Re: Noble Numbat general call for translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Dear Lukasz, and all,

Am Mo., 15. Apr. 2024 um 17:11 Uhr schrieb Lukasz Zemczak <
lukasz.zemc...@canonical.com>:

> Hello translators!
>
> We are getting really close to the 24.04 release. For Ubuntu and its
> various flavors to be easily accessible to people of all languages, it
> would be very nice if we got as many strings translated for at least
> the key applications and systems.
>
> Please help in getting as many translations for your languages as possible!
>
> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/noble/+translations
> The desktop installer translations are spread between multiple
> components and manged via weblate:
> https://hosted.weblate.org/projects/ubuntu-desktop-translations/
>
>
How does one actually know that there's work to be done on weblate?  I
didn't pay much attention to the March 27 email, because I don't know what
"Flutter" is or why to translate its installer.  I might pay more attention
to an announcement like "Language coordinators: Please note that the Ubuntu
installer is now translated on Weblate and cannot be translated in
Launchpad anymore", although technically I'm not coordinator anymore.

There's also the question of whether any documentation mentions weblate.
The weblate link is not included on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/
or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/TemplatesPriority .

But then again everyone else seems to already have known about this for a
long time.  So indeed, how does everyone know that there are important
translations on weblate?

Best regards
Ask
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Re: How much work is a translation/localization of an entire new language?

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello Carsten,

Am Mi., 3. Mai 2023 um 15:56 Uhr schrieb Carsten Agger :

> Hello,
>
> I'm new to this list. I've been using Ubuntu and free software since
> 2005 and have also been active in the general movement. I am currently a
> member of the General Assembly of Free Software Foundation Europe (FSFE).
>
> In my day job, I'm working as an architect on free/open source products,
> currently only projects specifically related to our work for the
> government of Greenland.
>
> My question/problem is this: I'd like to understand how much work it
> would take to localize Ubuntu into a completely new language where no
> volunteers were available but commercial translation is.
>
>
> How much work would it be to translate the standard edition of Ubuntu
> with all pre-installed programs? In terms of hours or weeks? How many
> words?
>
> I'm trying to see how I might arrive at an estimate. It would, of
> course, also be necessary to do technical work like creating new
> language packages.
>
> Specifically, I'd like to see Ubuntu translated into Greenlandic (an
> Inuit language also known as Kalaallisut). There is a project for this
> on Launchpad, but it doesn't seem to have much activity since 2010, and
> I suspect there aren't enough volunteers available - not that
> surprising, since there's only about 60,000 speakers of the language.
>

I don't know the exact numbers, but a lot of the content would be from the
GNOME desktop environment.

The GNOME desktop user interface [1] contains about 43500 messages with
185.000 words or 1.1 million characters (numbers extracted from English
originals).  Not all of GNOME UI needs to be translated in order to achieve
a reasonably complete desktop experience -- one should rather assess and
prioritize according to some criteria.  Some strings are "GConf"
configuration strings not accessible via the normal user interface, and
they won't be very high priority.  Also, some GNOME modules are developer
tools.  With the full UI translated, twice a year we need to update about
2000 messages (maybe a little bit less nowadays?) to keep up with software
updates across the GNOME codebase.

There are additional Ubuntu-specific strings on Launchpad such as the
installer.  Those would not exceed a few thousand messages AFAIK.  Maybe
someone knows better.

I hope these figures are helpful.

Best regards
Ask

[1] https://l10n.gnome.org/languages/da/gnome-44/ui/ (Danish)


>
>
>
> Best,
> Carsten
>
>
>
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Re: Ubuntu Flutter installer Swedish

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Luna,

Am Di., 8. Feb. 2022 um 09:51 Uhr schrieb Luna Jernberg :
>
> 96%

This is a mailing list with rather many subscribers, most of them not
involved in the particular thing that is 96% done.  Kindly refrain
from sending these updates.  Thanks!

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Merging Gnome translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Am So., 4. Okt. 2020 um 14:10 Uhr schrieb Jwtiyar ali :
>>
>> If you suspect it's stuck,
>> you can file a bug against the corresponding package.
>
> It's a very long way to file a bug to every package.

They're hardly *all* stuck.  If one is actually stuck, file a bug
report.  As I said mostly they're just slow.

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Re: Merging Gnome translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Dear Jwtiyar,

Am So., 4. Okt. 2020 um 13:18 Uhr schrieb Jwtiyar ali :
>
> Hey
> I have translated some files that available in l10.gnome.org but they are not 
> translate in ubuntu translation project, Is there any progress to merge these 
> strings from gnome to ubuntu?

It often takes a fair amount of time before launchpad imports
translations from upstream (i.e. GNOME).  Also it sometimes happens
that the Launchpad import mechanism gets stuck and they never occur (I
have seen imports stuck 3 years or so).  If you suspect it's stuck,
you can file a bug against the corresponding package.

I can't remember how to see the import queue of a package, something
about launchpad.net/ubuntu/packagename/+imports or something similar.

But probably it's not really stuck, just slow.

Best regards
Ask

>
>
> Best Regards.
>
> Jwtiyar Nariman
> Ex-Regional Leader At Gmaps
> Physical Lab. / Internal Auditor (ISO 9001:2015)
> Mass Iraq Co. for cement industry
> My Blog
> Why Linux Is Better
> Freedom For Abdullah Ocalan  (APO)
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Re: Notes about translation of Ubuntu 18.04

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Gunnar,

2018-04-01 21:25 GMT+02:00 Gunnar Hjalmarsson :
> Hi all!
>
> 2.5 weeks left until final freeze, and I'd like to call your attention to a
> few things.
>
> The translation coverage of the snapd package (the snappy template) is poor
> in many languages. Some issues with the translation template have probably
> contributed to that, but also the fact that the template has had too low
> priority in the Launchpad interface. I have raised the priority, so now the
> snappy template is shown on the first page of the translation overview for
> respective language, for instance:
>
> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+lang/gl
>
> It should be noted that Launchpad is upstream for the snapd translations.
>
> After the switch to GNOME, some of the core GNOME packages are more
> important than when Unity was default in Ubuntu. The GNOME packages are
> translated upstream, and in many cases the upstream translations are simply
> imported to LP and added to our language packs and there is not much to do
> for the translators on the Ubuntu side.
>
> But..
>
> Some of the GNOME packages have Ubuntu modifications with translatable
> strings which have to be translated via Launchpad.
>
> gnome-software
> gnome-control-center
> gnome-online-accounts
> gnome-session

Thank you very much for this useful information.

One question: Is there a way to see, or to know by means of some
public schedule, at what time imports will be done from upstream to
Launchpad?  The idea is to know whether to upload a translation
manually or simply wait for an automatic process.  We can upload our
upstream translations manually, but that's a lot of work when there
many modules.

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Fuzzy translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Glad to hear that this has been useful. Imagine how much time goes to waste
because launchpad lacks fuzzy support. Of course it does not matter for
most UI strings because they are short anyway, but documentation or
anything else that involves whole sentences is completely unsuited for
launchpad.

Best regards
Ask


El 15 mar. 2017 9:19 a. m., "Hannie Dumoleyn" <lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl>
escribió:

> I have downloaded ubuntu-help xenial (100% translated) and zesty
> (Untranslated: 252), merged the two, and the result was this: Not ready
> 171, Untranslated 83.
> I checked and approved the fuzzies in Lokalize (my favourite CAT), this
> doesn't take much time, and uploaded the new file to Launchpad.
> All we have to do now is translate the remaining 83 messages (instead of
> 252!!) in Launchpad.
> Hannie
>
>
> Op 13-03-17 om 15:06 schreef Krzysztof T:
>
> If anyone interested in fuzzy translations, there is a bug
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/1591941
>
> 2017-03-10 0:56 GMT+01:00 Ask Hjorth Larsen <asklar...@gmail.com>:
>
>> 2017-03-10 0:32 GMT+01:00 Gunnar Hjalmarsson <gunna...@ubuntu.com>:
>> > On 2017-03-09 20:15, Ask Hjorth Larsen wrote:
>> >>
>> >> To elaborate, msgmerge is the mechanism by which fuzzies are
>> >> always(-ish) generated when source code is updated.  It simply
>> >> fuzzy-matches all current strings against all previous strings when
>> >> the translations are updated from the source tree.
>> >
>> >
>> > Thanks for clarifying. I slowly get the picture. ;)
>> >
>> > Furthermore, I think I was wrong in my reply to Hannie: The
>> translations at
>> > the bottom of the PO files are *old* translations, which you may make
>> use of
>> > manually, but they are not really fuzzy entries. As you already pointed
>> out,
>> > Launchpad doesn't do that.
>>
>> Right.  For no particular reason here is some more info :)
>>
>> When generating/updating po-file from source code, gettext parses the
>> source code to recognize translatable strings.
>>
>> When this process starts, there are still 0 strings, and all
>> translations are effectively "obsolete" for the moment.
>>
>> For each string in the source code, gettext checks whether an obsolete
>> (or existing) string *exactly* matches that string.  If it does, that
>> string will appear as translated (and will be removed from obsoletes).
>> If it does not match exactly, it will instead do a fuzzy match, and
>> the string will be fuzzy.  Else the string will be untranslated.
>> Gettext has no idea whether a particular string was "changed" or is
>> "new" - all it knows is if it resembles a previous string or not.
>>
>> So the po-file is rebuilt from the old one, and most old translations
>> will (normally) be matched exactly, some will be fuzzy, and any that
>> were never matched will be obsolete.
>>
>> A consequence of this is that if some day the programmer reintroduces
>> a string, it will immediately be translated again, provided it exactly
>> matches an obsolete.  (Or it could be fuzzy if it is only similar.)
>>
>> (I have not verified all of the above behaviour 100%, but it is true
>> enough for household purposes.)
>>
>> Best regards
>> Ask
>>
>> >
>> > --
>> > Gunnar Hjalmarsson
>> > https://launchpad.net/~gunnarhj
>> >
>>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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Re: Fuzzy translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

2017-03-10 0:32 GMT+01:00 Gunnar Hjalmarsson <gunna...@ubuntu.com>:
> On 2017-03-09 20:15, Ask Hjorth Larsen wrote:
>>
>> To elaborate, msgmerge is the mechanism by which fuzzies are
>> always(-ish) generated when source code is updated.  It simply
>> fuzzy-matches all current strings against all previous strings when
>> the translations are updated from the source tree.
>
>
> Thanks for clarifying. I slowly get the picture. ;)
>
> Furthermore, I think I was wrong in my reply to Hannie: The translations at
> the bottom of the PO files are *old* translations, which you may make use of
> manually, but they are not really fuzzy entries. As you already pointed out,
> Launchpad doesn't do that.

Right.  For no particular reason here is some more info :)

When generating/updating po-file from source code, gettext parses the
source code to recognize translatable strings.

When this process starts, there are still 0 strings, and all
translations are effectively "obsolete" for the moment.

For each string in the source code, gettext checks whether an obsolete
(or existing) string *exactly* matches that string.  If it does, that
string will appear as translated (and will be removed from obsoletes).
If it does not match exactly, it will instead do a fuzzy match, and
the string will be fuzzy.  Else the string will be untranslated.
Gettext has no idea whether a particular string was "changed" or is
"new" - all it knows is if it resembles a previous string or not.

So the po-file is rebuilt from the old one, and most old translations
will (normally) be matched exactly, some will be fuzzy, and any that
were never matched will be obsolete.

A consequence of this is that if some day the programmer reintroduces
a string, it will immediately be translated again, provided it exactly
matches an obsolete.  (Or it could be fuzzy if it is only similar.)

(I have not verified all of the above behaviour 100%, but it is true
enough for household purposes.)

Best regards
Ask

>
> --
> Gunnar Hjalmarsson
> https://launchpad.net/~gunnarhj
>
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Re: Fuzzy translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

2017-03-09 15:15 GMT+01:00 Fòram na Gàidhlig <f...@foramnagaidhlig.net>:
> Sgrìobh Gunnar Hjalmarsson na leanas 09/03/2017 aig 11:38:
>> Hi Ask!
>>
>> On 2017-03-09 10:05, Ask Hjorth Larsen wrote:
>>> I am pretty sure the only way is to export both po-files and merge
>>> them offline (msgmerge).
>>
>> I doubt that would help; please see my reply to Hannie. Or am I missing
>> something?
>
> msgmerge has an option --no-fuzzy-matching, so it obviously can do fuzzy
> matches.

To elaborate, msgmerge is the mechanism by which fuzzies are
always(-ish) generated when source code is updated.  It simply
fuzzy-matches all current strings against all previous strings when
the translations are updated from the source tree.

Best regards
Ask


>
> I always download my translations and load them into Virtaal just to
> make sure that I have everything in my local translation memory. Of
> course, our locale has only 2 localizers, so keeping my TM up to date is
> less of an issue as for languages with many contributors.
>
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Re: Fuzzy translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Hannie

I am pretty sure the only way is to export both po-files and merge them
offline (msgmerge). Lack of fuzzy support is a continuing scandal of
launchpad, but does not seem to be a priority with the powers that be.

If the old one is not available anymore (frequently the case for ordinary
modules) then there may not be a way at all.

Best regards
Ask

El 9 mar. 2017 9:35, "Hannie Dumoleyn" 
escribió:

> Although the documentation string freeze will be on March 16th, I already
> want to start translating untranslated strings here: [1].
>
> In this version (Zesty) I noticed that there are untranslated strings
> which were translated in a previous version. Example: string
> #112=untranslated, but it is translated in 16.04 version.
>
> Before I start merging these versions manually and upload them to
> Launchpad, I would like to know if there is another way to get fuzzy
> translations in a newer version based on an older one.
>
> Hannie
>
> [1] https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/zesty/+source/
> ubuntu-docs/+pots/ubuntu-help/nl/+translate
>
>
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Re: Spelling error in location list during installation

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Dan

Which language are you using?

The standard package for timezone data, tzdata, has Montreal and does
not have Mount-Royal in any language for Ubuntu 16.04.  I don't know
from where Ubuntu gets its strings, or why it does not use the
standard tzdata package.

