Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Jim Devine]

I think I've figured this out. The problem is that when I got rid of
Norton, I had a firewall -- i.e., the one that comes with Windows XP
-- that blocks unwanted incoming stuff, but doesn't block unwanted
exports of information.

On top of that, Norton (virus that it is) had insinuated itself into
the firewall control panel so that it warned me of this one-sided
protection by telling me that its anti-worm program was needed. (If
Norton is a virus, so is Windows. So it's a virus within a virus.)

So what I did was to install a free firewall (by COMODO) that blocks
both unwanted imports and unwanted exports. The only problem is that
you have to teach it which information is desired. (It objected to
Firefox the first time.) I turned off Windows' built-in firewall, so
that I should get no more of the Norton warnings.

On 3/26/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

thanks. I'll get to it when I'm at home with the Norton-infected PC. I
already use AVG, which seems like an excellent program.

On 3/26/07, ravi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Jim Devine wrote:
> > On 3/25/07, ravi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> By message do you mean one of those transient pop-up windows?
> >
> > it's very transient. If I click on it, as it tells me to do, I go to
> > the Windows security center.
> >
>
> Perhaps then the message is not from Norton at all? Windows XP (and I am
> sure future versions) come with a built-in manager for firewall,
> security ,etc. It is possible that Norton registered itself with this
> manager as the anti-virus solution, and now that Norton is gone, Windows
> is trying to helpfully keep warning you that it knows of no virus
> manager on your system. You should be able to find the Windows Security
> system (there is an icon usually in the "system tray" that you can click
> on, and if not, you may find it in Start->Settings->Control Panel). Once
> there hopefully there is an option to not worry about the lack of a
> anti-virus component. Speaking of which, I hope you are not planning on
> running a Windows system without some form of AV software? There are at
> least two good free programs available (search for AVG and ClamAV).
>
> I am not a Windows person, and in fact no longer even have the one old
> box that I used to dual boot to Windows just so I can figure out what is
> going on in the Windows world. So please take my advice with a large
> spoon of salt.
>
> --ravi
>


--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger




--
Jim Devine / "Segui il tuo corso, e lascia dir le genti." (Go your own
way and let
people talk.) -- Karl, paraphrasing Dante.

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Jim Devine]

thanks. I'll get to it when I'm at home with the Norton-infected PC. I
already use AVG, which seems like an excellent program.

On 3/26/07, ravi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Jim Devine wrote:
> On 3/25/07, ravi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> By message do you mean one of those transient pop-up windows?
>
> it's very transient. If I click on it, as it tells me to do, I go to
> the Windows security center.
>

Perhaps then the message is not from Norton at all? Windows XP (and I am
sure future versions) come with a built-in manager for firewall,
security ,etc. It is possible that Norton registered itself with this
manager as the anti-virus solution, and now that Norton is gone, Windows
is trying to helpfully keep warning you that it knows of no virus
manager on your system. You should be able to find the Windows Security
system (there is an icon usually in the "system tray" that you can click
on, and if not, you may find it in Start->Settings->Control Panel). Once
there hopefully there is an option to not worry about the lack of a
anti-virus component. Speaking of which, I hope you are not planning on
running a Windows system without some form of AV software? There are at
least two good free programs available (search for AVG and ClamAV).

I am not a Windows person, and in fact no longer even have the one old
box that I used to dual boot to Windows just so I can figure out what is
going on in the Windows world. So please take my advice with a large
spoon of salt.

--ravi




--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[ravi]

Jim Devine wrote:
> On 3/25/07, ravi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> By message do you mean one of those transient pop-up windows?
>
> it's very transient. If I click on it, as it tells me to do, I go to
> the Windows security center.
>

Perhaps then the message is not from Norton at all? Windows XP (and I am
sure future versions) come with a built-in manager for firewall,
security ,etc. It is possible that Norton registered itself with this
manager as the anti-virus solution, and now that Norton is gone, Windows
is trying to helpfully keep warning you that it knows of no virus
manager on your system. You should be able to find the Windows Security
system (there is an icon usually in the "system tray" that you can click
on, and if not, you may find it in Start->Settings->Control Panel). Once
there hopefully there is an option to not worry about the lack of a
anti-virus component. Speaking of which, I hope you are not planning on
running a Windows system without some form of AV software? There are at
least two good free programs available (search for AVG and ClamAV).

