Re: [talk-au] Tagging a house name

[Graeme Fitzpatrick]

On Fri, 4 Feb 2022 at 22:18, Michael Collinson  wrote:

> in Ireland a "descriptive" address "The blue house called Bob, on the
> other side of the stream in the village of Inverkeith" is also formally
> acceptable - this is rare globally though.
>

Way back in Telecom days, so ~ early 80s, I spotted info on somebody's
phone service, which had their address listed as "the first driveway on the
right after the big Ghost Gum, 500m past the Rock Pools, Currumbin Creek
Rd, Currumbin Valley"
Here's Currumbin Creek Rd:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/576351#map=13/-28.2019/153.4181,
& the Rock Pools https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/-28.2075/153.3878
I've driven past there several times, looked for the big Ghost Gum, & said
Yep, *that* would be their driveway!

>
> https://www.houzz.com.au/magazine/how-to-name-your-house-stsetivw-vs~50717452
>
Interesting photo of one house in that article:
https://www.houzz.com.au/photos/summerlees-a-living-piece-of-australian-history-traditional-garden-sydney-phvw-vp~7570749

Address out the front is 219 over 7207?

Never seen an Aussie numbering scheme like that before?

Thanks

Graeme
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] Tagging a house name

[Michael Collinson]

> If I go to Officeworks and get a sign printed with the name "Bob" and 
put it on my letterbox, does that become the name of my house?


An interesting question which begs another question, what is an address? 
(warning: a bit of a philosophical ramble on a Friday night).


My global analysis so far suggests that there are basically three: 
POSTAL (so the postal service is usually involved), CADESTRAL (the 
building plot as defined by the local government and/or land 
registration body) and "HABITUAL" which is actually very powerful: if 
your Officeworks sign remains for long enough, the postman will find it 
even if not formally sanctioned by the postal service. Interestingly, in 
Ireland a "descriptive" address "The blue house called Bob, on the other 
side of the stream in the village of Inverkeith" is also formally 
acceptable - this is rare globally though.


Following a similar thread in the UK, it is evident that we don't have a 
clear definition in OSM for the addr: namespace and that makes things 
like tagging a house name a matter of debate and localisation. In Sweden 
where I usually live, properties have two completely different 
addresses: a formal postal address (always just road, house number, 
formal postal area (i.e. a city/town/village), post code) and a title 
deed "cadestral" address (unique block name, block number, block number 
subdivision number) which is used by the local council and the tax 
office. We use the postal format in the addr: namespace and again there 
is recent debate on whether addr:name is relevant.


From that perspective it looks like Australia is similar with the 
postal service and your local council being separate authorative sources 
but, unlike Sweden, they use overlapping nomenclature. The following is 
not a primary source so I would be more than curious to know if anyone 
has a more formal answer:


https://www.houzz.com.au/magazine/how-to-name-your-house-stsetivw-vs~50717452

*"Make it legal*
You can call your home any name you want, but if you want to register it 
as its official address, contact your local council and postal service. 
They will ascertain if the name is already taken in the area or if there 
are restrictions on removing an existing name. They’ll even disallow 
rude names! You’ll still require a street or road number attached to 
your address, though."


Mike

On 2022-02-04 19:48, Dian Ågesson wrote:


Genuine question:

If I go to Officeworks and get a sign printed with the name "Bob" and 
put it on my letterbox, does that become the name of my house?



On 2022-02-04 06:31, Warin wrote:



On 4/2/22 17:25, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:

I've always listed the name of units & so on just as name=*.



+1

No longer used as the address, used 2 centuries ago.



Thanks
Graeme

On Fri, 4 Feb 2022 at 16:14, Mat Attlee > wrote:


Whilst I was out surveying today I stumbled upon a building that
had a street number but also a house name, as just above the
entrance and door number it said Rivenhall. Now the question is
should this be tagged as the name or addr:housename? I know the
latter is common in the UK though I couldn't find anything about
best practice in Australia.



