Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Andrew Bernard]

Sorry, I can neither activate nor get updates for XP in my virtual 
machine with a proper licence. I'll bow out of this now.



Andrew


On 14/10/2022 3:21 pm, Andrew Bernard wrote:


OK./ I'm running up Windows XP 32 bit on a VM. I'll see if I can help out.

Re: another 'wrong type argument' error

[Werner LEMBERG]

>> So you checked all of LilyPond's dependencies and can guarantee
>> that it will stay like this forever?
> 
> I am on Big Sur (11.6) and I can still choose 10.9 as a deployment
> target.  [...]

>> I'm not going to work on anything. I have been alone trying to get
>> a build for macOS even though I don't even use Apple hardware and
>> other core developers do. It will take somebody willing to work on
>> this effort *and commit to maintaining it* because I don't think
>> it's a good idea to release something half-working.
> 
> In the spirit of my first comments in this email I’ll directly ask
> if the project needs help testing or working on the Mac build system
> at all?

Yes, we need help – namely for taking *permanent* care of the MacOS
releases in

  https://gitlab.com/lilypond/lilypond/-/releases

that have been built with the scripts in

  https://gitlab.com/lilypond/lilypond/-/tree/master/release

With 'permanent' I mean that the automatically created and released
binaries should be regularly tested on actual Mac hardware to check
whether they work as expected.  Jonas's fear is too real that some day
deployment support for older OS versions will break out of the blue,
unfortunately.

As Jonas writes: He isn't a MacOS users, and none of us main
developers is either.  It was a heroic effort of him to set up the
scripts, but details like handling deployment targets to make this
work on older MacOS versions needs a dedicated specialist.


Werner

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Andrew Bernard]

OK./ I'm running up Windows XP 32 bit on a VM. I'll see if I can help out.

Andrew

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Werner LEMBERG]

> I thought I had downloaded the Lilypond file from the list that you
> mentioned, but to make sure, I repeated the download and made sure I
> downloaded (lilypond-2.22.2-1.mingw.exe) from the list you suggested
> for 32 bits systems.  Unfortunately, I had the same result as the
> first time:
> 
> Error message: "The system cannot execute the specified program."  

OK.  So we have a first hint: the 32bit MinGW executable for 2.22.2
doesn't work on (your) XP at a very fundamental level.  I can now only
suggest that you search for the last executable that actually works on
Win XP.

* Just to be sure: Start with downloading the 2.10.33-1 bundle and
  check whether it works.  If it does, try 2.14.2, then 2.16.2, and so
  on.  Be careful, however, to move your original LilyPond
  installation temporarily out of the way (including binaries and
  DLLs) so that nothing gets overwritten accidentally.

* If 2.10.33-1 doesn't work, you are completely out of luck,
  unfortunately – it means that you got your binary elsewhere.  Note
  that we also have a 'cygwin' directory, with some binaries (and
  source bundles) up to 2.14.1-1, but it seems that you have to have a
  cygwin environment set up to run this, which you probably don't.


 Werner

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[David Wright]

On Fri 14 Oct 2022 at 00:16:39 (+), Dag Bergman wrote:
> > On Wed 12 Oct 2022 at 23:51:22 (+), Dag Bergman wrote:
> > > I have a Windows XP computer with Lilypond 2.10.25.  It works fine with 
> > > simple program codes and advanced code developed with earlier versions of 
> > > Lilypond.  It does not work so well when I try to use a newer program 
> > > developed with a later version of Lilypond, as I get many error messages. 
> > >  I therefore tried to install LilyPond-2.22.2, which is newer than the 
> > > versions of Lilypond the program were developed with.  It does not work 
> > > at all, however, and I get the error message: "The system cannot execute 
> > > the specified program."  It does not matter what code I try to run.

If "by code" you mean LilyPond source code, then no, it doesn't
matter, because the program doesn't start running, so it doesn't
even open the input file.

> > > What is the latest version of Lilypond that actually works on Windows XP?