I am not a Windows person, and in fact no longer even have the one old
box that I used to dual boot to Windows just so I can figure out what is
going on in the Windows world. So please take my advice with a large
spoon of salt.

--ravi

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Leigh Meyers]

Is it a message from Windows or Norton?

Windows security center will do this if it still thinks that Norton is
on your computer and not functioning correctly or shut off... BTW, did
you search for hidden folders in your quest to remove Norton by the
roots? Documents&setings/application data is one place that I'm pretty
sure Norton/Symantec maintains folders... sometimes it the important
stuff, that why the folder is hidden. Look in 'All Users'.

It couldn't hurt to check the firewall settings for any allowed Norton
or Symantec product and delete them from the allowed list. Windows
might be seeing an entry for an open port that isn't in use and
through whatever means figure out that it is open due to the norton
install/un-install.

I'm starting to run out of options.

Leigh


On 3/26/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

On 3/25/07, ravi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> By message do you mean one of those transient pop-up windows?

it's very transient. If I click on it, as it tells me to do, I go to
the Windows security center.

> The
> problem is probably that Norton's background process is not uninstalled
> (when you try to) because it is running. You could bring up Task Manager
> (right click on the taskbar and choose Task Manager) and find and kill
> the Norton process. Unfortunately, you are going to have to guess its
> name. What sort of system are you running? Windows 98? XP? 2000? Vista?
> Do you have administrative rights to the computer?

XP, yes I'm the administrator (but not, it seems, the decider).
--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Jim Devine]

On 3/25/07, ravi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

By message do you mean one of those transient pop-up windows?


it's very transient. If I click on it, as it tells me to do, I go to
the Windows security center.


The
problem is probably that Norton's background process is not uninstalled
(when you try to) because it is running. You could bring up Task Manager
(right click on the taskbar and choose Task Manager) and find and kill
the Norton process. Unfortunately, you are going to have to guess its
name. What sort of system are you running? Windows 98? XP? 2000? Vista?
Do you have administrative rights to the computer?


XP, yes I'm the administrator (but not, it seems, the decider).
--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Leigh Meyers]

On 3/25/07, ravi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:



By message do you mean one of those transient pop-up windows? The
problem is probably that Norton's background process is not uninstalled
(when you try to) because it is running. You could bring up Task Manager
(right click on the taskbar and choose Task Manager) and find and kill
the Norton process. Unfortunately, you are going to have to guess its
name. What sort of system are you running? Windows 98? XP? 2000? Vista?
Do you have administrative rights to the computer?

--ravi



If the registry entries are all gone and the folders have been removed
everywhere (including hidden folders like Documents &
Settings/Application Data/All Users (and your user name too) Norton
shouldn't know what to do.

Make sure to look for hidden folders and files

I'd like to think that after ALL that there aren't any Norton related
processes that could have started on bootup, but it can't hurt to
check.

Here's one to look for... Lucomserver, it's the live update 'phone
home' function.

Also, if you find the offending routine, you kill it, and it comes
back, try starting the computer in 'safe' mode, kill the process if it
even started, then seach the file name and while the process isn't
running delete the file and any other Norton and Symantec entries in
the registry.

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[ravi]

At around 25/3/07 11:08 pm, Jim Devine wrote:
> I've done everything -- including buying and installing Registry
> Mechanic -- and the problem remains!
>
 On 3/24/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I took Norton/Symantech anti-virus (etc.) off my PC after
> long frustration. But I still got a message from Norton
> saying that my PC is vulnerable to worms. So I went to the
> Norton page and found and ran
> a program that allegedly gets rid of all Norton programs
> (created, I think, due to a lawsuit against Norton). But I
> still get a message from Norton saying that my PC is
> vulnerable to worms.
>

By message do you mean one of those transient pop-up windows? The
problem is probably that Norton's background process is not uninstalled
(when you try to) because it is running. You could bring up Task Manager
(right click on the taskbar and choose Task Manager) and find and kill
the Norton process. Unfortunately, you are going to have to guess its
name. What sort of system are you running? Windows 98? XP? 2000? Vista?
Do you have administrative rights to the computer?

--ravi

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Jim Devine]

I've done everything -- including buying and installing Registry
Mechanic -- and the problem remains!

BTW, there's a great old e-mail post that circulated a few years ago
that says that MS Windows is a virus.

