can you use BGP4 (RFC 1771, 4271, 4632, 5678,5936 6198 etc ) and other RFC based standards to manage routing and such multipath needs? Conceptually? Sure. Minutia: I don't recall at the moment if the same version of the BGP protocol handles both IPv4 and IPv6. I think it does. But I need more caffeine and to check things to say for certain. Either way, I almost always see BGPv4 and BGPv6 neighbor sessions established independently. There is a fair bit more that needs to be done to support multi-path in addition to having a prefix. Who enforces what carriers do with networking. Here in the US, I'm pretty sure it's just up to the the Carrier/ISP/bypass_Carrier/backhaul-transport company) Yep. There is what any individual carrier will do and then there's what the consensus of the Internet will do. You can often get carriers to do more things than the Internet in general will do. Sometimes for a fee. Sometimes for free. It is completely dependent on the carrier. Conglomerates with IP resources, pretty much do what they want, and they are killing the standards based networking. If I'm incorrect, please educated me, as I have not kept up in this space, since selling my ISP more than (2) decades ago. Please elaborate on what you think the industry / conglomerates are doing that is killing the standards based networking. The trump-china disputes are only accelerating open standards for communications systems, including all things TCP/IP. Please elaborate. -- Grant. . . . unix || die
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Local mail server
On 7/30/20 5:38 PM, Ralph Seichter wrote: I'd be interested to hear from users who still need to pay extra for IPv6. I'd be willing, if not happy, to pay a reasonable monthly fee to be able to get native IPv6 from my ISP. But it's 2020 and my ISP doesn't support IPv6 at all. :-( As such, I use a tunnel for IPv6. -- Grant. . . . unix || die
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Local mail server
On 7/29/20 1:28 PM, Grant Edwards wrote: I don't know what most ISPs are doing. I couldn't get IPv6 via Comcast (or whatever they're called this week) working with OpenWRT (probably my fault, and I didn't really need it). So I never figured out if the IPv6 address I was getting was static or not. Ya That was probably a DHCPv6 for outside vs DHCPv6 Provider Delegation (PD) issue. I remember running into that with Comcast. I think for a while, they were mutually exclusive on Comcast. There is DHPCv6 (I've implemented it), but I have no idea if anybody actually uses it. Even if they are using DHCPv6, they can be using it to hand out static addresses. I've seen DHCPv6 used many times. It can be stateless (in combination with SLAAC to manage the address) or stateful (where DHCPv6 manages the address). Either way, there is a LOT more information that can be specified with DHCPv6 that simple SLAAC doesn't provide. For a long time you couldn't dynamically determine DNS server IP addresses without DHCPv6 or static configuration. The assumption always seemed to be that switching to IPv6 meant the end of NAT That's what the IPv6 Zealots want you to think. and the end of dynamic addresses. Nope, not at all. -- Grant. . . . unix || die
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Local mail server
On 7/29/20 9:41 AM, Peter Humphrey wrote: Aren't all IPv6 addresses static? No. SLAAC and DHCPv6 are as dynamic as can be. Static is certainly an option. But I see SLAAC and DHCPv6 used frequently. -- Grant. . . . unix || die
Re: [gentoo-user] Python 2.7 removal : problem with Firefox + Spidermonkey
On Wed, Jul 29, 2020 at 08:01:33PM -0400, james wrote > Me, palemoon is my fav browser and it seems to be long term stuck on > python 2.7.. Any suggests on a more secure, feature rich browser > other than palemoon would be interesting to me to at least test. Pale Moon is a Firefox fork and has inherited this dependancy from it. I used to build Pale Moon manually on an older 32-bit CentOS chroot. That CentOS version only went up to python 2.4, which did not work. I had to download a python 2.7 tarball and build it in the home dir (yes, it works). The Pale Moon build toolchain found it and it built OK. The steps are... # # Name it whatever you want mkdir pysource cd pysource wget https://www.python.org/ftp/python/2.7.18/Python-2.7.18.tar.xz tar xf Py* cd Python-2.7.18 # # Name it whatever you want ./configure --prefix=$HOME/py27 make # # "su" or "sudo" is not required in the next step. You have write # permission to your home directory. make install The "make" command may take while to build, depending on RAM and CPU in your machine. Afterwards you probably have to include... I don't run "desktop environments"; I run useful applications
