Re: [Vo]:Nano-thermite aka Superthermite
Howdy Jones, There's folks on Vo, and there's folks looking over the shoulder's of folks on Vo. This group's attraction is passed on to many others and be assured they get it. I suppose your mention of red mercury did make a few ears become pointed. The Dime Box Saloon's Large Hadron tequila bottle toss research project recently gained additional funding to study why thermite can take years off one's life among spectators not wearing hard hats while strolling past bldg 7. Please continue to expound as only a Jones Beene moment can stimulate. Lewis Carroll must be :) Richard Jones wrote, Furthermore, few on Vo seems to be getting the potential importance of superthermite to LENR- that being that the energy output (as evidence in the explosiveness) has been reported to be an order of magnitude higher than chemical. Sure these reports are mostly anecdotal - after all the military does not publish its most guarded secrets - even if there could be a valid civilian use for the technology behind those secrets -- and consequently it is easy for any skeptic to write this off ballotechnic stuff as SciFi ... and totally unconnected to LENR.
Re: [Vo]:Nano-thermite aka Superthermite
Hunh, doesnt seem that way to me. High dispersal and insane surface to area ratio is known for doing just that in chemical reactions and explosions. Look at fuel air explosives. On Fri, Sep 12, 2008 at 5:08 AM, R C Macaulay [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Howdy Jones, There's folks on Vo, and there's folks looking over the shoulder's of folks on Vo. This group's attraction is passed on to many others and be assured they get it. I suppose your mention of red mercury did make a few ears become pointed. The Dime Box Saloon's Large Hadron tequila bottle toss research project recently gained additional funding to study why thermite can take years off one's life among spectators not wearing hard hats while strolling past bldg 7. Please continue to expound as only a Jones Beene moment can stimulate. Lewis Carroll must be :) Richard Jones wrote, Furthermore, few on Vo seems to be getting the potential importance of superthermite to LENR- that being that the energy output (as evidence in the explosiveness) has been reported to be an order of magnitude higher than chemical. Sure these reports are mostly anecdotal - after all the military does not publish its most guarded secrets - even if there could be a valid civilian use for the technology behind those secrets -- and consequently it is easy for any skeptic to write this off ballotechnic stuff as SciFi ... and totally unconnected to LENR.
Re: [Vo]:Nano-thermite aka Superthermite
- Original Message From: leaking pen Hunh, doesnt seem that way to me. High dispersal and insane surface to area ratio is known for doing just that in chemical reactions and explosions. Look at fuel air explosives. Yes!- of course this ratio is important. But NOT for the reason you are thinking. In ffact almost the opposite. Thanks for the segue, nevertheless. Since you mentioned the surface area ratio - of fuel air explosives, as being key: let's look at that closely, as it is the defining comparison between the two very different types of reactions. The effective surface area with fuel-air explosives is much higher, incredibly higher than with superthemite. In fact, that is the only way superthemite works at all ! i.e. with less than full oxidation on the *first phase* of implosion. In fact the effective surface area ratio could be about 10^9 times higher with a complete dispersal of say LPG (gasoline or any hydrocarbon) - in air-- than when compared to 100 nm diameter iron oxide and aluminum. A lesser diameter is probably ideal but more dificult to manufacture. Therefore, as mentioned- surface area is important BUT not for the reasons you or the' official' sources were suggesting. [however, this does make for a good red herring if you are playing spy-vs-spy] This aboslute requirement in ballotechnics is for planned but INCOMPLETE combustion, on the first and initial phase of the reaction. This is so that the nano-particle will still have tens of thousands of atoms which are NOT on the surface of the nanopoarticle but which are going to be highly compressed for a few nanoseconds. The secondary reaction is where the real fireworks takes place. This then is the very reason that ballotechnics are said to be MORE energetic, not less. IOW you want the particle to burn away the surface area of atoms of small particles very rapidly but ONLY the surface area - so the interior volume of the particle reaches maximum compression (about 300,000-1,000,000 psi equivalent