On 3/25/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

thanks. I'll tell you if it works.

On 3/24/07, joel blau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Leigh Meyers wrote:
> > Ah Norton, the anti-virus that IS one. Runner-up... ZoneAlarm
> >
> > OK, I can tell you how, but you'll need to install a registry cleaner
> > like Cclean, Registry Mechanic or regvac.
> >
> > Use it to clean your registry.
> >
> > With Registry Mechanic, use the defaults. I'm fond of Registry
> > Mechanic, it's never done anything untowards to my computer. You
> > should be ok with the freebie version that doesn't remove certain
> > items. Those items aren't relevant.
> >
> > Cclean is also good, and it's top quality, professional, free/begware
> > . Check ALL the boxes in the
> > 'Issues' section.
> >
> > I have both and use them regularly... Cclean installs a right-click
> > menu on the trash bin. A convienient way to clean temp files and keeps
> > the web browsing experience snappy.
> >
> > Now:
> >
> > What you do, and I KNOW it sounds brutal, is search your computer for
> > the words Symantec and then Norton... no particular order, and DELETE
> > EVERYTHING. That's right, folders and all, by the roots.
> >
> > If 'delete' balks at a file because it's in use, don't fret, skip it,
> > it won't be in use in about 15 minutes.
> >
> > Next, use registry Mechanic, or whichever you choose and scan
> > everything that is scannable temp folders, everything. After you get
> > the results, clean everything.
> >
> > Now, reboot... the computer wiill cough and sputter, and you may get a
> > bounch of error messages. The computer WILL start.
> >
> > Now, run the registry cleaner again.
> >
> > Search again for the N word and the S word.
> >
> > They should be deletable now
> >
> > Registry clean one more time.
> >
> > That should do it.
> >
> >
> > Vaya Con Dios
> >
> >
> > I had the same problem, and the Dell tech person (from India) sent me
> > to SmitFraud fix. The viruses disappeared. I'd confirm this strategy
> > with someone who knows more, but it did work for me.
>
> Joel Blau
>
>
>
>
> > For DOG'S sake, make sure you have SOME antivirus software on tour
> > computer.
> >
> > On 3/24/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> I took Norton/Symantech anti-virus (etc.) off my PC after long
> >> frustration. But I still got a message from Norton saying that my PC
> >> is vulnerable to worms. So I went to the Norton page and found and ran
> >> a program that allegedly gets rid of all Norton programs (created, I
> >> think, due to a lawsuit against Norton). But I still get a message
> >> from Norton saying that my PC is vulnerable to worms.
> >>
> >> what to do?
> >>
> >> --
> >> Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
> >> -- C. P. Kindleberger
> >>
> >
>


--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger




--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Leigh Meyers]

This might be overkill, but the only other thing, after you do all the
other stuff,  ==>if you feel lucky (as in Clint Eastwood 'lucky') and
confident playing with the guts of the registry<== , would be to
physically check the registry with windows regedit, to manually find &
delete everything still linked to the N and S words.

There shouldn't be too many... if any.

Then registry clean again.


Leigh

On 3/25/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

thanks. I'll tell you if it works.