That's probably something you will have to determine for yourself.
The way in which the mingw binaries are built appears to have changed
over the years, so I'd be wary of jumping straight from 2.10.25
to 2.22.2.

At the very least, I'd try installing 2.10.33, which appears to be
the final version of 2.10. That will test whether your error message
is merely caused by trying to run a downloaded file without performing
some essential step first (perhaps concerning Virus protection,
unblocking downloads, etc). After all, you might have forgotten what
you had to do, long ago when you installed 2.10.25. Googling "the
system cannot execute the specified program" yields various problems
and solutions that just might be relevant.

If you can run 2.10.33, then I'd try 2.18.2, which was the stable
version of LP for a long time, and is therefore well tested. It's
a version you could probably live with for a while.

If that runs, then try 2.22.2 again, particularly if you've discovered
any step that was necessary to get the previous versions to run. The
goal at this stage is to get "GNU LilyPond 2.22.2 Processing …"
emitted, regardless of what follows, error messages or otherwise.

> > > What is the reason for this?

My reasoning for using the versions mentioned is merely that I've
observed differing structures between these binaries. I know
nothing about mingw, and my observations could be no more relevant
than a suggestion to try tasting red, yellow or green tomatoes just
on the basis of their colour.

> > > What to do about it?

That depends on whether you get different behaviours of the system
using these versions of LilyPond. Step one is checking whether you
can run /any/ downloaded lilypond file at all, regardless of version.

All the above assumes that you're sticking with your old XP machine
(I don't know how important LP is among its mix of tasks).

Cheers,
David.

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Andrew Bernard]

Just saying I'm happy to help you out with XP etc but this is probably 
getting OT, so we could do it offline if you care to.


Andrew

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Andrew Bernard]

Each to his own. But allow me to mention that VueScan supports hundreds 
of scanners, it not every scanner, and provides a very good solution to 
that if you are ever interested.


It's unfair to say Microsoft has made network file sharing difficult 
(why would they try?). Millions of users have no issue. I can point you 
to some links to set it up if you have any interest.


I run XP just fine with VirtualBox under Windows for a colleague (who 
also likes XP). Of course you need a licence to run it (XP, not 
VirtualBox). It can be done.


Andrew



On 14/10/2022 11:16 am, Dag Bergman wrote:

I run Windows XP on an old computer because I love that operating system

RE: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Dag Bergman]

Thanks again Werner for your reply.

You stated in an earlier email: "You are trying to use a 64bit program in a 
32bit environment, which
always fails."

I thought I had downloaded the Lilypond file from the list that you mentioned, 
but to make sure, I repeated the download and made sure I downloaded 
(lilypond-2.22.2-1.mingw.exe) from the list you suggested for 32 bits systems.  
Unfortunately, I had the same result as the first time:

Error message: "The system cannot execute the specified program."  

Accordingly, it appears that if your latest statement (*All* versions given in 
my link are 32bit versions) is correct, I cannot have tried to use a 64bit 
program in a 32bit environment, as far as I can see, so there would have to be 
a different reason for that error message.

Thanks for all your kind help.

Dag



-Original Message-
From: Werner LEMBERG  
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2022 15:17
To: Dag Bergman 
Cc: lilypond-user@gnu.org
Subject: Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP


> How do I know which of the versions listed and offered for download
> are for 32 bits or 64 bits systems?

*All* versions given in my link are 32bit versions.  Recent 64bit
versions are provided on gitlab.  Note that we no longer provide 32bit
versions.


Werner





-Original Message-
From: Dag Bergman  
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2022 15:02
To: Werner LEMBERG 
Cc: lilypond-user@gnu.org
Subject: RE: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

Thanks Werner for your quick and elaborate reply.

I guess you are correct that the error messages I received are due to changes 
in the syntax between versions of Lilypond.  The problem is that using 
`convert-ly` would probably only work if running an old script with a later 
version of Lilypond.  In my case, I was running a script that was made with a 
later version of Lilypond than the one I had installed, so I guess `convert-ly` 
would not solve that problem.  I tried to solve it by installing a later 
version of Lilypond, but that was when I got the error message: "The system 
cannot execute the specified program."