has been reported). This is not unlike the situation with nuclear weapons but the modality is non-nuclear and can be called suprachemical. Why? Dunno precisely - but that high compression is the intrinsic feature of a ballotechnic explosive that makes it far more energetic than a complete burn in a chemical reaction. At least this lack of understanding proves that making a project black does work to some degree. Actually, that underlying modality of ballotechnics is what I was trying to explain (hypothesize) in the previous post by introducing the hydrino-less paired-electron as *possibly* being the active unit for the greater explosiveness. This hypothesis could be accurate or not: for now, it only my take on it, and you will find it nowhere else, so please don't ask for an authoritative citation. These electrons will have around 54+ eV of mass-energy each to contribute - versus about 5 eV for the complete combustion of a fuel-air bomb of LPG or gasoline. By mass, the contribution is even higher by a multiple of ~2000 since the electron is of such low mass. Moreover, we know the heat energy available from those kinds of complete dispersion processes- such as we see in the fuel-air situation - is on the order of 20,000 BTU per pound of hydrocarbon (not counting the air). Now explosiveness is NOT heat energy per se - but it is related to a large degree. Explosiveness really gets down to acceleration (jerk, and jounce) and shock waves - rather than net energy released, but there is a direct relationship. OK - the reactants, gasoline and oxygen have a density when liquid of about one gram per cubic cm and produce 20.000 BTU per pound of gasoline -- and this is about 7000 per pound of ash (CO2). That can serve as a baseline for comparison with superthermite, which may produce up to 70,000 BTUs for the same volume (not weight) of reactant... or not. This has not been published authoritatively. Only problem is - with any black-project - the only way to compare any old weapon against superthermite is to look at specifications from countries which are trying to sell those weapons on the open market. Israel is one such country. Our military has turned this into a secret technology, despite the civilian interest, and except for that data which was published 10-20 years ago and can still be found in engineering libraries, which is where I ran across most of it - in addition to the internet. Personally, I do not have access to any current information - but those that claim to - have stated that the conventional high explosve bombs which are now replaced with superthermite are at least two times less energetic per given weight. So where does the order of magnitude more energetic claim fit in with only a 50% reduction in weight? after all a doubling of the power is far from a ten-fold increase. Well - There are several other factors which limit the gain in performance in
Re: [Vo]:Nano-thermite aka Superthermite
In reply to Jones Beene's message of Fri, 12 Sep 2008 09:21:46 -0700 (PDT): Hi, [snip] This then is the very reason that ballotechnics are said to be MORE energetic, not less. IOW you want the particle to burn away the surface area of atoms of small particles very rapidly but ONLY the surface area - so the interior volume of the particle reaches maximum compression (about 300,000-1,000,000 psi equivalent has been reported). This is not unlike the situation with nuclear weapons but the modality is non-nuclear and can be called suprachemical. [snip] This sounds a lot like the http://www.proton21.com.ua/index_en.html work. They talk about a severely compressed shell of charge passing through the material, and suggest that it catalyzes LENR reactions of the severe fusion-fission variety. I also have a vague recollection of about a 10:1 energy ratio being bandied about. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Vo]:Nano-thermite aka Superthermite
- Original Message From: Robin van Spaandonk I have wondered about He iso H undergoing shrinkage, and have previously also suggested that perhaps virtually any nucleus could steal a shrunken electron from a Hydrino. However I doubt that there is really anything like this going on in super thermite. Hi Robin - perhaps you should look beyond the single electron for an answer. I suspect many experts would even doubt that a lone electron - can be swapped around as shrunken at all - i.e. for a period which is long enough to be transfered in the exact same orbital to another nucleus- i.e. without some type of binding to another particle. Recently someone on HSG mentioned the electron atom - here is a wave function and visualization