RE: [maemo-users] RE: [maemo-developers] Future features for Maemo Desktop
On tis, 2006-08-29 at 12:52 -0300, ext Alessandro Ikeuchi wrote: I wish the Notes instead of Maemopad. My english is so bad? Sorry. May be in portuguese: Eu quero o código fonte do Notes, o Maemopad não me interessa... E eu quero que você também explique o motivo de gtk_text_buffer_insert_at_cursor(mybuffer, \u00E3, -1); não funcionar para Unicode. Não afronte minha inteligência, você não tem nada a ganhar com isso... Could *PLEASE* stop cross-posting between maemo-users and maemo-devel? If you intend to continue flaming, please keep the flames on one list. Regards: David -- A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Maemo alarms == retutime
On mån, 2006-07-31 at 14:17 +0200, ext Nils Faerber wrote: [snip] OK, where does that lead us now? Do I understand this right that you/Nokia have an implementation, right? And this implementation is still locked in some desk because it is not ready for production (yet), right? No, it's under active development here, and as soon as it works as expected well pass it through legal checks and unleash it onto the unsuspecting Maemo community. *Muahahaha!* (ehrm). Well, then I would propose two steps: - First, document somewhere what *is* existing concerning alarm with the current IT2006 edition, no matter how limited it is. This issue has been a FAQ for almost a year now and it would help to avoid n-th times asked questions. /mnt/initfs/usr/sbin/retutime --help The retutime tool has been mentioned several times on this list as far I can remember, and trying `--help' doesn't require that big of a leap of imagination, eh? - Second put that internal implementation somewhere so that it can be enhanced and productised by the community, like e.g. Garage. If you do not do so I see the danger that the community might not be willing to wait for a next IT2007 edition which might eventually have the framework in place (or may not). But instead we might end up with double effort, i.e. the community develops such a framework, uses it until you/Nokia release your version and the community version will become obsolete - very annoying. Well, it all boils down to manpower. It might seem that it's an easy enough thing to just release things into the public and let the community to the rest, but everything has to go through the Nokia legal machinery before this can happen, thus the work needed is pretty significant. At the moment we prefer using our time to make the new alarm framework as good as possible (which will be properly documented). Regards: David -- A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Maemo alarms == retutime
On mån, 2006-07-31 at 13:01 +0200, ext Nils Faerber wrote: [snip] Well, that is just half of the game, I am afraid. Google indeed points to a post by Jason Mills: http://maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2006-January/002437.html In this post Jason also sais: ... 4) The osso_alarm and osso_notifier daemons are missing at least from the 2005.51 Nokia build. ... I think what Chris, me and others are really looking for is the alarm framework for application notification, not the mere RTC alarm. There is no alarm framework There must be, at least I hope, a clean way to - set an alarm by an application No clean way. Retutime is the only way to set alarm, with all its limitations. - get notified when alarm is reached Nope. - remove a pending alarm Retutime. - do not conflict with other alarms (in case two aplications set alarms) That's easy, but not pretty. Since the only available means of setting alarms are through retutime, and retutime in turn depends on the hardware capabilities only, alarms are max 24h into the future, and only one can be set. Regards: David -- A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Maemo alarms == retutime
On mån, 2006-07-31 at 13:29 +0200, ext Nils Faerber wrote: Weinehall David (Nokia-M/Tampere) schrieb: On mån, 2006-07-31 at 13:01 +0200, ext Nils Faerber wrote: [snip] Well, that is just half of the game, I am afraid. Google indeed points to a post by Jason Mills: http://maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2006-January/002437.html In this post Jason also sais: ... 4) The osso_alarm and osso_notifier daemons are missing at least from the 2005.51 Nokia build. ... I think what Chris, me and others are really looking for is the alarm framework for application notification, not the mere RTC alarm. There is no alarm framework Uff! I would have expected such framework after the longish discussions on the mailinglist some time ago (effectively more than half a year ago). Since there isn't any calendar application in the 2006 software edition, management didn't really prioritise a sane alarm interface. Every other limitation follows from that. Regards: David -- A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] device powers on at 8am every day?
On tor, 2006-07-06 at 11:10 -0700, ext George Farris wrote: On Thu, 2006-06-07 at 10:49 -0700, Collin R. Mulliner wrote: Hi, I have a very strange bug/feature. My device (running IT2006 final) powers on every day at 8am. I don't have an alarm set in the clock application, so what could this be? To be clear, this happens while the device is shutdown and the cover is over the display. Any ideas, may be I miss a new feature? Interesting. I also experience auto power on. For example: Every evening I turn my 770 off before going to bed. I know it was off as I checked this morning before I left the house. When I got to work I pulled the 770 out of my pocket and there it was on. This isn't the first time this has happened. No it was not turned on in my pocket. I have turned it off at night and come back in the morning and it has been on, very weird. I have set an alarm before but don't have one set now unless once you set it the 770 never ever goes off again:-( Try removing the battery for an hour or so, to let the backup battery lose the time (you'll have to set your clock again after this), then insert the battery again and see if you have the same problem. If this solution works, it's probably a bug in the alarm software that does not reset the RTC-alarm after the alarm has been acknowledged. Regards: David -- A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Frustrating power downs...