If you are right that the file I downloaded from the list you mentioned is for 
64 bit systems, the question still is:

How do I know which of the versions listed and offered for download are for 32 
bits or 64 bits systems?

My old version, Lilypond 2.10.25, does work, so 32 bits versions have been 
created and offered in the past, so how to find the latest of those?

Thanks for your kind help.

Dag




-Original Message-
From: Werner LEMBERG  
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2022 06:35
To: Dag Bergman 
Cc: lilypond-user@gnu.org
Subject: Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP


> I have a Windows XP computer with Lilypond 2.10.25.  It works fine
> with simple program codes and advanced code developed with earlier
> versions of Lilypond.  It does not work so well when I try to use a
> newer program developed with a later version of Lilypond, as I get
> many error messages.

I guess this is mainly due to syntax changes in more recent LilyPond
versions.  Normally, you would run `convert-ly` (which is a Python
script) to update your the source code.

> I therefore tried to install LilyPond-2.22.2, which is newer than
> the versions of Lilypond the program were developed with.  It does
> not work at all, however, and I get the error message: "The system
> cannot execute the specified program."  It does not matter what code
> I try to run.
> 
> What is the reason for this?

You are trying to use a 64bit program in a 32bit environment, which
always fails.

> What to do about it?

To get the most recent version I guess you have to compile LilyPond
*and all its dependencies* by yourself - and I'm not sure whether this
is possible at all.  Contrary to MacPorts, which supports quite
ancient Mac computers, I'm not aware of a similar environment for
Windows XP that provides many Unix packages for Windows.

A fundamental problem is that the memory provided by 32bit
applications is often not sufficient for larger LilyPond scores.  This
is not a problem on Windows XP per se but with *all* 32bit versions of
LilyPond.  This is one of the reasons for no longer providing 32bit
binaries for LilyPond.

In general, AFAIK, we have never tried to build LilyPond directly on
Windows, not to mention Windows XP.  Instead, we always did (and still
do) a cross compilation on GNU/Linux.

> What is the latest version of Lilypond that actually works on
> Windows XP?

Good question.  You might try the last 32bit binaries, which can be
found at

  http://lilypond.org/download/binaries/mingw/


 Werner

RE: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Dag Bergman]

Hi David,

Thanks for your reply.

I run Windows 10 on a rather powerful Dell-Precision with an i7-7700HQ CPU and 
32.0 GB RAM.

I run Windows XP on an old computer because I love that operating system as it 
has a superior user interface to Windows 10.  XP makes much better use of the 
screen surface.  It has much better design of windows with a color pattern that 
makes it easy to see where one window ends and another window begins.  In 10, I 
very often click on the wrong thing because I don't see where the border is.  
There are many other user interface related reasons,  including the waste of 
time having to relearn how to do things or even never manage to figure out how 
to do things in 10 that were very easy to do in XP.

Other important reasons include that my expensive and well working side 
hardware (such as expensive scanners and printers) don't work with 10.

Finally, many of my favourite programs (that I know very well how to use) do 
not work on 10.  Some may have a later version that works on 10, but then at a 
cost to purchase and an even higher cost to learn to use, and often with loss 
of useful functionality.

I also failed to set up a virtual computer with XP on my Windows 10 computer.  
I have succeeded to run the Windows XP computer from inside the Windows 10 
computer, but...

I can't easily transfer files between my two computers, and have to use a 
USB-stick, as Microsoft has done everything it can to prevent easy sharing of 
files over a local network as I used to be able to do.  Accordingly, I wish to 
do my Lilypond work on the computer where I do my other related work on music.