Best regards
Ask

2016-12-07 19:29 GMT+01:00 Dan Shea :
> I'm guessing that this is where I have to send this... the bug reporting FAQ
> says 'misspelling and translation' errors should be sent to youse guys.
>
> I have most recently seen this in the installation for 16.10, but it has
> been present in every version of Ubuntu that I have ever installed (as far
> back as 8.04 at least)
>
> During the initial set up of the system, when it asks for your
> location/timezone, the city that I live in (Montreal) does not appear in the
> list.
>
> It appears that it is listed as 'Mont-Royal', which is a misspelling of
> 'Mount-Royal' (a suburb of Montreal).
>
> Thanks for your time.
> Dan
>
>
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Re: Vanuatu - Bislama Translation

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Robyn

Very good initiative.  I recommend starting with parts of the GNOME
desktop environment.  That is the most important component of Ubuntu
from a perspective of translations.

As far as I can see there is no Bislama team in GNOME, so it would
have to be created.  Once the central applications in GNOME have been
translated, they will propagate to the next version of Ubuntu and you
can translate the remaining Ubuntu-specific parts.  Be warned that
this is a huge project, so you should always focus on the parts that
are most important for the users.  For example GNOME contains lots of
software development tools, but it is no use translating those if the
main interface (menus, etc.) are not.

Here is the information necessary to get started on GNOME (see e.g.
"Starting a team"):

  https://wiki.gnome.org/TranslationProject

Best regards
Ask

2016-06-12 10:11 GMT+02:00 Robyn Willison :
> Hi Translators
>
> I am part of a community organisation that want to donate some computers to
> schools in Vanuatu. These computers are installed with Ubuntu and we'd like
> to have the local language on them. If I can get people in Vanuatu to help
> with translation can someone guide me through the process. The local
> language is Bislama.
>
>
> Regards
>
> Robyn
>
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Re: Clock App Translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello

On which day should the translation be finished?

Best regards
Ask

2015-10-09 13:12 GMT+02:00 Nekhelesh Ramananthan :
> Hi everyone,
>
> We're about to release a new version of clock app to the store. To my
> suprise it turns out that most languages have already been translated
> without me having to make a request :). Thanks a lot for that!
>
> There are a couple more languages (Spanish, Dutch, Chineese and Russian)
> that has some untranslated strings. Some of them are mandatory before
> pushing out a release. Can translators of those languages please translate
> them by next week. We just added 4 new strings for this release.
>
> Thanks again for translating clock app.
>
> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-clock-app
>
>
> Cheers,
> Nekhelesh
>
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New coordinator for Danish

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello translators

This is in a way old news, but I think I never sent an official
announcement to this list:

I hereby step down as coordinator of the Danish translation of Ubuntu.
Aputsiak Janussen (CC) is taking over as coordinator.  Welcome, Aputsiak!

I will remain an active translator of Ubuntu but work mostly on GNOME
translations (this was always the case, so nothing much has changed).

Thank you and best regards
Ask
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Re: Phone translations policy proposal

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello

Although the release date is unknown, maybe a tentative deadline could
nevertheless be provided, e.g., translations committed before $DATE are
guaranteed to be included.  Then the developers have a string freeze
starting a few days before $DATE.  When the phone can be released at any
date (soon), the developers should probably not be committing changes to
the user interface (and thus strings) anyway.  Would this be feasible?

The reason is that a lot of us have the motivation to do a job before a
fixed date, but not the time to keep it continuously at 100% with proper
review procedures after that date.

For the first release, many strings and perhaps even entire modules were
added after our initial translation deadline.  I assume this was because it
was the first release and things were not as well under control as they
will be during subsequent ones.

Best regards
Ask

2015-04-24 2:39 GMT+02:00 Cheng-Chia Tseng pswo10...@gmail.com:



 Fòram na Gàidhlig f...@foramnagaidhlig.net 於 2015年4月24日 星期五寫道：

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

  The benefit with opening translations in advance here would be that
  they would be done by Ubuntu Translators and would be consistent
  with each team's guidelines, which might not be the case for a
  translations agency. However, in any case for the projects
  eventually open-sourced, translators would be able to fix strings
  after release if required, fixes which would be then probably be
  shipped in an OTA update. My personal suggestion here would be to
  enable Ubuntu Translators to modify or complete the translations
  once the code is available. I know it's not a perfect solution, but
  I think it's the easiest in term of managing the logistics and
  working with manufacturers.

 How will selecting translation agencies work?

 I am doing commercial translation for a big software company and they
 ended up using 5-6 agencies, which was a logistical nightmare. Since
 we're a minority language and nobody else is qualified to do the job,
 we could put our foot down, go through 1 agency only and thus
 coordinate the work load.

 Of course, I don't know if Canonical has any power over which agencies
 are selected.

 It should also be possible for volunteers to give Canonical a shout so
 they can apply to register with the translation agency/agencies if
 they want to. Why should others earn the money rather than those
 people who have dedicated tons of their free time over the years. It
 would also serve translation consistency.


 Totally agree with you. It would be better that Canonical could have
 existing translators who need jobs hired first. They know the workflow well
 and are familiar with the existing glossary translations.


 The other question I am concerned with is the coordination between
 translation agencies and volunteer contributors.

 Mailing list perhaps?

 For example, there are only 2 main translators for traditional Chinese. It
 could be said that we don't have much chance to have the language 100%
 translated. Translation agencies must be involved in this case.

 However, I have seen many translations of games available in Android or
 iOS store are in poor quality that we are always laughing at the
 translations. It is believed the work was done by some cheap translation
 agencies.

 We, the translators, would like to ensure the quality of translations so
 they should follow the guidelines we set and keep the translation in
 consistency.


 --
 Cheers,
 by Cheng-Chia Tseng


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Re: Call for Telegram translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Thank you karni :)

So in conclusion, I understand that some advantage can be gained by
merging, but it's probably difficult to achieve automatically in a
meaningful way.  Translators could do it though by downloading the
po-files and running msgmerge.  Thank you!

Best regards
Ask

2015-03-31 18:18 GMT+02:00 Michal Karnicki michal.karni...@canonical.com:
 Hi Ask (what a nice, interesting name! :) ),

 a) Yes, I've been pointed to Transifex documentation by rvr. It's great they
 also support po files!

 b) when I said UI flows I rather meant things like ok, Android doesn't have
 this dialog, but has one button more here or they don't support entering
 contact phone [imported from phone book], so we'll need to figure which
 other strings can we use here, etc. Meaning, the UI's are not same, but
 indeed very close. I guess if we reused their strings, but ended up with a
 couple untranslated, would still be a fantastic opportunity.

 c) Yes. Telegram for Ubuntu was Canonical effort to have a usable instant
 messenger for the phone (I won't get here into much detailed plans around
 that), but as you know - Canonical isn't a big company, so ideally we'll
 arrive at the point where the code base is much more inviting and we could
 sustain it with community contributions. Going back to the subject - the
 UI's are very similar, but the strings are not reused (you may have noticed
 Android uses short compressed strings as keys for translating, whereas our
 QML already contains English phrases. If we wanted to reuse that, we would
 have to go through the whole source, and replace our text with those
 key-placeholders, for which I know I don't have time :(  ).

 Certainly the strings are reused visually - we took what we saw in Android
 Telegram UI and added stuff to Telegram for Ubuntu, so while it's not
 feasable with current resources, it's something (re-use of strings) that we
 could certainly do with some community help (community in general, I'm not
 thinking specifically about translators here, notably because this requires
 at least minimal knowledge about the source/build/etc).

 Thank you for your valuable feedback, I'm very happy we're having this kind
 of interaction!

 Sincerely,
 karni

 On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 5:47 PM, Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Hello Michal

 2015-03-31 17:19 GMT+02:00 Michal Karnicki
 michal.karni...@canonical.com:
  I have to admit I wasn't aware of that page. Now that I think of it, it
  would be really awesome to reuse the strings from one of those apps,
  however
  it may be difficult.
 
  a) Currently I'm the only internal developer + one actively contributing
  community developer on Telegram for Ubuntu and as such, our resources
  are
  limited. We're working on features, while trying to find time for bug
  fixes.
  I doubt we'd find time to try convert Transifex output to a pot form -
  but
  perhaps you know if it does support gettext format out of the box? Is it
  available for download?

 a) po-files can be exported from Transifex without any problem.  One
 can then use msgmerge from gettext to move strings from one po-file
 into another to the extent that they are identical or nearly identical
 (will be marked as fuzzy; but that feature is, painfully, not
 supported by Launchpad).

  b) If we were to reuse those, we would have to re-align our app in some
  places for those strings to match our UI flows.

 I guess this would be the responsibility of the translator.  Normally
 when we translate programmes we do not care much about the exact
 length of a string.  I guess in many cases we have to be more careful
 on mobile phones.  How do people generally test the translations -
 with a virtual machine?

  c) I believe we're simply not enough feature complete and stable to
  request
  moving in to Transifex for our translations. I may be wrong though on
  this,
  so I will reach out to Telegram task force with a question.
 
  While we're not at capacity to reuse those translated strings, and I
  belive
  our community is quite strong, at the same time if there's anyone that
  would
  like to support the effort of re-using Transifex output for our app
  (also
  engineering-wise), I am more than happy to try support this effort as
  well.
 
  Thanks,
  karni

 I understand now that the Ubuntu app is developed completely
 separately from e.g. the Android one, correct?  If the messages are
 not reused between them, then probably it is not so important to worry
 about this.  If they are reused, I'd say that they should be merged
 and then the translators have to review the formatting somehow.

 Best regards
 Ask

 
 
 
  On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 4:45 PM, Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com
  wrote:
 
  Hello (this particularly for the developers)
 
  The telegram web page specifies a translation on Transifex [1].  Now
  we also have translations on Launchpad.  How is this to be approached?
   Is one better/more official than the other?  I assume

Re: Call for Telegram translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello Michal

2015-03-31 17:19 GMT+02:00 Michal Karnicki michal.karni...@canonical.com:
 I have to admit I wasn't aware of that page. Now that I think of it, it
 would be really awesome to reuse the strings from one of those apps, however
 it may be difficult.

 a) Currently I'm the only internal developer + one actively contributing
 community developer on Telegram for Ubuntu and as such, our resources are
 limited. We're working on features, while trying to find time for bug fixes.
 I doubt we'd find time to try convert Transifex output to a pot form - but
 perhaps you know if it does support gettext format out of the box? Is it
 available for download?

a) po-files can be exported from Transifex without any problem.  One
can then use msgmerge from gettext to move strings from one po-file
into another to the extent that they are identical or nearly identical
(will be marked as fuzzy; but that feature is, painfully, not
supported by Launchpad).

 b) If we were to reuse those, we would have to re-align our app in some
 places for those strings to match our UI flows.

I guess this would be the responsibility of the translator.  Normally
when we translate programmes we do not care much about the exact
length of a string.  I guess in many cases we have to be more careful
on mobile phones.  How do people generally test the translations -
with a virtual machine?

 c) I believe we're simply not enough feature complete and stable to request
 moving in to Transifex for our translations. I may be wrong though on this,
 so I will reach out to Telegram task force with a question.

 While we're not at capacity to reuse those translated strings, and I belive
 our community is quite strong, at the same time if there's anyone that would
 like to support the effort of re-using Transifex output for our app (also
 engineering-wise), I am more than happy to try support this effort as well.

 Thanks,
 karni

I understand now that the Ubuntu app is developed completely
separately from e.g. the Android one, correct?  If the messages are
not reused between them, then probably it is not so important to worry
about this.  If they are reused, I'd say that they should be merged
and then the translators have to review the formatting somehow.

Best regards
Ask




 On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 4:45 PM, Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Hello (this particularly for the developers)

 The telegram web page specifies a translation on Transifex [1].  Now
 we also have translations on Launchpad.  How is this to be approached?
  Is one better/more official than the other?  I assume there is no
 synchronization between them.

 Best regards
 Ask

 [1] https://telegram.org/faq#q-can-i-translate-telegram


 2015-03-31 16:31 GMT+02:00 Michal Karnicki
 michal.karni...@canonical.com:
  Yes, thank you Víctor
  . We have a phrase with no format specifier (This contact is on
  Telegram)
  and one with two (n our of m contacts are on Telegram), and Launchpad
  doesn't like it. We'll fix it soon, thank you for your patience.
 
  Thanks,
  karni
 
  On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 4:27 PM, Víctor R. Ruiz
  victor.r...@canonical.com
  wrote:
 
Hi:
 
  On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 3:03 PM, marcoslans marcosl...@hotmail.com
  wrote:
   Yes, I get the same issue in galician language.
 
David told me in IRC that they are aware of the issue and probably
  will be changing the phrase, so skip it rigth now.
 
Greetings,
 
  --
  Víctor R. Ruiz  | - All this moments will be lost
  victor.r...@canonical.com | like tears in the rain
 
  --
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  --
  Software Engineer
  Professional and Engineering Services
  Canonical Ltd.
 
  Ubuntu - Linux for human beings | www.ubuntu.com
 
  --
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 Professional and Engineering Services
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 Ubuntu - Linux for human beings | www.ubuntu.com

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Re: Meeting minorized language translators

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

By the way, have you considered advertising it on the GNOME i18n list as well?

Best regards
Ask

2014-09-11 0:15 GMT+02:00 Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com:
 Hello/hola Miguel

 I sent an e-mail to trasno about this a week ago and nobody answered.
 Unfortunately I have just made other plans.

 Hace una semana envié un correo-e a trasno y nadie ha respondido.
 Desgraciadamente acabo de hacer otros planes.

 Best regards/saludos
 Ask

 Meeting minorized language translators

 [en]

 From Proxecto Trasno
 (http://www.trasno.net/english-about-trasno-project-and-galician/), the
 Galician team of open source translators, we want to announce:

 Next days, on 4th and 5th October (Saturday and Sunday) we will have a
 meeting within groups of minorized languages translation of the Iberian
 peninsula.

 You are all invited to participate and collaborate with us.