On 3/24/07, joel blau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Leigh Meyers wrote:
> > Ah Norton, the anti-virus that IS one. Runner-up... ZoneAlarm
> >
> > OK, I can tell you how, but you'll need to install a registry cleaner
> > like Cclean, Registry Mechanic or regvac.
> >
> > Use it to clean your registry.
> >
> > With Registry Mechanic, use the defaults. I'm fond of Registry
> > Mechanic, it's never done anything untowards to my computer. You
> > should be ok with the freebie version that doesn't remove certain
> > items. Those items aren't relevant.
> >
> > Cclean is also good, and it's top quality, professional, free/begware
> > . Check ALL the boxes in the
> > 'Issues' section.
> >
> > I have both and use them regularly... Cclean installs a right-click
> > menu on the trash bin. A convienient way to clean temp files and keeps
> > the web browsing experience snappy.
> >
> > Now:
> >
> > What you do, and I KNOW it sounds brutal, is search your computer for
> > the words Symantec and then Norton... no particular order, and DELETE
> > EVERYTHING. That's right, folders and all, by the roots.
> >
> > If 'delete' balks at a file because it's in use, don't fret, skip it,
> > it won't be in use in about 15 minutes.
> >
> > Next, use registry Mechanic, or whichever you choose and scan
> > everything that is scannable temp folders, everything. After you get
> > the results, clean everything.
> >
> > Now, reboot... the computer wiill cough and sputter, and you may get a
> > bounch of error messages. The computer WILL start.
> >
> > Now, run the registry cleaner again.
> >
> > Search again for the N word and the S word.
> >
> > They should be deletable now
> >
> > Registry clean one more time.
> >
> > That should do it.
> >
> >
> > Vaya Con Dios
> >
> >
> > I had the same problem, and the Dell tech person (from India) sent me
> > to SmitFraud fix. The viruses disappeared. I'd confirm this strategy
> > with someone who knows more, but it did work for me.
>
> Joel Blau
>
>
>
>
> > For DOG'S sake, make sure you have SOME antivirus software on tour
> > computer.
> >
> > On 3/24/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> I took Norton/Symantech anti-virus (etc.) off my PC after long
> >> frustration. But I still got a message from Norton saying that my PC
> >> is vulnerable to worms. So I went to the Norton page and found and ran
> >> a program that allegedly gets rid of all Norton programs (created, I
> >> think, due to a lawsuit against Norton). But I still get a message
> >> from Norton saying that my PC is vulnerable to worms.
> >>
> >> what to do?
> >>
> >> --
> >> Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
> >> -- C. P. Kindleberger
> >>
> >
>


--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Jim Devine]

thanks. I'll tell you if it works.

On 3/24/07, joel blau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Leigh Meyers wrote:
> Ah Norton, the anti-virus that IS one. Runner-up... ZoneAlarm
>
> OK, I can tell you how, but you'll need to install a registry cleaner
> like Cclean, Registry Mechanic or regvac.
>
> Use it to clean your registry.
>
> With Registry Mechanic, use the defaults. I'm fond of Registry
> Mechanic, it's never done anything untowards to my computer. You
> should be ok with the freebie version that doesn't remove certain
> items. Those items aren't relevant.
>
> Cclean is also good, and it's top quality, professional, free/begware
> . Check ALL the boxes in the
> 'Issues' section.
>
> I have both and use them regularly... Cclean installs a right-click
> menu on the trash bin. A convienient way to clean temp files and keeps
> the web browsing experience snappy.
>
> Now:
>
> What you do, and I KNOW it sounds brutal, is search your computer for
> the words Symantec and then Norton... no particular order, and DELETE
> EVERYTHING. That's right, folders and all, by the roots.
>
> If 'delete' balks at a file because it's in use, don't fret, skip it,
> it won't be in use in about 15 minutes.
>
> Next, use registry Mechanic, or whichever you choose and scan
> everything that is scannable temp folders, everything. After you get
> the results, clean everything.
>
> Now, reboot... the computer wiill cough and sputter, and you may get a
> bounch of error messages. The computer WILL start.
>
> Now, run the registry cleaner again.
>
> Search again for the N word and the S word.
>
> They should be deletable now
>
> Registry clean one more time.
>
> That should do it.
>
>
> Vaya Con Dios
>
>
> I had the same problem, and the Dell tech person (from India) sent me
> to SmitFraud fix. The viruses disappeared. I'd confirm this strategy
> with someone who knows more, but it did work for me.

Joel Blau




> For DOG'S sake, make sure you have SOME antivirus software on tour
> computer.
>
> On 3/24/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> I took Norton/Symantech anti-virus (etc.) off my PC after long
>> frustration. But I still got a message from Norton saying that my PC
>> is vulnerable to worms. So I went to the Norton page and found and ran
>> a program that allegedly gets rid of all Norton programs (created, I
>> think, due to a lawsuit against Norton). But I still get a message
>> from Norton saying that my PC is vulnerable to worms.
>>
>> what to do?
>>
>> --
>> Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
>> -- C. P. Kindleberger
>>
>




--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Leigh Meyers]

On 3/24/07, joel blau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


>
>
> I had the same problem, and the Dell tech person (from India) sent me
> to SmitFraud fix. The viruses disappeared. I'd confirm this strategy
> with someone who knows more, but it did work for me.


I'm assuming the message Jim is getting is related to the Norton
anti-virus wanting to 'LiveUpdate' etc, not that Norton is warning of
an actual intrusion... just the potential of intrusion.