Best regards

Dag




-Original Message-
From: David Wright  
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2022 17:25
To: Dag Bergman 
Cc: lilypond-user@gnu.org
Subject: Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

On Wed 12 Oct 2022 at 23:51:22 (+), Dag Bergman wrote:
> 
> I have a Windows XP computer with Lilypond 2.10.25.  It works fine with 
> simple program codes and advanced code developed with earlier versions of 
> Lilypond.  It does not work so well when I try to use a newer program 
> developed with a later version of Lilypond, as I get many error messages.  I 
> therefore tried to install LilyPond-2.22.2, which is newer than the versions 
> of Lilypond the program were developed with.  It does not work at all, 
> however, and I get the error message: "The system cannot execute the 
> specified program."  It does not matter what code I try to run.
> 
> What is the reason for this?

Can I take a step back and turn your question around—why are you
running XP at all? Presumably there's some important reason, but
surely it can't mean that this is the only machine available to you
(which would imply that you connect it to the internet).

> What to do about it?

It may depend on your answer to the previous question, and what the
machine is—you haven't said.

> What is the latest version of Lilypond that actually works on Windows XP?

Whether that matters depends on your answers to the previous two …

Cheers,
David.

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Andrew Bernard]

Still curious now about XP. There's no certainty next versions will work.

Andrew

On 14/10/2022 10:42 am, Dag Bergman wrote:

Thanks Karlin and Michael for your kind replies, and for considering how to 
test Lilypond versions on a Windows XP machine.

It appears to be far too complicated for you to do that and I only expected 
people to take the trouble to reply in case they already knew what was going 
on.  Thank you, though, for even considering to test, but I don't expect you to 
take that trouble.

RE: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Dag Bergman]

Thanks Karlin and Michael for your kind replies, and for considering how to 
test Lilypond versions on a Windows XP machine.

It appears to be far too complicated for you to do that and I only expected 
people to take the trouble to reply in case they already knew what was going 
on.  Thank you, though, for even considering to test, but I don't expect you to 
take that trouble.

To clarify, I had no problem to download the installation file from the 
Lilypond website, and it installed nicely and indicated with a message to that 
effect when it was ready.

My problem appeared when I called the program with a simple string, such as:

"Lilypond test1.ly" at the command prompt, which had worked fine with the 
earlier version (that had been fully removed before I installed the later 
version).

Best regards

Dag





-Original Message-
From: Karlin High  
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2022 16:36
To: Michael Hendry 
Cc: Dag Bergman ; lilypond-user@gnu.org
Subject: Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

On 10/13/2022 10:27 AM, Michael Hendry wrote:
> run legacy software on a Windows XP virtual machine

That reminds me -- Windows 7 Pro with its XP Mode based on Microsoft 
Virtual PC, that would be less of an ask.

I have remote access to one of those, but it is at a customer's place 
and is dedicated to doing batch-copying of files into NETBEUI shares for 
CNC controls still using that protocol. I better not use it for this 
testing effort. ;-)
-- 
Karlin High
Missouri, USA


-


-Original Message-
From: Karlin High  
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2022 15:36
To: Dag Bergman ; lilypond-user@gnu.org
Subject: Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

On 10/12/2022 6:51 PM, Dag Bergman wrote:
> I get the error message: “The system cannot execute the specified program.”

This seems like a pretty broad error. I see mentions of needing 
Right-Click -> Properties -> Unblock, to allow a downloaded executable 
to run.

Other cases involve system files or runtime libraries of some sort...



I am afraid sorting out issues like this is going to "come with the 
territory" of making operating systems keep working long after being 
abandoned by their producers. Sometimes people have major reasons for 
doing so, as in "hard binding to big equipment that costs more than a 
house to upgrade." When asking for help with them, though, the starting 
assumption in response will usually be that anything not working can be 
blamed on the expired system.

I could check my "fencerow" to see if any startable Windows XP machines 
remain in it for helping test this, but keep expectations near zero and 
allow at least a week.
-- 
Karlin High
Missouri

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Andrew Bernard]

Hello Dag,

As mentioned in my post Windows XP is way, way past any support from 
Microsoft (EOL 2009!). A couple of others have queried why it is 
necessary for you to be running this system also. Before people go to 
extraordinary lengths to source XP machines to try to help, would you 
ever so kindly explain the situation for us? If you simply must have XP, 
you could run it in a VM on a more recent Windows version. Then your 
Lilypond problems go away. Do let us know.