 [es]

 Desde Proxecto Trasno (http://www.trasno.net), equipo de traductores de
 S.L. al gallego, queremos informaros:

 Los próximos días 4 y 5 de octubre (sábado y domingo) celebraremos un
 encuentro entre los grupos de traducción a lenguas minorizadas de la
 península ibérica.

 Estais todos invitados a participar y a colaborar con nosotros.

 [links]

 http://encontro.trasno.net/

 https://plus.google.com/u/0/b/103117616625458007025/events/ch14mosjlpqe6gbg42v4k1ejeuo

 --
 Membro de «The Document Foundation Projects»
 http://www.documentfoundation.org/foundation/members
 Membro do «Grupo de Amigos GNU/Linux de Pontevedra (GALPon)»
 http://galpon.org
 Membro de «Proxecto Trasno» http://trasno.net
 Co-coordinador do proxecto «GALPon MiniNo» http://minino.galpon.org

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Re: Meeting minorized language translators

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello Miguel

Thank you for looking.  The address I wrote to was for the mailing
list, proxe...@trasno.net, on September 3.  Apparently I should have
written to info@.  Anyway it proved difficult for me to allocate time,
otherwise I would certainly have tried harder.

Have a nice and productive conference! :)

Best regards
Ask

2014-09-11 18:55 GMT+02:00 Miguel Bouzada mbouz...@gmail.com:
 Hi Ask

 In relation to the email you comment, I'd like to say you I have not found
 any, I searched for in the server, in the 3 accounts with public access and
 either I found it in span or blocked. I don't know what happened. Anyway,
 info[at]trasno.net is the email prefrered for contacts in general and it is
 the same used for information from http://encontro.trasno.net inscriptions.

 Respect to the list of Gnome, go ahead, it is very good idea.

 Regards

 2014-09-11 12:22 GMT+02:00 Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com:

 By the way, have you considered advertising it on the GNOME i18n list as
 well?

 Best regards
 Ask

 2014-09-11 0:15 GMT+02:00 Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com:
  Hello/hola Miguel
 
  I sent an e-mail to trasno about this a week ago and nobody answered.
  Unfortunately I have just made other plans.
 
  Hace una semana envié un correo-e a trasno y nadie ha respondido.
  Desgraciadamente acabo de hacer otros planes.
 
  Best regards/saludos
  Ask
 
  Meeting minorized language translators
 
  [en]
 
  From Proxecto Trasno
  (http://www.trasno.net/english-about-trasno-project-and-galician/), the
  Galician team of open source translators, we want to announce:
 
  Next days, on 4th and 5th October (Saturday and Sunday) we will have a
  meeting within groups of minorized languages translation of the Iberian
  peninsula.
 
  You are all invited to participate and collaborate with us.
 
  [es]
 
  Desde Proxecto Trasno (http://www.trasno.net), equipo de traductores
  de
  S.L. al gallego, queremos informaros:
 
  Los próximos días 4 y 5 de octubre (sábado y domingo) celebraremos un
  encuentro entre los grupos de traducción a lenguas minorizadas de la
  península ibérica.
 
  Estais todos invitados a participar y a colaborar con nosotros.
 
  [links]
 
  http://encontro.trasno.net/
 
 
  https://plus.google.com/u/0/b/103117616625458007025/events/ch14mosjlpqe6gbg42v4k1ejeuo
 
  --
  Membro de «The Document Foundation Projects»
  http://www.documentfoundation.org/foundation/members
  Membro do «Grupo de Amigos GNU/Linux de Pontevedra (GALPon)»
  http://galpon.org
  Membro de «Proxecto Trasno» http://trasno.net
  Co-coordinador do proxecto «GALPon MiniNo» http://minino.galpon.org
 
  --
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  https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
 




 --
 Membro de «The Document Foundation Projects»
 http://www.documentfoundation.org/foundation/members
 Membro do «Grupo de Amigos GNU/Linux de Pontevedra (GALPon)»
 http://galpon.org
 Membro de «Proxecto Trasno» http://trasno.net
 Co-coordinador do proxecto «GALPon MiniNo» http://minino.galpon.org

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Re: Meeting minorized language translators

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello/hola Miguel

I sent an e-mail to trasno about this a week ago and nobody answered.
Unfortunately I have just made other plans.

Hace una semana envié un correo-e a trasno y nadie ha respondido.
Desgraciadamente acabo de hacer otros planes.

Best regards/saludos
Ask
Meeting minorized language translators

[en]

From Proxecto Trasno (
http://www.trasno.net/english-about-trasno-project-and-galician/), the
Galician team of open source translators, we want to announce:

Next days, on 4th and 5th October (Saturday and Sunday) we will have a
meeting within groups of minorized languages ​​translation of the Iberian
peninsula.

You are all invited to participate and collaborate with us.

[es]

Desde Proxecto Trasno (http://www.trasno.net), equipo de traductores de
S.L. al gallego, queremos informaros:

Los próximos días 4 y 5 de octubre (sábado y domingo) celebraremos un
encuentro entre los grupos de traducción a lenguas minorizadas de la
península ibérica.

Estais todos invitados a participar y a colaborar con nosotros.

[links]

http://encontro.trasno.net/

https://plus.google.com/u/0/b/103117616625458007025/events/ch14mosjlpqe6gbg42v4k1ejeuo

-- 
Membro de «The Document Foundation Projects»
http://www.documentfoundation.org/foundation/members
Membro do «Grupo de Amigos GNU/Linux de Pontevedra (GALPon)»
http://galpon.org
Membro de «Proxecto Trasno» http://trasno.net
Co-coordinador do proxecto «GALPon MiniNo» http://minino.galpon.org

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Re: Translating keywords in QML files

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Also, in GNOME it is an error if the trailing ; is omitted.  Then
the keyword string will not work (or at least it was so at one time).
Whereas here it is apparently fine, as even the English strings omit
trailing ;.  It is strange how little information can be found about
this.  Here's the info from GNOME:

  https://wiki.gnome.org/Initiatives/GnomeGoals/DesktopFileKeywords

Doesn't contain an answer to your actual question though. :)

Best regards
Ask

2014-08-21 11:52 GMT+02:00 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com:
 Any input about this?

 (also http://projects.davidplanella.org/ is down).

 Simos


 On Fri, Aug 8, 2014 at 4:14 PM, Simos Xenitellis
 simos.li...@googlemail.com wrote:

 Hi All,

 This probably is in some FAQ that I did not find. If so, please give me
 the URL.

 In the .qml files from Unity 8 apps, there are messages like those in the
 second line (keywords:):

 UnityActions.Action {
 text: i18n.tr(Delete)
 keywords: i18n.tr(Trash;Erase Note)
 enabled: noteList.currentIndex !== -1
 onTriggered: dataModel.deleteNote(noteList.currentIndex)
 }

 What are the semantics for those when translating them? Apparently they
 are similar to the keywords in .desktop files.
 Shall we include both English and local language in the translated message
 so as to get matches in both cases?
 Are these case-insensitive? Or accent-insensitive;

 Simos




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Re: Utopic plurals

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Michael

Generally if you are on the translations page, click 'Bugs' on the top
(there are Overview, Code, Bugs, Blueprints, Translations, Answers).
That should take you to the appropriate bug page.

Best regards
Ask

2014-08-19 1:28 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer f...@akerbeltz.org:
 I haven't filed a bug... partly because I wasn't aware that that's a
 bug-level issue, partly because my experience with bugs on Launchpad ain't
 that great but mostly because I can never remember where to file a bug.
 You'd think this
 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu
 was the obvious place but from there
 Report a bug
 takes you to this place
 https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs
 and from there, all I can find are seemingly recursive links but nowhere to
 actually file a bug...

 Eventually found it, would love to paste the link but Launchpad catapults
 you somewhere after reporting but no idea where in relation to the bug you
 just reported.

 Bah...

 Michael

 18/08/2014 03:02, sgrìobh David Planella:

 Hi Michael,

 Thanks for pointing that out. You might have done this, but the best bet
 is to file a bug against the project.

 I'm CC'ing Facundo Batista, one of the remote scopes developers who might
 be able to help us.

 @Facundo, there are a few strings in the remote scopes code that would
 benefit from using plural forms. Do you think you might be able to look into
 these?

 Thanks!

 Cheers,
 David.



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Re: Utopic plurals

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Michael

I don't quite follow.  The translations page

  
https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-rest-scopes/trunk/+pots/ubuntu-rest-scopes/es/+translate

has a 'bugs' link which goes to

  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-rest-scopes/trunk

It has a 'report bug' button but no bug.  If you remove /trunk at the
end, there's something which has actual bugs.

Best regards
Ask

2014-08-19 1:50 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer f...@akerbeltz.org:
 Ask,

 That takes me exactly to where I was - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu
 with no obvious place to report

 Michael

 19/08/2014 00:39, sgrìobh Ask Hjorth Larsen:

 Hi Michael

 Generally if you are on the translations page, click 'Bugs' on the top
 (there are Overview, Code, Bugs, Blueprints, Translations, Answers).
 That should take you to the appropriate bug page.

 Best regards
 Ask



 --
 Akerbeltz
 Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
 Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
 Facs: +44-141-945 2701

 Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!
 Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
 geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net

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Re: Utopic plurals

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi

Could you send a link to the specific translation template please?

Best regards
Ask

2014-08-13 2:39 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer f...@akerbeltz.org:
 Hi

 Could someone give the developers in question a reminder about proper plural
 formatting? Had a whole batch in the current strings which just use English
 plurals:

 %d results
 Located in src/scopes/ebay.py:521
 (missed copying the singular string name of this one)

 (1 result)
 Located in src/scopes/sevendigital.py:512

 ({} results)
 Located in src/scopes/sevendigital.py:515

 Cheers :)

 Michael

 --
 Akerbeltz
 Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
 Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
 Facs: +44-141-945 2701

 Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!
 Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
 geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net

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Phone translations keep coming in, still no word of a deadline

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Dear influential people whom I know to be reading this

I shall have to apologize in advance for the bit of complaining that I
shall be doing below.  The Ubuntu phone strings keep coming in at a
steady pace, we have to hurry every day to patch everything up in case
that day happens to be the deadline, which we don't know.

Instead of working efficiently offline with po-files we have to work
with Launchpad which is unstable and does not properly support a
review process, because of all the small changes taking place across
many modules.  The result is that we spend much more time patching up
the translations every time there's a little update than it would take
to do a big chunk of bulk translations once and for all, then run that
once through the review process.  We have patched the Danish
translation probably four times with big fanfare and e-mail exchanges,
only to see ~200 new strings again today.  Please, please provide a
proper string freeze and a deadline.  This is not all right.  Would
you please try to talk to the responsible people and get them to
provide some useful information or estimates that we can use to
facilitate our own work?

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Timeouts when trying to translate on Launchpad

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello

I see this quite frequently.  I assume it's the same for everyone.

Best regards
Ask

2014-08-08 13:03 GMT+02:00 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com:
 Hi All,

 When trying to translate on Launchpad, I get quite often Timeout errors.
 That is, when I am submitting a translation and click to get the next 10
 message,
 the page give the Timeout error. I need to refresh several times in order to
 proceed to the next set of messages.

 I have tried with both Firefox and Chrome.
 Does anyone else exhibit this issue?
 I am translating for Greek (in case there is some server-side extra
 processing for some languages).

 Simos

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Re: Timeouts when trying to translate on Launchpad

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Michael

Are you sure they were lost?  Usually they get submitted correctly,
and it is the next page which refuses to load.  So far I have not lost
a page of translations due to the usual timeout error.

Best regards
Ask

2014-08-08 13:26 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer f...@akerbeltz.org:
 Yep, get it a lot too. Especially annoying when the back button does not
 bring up your translations again. I actually just lost a whole page worth 2
 minutes ago.

 Michael

 08/08/2014 12:08, sgrìobh ubuntu-translators-requ...@lists.ubuntu.com:

 Hi All,

 When trying to translate on Launchpad, I get quite often Timeout errors.
 That is, when I am submitting a translation and click to get the next 10
 message,
 the page give the Timeout error. I need to refresh several times in order
 to proceed to the next set of messages.

 I have tried with both Firefox and Chrome.
 Does anyone else exhibit this issue?
 I am translating for Greek (in case there is some server-side extra
 processing for some languages).

 Simos



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Re: Heads up: new phone translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello

As I recall it, the deadline is tomorrow.  Could you please talk to
the relevant people so that they extend it?

Best regards
Ask

2014-07-30 14:25 GMT+02:00 David Planella david.plane...@ubuntu.com:
 Hi Translators,

 You might have noticed that new translatable strings are landing on the
 phone. Everyone is busy trying to get everything ready for RTM and you might
 see more of this in the coming days as bug fixes land. If you come up any
 string that's not translatable, please do share it on the list. If you know
 the affected project in Launchpad, feel free to file a bug directly in
 there.

 You'll notice some of the new messages here:

 http://projects.davidplanella.org/stats/utopic

 And another project that will be added to the stats tomorrow morning:

 https://translations.launchpad.net/telephony-service/

 This will include the messages for the number of calls and messages
 received/made/written on the welcome screen (the fix to include those hasn't
 landed yet, though).

 Cheers,
 David.

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Unclear strings - Ubuntu phone

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello

A few Ubuntu phone strings that I don't understand.  I will be
grateful if some of you can help, or maybe we should file bug reports
since usually unclear strings marked for translation should be
considered bugs.  Let's begin:

#: src/imports/ContactView/ContactDetailOnlineAccountsView.qml:30
msgid Touch

What does Touch mean in the address book application?  Is it a verb
or a noun?  It seems very out of context.  Maybe it's even the name of
a protocol?

#. the {0} will be replaced by the name of a city in a search query,
#. the {1} will indicate the end of the query's string
#: curucu/restscopes/scopes.py:180
msgid {0} weather{1}

In curucu, the comment above about {1} does not seem to be of much
help.  Is the query's string not just the same as the city name if the
user searched for the city?  What kind of string is it then?  And why
only the end?


