Market space for a 16-bit linux product?
A question for linux-8086 list readers: With such OS vendors as QNX looking to become at least partially open, do you think there is a space in the embedded systems marketplace for an open source 16-bit processor Linux variant (like ELKS) with TCP/IP protocol stack? Could you ever imagine that it could grab a significant share of this marketplace? After all, there exists MINIX and open-source 11Kb kernels for microcontrollers with TCP/IP stack and all... Look forward to hearing some comments. Eli Liang
Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product?
On Fri, 9 Jun 2000, Eli Liang wrote: A question for linux-8086 list readers: With such OS vendors as QNX looking to become at least partially open, do you think there is a space in the embedded systems marketplace for an open source 16-bit processor Linux variant (like ELKS) with TCP/IP protocol stack? Could you ever imagine that it could grab a significant share of this marketplace? After all, there exists MINIX and open-source 11Kb kernels Now when Minix is Open Source, minix code can get incorporated into ELKS and the reverse is also true. JAkob
Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product?
After all, there exists MINIX and open-source 11Kb kernels for microcontrollers with TCP/IP stack and all... 11K with tcp/ip - I've not seen that. 11K core oh and its 30K for TCP minimum but we didnt tell you until you asked I have seen ;)
Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product?
- Original Message - From: "Alan Cox" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "Eli Liang" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 09, 2000 9:24 AM Subject: Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product? After all, there exists MINIX and open-source 11Kb kernels for microcontrollers with TCP/IP stack and all... 11K with tcp/ip - I've not seen that. 11K core oh and its 30K for TCP minimum but we didnt tell you until you asked I have seen ;) Seems to me there will always be space for lotsa sixteen-, eight- and four-bit stuff with the clean good lines that we associate with Linux. Maybe, however, the credit should go to KR, rather than to Linus. -dlj.
Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product?
At 10:38 PM 6/8/00 -0400, David Lloyd-Jones wrote: Seems to me there will always be space for lotsa sixteen-, eight- and four-bit stuff with the clean good lines that we associate with Linux. Indeed. Just because you have a fast Alpha or i686 doesn't stop the pleasure of hacking with an old Z80 or 8086 for that matter. Maybe, however, the credit should go to KR, rather than to Linus. or both
Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product?
On Fri, 9 Jun 2000, Alan Cox wrote: 11K with tcp/ip - I've not seen that. 11K core oh and its 30K for TCP minimum but we didnt tell you until you asked I have seen ;) Have you seen WebACE? http://world.std.com/~fwhite/ace/ It does bit-banging-serial, SLIP, TCP, IP, ICMP, HTTP, dynamically generated web pages, and controlling an external port based on the URL submitted to it in 454 instructions on an 8 pin microcontroller! Okay, so it's not exactly a general purpose OS with a TCP/IP stack, and the stack is far from RFC compliant (there isn't enough RAM for that), but it's very cool just the same (and it isn't a joke either- I have the source code). --- Linux- the choice of a GNU generation. -- : Alex Holden (M1CJD)- Caver, Programmer, Land Rover nut, Radio Ham : http://www.linuxhacker.org/
Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product?
Essentially, you are looking at this from a traditional capitalist mentality. We are no longer there. In the Microcosm, in the "information age", information is the commodity and there, to some extent is an unlimited 'market space'. You aren't here creating an operating system, per se, but informational raw materials. From this products will be made and niches will be filled. This may enable someone to create a product where there was no capability before. Minix is fine, but where is it hacked and 'supported' on this scale? And as was said before, that is just more raw material for the fire. Linux/Elks is free to the end user and developer. That leaves the developer and integrator free to concentrate on the end user product or system while receiving "free" RD. Everything becomes faster, smaller, cooler, and cheaper in the microcosm as it gets more complex. -Mike -Original Message- From: Alex Holden [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Alan Cox [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Eli Liang [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, June 09, 2000 1:23 PM Subject: Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product? On Fri, 9 Jun 2000, Alan Cox wrote: 11K with tcp/ip - I've not seen that. 11K core oh and its 30K for TCP minimum but we didnt tell you until you asked I have seen ;) Have you seen WebACE? http://world.std.com/~fwhite/ace/ It does bit-banging-serial, SLIP, TCP, IP, ICMP, HTTP, dynamically generated web pages, and controlling an external port based on the URL submitted to it in 454 instructions on an 8 pin microcontroller! Okay, so it's not exactly a general purpose OS with a TCP/IP stack, and the stack is far from RFC compliant (there isn't enough RAM for that), but it's very cool just the same (and it isn't a joke either- I have the source code). --- Linux- the choice of a GNU generation. -- : Alex Holden (M1CJD)- Caver, Programmer, Land Rover nut, Radio Ham : http://www.linuxhacker.org/
Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product?
Essentially, you are looking at this from a traditional capitalist mentality. We are no longer there. In the Microcosm, in the "information age", information is the commodity and there, to some extent is an unlimited 'market space'. You aren't here creating an operating system, per se, but informational raw materials. From this products will be made and niches will be filled. This may enable someone to create a product where there was no capability before. Minix is fine, but where is it hacked and 'supported' on this scale? And as was said before, that is just more raw material for the fire. Linux/Elks is free to the end user and developer. That leaves the developer and integrator free to concentrate on the end user product or system while receiving "free" RD. Everything becomes faster, smaller, cooler, and cheaper in the microcosm as it gets more complex. -Mike -Original Message- From: Alex Holden [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Alan Cox [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Eli Liang [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, June 09, 2000 1:23 PM Subject: Re: Market space for a 16-bit linux product? On Fri, 9 Jun 2000, Alan Cox wrote: 11K with tcp/ip - I've not seen that. 11K core oh and its 30K for TCP minimum but we didnt tell you until you asked I have seen ;) Have you seen WebACE? http://world.std.com/~fwhite/ace/ It does bit-banging-serial, SLIP, TCP, IP, ICMP, HTTP, dynamically generated web pages, and controlling an external port based on the URL submitted to it in 454 instructions on an 8 pin microcontroller! Okay, so it's not exactly a general purpose OS with a TCP/IP stack, and the stack is far from RFC compliant (there isn't enough RAM for that), but it's very cool just the same (and it isn't a joke either- I have the source code). --- Linux- the choice of a GNU generation. -- : Alex Holden (M1CJD)- Caver, Programmer, Land Rover nut, Radio Ham : http://www.linuxhacker.org/