Andrew


On 14/10/2022 3:24 am, David Wright wrote:

Can I take a step back and turn your question around—why are you
running XP at all? Presumably there's some important reason, but
surely it can't mean that this is the only machine available to you
(which would imply that you connect it to the internet).

Re: Four eighth note beamed when first eighth note looks like a half note

[Knute Snortum]

On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 1:45 PM Aaron Hill  wrote:
>
> On 2022-10-13 1:31 pm, Knute Snortum wrote:
> > I have a situation that seems like it would be straightforward.  I
> > want four eighth notes beamed with the first eighth looking like a
> > half note.  I thought I could just do this:
> >
> > { b2*1/4[ b'8 b' b'] }
> >
> > But that code doesn't attach the beam to the first note and produces
> > two warnings:
> >
> > warning: stem does not fit in beam
> > warning: beam was started here
> >
> > What am I doing wrong?
>
> Does this help?
>
> 
> { \tweak duration-log 1 b8[ b' b' b'] }
> 
>
> -- Aaron Hill

It certainly does!  Thank you, and I have a new arrow in my quiver!

--
Knute Snortum

Re: Four eighth note beamed when first eighth note looks like a half note

[Aaron Hill]

On 2022-10-13 1:31 pm, Knute Snortum wrote:

I have a situation that seems like it would be straightforward.  I
want four eighth notes beamed with the first eighth looking like a
half note.  I thought I could just do this:

{ b2*1/4[ b'8 b' b'] }

But that code doesn't attach the beam to the first note and produces
two warnings:

warning: stem does not fit in beam
warning: beam was started here

What am I doing wrong?


Does this help?


{ \tweak duration-log 1 b8[ b' b' b'] }


-- Aaron Hill

Four eighth note beamed when first eighth note looks like a half note

[Knute Snortum]

I have a situation that seems like it would be straightforward.  I
want four eighth notes beamed with the first eighth looking like a
half note.  I thought I could just do this:

{ b2*1/4[ b'8 b' b'] }

But that code doesn't attach the beam to the first note and produces
two warnings:

warning: stem does not fit in beam
warning: beam was started here

What am I doing wrong?

--
Knute Snortum

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[David Wright]

On Wed 12 Oct 2022 at 23:51:22 (+), Dag Bergman wrote:
> 
> I have a Windows XP computer with Lilypond 2.10.25.  It works fine with 
> simple program codes and advanced code developed with earlier versions of 
> Lilypond.  It does not work so well when I try to use a newer program 
> developed with a later version of Lilypond, as I get many error messages.  I 
> therefore tried to install LilyPond-2.22.2, which is newer than the versions 
> of Lilypond the program were developed with.  It does not work at all, 
> however, and I get the error message: "The system cannot execute the 
> specified program."  It does not matter what code I try to run.
> 
> What is the reason for this?

Can I take a step back and turn your question around—why are you
running XP at all? Presumably there's some important reason, but
surely it can't mean that this is the only machine available to you
(which would imply that you connect it to the internet).

> What to do about it?

It may depend on your answer to the previous question, and what the
machine is—you haven't said.

> What is the latest version of Lilypond that actually works on Windows XP?

Whether that matters depends on your answers to the previous two …

Cheers,
David.

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Karlin High]

On 10/13/2022 10:27 AM, Michael Hendry wrote:

run legacy software on a Windows XP virtual machine


That reminds me -- Windows 7 Pro with its XP Mode based on Microsoft 
Virtual PC, that would be less of an ask.