#: ../alarm/AddAlarmPage.qml:594
msgid Occurs
msgstr 

#: ../alarm/AddAlarmPage.qml:637
msgid Occurrence
msgstr 

In the alarm app, it should be added in a comment that the first one
refers to a week day, and the other to a list of week days.  (I assume
this is so; if it is wrong, then our translation is wrong.  But I
think it is correct because I looked at the code)

#: src/qml/dialer-app.qml:364
msgid Calling Line Presentation
msgstr 

#: src/qml/dialer-app.qml:376
msgid Calling Line Restriction
msgstr 

#: src/qml/dialer-app.qml:370
msgid Connected Line Presentation
msgstr 

#: src/qml/dialer-app.qml:382
msgid Connected Line Restriction
msgstr 

In the dialer app, what are these?  I cannot see it from the source.

The German translation has [directly translated] call number
suppression from the caller whereas in Spanish some of them are
translated as actions, like Restrict line of the call.  I doubt that
these two can be correct at the same time.

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Unclear strings - Ubuntu phone

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello Hannie

Ideally they should have put the Report-Msgid-Bugs-To field in the
po-files.  Then everything would be easy.  Unfortunately it's a bit
more complicated.  Since there were several previous cases under
discussion on this list, perhaps some hero will unite all the
troublesome strings and put them in bug reports for each ubuntu phone
project (do they all have launchpad bug pages?).

Best regards
Ask

2014-07-21 17:30 GMT+02:00 Hannie Dumoleyn lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl:
 Hey Ask,
 You have done your homework ;)
 We now know that quite a few of us have problems with the translation of
 strings that need more information.
 Is it an idea to try and contact one or more of the developers so they can
 answer the questions that are put here on the translators list?
 Perhaps David can provide us with names of whom we may contact.
 Personally I think this might work better than filing bugs for each
 question. Or should we file one general bug reporting that we need more
 information on many a string?
 Hannie

 op 21-07-14 15:51, Ask Hjorth Larsen schreef:

 Hello

 A few Ubuntu phone strings that I don't understand.  I will be
 grateful if some of you can help, or maybe we should file bug reports
 since usually unclear strings marked for translation should be
 considered bugs.  Let's begin:

 #: src/imports/ContactView/ContactDetailOnlineAccountsView.qml:30
 msgid Touch

 What does Touch mean in the address book application?  Is it a verb
 or a noun?  It seems very out of context.  Maybe it's even the name of
 a protocol?

 #. the {0} will be replaced by the name of a city in a search query,
 #. the {1} will indicate the end of the query's string
 #: curucu/restscopes/scopes.py:180
 msgid {0} weather{1}

 In curucu, the comment above about {1} does not seem to be of much
 help.  Is the query's string not just the same as the city name if the
 user searched for the city?  What kind of string is it then?  And why
 only the end?


 #: ../alarm/AddAlarmPage.qml:594
 msgid Occurs
 msgstr 

 #: ../alarm/AddAlarmPage.qml:637
 msgid Occurrence
 msgstr 

 In the alarm app, it should be added in a comment that the first one
 refers to a week day, and the other to a list of week days.  (I assume
 this is so; if it is wrong, then our translation is wrong.  But I
 think it is correct because I looked at the code)

 #: src/qml/dialer-app.qml:364
 msgid Calling Line Presentation
 msgstr 

 #: src/qml/dialer-app.qml:376
 msgid Calling Line Restriction
 msgstr 

 #: src/qml/dialer-app.qml:370
 msgid Connected Line Presentation
 msgstr 

 #: src/qml/dialer-app.qml:382
 msgid Connected Line Restriction
 msgstr 

 In the dialer app, what are these?  I cannot see it from the source.

 The German translation has [directly translated] call number
 suppression from the caller whereas in Spanish some of them are
 translated as actions, like Restrict line of the call.  I doubt that
 these two can be correct at the same time.

 Best regards
 Ask



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Untranslated strings in Evolution

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello

I notice that evolution and evolution-data-server were missing
hundreds of strings in the Danish version of Ubuntu trusty.

In contrast, we always keep it at or near 100% in GNOME.

Does anyone know why strings were not pulled from upstream?  Is there
some error?

I have now done manual merges with the GNOME translations, which will
bring both programmes close to 100% if the import succeeds.

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Problems translating some strings

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hello Ibai

My guess is that the code #27; is confusingly inserted by Launchpad
instead of the sign '.  The original substitution code is %'d, which
works like %d except the formatting may depend on locale.  I don't
know why Launchpad does these silly things.  You should be able to
write %'d.  But I guess %d works also.  This seems to be just another
error in Launchpad.

Agur eta ondo pasa :)
Ask


2014-03-25 0:58 GMT+01:00 Ibai Oihanguren Sala i...@oihanguren.com:
 I think I have corrected the first problem too, looking to the Spanish
 translation. I've put %d instead of %#x27;d.
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Re: Most common strings?

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Michael

Please remember if you fix errors in e.g. GNOME or KDE to propagate
those fixes to the upstream GNOME and KDE teams, and other upstreams
like translationproject.org etc. that are not too exotic to locate; in
fact the easiest way would be to apply fixes directly upstream and
wait for the strings to propagate to Ubuntu.

The first one or two pages on the Launchpad listing contain many
Ubuntu-only modules for which this is not necessary, for example the
installers.  These are probably considered so important in Ubuntu
because they are Ubuntu-only, whereas almost all the programmes a
couple of pages down the list have a separate translation team in
charge somewhere on the internet.

Best regards
Ask

2013/4/11 Michael Bauer f...@akerbeltz.org:
 Hi David,

 Thanks for that - it sort of helps and sort of doesn't because the list
 assumes you know what each module does. Maybe I should just keep going from
 the top :/

 Cheers

 Michael

 11/04/2013 14:05, sgrìobh David Planella:

 Hi Michael,

 The list of translatable templates (which for most cases corresponds to
 the list of applications) [1] is ordered in terms of those we consider
 most important (i.e. visible) to translate, according to these rules:

  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/TemplatesPriority

 Technically, there is no way that's been implemented to automatically
 find out the most visible strings in Ubuntu, which is why we came up
 with manual priorities, set by our experience in translating those
 applications.

 The list might not be perfect, but it works well for our purposes.
 Priorities can be edited in Launchpad, so if you or anyone else sees any
 that might need tweaking, you can mention it on the list or ping me or
 anyone else in the Translations Coordinators team [2], and we can change
 it in a matter of minutes.

 As you're correcly saying, the installer templates are at the top of the
 list, but if you're only interested in proofreading the UI, you can just
 skip those.

 Let me know if this helps.

 Cheers,
 David.

 [1] https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu
 [2] https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-translations-coordinators



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Re: Importing gnome-user-docs translations into ubuntu-docs

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi

On Fri, 13 Apr 2012, Matthew East wrote:
(...)

In the meantime I encourage all translators to upload gnome-user-docs
manually to the ubuntu-docs template here:

https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-docs/precise/+translations


But someone disabled the function so you cannot anymore upload files that 
do not come from Launchpad.  Except if you somehow tinker with the header 
and do strange magic until it works.  Maybe we can have the old import 
function back?  (In fact, why was the quite excellent import function 
removed in the first place?)


Best regards
Ask

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Re: Pull translations from upstream?

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Sat, Apr 7, 2012 at 3:06 PM, Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi

 I just noticed that the Danish coreutils translation in Launchpad was
 incomplete while the same version is fully translated at
 TranslationProject.
(...)

Maybe I should be nice and include some links:

https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/coreutils
http://translationproject.org/domain/coreutils.html

Regards
Ask

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Re: New participant

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Anton

On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 5:19 PM, Антон Даньшин anton.dans...@frtk.ru wrote:
 Hello!
 My name is Anton Danshin. I'm a 3rd-year student from Russia. I'd like to
 take part in Ubuntu translation.
 How do I get started?
 Best regards, Anton Danshin

You can contact the Russian Ubuntu translators' group:

  https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-l10n-ru

They are responsible for the translation and should be able to help
you get started.  Good luck translating!

Regards
Ask

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Re: 25 new lines in app-install-data and we are past translation deadline :(

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 3:05 PM, Anders Jenbo and...@jenbo.dk wrote:
 https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/app-install-data-ubuntu/+pots/app-install-data

 -Anders

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Hvis vi er forbi deadline, så er ændringerne i de engelske jo også
forbi deadline, så det kan sagtens være det ikke har nogen betydning.

Jeg har dog gennemgået og skrevet forslag, har du tid til at se på
dem?  Deadline er ca. nu for langpack, i øvrigt.

Mvh Ask

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Re: Tools for searching translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi André

On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 8:32 PM, André Gondim andregon...@ubuntu.com wrote:
 Hi Adi,

 I tried to use you search translation tool, but I didn't have sucesso
 with bzr command, is it down?

 Cheers,

I have the ubuntu translator tools as a ppa package (not copied to
natty though).

https://launchpad.net/~askhl/+archive/ppa

Regards
Ask

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Re: Review Infringment

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi

On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 10:57 AM, Simos Xenitellis
simos.li...@googlemail.com wrote:
 On Sun, Apr 3, 2011 at 4:10 PM, Daniel Nylander p...@danielnylander.se 
 wrote:

 Translators,

 I wonder what the following string in software-center should be
 interpreted as. How is it used? A button? Page title?
 If anyone got a screenshot, that would help a lot!


 Review Infringment

 https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/software-center/+pots/software-center/sv/+translate?show=untranslated


 The same page mentions Located in ../utils/submit_review.py:1007, so
 you find the source file
 http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/natty/software-center/natty/view/head:/utils/submit_review.py

 Looking in the source file you notice the message
 By submitting this review, you agree not to include anything
 defamatory, __infringing__, or illegal. Canonical may, at its
 discretion, publish your name and review in Ubuntu Software Center and
 elsewhere, ...

 Therefore, Review Infringement means that there has been an
 infringement of a review that was sent through the Software centre,
 and the message is used as a title for the details of the person that
 reported the infringement by the posting of a restricted review.
 Review is not used as a verb here.

 Simos

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So let's get this crystal clear.

A suitable rewording of Review Infringement is Review infringes on
copyright, which seems unambiguous to me.

True or false?

Regards
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Re: Taking GNOME 2.32 translations for Natty from GNOME git

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 10:55 PM, pec...@gmail.com pec...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi David and others!

 Is there any chance that when packaging gnome 2.32 for Natty you will
 take translations from current git branches? My team have lot of
 quality updates on GNOME git gnome-2-32 branch and I hope they can be
 rolled in this way.

 Thanks for any info,
 Cheers,
 Peter.

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Getting the recent translations from upstream (GNOME in particular) to
Ubuntu is also one of my regular problems, particularly after the
import feature unfortunately disappeared.  Some sort of guarantee
the strings in GNOME git will be imported on $UPSTREAM_IMPORT_DAY
would be very highly appreciated.

Regards
Ask

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Re: Firefox has reverted to English

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 12:39 PM, Gabor Kelemen kelem...@gnome.hu wrote:
 2011-03-05 12:33 keltezéssel, Ask Hjorth Larsen írta:

 On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 12:19 PM, Gabor Kelemenkelem...@gnome.hu  wrote:

 2011-03-05 10:30 keltezéssel, David Planella írta:

 2011/3/5 Redmarred...@ubuntu-nl.org:

 Hi all,

 I'm using Maverick with the langpack-proposed ppa enabled, and firefox
 has reverted to using English text since a week or so. I'm not sure
 where I should report this, so I sent a mail to the list, I hope
 someone
 can help me out. All other programs are still shown in Dutch.

 Summary:
 Distro: Maverick
 Lang: Dutch(nl)
 Application: Firefox

 That's exactly the right place to report it, thanks :-)

 I'm on Natty, so I cannot verify it quickly. Has anyone else using
 Maverick and the langpacks PPA detected a problem?

 I have enabled the langpack PPA (also -proposed, but no -backports), and
 Firefox became English too. Perhaps this has something to do with it, but
 simply downgrading the langpacks to the ones in the -updates repository
 didn't help:

 $ dpkg -l language-pack-hu
 Desired=Unknown/Install/Remove/Purge/Hold
 |

 Status=Not/Inst/Conf-files/Unpacked/halF-conf/Half-inst/trig-aWait/Trig-pend
 |/ Err?=(none)/Reinst-required (Status,Err: uppercase=bad)
 ||/ Név                                               Verzió
                            Leírás

 +++-==-==-
 ii  language-pack-hu                                   1:10.10+20110301
                               translation updates for language Hungarian
 eduard@eduard-laptop:~$ dpkg -L language-pack-hu | grep firefox
 /usr/lib/firefox-addons
 /usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions
 /usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions/langpack...@firefox-4.0.ubuntu.com

 Regards
 Gabor Kelemen


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 Having the langpack PPA enabled and no other repos, I can confirm that
 firefox is in now in English.  I don't know whether this coincides
 with an update to language-selector or gdm.

 I see now something strange. After reinstalling language-pack-hu-base,
 Firefox is normal again, even with the PPA updates installed.
 Could you post the result of

 dpkg -L language-pack-dk-base | grep firefox

 now, and after reinstalling this package?

 Regards
 Gabor Kelemen


Before removing the base langpack and its three other dependencies:

askhl@askm:~$ dpkg -L language-pack-da-base | grep firefox
/usr/lib/firefox-addons
/usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions
/usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions/langpack...@firefox-3.6.ubuntu.com

After adding all four packages again:

/usr/lib/firefox-addons
/usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions
/usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions/langpack...@firefox-3.6.ubuntu.com
/usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions/langpack...@firefox-3.6.ubuntu.com/chrome.manifest
/usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions/langpack...@firefox-3.6.ubuntu.com/firefox-3.6-da.jar
/usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions/langpack...@firefox-3.6.ubuntu.com/install.rdf

At this point Firefox is in Danish again.