___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au


___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-auBEGIN:VCARD
VERSION:4.0
EMAIL;PREF=1:m...@ayeltd.biz
EMAIL:mike.collin...@ticketebo.com.au
FN:Michael Collinson
N:Collinson;Michael;;;
TEL;TYPE=work;VALUE=TEXT:+61 491 086 207
TEL;TYPE=cell;VALUE=TEXT:+46 73 581 22 19
X-MOZILLA-HTML;VALUE=BOOLEAN:TRUE
UID:fd70790f-e54a-1b4d-a9e3-7ea6b0059431
END:VCARD
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] Tagging a house name

[stevea]

On Feb 4, 2022, at 12:48 AM, Dian Ågesson  wrote:
> Genuine question:
> 
> If I go to Officeworks and get a sign printed with the name "Bob" and put it 
> on my letterbox, does that become the name of my house?

I would think this is an EXCEEDINGLY "locally variable" question (and answer).

To wit:

I once lived at a house, in a city, with a post office, in a country with a 
postal service, that had a three digit address.  There was a "granny unit" 
(called an "auxiliary dwelling unit" in local California real estate / zoning 
parlance) in the backyard where a couple lived (they necessarily shared 
utilities with the "main house," but it was like a little cottage, completely 
separate from the main house, but built on a different foundation on the same 
property parcel).  At a certain point, to avoid both confusion and mix-up and 
to offer some additional privacy (as to where certain people's mail was coming 
from), a new mailbox appeared on the porch (next to the other mailbox for the 
main house where a group of us university students shared housing in our 
salad-days of under- and graduate-school semi-poverty).  This new mailbox was 
labelled (somewhat amateurishly by one the couple in the backyard cottage with 
the three digits of the house number, likely designated by either the city, the 
post office or both a century or so ago (old Victorian-style house from the 
early 20th-century), plus the figure "1/2" (one-half).

During the time I lived there, the garage was converted into a living space 
(likely illegally, i.e. without proper permits), and once again, a new (third) 
mailbox appeared at the cluster of the previous two, this time, with the three 
digits of the main house's address, a hyphen and the capital letter A.

Nobody did anything, nobody asked permission (of the city, of the post 
office...), and mail "so addressed" was actually placed into the proper boxes.  
This lasted some number of years while I lived there and even for a while 
during the time my mail got forwarded until my name was no longer was 
associated with the address.

A few years ago, I drove by that house (sentimental memories?) and while not 
much else had changed, there was only a single mailbox there.  I could not tell 
if either the "backyard cottage" was still there, or if the garage was still 
occupied (with "illegal" plumbing and an outdoor shower shielded by little more 
than some tall bamboo), but one mailbox seemed to fit the circumstances of all 
who lived on the property.

Are there "proper" procedures to "split" an address or "name" a house?  
Probably (in some places).  Probably not, in other places.  I'd ask around 
locally, as I really think this is an EXCEEDINGLY "local" thing.
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] Tagging a house name

[Warin]

On 4/2/22 19:48, Dian Ågesson wrote:


Genuine question:

If I go to Officeworks and get a sign printed with the name "Bob" and 
put it on my letterbox, does that become the name of my house?




Traditionally the name went on the house.

The post man delivered the letters to the householder, there was no 
letter box. This was in a time before phones, letters were the main form 
of communication .. in populated areas letter delivery could take place 
twice a day.




On 2022-02-04 06:31, Warin wrote:



On 4/2/22 17:25, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:

I've always listed the name of units & so on just as name=*.



+1

No longer used as the address, used 2 centuries ago.



Thanks
Graeme

On Fri, 4 Feb 2022 at 16:14, Mat Attlee > wrote:


Whilst I was out surveying today I stumbled upon a building that
had a street number but also a house name, as just above the
entrance and door number it said Rivenhall. Now the question is
should this be tagged as the name or addr:housename? I know the
latter is common in the UK though I couldn't find anything about
best practice in Australia.



___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au


___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] Tagging a house name

[Dian Ågesson]

Genuine question:

If I go to Officeworks and get a sign printed with the name "Bob" and 
put it on my letterbox, does that become the name of my house?


On 2022-02-04 06:31, Warin wrote:


On 4/2/22 17:25, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:


I've always listed the name of units & so on just as name=*.


+1

No longer used as the address, used 2 centuries ago.

Thanks

Graeme

On Fri, 4 Feb 2022 at 16:14, Mat Attlee  wrote:

Whilst I was out surveying today I stumbled upon a building that had a 
street number but also a house name, as just above the entrance and 
door number it said Rivenhall. Now the question is should this be 
tagged as the name or addr:housename? I know the latter is common in 
the UK though I couldn't find anything about best practice in 
Australia.


___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au