I have remote access to one of those, but it is at a customer's place 
and is dedicated to doing batch-copying of files into NETBEUI shares for 
CNC controls still using that protocol. I better not use it for this 
testing effort. ;-)

--
Karlin High
Missouri, USA

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Michael Hendry]

On 13 Oct 2022, at 15:35, Karlin High  wrote:

> 
> On 10/12/2022 6:51 PM, Dag Bergman wrote:
>> I get the error message: “The system cannot execute the specified program.”
> 
> This seems like a pretty broad error. I see mentions of needing Right-Click 
> -> Properties -> Unblock, to allow a downloaded executable to run.
> 
> Other cases involve system files or runtime libraries of some sort...
> 
> 
> 
> I am afraid sorting out issues like this is going to "come with the 
> territory" of making operating systems keep working long after being 
> abandoned by their producers. Sometimes people have major reasons for doing 
> so, as in "hard binding to big equipment that costs more than a house to 
> upgrade." When asking for help with them, though, the starting assumption in 
> response will usually be that anything not working can be blamed on the 
> expired system.
> 
> I could check my "fencerow" to see if any startable Windows XP machines 
> remain in it for helping test this, but keep expectations near zero and allow 
> at least a week.
> -- 
> Karlin High
> Missouri, USA
> 

I uses Parallels Desktop on my (64-bit) iMac to run legacy software on a 
Windows XP virtual machine to access data which I can’t readily transfer to an 
up-to-date requirement.

I have downloaded the lilypond-2.23.6-1.mingw.exe file but I’m not how to 
install it to test whether it works.

Michael

Re: another 'wrong type argument' error

[David Kastrup]

David Wright  writes:

> No problem for a 1.5GHz 32-bit processor with 512MB memory.
> BTW the term "plain x86" is almost meaningless. For a start,
> are you talking about the processor, or the architecture?
> Debian's "amd64" architecture is still an x86, just 64-bit.

Well, for one thing one should not rely on a mathematical coprocessor.
It was optional (and not exactly cheap) with the 80386.  And yes, I did
run Linux (and previously UNIX) on an 80SX386, the 8-bit bus version of
the 80386 processor, though mainly as a thin client to a full-fledged
80486 server with a whopping 16MB of RAM and a SCSI hard disk with over
100MB of capacity.

I think we used Interactive UNIX and Coherent UNIX before converging on
Linux when it became useable (which was a surprisingly short time after
it became available first, something like 1 or 2 years).

-- 
David Kastrup

Re: another 'wrong type argument' error

[David Wright]

On Mon 10 Oct 2022 at 12:06:11 (+0100), Wols Lists wrote:
> On 10/10/2022 06:43, Jean Abou Samra wrote:
> > The problem isn’t LilyPond’s or its dependencies’ support for older macOS, 
> > which is better than even the system support. The real problem is Apple 
> > preventing you from upgrading your computer past a certain macOS version.
> 
> Which is probably down to newer versions of MacOS taking advantage of
> new chip features.
> 
> Linux drops support for older chips over time - it's almost impossible
> to get a distro that supports plain x86 any more ...

Hmm. My 2004 Acer Travelmate is currently running Debian/stable with
Linux acer 5.10.0-18-686 #1 SMP Debian 5.10.140-1 (2022-09-02) i686 GNU/Linux
and it can run FireFox, but slowly. Linux 5.10 is a longterm release;
kernel.org currently shows support until December 2026. The Debian/testing
installation manual still shows i386 support for their ~2023 release.

With the Travelmate, I just ran the source for K310 supplied in
https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2020-10/msg00344.html
on Debian/stable's 2.22 i386 version, and the PDF output is visually
indistinguishable from that produced by 2.23.10 on current hardware.
Here's the log:

09:47:37 /tmp$ lily -d K-310 # -d selects the Debian-installed version of LP
/usr/bin/lilypond -dno-point-and-click K-310.ly
GNU LilyPond 2.22.0
Processing `K-310.ly'
Parsing...
Interpreting 
music...[8][16][24][32][40][48][56][64][72][80][88][96][104][112][120][128]
Preprocessing graphical objects...
Interpreting music...[8][16][24][32][40][48][56][64][72][80][88]
Preprocessing graphical objects...
Interpreting music...
warning: type check for `beatStructure' failed; value `1' must be of type `list'
[8][16][24][32][40][48][56][64][72][80][88][96][104][112][120][128][136][144][152][160][168][176][184][192][200][208][216][224][232][240][248]
Preprocessing graphical objects...
Finding the ideal number of pages...
Fitting music on 19 or 20 pages...
Drawing systems...
Converting to `K-310.pdf'...
Success: compilation successfully completed
09:48:31 /tmp$ 

No problem for a 1.5GHz 32-bit processor with 512MB memory.
BTW the term "plain x86" is almost meaningless. For a start,
are you talking about the processor, or the architecture?
Debian's "amd64" architecture is still an x86, just 64-bit.