Regards
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Re: Call for friendly-recovery testing

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Nobuto

On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 4:07 AM, Nobuto MURATA nob...@nobuto-murata.org wrote:
 Hi Ask,

 (2011年02月20日 22:47), Ask Hjorth Larsen wrote:
 On Sun, Feb 20, 2011 at 2:33 PM, Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com 
 wrote:
 locale: da_DK.utf8
 affected: NO
 percentage: 100%

 (Includes non-latin characters)


 Regards
 Ask


 I found that the lower/uppercase letters æ, Æ, å and Å are correct,
 but the last of the Danish non-latin characters, ø, looks somewhat
 wrong when using a non-X terminal, because it is raised above the
 baseline of the other characters.  Also the uppercase Ø is replaced by
 something which doesn't resemble it very well.  I notice that in
 general, very few non-latin characters are displayed correctly in the
 non-X-terminal, but this does not have to do with friendly-recovery
 specifically.  Does anyone notice anything similar? (We should
 probably move this to a new thread)

 The font in console seems to cover Latin-1(ISO8859-1) only by default.
 Your issue might be related to this case[1].

 BTW, in your locale some characters have different glyphs, but no
 unreadable characters like squares. Is my recognithon correct?

Correct.  The different glyphs are very ugly (particularly the
uppercase one) but not unreadable.


 Then your locale is not enough to disable translations, right? In other
 words, keeping translated is fine?

Indeed, they should be kept.


 [1]
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO/IEC_8859-1#Languages_commonly_supported_but_with_incomplete_coverage

 --
 Nobuto MURATA / 村田信人

This is not the incomplete coverage issue, because it doesn't relate
to ǿ (i.e. ø with an apostrophe, which is used very rarely, and even
then only optionally).  It is related to ø and Ø without apostrophe.
The ø is replaced by an ø which is placed a few pixels above the
baseline of the other letters, while the Ø is replaced by some kind of
O-like character.  Ø is unicode 00D8 if this can help to reproduce the
problem.

Regards
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Re: Ubuntu language pack update requests procedure

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi

On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 3:21 PM, David Planella
david.plane...@ubuntu.com wrote:
 Hi translators,

 As part of the language pack updates spec, there was a remaining item
 for me to do to document a procedure for on-demand language pack
 updates. In short, for a translation team to request a language pack
 update out of the normal schedule.

 You'll find it here:

 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/LanguagePackUpdateRequest

 Please have a look at it, and let me know what you think
 (+1/-1/comments/questions...).

 Thanks!

 Regards,
 David.

 [1]
 https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ubuntutheproject-community-n-translations-language-pack-updates-schedule

 --
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 Ubuntu Translations Coordinator
 www.ubuntu.com / www.davidplanella.wordpress.com
 www.identi.ca/dplanella / www.twitter.com/dplanella

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It's good to have a well-defined procedure for extraordinary updates,
and the procedure seems fine.  I think the regular updates are
frequent enough that extraordinary ones should not be requested just
for the sake of new translations - only critical bugs require this
IMHO.

Regards
Ask

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Re: Firefox translations status in Natty

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi David

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 7:16 PM, David Planella
david.plane...@ubuntu.com wrote:
 El ds 05 de 02 de 2011 a les 19:05 +0100, en/na Ask Hjorth Larsen va
 escriure:
 Hi David

 On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 4:53 PM, Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com 
 wrote:
  Hi David
 
  On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 4:00 PM, David Planella
  david.plane...@ubuntu.com wrote:
  Hi translators,
 
  I thought I'd give you a quick update on the Firefox translations in
  Natty:
 
  Due to a change in the way upstream packages translations, those of you
  who are testing Natty will have noticed that Firefox is in English only.
 
  During the Canonical Platform Rally last week we worked on fixing this
  to import translations into Launchpad and put them in the language
  packs. Special thanks go to Danilo on his great work on modifying po2xpi
  for the new format [1], Chris Coulson for getting the Firefox en-US
  template to build automatically and Martin Pitt to integrate the po2xpi
  changes into langpack-o-matic [2], which will allow to build the Firefox
  translations and put them into the language packs.
 
  If all goes well, most of the translations should be available after
  Alpha-2 on February the 3rd.
 
       * Once they are available, please make sure to test them well and
         report any bugs you might find.
 
  In addition to that, while importing some upstream translations we
  noticed a couple of bugs. These need to be fixed upstream, so I'd like
  to ask the teams affected to coordinate with upstream to fix them.
 
  Here are the bugs in Launchpad with upstream links:
 
  Brazilian Portuguese:
  https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704210
 
  Norwegian Nynorsk:
  https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704202
 
  Oriya:
  https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704205
 
  Telugu:
  https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704208
 
  Tamil:
  https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704211
 
 
       * Please work with the upstream teams to get these fixed. In the
         meantime, you can fix them in the xpi files for Ubuntu [3] and
         upload them.
 
  Finally, just a note to say that we imported the translations from [4].
  I know some teams haven't got their translations in there yet, only on
  Mercurial. We've only imported the official ones for now. If you need
  your non-official translation to get imported, let us know and we'll see
  if we can figure something out.
 
  Regards,
  David.
 
  [1] https://code.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/po2xpi/trunk
  [2] https://launchpad.net/langpack-o-matic
  [3] 
  https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/firefox/+imports?field.filter_status=FAILEDfield.filter_extension=all
  [4] 
  http://releases.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/4.0b9/linux-i686/
 
  --
  David Planella
  Ubuntu Translations Coordinator
  www.ubuntu.com / www.davidplanella.wordpress.com
  www.identi.ca/dplanella / www.twitter.com/dplanella
 
  Are there any ubuntu-specific changes to the firefox templates?  I
  notice that we have a few untranslated strings, and this is unusual
  because the Danish upstream Mozilla translators tend to keep it at
  100%.
 
  Regards
  Ask
 

 How are the untranslated strings in Firefox supposed to be translated?
  They are all on the form update.downloading.end,
 setup.tosAgree2.accesskey and so on.  That usually means they should
 not be translated.  But then why are they marked for translation?
 Anders Jenbo told me that apparently they are placeholders for other
 strings that one would need the source code to figure out.

 The following languages have translated Firefox 100%:  Slovenian,
 Spanish, Albanian, British, Portuguese, Brazilian Portuguese.   These
 have all dealt with these strings by copying the English ones.  Can
 someone please tell us all what the right thing to do is?

 Regards
 Ask

 Hi Ask,

 Let me first add a bit of background: Launchpad is based on the gettext
 model, in which you've got a .pot template with a fixed set of messages
 and then translations in each language.

 The way Launchpad supports the Mozilla XPI format is accomodating it as
 much as it can be to gettext. Mozilla does not have the concept of
 templates, there are only .xpi files for each available language.
 However, what can be done is to consider the en-US.xpi file as the
 master template, from which other languages create the translations.

 So far so good, except for the fact that the translations in Mozilla do
 not necessarily have to match the en-US.xpi file, so, for example in the
 fi.xpi you could just omit some messages that are in en-US.xpi file.

 Folowing this example, and considering that Mozilla translations are
 nothing else as .properties and .dtd files zipped inside an .xpi
 archive, let's imagine the en-US.xpi template contains a file called
 dummy.properties, which looks like this:

 8-

 # Write your first translation in the New translation text box.
 firstTranslation=My first

Re: Announcing new Lucid language packs for the 10.04.2 release

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 7:28 PM, David Planella
david.plane...@ubuntu.com wrote:
 El dt 08 de 02 de 2011 a les 08:56 +0100, en/na Hannie va escriure:
 Hello David,
 While checking
 https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+lang/nl/ I noticed
 that gcalctool still has 124 strings untranslated or need review.
 Since I have recently completed gcalctool at Gnome,
 http://l10n.gnome.org/module/gcalctool/, I presume that Lucid uses an
 older version, but which one?


 Branches: master - gnome-2-32 - gnome-2-30 - gnome-2-28 - gnome-2-26 -
 gnome-2-24 - gnome-2-22 - gnome-2-20 - gnome-2-18


 Yeah, Lucid does not use the master branch, but looking at
 https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+source/gcalctool i cannot really
 correlate the version to the one in GNOME.

 There it says that gcalctool is 5.28, which I could imagine it relates
 to 2.28, that is, the gnome-2-28 translations branch in Damned Lies.

 I'm CC'ing Robert Ancell, the gcalctool developer. Robert, can you
 confirm the above?

 Thanks.

 Regards,
 David.


 What strikes me is that at Damned Lies it has 223 messages, while in
 Launchpad there are 452, what a difference!


 Can you advise me on what to do with this?


 Regards,
 Hannie

The number of strings 452 coincides exactly with the string-frozen
version of gcalctool from GNOME 2-28, and none of the other versions.
So it's the one from GNOME 2-28.

Regards
Ask

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Re: Suggestion for broken translation reportings

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 4:29 PM, Yaron Shahrabani sh.ya...@gmail.com wrote:
 Tomer just brought to my attention that although there are some broken
 translation people don't want to deal with that.

 Tomer found a mistake in GNOME translation, after checking he found that the
 translation was already updated but the broken translation was there really
 long time ago and will stay there at least until 3.0 will be released.

 This is why I think the Translate this Application... entry under the Help
 menu is useless comparing to Report broken translation...

 My idea is to make this menu item launch an apport screen that will let you
 take a screenshot of the required string or window.

 Please have a look at the attached mockup.
 Yaron Shahrabani

 Hebrew translator

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On

  http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/27054/

you state that:

In Ubuntu the Translate this Application menu item under Help has
become completely useless recently and I think we should consider an
alternative while utilising gnome-screenshot and apport. 

You state this as if it is obvious.  If it is so obvious to you, how
about enlightening the rest of us?

Regards
Ask

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Re: Suggestion for broken translation reportings

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Sun, Feb 6, 2011 at 2:53 PM, Yaron Shahrabani sh.ya...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Sun, Feb 6, 2011 at 3:39 PM, Ask Hjorth Larsen asklar...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 On Sun, Feb 6, 2011 at 2:21 PM, Yaron Shahrabani sh.ya...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  The number of new Hebrew translators (Including candidates) for the
  Hebrew
  translation is very low, about 1 candidate every 3 or 4 months (most of
  them
  are not accepted since we are trying to keep on consistency and
  quality).
  On the other hand I get many correction suggestions from people who
  don't
  have a launchpad account.
  Sorry if I hurt your feelings Ask but from my point of view the current
  functionality is useless comparing to the one I suggested.
  We can combine them but suggesting a correction really is a necessary
  function.
  Kind regards,
  Yaron Shahrabani

 I think most of our prospective translators come from the translate
 this application button in some way.  That being said, it's useful if
 people can easily report bugs.  I'm not affiliated with the
 translate this application button and don't take offense if someone
 says it's useless, but I do disagree.

 As long as you are not offended everything is just fine ☺
 Let me ask you some relevant questions:
 Do you believe the Translate this application menu item is satisfactory?

Yeah, I think it's a significant source of new translators.

 Don't you think this menu item can be much more useful?

Things can probably be improved, but it gets the job done.

 Would you like to see the discussed feature alongside the current
 functionality?

Sure, if someone has time to implement it.  Reporting bugs is often a
bottleneck: People are willing to report them, but not to spend time
creating accounts, figuring out where and how and so on.  But also,
people who are taking over the bug reports have to spend time sorting
and redirecting/verifying them.  An easy one-click bug function
would probably help a lot with that.

 Do you have any other suggestion for improvement?
 Kind regards,
 Yaron Shahrabani.

Hmmm.  Not really.

Regards
Ask

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Re: [Ubuntu-manual] Manual: fuzzies, on/offline and translator credits

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi Hannie

On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 4:52 PM, lafeber-dumoleyn2
lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl wrote:
 Thanks to all the reactions in the thread Not happy at all, which I
 started in December, I can give you an update on what I have done.
 After merging manual-lucid and manual-maverick with the command 'msgmerge',
 the result is a new po-file with all the old translations in it, contrary to
 manual-maverick in Launchpad which lacks more than 400 translated
 paragraphs. I cannot upload this new po-file to Launchpad because then all
 the fuzzies are missing.
 So the only options are:
 1. copy all the fuzzies from the po-file to manual-maverick in Launcpad.
 This is a very time-consuming job and on top of that the name of the
 original translator is substituted by the name of the person who copies the
 paragraphs. This is hardly fair to the original translator.
 2. finish the manual-maverick po-file offline in a CAT. This would be much
 faster, but I am afraid that it will become a mess when this file is later
 uploaded to Launchpad. Besides, working offline can only be done by one
 person. And here we have the same problem, the names of the original
 translators are lost.
 Perhaps there is someone who can come up with a brilliant idea to solve
 this. I am particularly interested in how the German and Greek translation
 teams have tackled this.

It shouldn't become a mess when the file is uploaded to Launchpad
after working offline.  It might complain if the po-file header has
changed, but that should not be a problem if you choose import
rather than upload.  Did you observe any problems?

Regards
Ask


 I also experimented, with the help of Ask, with the commands podiff, wdiff
 and cdiff. These are useful to find out which version is the right one.
 Example: I had about 4 versions of manual-Lucid, with slight differences.
 With wdiff/cdiff it was made easy to find which was the right one.
 Hannie



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 Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-manual
 Post to     : ubuntu-man...@lists.launchpad.net
 Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-manual
 More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp


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Re: Firefox translations status in Natty

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi David

On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 4:00 PM, David Planella
david.plane...@ubuntu.com wrote:
 Hi translators,

 I thought I'd give you a quick update on the Firefox translations in
 Natty:

 Due to a change in the way upstream packages translations, those of you
 who are testing Natty will have noticed that Firefox is in English only.

 During the Canonical Platform Rally last week we worked on fixing this
 to import translations into Launchpad and put them in the language
 packs. Special thanks go to Danilo on his great work on modifying po2xpi
 for the new format [1], Chris Coulson for getting the Firefox en-US
 template to build automatically and Martin Pitt to integrate the po2xpi
 changes into langpack-o-matic [2], which will allow to build the Firefox
 translations and put them into the language packs.

 If all goes well, most of the translations should be available after
 Alpha-2 on February the 3rd.

      * Once they are available, please make sure to test them well and
        report any bugs you might find.

 In addition to that, while importing some upstream translations we
 noticed a couple of bugs. These need to be fixed upstream, so I'd like
 to ask the teams affected to coordinate with upstream to fix them.