On ons, 2006-05-03 at 09:42 +0200, ext Nils Faerber wrote: Martin Mueller wrote: Hi, Wup! On Tue, May 02, 2006 at 01:59:32PM +0200, Nils Faerber wrote: Does anybody else see this happening? Yes, me. Ah, puh, at least I am not alone ;) Are there any hints on what might be tha cause? It happened to my device when I had a lot of 3rd-party packages installed. I reflashed it from scratch and did only install xterm. It still reboots randomly but doesn't power off anymore. I test it in this configuration since around 10 days now and didn't have a power off. Last time it happened I had an uptime of 10 days :( Good luck that your's keeps up now! Some of the software on the device is run by a software lifeguard that either reboots the device when the software crashes, or tries to respawn it a certain number of times, then reboots the device if this fails. So my guess is that something causes one of those to crash. Examples of software that run with this kind of policy is the X-server, bme, mce, and the dsp software. The problem is that tracking down this kind of bugs is extremely tricky unless you can somehow come up with a reproducible way of triggering the bug (even if it takes 10 days the bug can still be located with the proper tools if there's a reproducible way to trigger it). So any further input is *warmly* accepted. Regards: David ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Frustrating power downs...
On ons, 2006-05-03 at 09:42 +0200, ext Nils Faerber wrote: Martin Mueller wrote: Hi, Wup! On Tue, May 02, 2006 at 01:59:32PM +0200, Nils Faerber wrote: Does anybody else see this happening? Yes, me. Ah, puh, at least I am not alone ;) Are there any hints on what might be tha cause? It happened to my device when I had a lot of 3rd-party packages installed. I reflashed it from scratch and did only install xterm. It still reboots randomly but doesn't power off anymore. I test it in this configuration since around 10 days now and didn't have a power off. Last time it happened I had an uptime of 10 days :( Good luck that your's keeps up now! Oh, one more thing: did you restore any backups, or was the device completely standard except for that xterm? Regards: David ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Frustrating power downs...
On ons, 2006-05-03 at 11:15 +0200, ext Martin Mueller wrote: On Wed, May 03, 2006 at 12:01:43PM +0300, Weinehall David (Nokia-M/Tampere) wrote: Oh, one more thing: did you restore any backups, or was the device completely standard except for that xterm? It reboots about every second day without installing anything except xterm and copying over the opera bookmarks manually as well as editing the opera rc-file to make the zoom buttons scroll up and down. Later (about 4 days ago, when I took it with me away from my home) I restored the backup from the .51 release since I was too lazy to reenter all the WEP keys. That didn't change anything sigificantly. It would be nice, if the software could report the reboot or poweroff reason in some logfile (maybe it does and I didn't find it). It should be noted that there is a big difference between poweroff and reboot. If the device reboots, it is very likely a software error; usually triggered by memory leaks or system essential software dying. Shutdowns on the other hand are usually caused by an empty (or near-empty) battery, or hardware errors (empty battery should cause a clean shutdown, hardware errors a non-clean shutdown). So, when reporting this kind of problems, please *clearly* state whether you're having problems with the device powering off or with reboots. They are generally two completely disjoint sets of problems. Regards: David ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Too busy to accept help? I'm not complaining
On ons, 2006-04-19 at 13:06 -0700, ext Shawn Gordon wrote: [snip] faster because it is done, has been used, refined, debugged and developed for for years, so other than device drivers in the kernel it wouldn't have taken hardly any time at all to get it up and running. cheaper - I'm assuming cheaper based on what I know of the licensing costs and the costs to hire a bunch of developers for years to develop and support the software. Nokia is not going to just rely on the open source community for something that they depend on, they will certainly have their own developers and these are going to be far more expensive than simply paying a small per unit license cost (I'm talking ones of dollars per unit). Just using plain Qtopia wouldn't have been an option, just as using plain GTK+ without Hildon wasn't an option; we had to use a UI that looks somewhat like Nokia's earlier products, without forking too wildly. So the work effort would've been the same either way; the difference being that Qtopia would've incurred the added penalties of a licensing cost, C++, and of course the extra legal issues surrounding the fact that Qtopia is GPL, not LGPL. The Nokia legal process is not a smoothly operating machine, it's more akin to the Spanish inquisition... [snip] The world is only black and white if you filter out the greys by deliberately ignoring to see some things and are not privy to other things. Regards: David ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Abuse on the ApplicationCatalog page
On ons, 2006-04-05 at 01:15 -0700, ext Aaron Levinson wrote: On Wed, 5 Apr 2006, Weinehall David (Nokia-M/Tampere) wrote: [snip] Also, whether or not this application belongs on the Application Catalog page, it's still appropriate to consult with the author before deleting an entry (something that is difficult to do if anyone can modify the Wiki without registering). Doing otherwise, as the individual has done who has repeatedly deleted this entry, demonstrates a lack of common courtesy. I can agree that we need some sort of rules about what stays and what goes, and only non-anonymous access, but needing to contact the author before removing something defeats the whole purpose of a wiki. Regards: David ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] 770 display failure workaround