> Because Apple has
> far tighter integration between computer and OS, they can more easily
> upgrade in lock-step.

Cheers,
David.

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Karlin High]

On 10/12/2022 6:51 PM, Dag Bergman wrote:

I get the error message: “The system cannot execute the specified program.”


This seems like a pretty broad error. I see mentions of needing 
Right-Click -> Properties -> Unblock, to allow a downloaded executable 
to run.


Other cases involve system files or runtime libraries of some sort...



I am afraid sorting out issues like this is going to "come with the 
territory" of making operating systems keep working long after being 
abandoned by their producers. Sometimes people have major reasons for 
doing so, as in "hard binding to big equipment that costs more than a 
house to upgrade." When asking for help with them, though, the starting 
assumption in response will usually be that anything not working can be 
blamed on the expired system.


I could check my "fencerow" to see if any startable Windows XP machines 
remain in it for helping test this, but keep expectations near zero and 
allow at least a week.

--
Karlin High
Missouri, USA

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Werner LEMBERG]

> How do I know which of the versions listed and offered for download
> are for 32 bits or 64 bits systems?

*All* versions given in my link are 32bit versions.  Recent 64bit
versions are provided on gitlab.  Note that we no longer provide 32bit
versions.


Werner

Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Hendursaga]

Andrew Bernard  writes:

> Not exactly a supported platform nowadays. [...]

I would be curious if (older) LilyPond versions would work under ReactOS[1]..

~ Hendursaga

[1] https://reactos.org/

RE: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Dag Bergman]

Thanks Karlin for your quick reply.

Yes, I used the first link you asked about and found it in the list that your 
second link leads to.

I will try the other two versions you suggested, but if all versions in that 
list are only for 64 bits system (if I understood Werner's reply correctly), 
they will not work either.  I clearly need to get hold of the latest 32 bits 
version, and I don't know which that is and how to get it.

Best regards

Dag


-Original Message-
From: Karlin High  
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2022 04:33
To: Dag Bergman 
Cc: lilypond-user@gnu.org
Subject: Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

Which link did you use? This one?



The full collection of past downloads is here:



Try 2.20 or 2.18 if a fresh download of 2.22 doesn't work.
-- 
Karlin High
Missouri, USA

RE: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP

[Dag Bergman]

Thanks Werner for your quick and elaborate reply.

I guess you are correct that the error messages I received are due to changes 
in the syntax between versions of Lilypond.  The problem is that using 
`convert-ly` would probably only work if running an old script with a later 
version of Lilypond.  In my case, I was running a script that was made with a 
later version of Lilypond than the one I had installed, so I guess `convert-ly` 
would not solve that problem.  I tried to solve it by installing a later 
version of Lilypond, but that was when I got the error message: "The system 
cannot execute the specified program."

If you are right that the file I downloaded from the list you mentioned is for 
64 bit systems, the question still is:

How do I know which of the versions listed and offered for download are for 32 
bits or 64 bits systems?

My old version, Lilypond 2.10.25, does work, so 32 bits versions have been 
created and offered in the past, so how to find the latest of those?

Thanks for your kind help.

Dag




-Original Message-
From: Werner LEMBERG  
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2022 06:35
To: Dag Bergman 
Cc: lilypond-user@gnu.org
Subject: Re: LilyPond-2.22.2 does not work on Windows XP


> I have a Windows XP computer with Lilypond 2.10.25.  It works fine
> with simple program codes and advanced code developed with earlier
> versions of Lilypond.  It does not work so well when I try to use a
> newer program developed with a later version of Lilypond, as I get
> many error messages.