 Here are the bugs in Launchpad with upstream links:

 Brazilian Portuguese:
 https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704210

 Norwegian Nynorsk:
 https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704202

 Oriya:
 https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704205

 Telugu:
 https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704208

 Tamil:
 https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/704211


      * Please work with the upstream teams to get these fixed. In the
        meantime, you can fix them in the xpi files for Ubuntu [3] and
        upload them.

 Finally, just a note to say that we imported the translations from [4].
 I know some teams haven't got their translations in there yet, only on
 Mercurial. We've only imported the official ones for now. If you need
 your non-official translation to get imported, let us know and we'll see
 if we can figure something out.

 Regards,
 David.

 [1] https://code.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/po2xpi/trunk
 [2] https://launchpad.net/langpack-o-matic
 [3] 
 https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/firefox/+imports?field.filter_status=FAILEDfield.filter_extension=all
 [4] 
 http://releases.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/4.0b9/linux-i686/

 --
 David Planella
 Ubuntu Translations Coordinator
 www.ubuntu.com / www.davidplanella.wordpress.com
 www.identi.ca/dplanella / www.twitter.com/dplanella

Are there any ubuntu-specific changes to the firefox templates?  I
notice that we have a few untranslated strings, and this is unusual
because the Danish upstream Mozilla translators tend to keep it at
100%.

Regards
Ask

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Re: [Ubuntu-manual] Not happy at all

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 9:14 AM, lafeber-dumoleyn2
lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl wrote:
 Op 11-01-11 18:30, Ask Hjorth Larsen schreef:

 For me the alternative is only one, at the present time:

 - download the package, translate offline and create a translation
 memory, then
 upload again the file.
 - the next time the file will be updated, you have the old tm ready to be
 used
 in your CAT tool, so minor changes will be minor headaches for us :)

 Choose the CAT tool you prefer, I personally use Lokalize for Interface
 and
 Help KDE/OOo/Libņ files, and OmegaT for other stuff.


 Now, about your suggestion: working offline has the same disadvantage. Since
 Lucid and Maverick are not merged you can only transfer translations from LL
 to MM manually, and that is just as much work as copying in LP from LL to
 MM.

 What do you mean when you say that you cannot transfer them because
 they are not merged?

 Hi Ask,
 What I meant is this. When I download the Maverick package, as Valter
 suggests, I first have to find out which strings are already translated in
 Lucid (the string numbers do not match) and then copy and paste them. I
 think that will cost me a lot of time, perhaps even more than when I
 translate afresh . Besides, working like this (offline) would mean I would
 have to do it on my own. The advantage would be, as Valter says, that you
 build a translation memory which you can use for the next versions. But then
 again, this would only work when you can share this TM with others (I think
 Lokalize has this option, but I have never used it).
 In Lokalize there seems to be a merging option, but I have never worked with
 that before. If I can merge LL and MM in Lokalize it would save me a lot of
 time. I might give it a try, but I'm afraid it will mean a lot of
 experimenting before it works. If I succeed I will let you know.
 Regards,
 Hannie


Download the two po-files and run the command:

  msgmerge lucid-po-file.po maverick-po-file.po  merged.po

This will move the translated messages over to the new po-file using
fuzzy matching.  After this you'll still have to review the fuzzies,
but this is much easier if you install a po diffing tool such as
podiff from e.g. pyg3t[1] along with wdiff, which can be used to
highlight the differences.  After that the po-file can be uploaded and
completed e.g. on launchpad.

[1] https://launchpad.net/pyg3t

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Re: [Ubuntu-manual] Not happy at all

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 1:05 PM, lafeber-dumoleyn2
lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl wrote:
 Op 12-01-11 11:34, Ask Hjorth Larsen schreef:

 Download the two po-files and run the command:

   msgmerge lucid-po-file.po maverick-po-file.po  merged.po

 This will move the translated messages over to the new po-file using
 fuzzy matching.  After this you'll still have to review the fuzzies,
 but this is much easier if you install a po diffing tool such as
 podiff from e.g. pyg3t[1] along with wdiff, which can be used to
 highlight the differences.  After that the po-file can be uploaded and
 completed e.g. on launchpad.

 [1] https://launchpad.net/pyg3t

 Hi Ask,
 Thank you for your tip. I have done what you described above, and now I have
 a merged file (1661 strings, 400 not ready, 62 untranslated). This may be
 the right starting point to continue with the translations of new versions,
 providing that the maverick version is based on the Lucid version + extra
 strings. I'm not sure if strings from lucid have been removed in the
 maverick version. I will contact the manual guys about this.
 I will not upload the merged file unless I am absolutely sure that the
 result is right.
 Regards,
 Hannie



It's unimportant whether strings have been removed, the main issue is
that the existing ones are transferred.  If msgmerge produces a
po-file with more entries in it than it should (I don't know why that
sometimes happens), merge the msgmerged file into the maverick po-file
again to get something with exactly the correct entries.

I confirm that yes, this *is* the right way to continue with the
translations (as was mentioned in the very first reply in this thread,
so this should not come as a surprise by now), and indeed the exact
reason why msgmerge exists.  It's the standard procedure when
transferring translations when programmes are updated.

Regards
Ask

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Re: [Ubuntu-manual] Not happy at all

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 6:25 PM, lafeber-dumoleyn2
lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl wrote:

 Op 10-01-11 12:21, Valter Mura schreef:

 In data mercoledì 22 dicembre 2010 13:06:11, c7p ha scritto:

 Hi Hannie,
 the fact that lp isn't acting as we would like as translators is a known
 and the only thing we can do is copy n paste the lucid-e1 string to
 lucid-e2 string and translated the minor change.
 Lp is speciallized for translating software messages/strings not paragraphs
 of a book and because of that we are trying to find an alternative solution
 for example a new translation service or platform for the manual editions
 to come.

 What am proposing you to do is not to translate the lucid-e2, since the
 changes are minor and i don't think that they worth the effort of
 retranslating the book again -that's my point of view-.

 I hope we will find the solution soon, if you have to propose a solution or
 an idea, fire it away!

 For me the alternative is only one, at the present time:

 - download the package, translate offline and create a translation memory, 
 then
 upload again the file.
 - the next time the file will be updated, you have the old tm ready to be used
 in your CAT tool, so minor changes will be minor headaches for us :)

 Choose the CAT tool you prefer, I personally use Lokalize for Interface and
 Help KDE/OOo/Libò files, and OmegaT for other stuff.

 I wonder if Launchpad will reintroduce the fuzzy state option (marking the
 string with a percentage of match), very useful in these specific cases.


 Best regards,

 Hello Valter,
 The manual is a special case. It is an advantage that it can be translated 
 online through Launchpad as long as we have to do with the first time strings 
 are translated. In our case that was Ubuntu Manual Lucid Lynx. But Launchpad 
 was not able to transfer the translation of the same strings to the next 
 version of the manual, in this case Maverick Meerkat. Now we get a kind of 
 strange situation which I will illustrate using the following example:

 English string in Lucid-e1:
 \newglossaryentry{router}{name={router}, description={A router is a specially 
 designed computer that using its software and hardware, routes information 
 from the internet to a network. It is also sometimes called a gateway.}}
 Dutch translation in Lucid-e1
 \newglossaryentry{router}{name={router}, description={Een router is een 
 speciaal ontworpen apparaat dat, met behulp van speciale software en 
 hardware, informatie van het internet naar een netwerk stuurt. Het wordt soms 
 ook wel een gateway genoemd.}}
 Translated by Kenneth Venken on 2010-08-13
 Reviewed by Redmar on 2010-08-22

 Dutch translation in Maverick Meerkat
 \newglossaryentry{router}{name={router}, description={Een router is een 
 specifiek ontworpen computer waarmee, gebruikmakend van zijn software en 
 hardware, informatie gerouteerd wordt van het Internet naar een netwerk. Het 
 wordt soms ook wel een gateway genoemd.}}
 Translated by kwoot on 2010-08-26
 Reviewed by Kenneth Venken on 2010-09-28
 Look at the names and dates and you can see what happened here (even though 
 you do not understand Dutch, the differences are clear). And this is just ONE 
 example! I think this is a waste of energy and it leads to different 
 translations, even if the same translator is involved.
 Now, about your suggestion: working offline has the same disadvantage. Since 
 Lucid and Maverick are not merged you can only transfer translations from LL 
 to MM manually, and that is just as much work as copying in LP from LL to MM.
 I am still just as unhappy about the situation as I was when I started this 
 thread, but I do appreciate the many reactions and suggestions that were put 
 on the list. With that I hope we can get to a solution together.
 Regards,
 Hannie

What do you mean when you say that you cannot transfer them because
they are not merged?

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Re: Not happy at all

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 1:24 PM, Danilo Šegan dan...@canonical.com wrote:
 Hi Ask,

 У сре, 22. 12 2010. у 13:01 +0100, Ask Hjorth Larsen пише:

 It's unfortunate that the `fuzzy' feature of gettext is not supported
 in LP, and there have been previous discussions in the manual team
 about what to do, but there's no really good solution as it is.

 Perhaps we should really just turn fuzzy translations into suggestions.
 It wouldn't be a big deal for us, but:

  1. people *will* mistakenly approve suggestions which look almost the
 same (imagine someone fixing a typo of a missing not in a long
 documentation message: I will bet you that most people will not notice
 the not and will just approve the existing translation); this is a
 problem even with offline translation, but Launchpad makes it very easy
 to make this mistake for reviewers
  2. if msgmerge was not done prior to the import, there won't be any
 benefit
  3. people will expect this to actually work, and yet it wouldn't (iow,
 we'll get questions why was there not a suggestion for one string or
 another, and those questions are nothing but a distraction); today we
 just get feature requests about this :)

 Those are the reasons why it's not behaving like that today.  We do,
 however, want to have a smart similarity matching feature for
 suggestions.  That's a lot more work.  I'd be happy to guide anyone with
 some time on their hands into implementing that.

 Cheers,
 Danilo

Hi Danilo

I agree that fuzzies should not be labeled as suggestions for the
reasons you mention.  But it would be great the fuzzies could be
displayed with a different label like Fuzzy, although possibly more
descriptive like This string may be similar to  Then the
reviewer will know that this was not a suggestion as such, and will be
more careful.  (If the project expects high-quality translations, the
reviewer will presumably be a member of a translation team, and can be
expected to at least follow some basic instructions.)

If this is too much of an interface change, the text accompanying the
suggestion could instead be changed from the present form:

  Suggested in coreutils in Ubuntu Intrepid package coreutils by Ask
Hjorth Larsen on 2010-03-08

to something like

  This suggestion was chosen by a computer based on existing similar strings

Wouldn't this mostly solve the fuzzy issue, and require less work than
a new similarity matching feature?  Sorry to further derail the
discussion.  (It's unrealistic for me to help with implementation for
the next 10 months or so, although I would love to if I had more time)

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Not happy at all

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi

On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 11:20 AM, lafeber-dumoleyn2
lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl wrote:
 After having finished the Lucid-e1 Dutch translation I took a look at
 Lucid-e2 on Launchpad. I discovered that 25% (415 strings) was
 untranslated, but when I checked the first untranslated string I
 noticed that there was only a minor change. Most of it was like in
 Lucid-e1, but someone had translated the whole string all over again. I
 am afraid this is the case with most of the untranslated strings. When
 there is a minor change, LP will not copy the translation of the string
 from Lucid-e1, which means that people start translating the whole
 string all over again.
 It is sad that a lot of effort and hard work is spent on something that
 has been done already.
 I see no quick solution to this problem, but perhaps it is better NOT to
 make minor changes, unless it is really necessary.
 I will give one example of a (pretty long) string that has been
 translated twice:

 Lucid-e2
 With more people working on the project than ever before, Ubuntu
 continues to see improvement to its core features and hardware support,
 and has gained the attention of large organizations worldwide. For
 example, in 2007, \Index{Dell} began a collaboration with
 \Index{Canonical} to sell computers with Ubuntu preinstalled.
 Additionally, in 2005, the French Police began to transition their
 entire computer infrastructure to a variant of Ubuntu\dash a process
 which has reportedly saved them ``millions of euros'' in licensing fees
 for Microsoft Windows. By the year 2012, the French Police anticipates
 that all of their computers will be running Ubuntu. \Index{Canonical}
 profits from this arrangement by providing technical support and
 custom-built software.

 Lucid-e1
 Now with more people working on the project than ever before, Ubuntu
 continues to see improvement to its core features and hardware support,
 and has gained the attention of large organizations worldwide. For
 example, in 2007 Dell began a collaboration with Canonical to sell
 computers with Ubuntu pre-installed. Additionally, in 2005 the French
 Police began to transition their entire computer infrastructure to a
 variant of Ubuntu\dash a process which has reportedly saved them
 ``millions of Euro'' in licensing fees for Microsoft Windows. By the
 year 2012, the French Police anticipates that all of their computers
 will be running Ubuntu. Canonical profits from this arrangement by
 providing technical support and custom-built software.

 Nu, met meer mensen dan ooit die aan het project meewerken, worden er in
 Ubuntu nog steeds verbeteringen aangebracht, zowel aan de kernfuncties
 als aan de hardware-ondersteuning, en krijgt het wereldwijd aandacht
 van grote organisaties. Zo ging Dell in 2007 samenwerken met Canonical
 om computers te verkopen waarop Ubuntu reeds geïnstalleerd is. Bovendien
 begon de Franse politie in 2005 met de overstap naar een variant van
 Ubuntu – dit zou hen “miljoenen euro’s ” hebben bespaard aan
 licentierechten voor Microsoft Windows. Tegen 2012 verwacht de Franse
 politie dat al hun computers op Ubuntu zullen draaien. Canonical
 profiteert hiervan door
 technische ondersteuning en software-op-maat aan te bieden.

 If this kind of translation is not transferred from e1 to e2 I see no
 quick way of reviewing 415 strings that have been retranslated in the
 form of suggestions.
 Hannie
 Ubuntu Dutch Translators




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It's unfortunate that the `fuzzy' feature of gettext is not supported
in LP, and there have been previous discussions in the manual team
about what to do, but there's no really good solution as it is.