On ons, 2006-03-29 at 13:41 +0200, ext Philippe Laporte wrote: Hi, I'm not quite sure why you adopt such an antagonistic attitude. I would bet you 1000 Euros, and I am not rich, that the Nokia kernel team has a workaround patch. Yeah, because it's so much more profitable for Nokia to replace devices than provide a software fix. Ehrm. NOT. Just face it, you're off chart here. Even though my grand plan may be evasive to some, it should be obvious thta I am trying tyo pressure Nokia into allocating time to provide the code for the patch. The reason for not having it in the device: you are convinced that if any reason would exist, you would be personaly aware of it? The LCD hasn't failed. The reference here is http://www.maemo.org/maemowiki/HowDoiBecomeRoot The article you reference to quite clearly says: If you get this, there is a hardware failure in your device and you need to return it and get a replacement -- VilleRanki That failure is probably not related to any software-actions. Displays like the one of the 770 tend to break at powerup. But if yours survived the first 5 or 10 times, it should survive the rest, too In other words, the display has the highest likelihood of breaking the first few times you power cycle the device. That's when most people (well, at least the developers) enable the RD mode. People see broken display, and draw the conclusion O, broken display when I enabled RD-mode, must be a software bug. This is incorrect reasoning though. The display is faulty, not the software. Bottom line: STOP TROLLING! Oh, and PLEASE don't top-post. Regards: David Weinehall (and YES, I work for Nokia/OSSO) ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] 770 display failure workaround
On ons, 2006-03-29 at 14:06 +0200, ext Philippe Laporte wrote: [snip] I give you a couple of days...keep working...until the guy who told there is a patch says there isn't I will stand by my ground. Looking forward to it. We could save a lot of money with such a fix. Oh, and PLEASE don't top-post. What does that mean? Top-posting means that you post the comment to a block of text before that block, which breaks the flow of thought when reading the email. Example: A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? Regards: David ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [Jamvm-general] Re: [maemo-developers] J2ME on Nokia 770
On tis, 2006-03-07 at 15:26 +0100, ext Philippe Laporte wrote: Michael Koch wrote: On Tue, Mar 07, 2006 at 02:49:32PM +0100, Philippe Laporte wrote: Well then we all want to know what Nokia's legions of lawyers have to say...:-) I'm sure they will introduce just another opinion. ok, but what assets does FSF have to lose...? Freedom? Regards: David Weinehall [not speaking for Nokia] ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] device lock bypass in charging mode
On tis, 2006-02-07 at 19:01 +, ext Adam Laurie wrote: I just noticed that if I power off my 770 but plug it into the charger before it's completely off, or power it off while already plugged into the charger (basically so you end up with the charging logo on the screen), it never goes into lock mode, so can be powered back up after any length of time without having to enter the security code... IMHO this is not expected behaviour... It's indeed not expected behaviour, but it's a known bug that I fixed recently... Regards: David weinehall ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] device lock bypass in charging mode
On ons, 2006-02-08 at 11:18 +, ext Jonathan Matthews-Levine wrote: [snip] Is there anything I should have done to my bug #332 (https://maemo.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=332) to kick it into someone's workflow, or is it just waiting for someone to pick it up? [It *is* related to the same sort of locking area that this thread started with, so I'm not feeling /too/ guilty ... :-)] Well, this is a policy issue rather than a coding issue; we know how to fix it, but it remains to be decided whether or not this behaviour should be modified, hence the apparent inactivity on this bug. Regards: David ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Maemo Alarm/Notifier Interface
On mån, 2006-01-16 at 20:46 +0100, ext Frantisek Dufka wrote: snip] Why not let users shutdown easily? Because you keep the state and don't need to boot the device through tons of /etc/rcx.D/* (and do it in advance without user noticing anything) to handle single alarm and then shutdown it again. Because with proper suspend (or should it be called standby?) instead of poweroff you may save enough battery to have it look like real poweroff without any ill effects. Because this is a PDA or 'Internet Tablet' not unix server that can take minutes to boot or shutdown and noone cares because you do it once per several years. We already do the power saving part, we already have all the positive side effects of keeping alive -- but *if* the user wants to do a proper shutdown, which will allow him to keep the device alive even longer than usual -- let them. It's not going to hurt you one single bit -- you're not forced to use the functionality just because it's there... Current 'Switch off!' mode should be something people should do only when the want to put the device to drawer for months and want the battery charged (which you could do by removing battery anyway). On ipaq you have very awkward key combo for this mode buried deep in manual on page noone reads. Not directly in menu on device. And yes in this mode alarms are not supposed to wake up the device :-) I don't really think we should consider iPaq as a reference point of brilliant design... I definitely expect my devices to wake up from sleep even when they're off. Hell, my phone(s) wakes up from sleep even when it's off. Yours probably does too. Power management efficient enough to make suspend meaningless If the suspend is taken as replacement of poweroff the reason is here because it should pause the device in the midle of playing video or sound. Take it as the current 'Lock touchscreen and keys' plus pausing sound and network plus anything that takes power or keeps state that is useless after couple of minutes. Maybe suspending tasks is not needed after all just send them different signal so they know device will be paused for many minutes and may wake up in different environment so they should really finish/stop what they do. So it is probably about more device modes than current offline or flight mode (are they same?) and normal. Introducing something like that would mean that we'd need to modify all programs to handle custom signals. As a side note: yes, at the moment, offline mode and flight mode are the same, that may not remain so. I cannot really understand why a lot of people here seem to want crippled functionality just because other platforms have limitations. Instant poweron and proper pausing of everything when you press one button is not crippled functionality but very simple and neat thing Palm devices do and people expect. If you want the kind of soft poweroff you talk about, try putting the cover on your device some time... Whoops! It pauses video playback! It disconnects network connections!. And if you really want the audio playback to be disabled too when the cover is closed (personally I find it a quite nice that it keeps playing), we can hack that up just for you, no problem. All this said, the powerkeymenu is going to be redesigned to allow for custom actions, and an action that emulates soft powerup by doing enable keypadlock + offline mode + pause sound playback should be trivial enough to implement. Regards: David Weinehall ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Maemo Alarm/Notifier Interface
On mån, 2006-01-16 at 15:58 +0100, ext Frantisek Dufka wrote: Nils Faerber wrote: I also guess that most Palms and alike behave the same - off is off. Only exception from that rule I know of are (some) mobile phones. No in PalmOS off is not off. On Tungsten T2 you can set it to be waked up by initiating bluetooth connection with it when it is 'off'. You can also schedule alarm procedure which gets executed and the display is even not waked up if you wish. Unlike with N770 you really can't shutdown PalmOS and battery is not removable in most units so there is not this type of problem there. Solution for N770 would be to remove the poweroff item to make it behave like PalmOS and maybe also implement suspend in kernel which pauses all tasks and powers off unneeded hardware. But the current system is also good, just don't let users shutdown the device so easily. Why?!? A mechanism for wake-up from power-off exists (yes, it's a bit sucky, so we'll have to have a workaround for alarms 24h into the future, but at least it's possible) -- check Power management efficient enough to make suspend meaningless -- check I cannot really understand why a lot of people here seem to want crippled functionality just because other platforms have limitations. Regards: David Weinehall ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
RE: [maemo-developers] flasher (Linux) doesn't find device
On tor, 2005-10-27 at 14:06 +0200, ext Martin Grimme wrote: Hello, Am Donnerstag, den 27.10.2005, 14:38 +0300 schrieb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Yes, always start flashing by first turning off the device. Then you connect the usb cable, start flasher with parameters like (whatever you prefer), my usual parameters are: ./flasher -F rootimagename -f --enable-rd-mode --enable-usb-host-mode --set-rd-flags=serial-console and only after that you switch the device on with the power button. Is there a description somewhere about the available rd-flags and what they do? Yes. Just do flasher --set-rd-flags Regards: David Weinehall ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] No response from developer device program?
On tis, 2005-07-05 at 21:01 -0300, ext Gustavo Barbieri wrote: On 7/5/05, Weinehall David (Nokia-M/Tampere) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As far as I know, yes. As long as the address is still available on the web page, you can still send an application =) What's the web page URL? http://maemo.org/news/25052005.html Regards: David Weinehall ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] What is dsme?
On fre, 2005-06-17 at 13:39 +0200, ext Florian Boor wrote: Hello, some of the startup scripts (e.g. gconf-daemon.sh) try to execute a dsmetool located in /usr/sbin. I couldn't find any source package which contains it. What is it and where do i get it? I guess i need it to create working maemo filesystems with OpenEmbedded. DSME is the Device State Management Entity, and dsmetool monitors is basically a process lifeguard. It's not currently released under a free license =( All init-scripts that lack an alternative invocation of start-stop-daemon instead of dsmetool when dsmetool isn't installed should be bug-reported. Regards: David Weinehall ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