I guess this is mainly due to syntax changes in more recent LilyPond
versions.  Normally, you would run `convert-ly` (which is a Python
script) to update your the source code.

> I therefore tried to install LilyPond-2.22.2, which is newer than
> the versions of Lilypond the program were developed with.  It does
> not work at all, however, and I get the error message: "The system
> cannot execute the specified program."  It does not matter what code
> I try to run.
> 
> What is the reason for this?

You are trying to use a 64bit program in a 32bit environment, which
always fails.

> What to do about it?

To get the most recent version I guess you have to compile LilyPond
*and all its dependencies* by yourself – and I'm not sure whether this
is possible at all.  Contrary to MacPorts, which supports quite
ancient Mac computers, I'm not aware of a similar environment for
Windows XP that provides many Unix packages for Windows.

A fundamental problem is that the memory provided by 32bit
applications is often not sufficient for larger LilyPond scores.  This
is not a problem on Windows XP per se but with *all* 32bit versions of
LilyPond.  This is one of the reasons for no longer providing 32bit
binaries for LilyPond.

In general, AFAIK, we have never tried to build LilyPond directly on
Windows, not to mention Windows XP.  Instead, we always did (and still
do) a cross compilation on GNU/Linux.

> What is the latest version of Lilypond that actually works on
> Windows XP?

Good question.  You might try the last 32bit binaries, which can be
found at

  http://lilypond.org/download/binaries/mingw/


 Werner

Re: another 'wrong type argument' error

[Alex Harker]

On 10 Oct 2022, at 20:29, Jonas Hahnfeld  wrote:

> Yes, I build on macOS 10.15 and it will work on versions newer than
> that, as also announced with the first release of this infrastructure:
> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2022-02/msg00155.html

I wanted to say that I didn’t mean to cause any friction in raising this issue 
about min deployment targets. I did my first serious project in lilypond in 
2021 and was super impressed with what I was able to achieve in terms of custom 
notation / layout etc. It’s an excellent project, and when recently moving to a 
newer MacOS the lack of as easy a route to running it was a little frustrating 
- I’m just interested in it being as available as possible to different people. 
I’m personally very grateful to anyone working on it for maintaining something 
so valuable.

>> I read that SDK 10.14.1 supports 10.9 as the oldest version 
> 
> So you checked all of LilyPond's dependencies and can guarantee that it
> will stay like this forever?

I am on Big Sur (11.6) and I can still choose 10.9 as a deployment target. FWIW 
I consider that to be a little beyond what I’d normally support (10.11 is about 
my cutoff), but it is still possible. In terms of the dependencies, that was 
the thing that I hadn’t considered detail  and it really depends how the build 
system works how much hassle it would be - if this can be set in one place then 
it would be straightforward to try, if it’s a matter of the individual 
dependencies approach to building then it’s totally different. As far as I can 
reason any incompatibility should break at compile time, however, rather than 
runtime, as this is about hooks in OS routines, and not any of the other code. 
It looks (from above) like a MacPorts build for 10.13 does currently work.

> For the record, the easier variant of this setting is the environment
> variable MACOSX_DEPLOYMENT_TARGET.

That makes sense - that’s what you’d set in Xcode - I just went directly for 
the clang/llvm docs and I wasn’t sure if it was an alias, but an environment 
variable would be easiest.

>> Whatever Jonas is able to manage with his build setup,
> 
> I'm not going to work on anything. I have been alone trying to get a
> build for macOS even though I don't even use Apple hardware and other
> core developers do. It will take somebody willing to work on this
> effort *and commit to maintaining it* because I don't think it's a good
> idea to release something half-working.

In the spirit of my first comments in this email I’ll directly ask if the 
project needs help testing or working on the Mac build system at all? I would 
be interested in helping out if it is needed, and I maintain and work on some 
other open source projects (https://github.com/AlexHarker 
 / https://github.com/iPlug2/iPlug2 
), with Mac as my main platform for 
development.

Jonas - thanks for your work on the Mac builds. It is appreciated here and I’m 
sure by lots of other people.

Alex