The LiveUpdate functions, and a bunch of other crap, gets left behind
when you un-install Norton, and it still 'phones home', so to speak.
That's where the notice comes from.

If you follow it's leads, you'll end up re-installing Norton AV.

VIral marketing (snicker), or should I say 'fear of viral' marketing.

Leigh\

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[joel blau]

Leigh Meyers wrote:

Ah Norton, the anti-virus that IS one. Runner-up... ZoneAlarm

OK, I can tell you how, but you'll need to install a registry cleaner
like Cclean, Registry Mechanic or regvac.

Use it to clean your registry.

With Registry Mechanic, use the defaults. I'm fond of Registry
Mechanic, it's never done anything untowards to my computer. You
should be ok with the freebie version that doesn't remove certain
items. Those items aren't relevant.

Cclean is also good, and it's top quality, professional, free/begware
. Check ALL the boxes in the
'Issues' section.

I have both and use them regularly... Cclean installs a right-click
menu on the trash bin. A convienient way to clean temp files and keeps
the web browsing experience snappy.

Now:

What you do, and I KNOW it sounds brutal, is search your computer for
the words Symantec and then Norton... no particular order, and DELETE
EVERYTHING. That's right, folders and all, by the roots.

If 'delete' balks at a file because it's in use, don't fret, skip it,
it won't be in use in about 15 minutes.

Next, use registry Mechanic, or whichever you choose and scan
everything that is scannable temp folders, everything. After you get
the results, clean everything.

Now, reboot... the computer wiill cough and sputter, and you may get a
bounch of error messages. The computer WILL start.

Now, run the registry cleaner again.

Search again for the N word and the S word.

They should be deletable now

Registry clean one more time.

That should do it.


Vaya Con Dios


I had the same problem, and the Dell tech person (from India) sent me
to SmitFraud fix. The viruses disappeared. I'd confirm this strategy
with someone who knows more, but it did work for me.


Joel Blau





For DOG'S sake, make sure you have SOME antivirus software on tour
computer.

On 3/24/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

I took Norton/Symantech anti-virus (etc.) off my PC after long
frustration. But I still got a message from Norton saying that my PC
is vulnerable to worms. So I went to the Norton page and found and ran
a program that allegedly gets rid of all Norton programs (created, I
think, due to a lawsuit against Norton). But I still get a message
from Norton saying that my PC is vulnerable to worms.

what to do?

--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger

Re: [PEN-L] Norton nonsense

[Leigh Meyers]

Ah Norton, the anti-virus that IS one. Runner-up... ZoneAlarm

OK, I can tell you how, but you'll need to install a registry cleaner
like Cclean, Registry Mechanic or regvac.

Use it to clean your registry.

With Registry Mechanic, use the defaults. I'm fond of Registry
Mechanic, it's never done anything untowards to my computer. You
should be ok with the freebie version that doesn't remove certain
items. Those items aren't relevant.

Cclean is also good, and it's top quality, professional, free/begware
. Check ALL the boxes in the
'Issues' section.

I have both and use them regularly... Cclean installs a right-click
menu on the trash bin. A convienient way to clean temp files and keeps
the web browsing experience snappy.

Now:

What you do, and I KNOW it sounds brutal, is search your computer for
the words Symantec and then Norton... no particular order, and DELETE
EVERYTHING. That's right, folders and all, by the roots.

If 'delete' balks at a file because it's in use, don't fret, skip it,
it won't be in use in about 15 minutes.

Next, use registry Mechanic, or whichever you choose and scan
everything that is scannable temp folders, everything. After you get
the results, clean everything.

Now, reboot... the computer wiill cough and sputter, and you may get a
bounch of error messages. The computer WILL start.

Now, run the registry cleaner again.

Search again for the N word and the S word.

They should be deletable now

Registry clean one more time.

That should do it.


Vaya Con Dios



For DOG'S sake, make sure you have SOME antivirus software on tour computer.

On 3/24/07, Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

I took Norton/Symantech anti-virus (etc.) off my PC after long
frustration. But I still got a message from Norton saying that my PC
is vulnerable to worms. So I went to the Norton page and found and ran
a program that allegedly gets rid of all Norton programs (created, I
think, due to a lawsuit against Norton). But I still get a message
from Norton saying that my PC is vulnerable to worms.

what to do?

--
Jim Devine / "The first derivative is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
-- C. P. Kindleberger