The best solution for the time being is to export the po-files of both
manual versions from Launchpad and use msgmerge to merge the
translations from the old one into the new template.  This will
produce `fuzzy' strings in the new template, which can then be
reviewed (although offline).  You may find a po-editor useful, as well
as podiff + wdiff.

It's a social problem that one will have to specifically prevent
contributors from wasting their time by contributing to the wrong
version in Launchpad.  Try to communicate over a mailing list and
agree who does what in which version.  That's all the advice I can
give.

Best regards
Ask

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Re: [Ubuntu-manual] Not happy at all

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi

On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 6:26 PM, Kevin Godby god...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hello, Hannie.

 On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 9:44 AM, lafeber-dumoleyn2
 lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl wrote:
 If authors who write new versions only add new strings, and do not add minor
 changes to strings that already exist, our problem is solved. LP will
 transfer all the old strings and their translations, as long as they have
 not changed. There is no problem with new strings, as I mentioned before.
 As for Lucid-e2, I have no intention of reviewing it in LP as long as this
 problem occurs. But it is a pity for all those people who have spent time
 and effort on translating strings that had already been translated and will
 not be reviewed.
 I hope that the Natty version will be based on Lucid-e1 plus ONLY NEW
 strings.
 LP is not to blame in this. It is quite logical that they only transfer
 translations of identical strings.

 The Maverick edition is based on Lucid-e2, and Natty will likely be
 based on Maverick.  We continue to edit from the most recent version.

 A number of the Lucid-e2 strings changed because I moved the margin
 notes around.  I actually moved them in Lucid-e1, but it was done just
 prior to publishing and after the writing freeze. I didn't push those
 changes to Launchpad because it would've caused the same problems
 you're seeing now.

 As far as I recall, there at no substantial changes between Lucid-e1
 and Lucid-e2 -- just fixing some typos, grammatical errors, and
 formatting issues.

 We can't simply add new text and leave the existing text as is or we
 wouldn't have the opportunity to fix these bugs.

 Ideally, our translation system would handle these fuzzy matches by
 highlighting the differences between the two strings so that the
 translator can easily determine whether the new string warrants a new
 translation.  It'd be nice if the system could also manage continuous
 updates.  So instead of waiting for a writing freeze and having an
 entire book dumped in your lap, you could start translating
 immediately.  Anything that had been previously translated would stay
 in the system and not be lost when the original strings are updated.
 Any altered strings would be show to the translator (as mentioned
 earlier) for review.

 Currently, our translation software works at the paragraph level.
 That is, each string is a full paragraph.  The benefit of this (aside
 from it being easier for the LaTeX-to-pot-file converter) is that it
 allows the translators to rearrange sentences within the paragraph or
 rewrite the entire paragraph as they see fit.  This means that the
 translated edition will sound more natural and flow better.  The
 downside is that if anything in that paragraph changes, Launchpad
 tosses out the original translation and you have to start over again.

 We've tossed around the idea of ditching Launchpad and creating our
 own translation system, but I haven't had time to research the issue
 or think about it much yet.  We'd need to sit down with translators,
 editors, and developers to establish what our needs are and what a
 translation system is actually capable of doing.  If you have any
 suggestions or ideas with regard to this sort of thing (or would like
 to kick off a discussion about it), I'd love to hear them!

 --Kevin

 ___
 Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-manual
 Post to     : ubuntu-man...@lists.launchpad.net
 Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-manual
 More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp


My opinion on what we need technically:

Fuzzy matching and a word-wise po-file diffing utility.

The only way to do this without doing lots of development first, I
think, is to use off-line tools.  This also means that it'll be more
difficult to contribute than if we were using Launchpad.  However it
would be straightforward for people with some technical experience.

The tricky issue is that while Launchpad would be suited for
first-time translations, it's not possible to set up things so that
people will work on one sensible version in LP and no other versions.

I don't think the paragraphs should be split into more strings.  The
benefit of being able to split/merge sentences is probably important
for some languages, and at least beneficial for almost all languages.
In free-flowing text it is also very difficult for the translator to
guess what is being referred to by words like this or that, since
that probably depends on the contents of the last sentence.  Then you
would need to look at the full text to translate it at all, and you
might as well open the tex file and just rewrite that in a new
language.  Which is also a possibility of course.

Best regards
Ask

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changes in grub2

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi translators

In a recent IRC discussion we were wondering about the difference
between the grub template in Launchpad with 460 strings and the
upstream template on translationproject.org with only 270 strings.

In case anyone else is wondering, these surprising numbers are due to
some radical upstream additions between versions 1.97 and 1.99 of
grub, which are not visible on translationproject yet.  So these are
not ubuntu-specific, but should be propagated upstream at some point,
once the template is ready on translationproject.

Best regards
Ask

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Re: [Launchpad-translators] Chromium browser now translatable in Launchpad

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at 3:44 PM, Khaled Hosny khaledho...@eglug.org wrote:
 Yes, except that you are going to piss off all users of scripts with
 complex layout requirements.

 Regards,
  Khaled

What do you mean?

Regards
Ask

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Re: First Maverick post-release language packs uploaded to the PPA

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi David

On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 2:39 PM, David Planella
david.plane...@ubuntu.com wrote:
 Hi translators,

 Just a heads up that after fixing some technical issues, the first
 Maverick language packs are now available from the language packs PPA
 [1].

 What does this mean?

      * Maverick language packs will now be available on the PPA every
        week on Wednesday, as per the current schedule [2]. If you want
        to test fresh translation updates every week, you can go and add
        this PPA to your system following the instructions at [3].
      * These language packs will be available to testers subscribed to
        the PPA every week, and they will be released to the
        maverick-updates repository (after testing [4]) from time to
        time, to be delivered to all users.
      * We are still determining the schedule [5] for the releases to
        maverick updates, but it will be announced in due time on this
        list.

 I'm thinking of proposing the next language pack on Wednesday next week
 to be considered for maverick-updates. Unless there are any concerns,
 this means:

      * You've got some time until Tuesday (the date of the export) to
        complete any remaining Maverick translation you'd like to see on
        this language pack.
      * Wednesday or Thursday (depending on how long it takes for the
        packages to build) the packages will be uploaded to
        maverick-proposed and I'll send a call for testing.
      * After that, we'll follow the procedure for testing them [4], and
        those teams which have acknowledged that they've successfully
        tested the packages will have their packages uploaded to
        maverick-updates.

 Does that sound good? If you've got any questions or concerns, please
 let me know.

 Regards,
 David.

 [1]
 https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-langpack/+archive/ppa/+packages?field.name_filter=field.status_filter=publishedfield.series_filter=maverick
 [2] https://dev.launchpad.net/Translations/LanguagePackSchedule
 [3] https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-langpack/+archive/ppa
 [4] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/LanguagePackUpdatesQA
 [5]
 https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ubuntutheproject-community-n-translations-language-pack-updates-schedule

Any updates on the call for testing?

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Policy proposal: Translation team coordinator e-mail address

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi

On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 3:20 PM, David Planella
david.plane...@ubuntu.com wrote:
 Hi translators,

 I've been meaning to ask you for your opinion on this for a while.
 Having just spent 10 minutes looking for the e-mail address of a
 language team coordinator has actually prompted me to do it now.

 So the question is:

      * Should we request translation team leaders to have a visible
        e-mail address in Launchpad?

 And the background is:

 I believe translation team leaders should be people that are easily
 contactable, both by the Ubuntu Translations Coordinators team and by
 other translators, and having a hidden translation address in Launchpad
 does not make things easy. As a reminder: having a visible e-mail
 address in Launchpad makes it only visible to other people who have
 logged in with a valid account in Launchpad - so it's not just visible
 to anyone.

 Now if it took me a non-trivial amount of time to find someone's address
 today, I could imagine that it would be even more difficult for a new
 translator not familiar with our workflow. One could argue that he or
 she could use the Contact this user link, but that has its drawbacks:
 you cannot have a record of the message sent, and it can be used only 3
 times a day to prevent spam, IIRC.

 This is not something new: other translations systems (GNOME, KDE,
 Translation Project, etc.) request coordinators to have a known and
 stable e-mail address, and in some of them it's even a policy.

 If the majority of you think it's a good idea, I'd propose to make it a
 policy. To most of the translation team leaders, it will not make a
 difference. To the few that have got a hidden e-mail address, they would
 simply have to tick a checkbox to make it visible.

 Let me know what you think. +1/-1/comments/concerns...?

 Regards,
 David.

+1.

(Come to think of it, it would be nice if 'contact this user' also
sent a receipt back to yourself, but that's another discussion.)

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Re: Ubuntu 11.04 Translations Plans

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Sun, Oct 3, 2010 at 9:43 AM, Yaron Shahrabani sh.ya...@gmail.com wrote:
 I think we should add it to the roadmap, any objections?
 Yaron Shahrabani


I'm not quite clear on how this will work (displaying screenshots of
various programmes to help translators).  Who uploads the images how,
and how are they kept up to date?  Is it all automatic in some way?

Regards
Ask

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Re: Suggestion: Faster lanugage pack update after final release

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi translators

On Thu, Sep 23, 2010 at 11:24 PM, Kenneth Nielsen k.nielse...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hallo everyone

 I would also really like to have regular, fast and frequent language
 pack releases, so I think we should try and get this thread going
 again. I have made a draft[1] for a template, from which we can create
 language pack release schedules for the individual releases. I have
 already discussed this with David to work in some of his ideas for the
 schedule and now I would very much like your feedback.

 The schedule is designed in such a way, that there will be 5 language
 pack updates for an ordinary release and 8 for a LTS. The first one
 will be made already after 2 weeks, to allow us to get rid of those
 very few but very ugly mistakes that sometimes pop up.

 The amount of releases may sound like a lot, but keep in mind that you
 are not _required_ to release a language pack on all these occasions.
 These will work merely as the times where you have the _opportunity_
 to release one. The idea is that if you want to release a language
 pack, you should test it in the way described in the quality assurance
 page[2] and put your language name on the list (we will then reset the
 page after each language pack release), and if you don't want to
 release a language pack update you simply do nothing ;)

 Let me know what you think.
 Regards Kenneth Nielsen

 [1] 
 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/LanguagePackUpdatesQA/LanguagePackUpdateScheduleTemplate
 [2] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/LanguagePackUpdatesQA

I think it's great.  While the exact dates are not important, the
existence of a fixed schedule makes everything simple to figure out,
and the quick update in the beginning is particularly welcome.  Thank
you for creating the wiki page and getting things going.

Best regards
Ask

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Deadline for translations on live-cd

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi

There have been multiple surprising string changes past the deadline
lately.  What exactly is the deadline for translations that go on the
live-cd?

If the translations have already been exported for the live-cd, then I
cannot guarantee that our translations are complete.  I request an
extension of the deadline into at least the middle of next week, else
we probably can't test the live-cd (again).

Regards
Ask

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Re: translation for a package which is not in launchpad

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 11:19 AM, Bernard beerna...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hello.
 I have translated gramps package upstream after the import in maverick
 was made. How do I get the translation into maverick? (the package is
 not translated on launchpad). Is the version of gramps the same one that
 will be in the final release?
 Thanks for the answers.
 Bernard

Dear Bernard

Get the po-file from upstream.

Find the downstream translation and click the 'Upload translation'
button.  Select 'Imported translation' and provide the po-file.  It'll
take a while as it gets through the import queue.

If anything is not entirely clear, just ask.

Regards
Ask

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Re: Suggestion: Faster lanugage pack update after final release

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi David and Andrej

On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 7:30 PM, David Planella
david.plane...@ubuntu.com wrote:
 Hi Andrej,

 El dj 19 de 08 de 2010 a les 09:27 +0200, en/na Andrej Žnidaršič va
 escriure:
 Hello !

 In slovenian team we get about 80% of 3rd party bug reports (from
 people who are not member of any translation team) in the period of 2
 weeks, between the release of RC and 1 week after final release. This
 is the time when most users upgrade and hence also report bugs.
 A bit more conservative users wait a week or two before upgrade.
 In 10.04 we got a lot bug reports (there were a lot of mistakes in one
 of the packages, due to one translator's unseriousness), and we
 quickly fixed them, but language packs weren't generated for 3 months
 - until the release of 10.4.1 so:


 a) The people who reported bugs were frustrated, as nothing has
 changed (they couldn't see any changes)
 b) People who installed ubuntu later were still exposed to these
 mistakes.


 Hence i propose that there is a language pack update 1-2 weeks after
 the final release. Is that possible?


 This is a good point, and I think it would be possible. In this regard,
 we've been talking about a schedule for translation updates several
 times at UDSs, but so far no initiative has taken traction, mostly for
 lack of time and other priorities getting in the way.

 This is something we definitely need to sort out, and I'd finally like
 to make it a policy, so I'd very much welcome any feedback on this
 thread.

 Things to consider for a schedule:

 * How many releases' translations we want to update?
 * How often do we want to update each release (current stable, old,
 LTSs)?
 * How many teams would be testing the updates?
 * Where could we host a public calendar for the updates?

 We could also discuss this on a meeting. We haven't been running any on
 this cycle yet, so I'm thinking of scheduling one for next week or the
 one after.

 I'd be happy to hear everoyne's proposals.

 Thanks!

 Regards,
 David.

We had the same issue as Andrej - after the release, multiple errors
were spotted in a short amount of time, a few of which were really
annoying.  A language pack upgrade after 2-3 weeks would be ideal, and
I also think that 'automatic' (from our point of view :)) upgrades
every so often (1-2 months) would be a good thing if possible.

Is there any particular reason not to provide lots of updates to
language packs? (Can things easily go wrong?)

Regards
Ask

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Deletion of strings in Launchpad by accident

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi translators

Here is an issue which has annoyed several of the translators in my
team, including myself.

Let us say that you are translating.  You want to perform some action
such as looking up a word.  This probably involves a shortcut key from
the browser, e.g. to go to the adjacent workspace.  Now, when you
press the key, Launchpad will immediately activate the text field of
the current entry (if you haven't done any editing yet on this page,
the 'current' entry will be the top entry on the current page).  Most
people wouldn't notice that the text field is suddenly active for no
apparent reason, so they return to the browser window, scroll down (or
maybe they had already scrolled down and had no chance at all to spot
the problem) and edit some of the strings further down the page.  When
accepting and going to the next page - oops - the first entry is
overwritten with an empty string.

So how frequently does this happen?  Let's say you are reviewing -
there are already many translated entries.  On every page you probably
need to check something (since we're doing the nitpicky review process
and want to be sure about everything).  In practice that means a at
least couple of strings are deleted every time someone reviews
something.  Sometimes long strings.

Telling translators that, 'oops, we deleted your strings, our bad'
gets old *really* quickly.  Would it be possible to disable this
function that activates a text field if you hit the multitasking  - or
indeed any - buttons?

Best regards
Ask Hjorth Larsen

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Re: Translator/reviewer mode in Launchpad Translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Sun, Jun 6, 2010 at 10:24 PM, Hannie Lafeber-Dumoleyn
lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl wrote:
 Ask Hjorth Larsen schreef:

 On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 12:23 AM, Adi Roiban a...@roiban.ro wrote:


 Hi,

 If you are a member of Launchpad Beta Testers team and in the same time
 you are a member of an Ubuntu translation team, you might have notice
 that on the translate page there is a new Translator/reviewer mode.

 The purpose of the Translator/Reviewer mode is to help members of Ubuntu
 Translators team to implement a peer-review process as a way of assuring
 translations quality.

 If it is not working as you have expected, you are welcomed to give your
 feedback by replying to this email or by adding a comment on the bug
 report:
 https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/rosetta/+bug/525992


 Cheers,

 --
 Adi Roiban


 Hi

 This is a great feature.  After using it for a while I have one
 suggestion (if it's not too late).  In translator mode, the 'needs
 review' checkbutton will be checked if you *write* a suggestion, but
 not if you copy the English message or an existing suggestion and edit
 it.  In my opinion it would be better to always check the 'needs
 review' button in translator mode - it's a more consistent behaviour
 (so you have to think less), and you are 100% sure that you cannot
 overwrite or delete something by accident.  Are there others who have
 an opinion on this?

 Best regards
 Ask



 Hello Ask,
 Having read the explanation:

 Reviewer: This is the default working mode. All changes you make are
 approved automatically. If you want to make a suggestion, rather than a new
 translation, you need to manually select the Someone needs to review this
 translation check-box.
 Translator: When entering new translations, they're treated as suggestions
 that someone else needs to review. You can make a direct translation by
 deselecting the Someone needs to review this translation check-box.

 I come to the following conclusion: only once in a while do I use the
 Someone needs to review this translation check-box. This was the case in the
 old situation and is the same in Reviewer mode. Personally I cannot find a
 reason to choose the translator mode. Why would I want all my translations
 to be reviewed by other members of our translation team?

Well, mistakes happen.  In our team we always review translations:
Someone writes a translation, someone else proofreads it.  This is
done for all strings - if a string is so simple it doesn't need
proofreading, then it doesn't really take any time to proofread
either, so it's not a problem to just mark all of them for
proofreading.  But I guess people do it differently.

 In the old situation people who did not have full translation/review rights
 could only make suggestions which were reviewed by translators with full
 rights. I understand that, in the new situation,  they can only use the
 translator mode and are unable to deselect the Someone needs to review this
 translation check-box. Am I right?
 Hannie

The checkbox will simply not be there unless you're a member of the
ubuntu translators team, I think.  Which means suggestions only.

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Where are my translations?

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi David

2010/6/4 David Planella david.plane...@ubuntu.com:
   I thought that if you fixed something for ubuntu/lucid in
 Rosetta, then that fix would be in the next langpack update.


 That's exactly how it works, what makes you think it doesn't?

 During the development cycle language packs are released very frequently
 (more or less weekly), so you can see the updates in translations going
 into the system quite often.

 However, after release, language pack updates are not that frequent.

 The reason why your translation updates are not visible yet is because
 we haven't released any post-release language pack update yet, and you
 fixed the typo after the last language pack.

Blimey, I could have sworn I saw some language pack update in May, but
it's not in the logs, so I must have been hallucinating.  Apparently
everything works the way it should.  Thank you, and apologies for all
the confusion.

Regards
Ask

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Re: Translator/reviewer mode in Launchpad Translations

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 12:23 AM, Adi Roiban a...@roiban.ro wrote:
 Hi,

 If you are a member of Launchpad Beta Testers team and in the same time
 you are a member of an Ubuntu translation team, you might have notice
 that on the translate page there is a new Translator/reviewer mode.

 The purpose of the Translator/Reviewer mode is to help members of Ubuntu
 Translators team to implement a peer-review process as a way of assuring
 translations quality.

 If it is not working as you have expected, you are welcomed to give your
 feedback by replying to this email or by adding a comment on the bug
 report:
 https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/rosetta/+bug/525992


 Cheers,

 --
 Adi Roiban

Hi

This is a great feature.  After using it for a while I have one
suggestion (if it's not too late).  In translator mode, the 'needs
review' checkbutton will be checked if you *write* a suggestion, but
not if you copy the English message or an existing suggestion and edit
it.  In my opinion it would be better to always check the 'needs
review' button in translator mode - it's a more consistent behaviour
(so you have to think less), and you are 100% sure that you cannot
overwrite or delete something by accident.  Are there others who have
an opinion on this?

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Where are my translations?

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi David

2010/6/2 David Planella david.plane...@ubuntu.com:
 Hi Ask,

 El dc 02 de 06 de 2010 a les 13:05 +0200, en/na Ask Hjorth Larsen va
 escriure:
 Hi David

 Thank you very much for the explanation of how strings propagate to
 Ubuntu.  I have a few extra questions though.

 2010/6/2 David Planella david.plane...@ubuntu.com:
 (...)
  GNOME Translator translates Empathy documentation
 
     |
     v
 
  GNOME Translation team member commits translation to git.gnome.org after
  review
 
     |
     v
 
  Empathy tarball (empathy-version.tar.gz) is released from [1],
  containing all those translations
 
     |
     v
 
  The empathy tarball is packaged for Ubuntu

 Who does this, and how frequently? (In rough terms)

 Upstream maintainers, how frequently depends on the project release
 schedule. Focusing in GNOME as our major upstream and as an easy
 example: GNOME maintainers, (very roughly) every couple of weeks during
 the development cycle. Basically, every time you see unstable release
 on the timeline.

  http://live.gnome.org/TwoPointThirtyone

 There are other upstreams which are packaged in Debian first, so there
 is another step in between (Debian packages - Ubuntu packages)


     |
     v
 
  Translations are imported into Launchpad

 By a computer or a human?  Does this automatically happen after the 
 packaging?


 Ubuntu developers as humans (some might argue that some of them are
 superhumans) create the packages and upload them to the archive.
 Launchpad (the Soyuz component) picks them up and imports translations
 automatically.

     |
     v
 
  Translations are released as language packs

 Do you know the flow for ordinary, translatable-in-Rosetta strings?

 If I understand your question correctly, it's exactly the same (saving
 known exceptions such as the installer), only that for Ubuntu-specific
 applications upstreams are generally hosted in Launchpad. But that does
 not change the workflow: release (developers) - packages (packagers) -
 package upload (packagers) - translation importing (Launchpad).

 I'm mostly interested in who does what and how often, since that is
 what I have to know in order to make sure that the translations get
 through the system

 I hope that gave an overview. This is the (very) generic workflow, but
 we do have many upstreams, and there are always some exceptions.

Thank you for the explanation.


  (I recently opened a bug report because a
 particular fix didn't make it into the langpack update in spite of
 having been fixed in Rosetta well before).


 If you provide more details and the bug number, I'm sure we can find out
 what happened.

Adi Roiban already me with this:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-translations/+bug/581403

Admittedly it isn't entirely clear to me why a bug report is
necessary.  I thought that if you fixed something for ubuntu/lucid in
Rosetta, then that fix would be in the next langpack update.

Since that isn't the case, what actually goes into a langpack update?
Only things with bug reports?

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Where are my translations?

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Hi David

Thank you very much for the explanation of how strings propagate to
Ubuntu.  I have a few extra questions though.

2010/6/2 David Planella david.plane...@ubuntu.com:
(...)
 GNOME Translator translates Empathy documentation

    |
    v

 GNOME Translation team member commits translation to git.gnome.org after
 review

    |
    v

 Empathy tarball (empathy-version.tar.gz) is released from [1],
 containing all those translations

    |
    v

 The empathy tarball is packaged for Ubuntu

Who does this, and how frequently? (In rough terms)

    |
    v

 Translations are imported into Launchpad

By a computer or a human?  Does this automatically happen after the packaging?

    |
    v

 Translations are released as language packs

Do you know the flow for ordinary, translatable-in-Rosetta strings?
I'm mostly interested in who does what and how often, since that is
what I have to know in order to make sure that the translations get
through the system (I recently opened a bug report because a
particular fix didn't make it into the langpack update in spite of
having been fixed in Rosetta well before).

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Where are my translations?

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Thu, May 27, 2010 at 9:18 AM, lafeber-dumoleyn2
lafeber-dumole...@zonnet.nl wrote:
 As a member of the Dutch translation team I have translated the
 (upstream) documentation of gedit, Empathy and Gnome-utils. In the
 beginning of April I sent the .po-files to Gnome-nl, where the files
 were committed. I am sad to say that, although I have sent them on time,
 they do not appear in Lucid Lynx, where I still get the English version.
 What happened to my translations? Have I done all the hard work for nothing?
 At Gnome-nl they say it is ubuntu's responsibility to publish the
 translations. But who is responsible: ubuntu-translators or ubuntu-nl?
 How does it work? Should I have imported my translations in Launchpad,
 or is this done automatically?
 Will my translations appear in a language update? And if so, when?
 I would really appreciate it if someone can help me on this, because it
 is rather frustrating to do all the hard work for nothing.
 Hannie

Hi Hannie

I'm a translator and don't know all that much, so the following are
just my impressions/opinions.

I have also found that imports in Ubuntu are very difficult to figure
out.  The safe way is to specifically commit/import the translation
both to the original project and in Launchpad.  I don't know who is
ultimately responsible, but at least it is something you *can*
choose to do yourself.  My advice is therefore to do it yourself, even
if it's not your responsibility.  It may be necessary to file a bug
report to have it included in a language pack now, after the release.

In the near future, Launchpad should get automatic bzr imports from
gnome in particular, which means synchronization will happen within a
day, I think.  I don't know the complete prospects for this feature,
but it sure will make life easier.

Best regards
Ask

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Re: Paraphrasing Social from the Start for translators

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 8:00 PM, Timo Jyrinki timo.jyri...@gmail.com wrote:
 I think a related possibly difficult term is broadcast, which I
 first translated more directly, but it felt quite non-descriptive in
 Finnish (not sure how people understand brodcasting in English) so I
 then changed to more like social networks and social network
 messaging.

 -Timo

We also had a bit of trouble with 'broadcast' in Danish.  So far we
have settled on the rather vague 'web accounts' (webkonti), which is
both short and clean if not entirely equivalent.

Regards
Ask

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Re: ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu: contemplating some string changes

[Ask Hjorth Larsen]

Dear Danilo

On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 5:03 PM, Danilo Šegan dan...@canonical.com wrote:
 Hi Khaled,

 I am sorry you find this missing feature of Launchpad a deal-breaker.
 Here's a few explanations on what's the case with fuzzy matching, and
 other ways you can work-around it.

 У пет, 26. 03 2010. у 00:00 +0200, Khaled Hosny пише:

 What I can't really understand how a very simple and basic feature
 like marking old translation as fuzzy when merging new templates
 doesn't yet exist! some thing that gettext tools had years before my birth.

 I am sorry to hear you feel this way. gettext fuzzy matching works very
 well for cases like typos. Unfortunately, it also fails for anything
 else because it uses an algorithm based on character counting.  I've
 seen numerous cases were translations in Ubuntu were 'approved' from
 incorrect fuzzy suggestions.  At the same time, majority of messages in
 Ubuntu are short where it does more harm than good.  And with long
 messages, it's even harder to notice wrong translation if it differs in
 something like not.

But many translators (and definitely *all* reviewers, people with
permission to accept suggestions) should know what fuzzy means.  When
dealing with a fuzzy message it is clearly necessary to see what the
difference from the previous English message was - which is true for
all semi-automatic translation suggestions.  It seems that fuzzy
support was eliminated because the translation teams are not *trusted*
to handle them correctly, which is not a very nice thing.  It should
be assumed that translation teams know what they are doing.

I don't want to sound too antagonistic here (we all want to improve
Rosetta!), but I view the lack of support for fuzzy strings as a
serious problem, making launchpad translations inherently more
wasteful when comparing to 'direct' po-file translations (such as the
GNOME damned lies translation site or translationproject.org).

(...snip...)
 I am really sorry Launchpad causes so much waste of your time. However,
 apart from the workaround Gabor mentioned, there is another: download
 latest POT/PO file and do your merging locally using gettext tools, and
 you'll get exactly the same benefit msgmerge (from gettext) provides you
 otherwise.

 You'll have to go through all the fuzzy messages in an offline PO editor
 (like KBabel, GTranslator, POEdit...), but once you are done you can
 re-upload it (don't forget to strip fuzzy flags off).

 I don't see how this is different than what happens anywhere else (like
 GNOME, KDE, or anywhere else at all). It's just that Launchpad otherwise
 hides all the complexity so doing this step that is painful everywhere
 is as painful with Launchpad, instead of being simple as everything else
 is simple in Launchpad. But then again, I *am* biased.

Do the downloaded files from Launchpad contain the fuzzies (such that
they are still there behind the scenes)?  Or is that only true of the
upstream versions?  I didn't find any fuzzies in the modules I just
tested, so I assume no.  But I would very much like the answer to be
yes.

Best regards
Ask Hjorth Larsen
Danish translation team

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