http://www.scientificarts.com/wavefunctions/hwavefunctions.html Here is Mills' chapter on the hydrino version: http://www.blacklightpower.com/theory/TOE%2002.10.03/Chapters/CH07061207.pdf OK given all of that -- the intrepid theorist can even take the next step - which is hydrino-less... to be more specific: ... now that more and more info is becoming available on Cooper-pairs, perhaps we can cross-fertilize those not so disparate parameters to paired-electrons in general, and also without the cryogenics - and it becomes possible to imagine that that the proton itself can become superfluous to two paired electrons with an enhanced lifetime as well as the ultra-cold... That is at least for a short period, and in a transitory situation of extreme pressure - i.e. in a virtual can where the pressure substitutes for coldness, by restraining freedom of movement to the same degree. What is a virtual can ? Cooper (Leon not DB) showed that an arbitrarily small attraction between electrons in a metal can causes a paired state of electrons to have a lower energy than the Fermi energy, which implies that the pair is bound. In normal superconductors, this attraction is due to the electron/phonon interaction; and the Cooper pair state is responsible for superconductivity which is a very long lifetime effect. In the electron/phonon interaction the effective charge balancing has been moved from an internal nucleus to an external cold can but there could be a related state where the electron-pair is bound with a shorter lifetime - but in a very hot can. The next step beyond HTSC in this emerging hypothesis is the ballotechnic state. Ballotechnics are a class of materials that undergo a supra-chemical reaction when quickly subjected to extreme pressure - of the order of tens of thousands of atmospheres, often initiated by shock waves. Curiously the effective pressure in the LENR matrix is also tens of thousands of atmospheres. Admittedly some observers call this situation a kind of overpotential and do not believe that the particles feel the pressure in the same way. I believe that they do it the same way and that the state is similar to extreme cold in its ability to reduce movement. There could be a transitory bound state of electrons in that condition, the virtual can which will have an increased lifetime, similar to the Cooper pair- yet when the pressure is dropped, they will decay explosively and accelerate away from each other at anomalously high energy. IOW they have been pumped-up by the ZPF in that brief moment of binding in the can. (trying to avoid the urge to get pun-ny) Furthermore, few on Vo seems to be getting the potential importance of superthermite to LENR- that being that the energy output (as evidence in the explosiveness) has been reported to be an order of magnitude higher than chemical. Sure these reports are mostly anecdotal - after all the military does not publish its most guarded secrets - even if there could be a valid civilian use for the technology behind those secrets -- and consequently it is easy for any skeptic to write this off ballotechnic stuff as SciFi ... and totally unconnected to LENR. ... but it is not easy to write-off the use of this material in our most advance military weapons; and in the specs for which there also appears to be the energy anomaly. You cannot hide everything. If you can afford a small consulting fee, then you can probably get these accurate specs - such as on the latest tunnel busting bombs from Jane, not Alice and her white rabbit friends: http://www.janes.com/ ...and you can ponder how a smaller bomb can deliver so much more damage, if there is really no energy anomaly. This is data which I would not want to repeat, even if I knew it - nor even admit knowledge therof. I'm late / I'm late / For a very important date... (gotta find a deeper rabbitt hole) No time to say Hello / Goodbye
[Vo]:Nano-thermite aka Superthermite
The pool of tears wonderland-style: Ok the following may be venturing way down into the rabbitt hole of Alice, so it is worth prefeacing these remarks as being generally unrelated to the prior discussion about thermite - such as used in demolition. Question to the Cheshire Cat: What do the most lethal weapons in the US arsena have in common - i.e. such as cave-buster bomb which has up to 10 time the detonation force per pound as conventional bombs (such as the older daisy cutter or MOAB mother of all bombs)? Answer from a cat-like smile: Doh! from the subject line, you should be able to guess it. Basic Thermite is comprised of aluminum powder and iron oxide powder and does not explode on its own. So far so good. When the powders are ground to “ultra-fine grain” in a vacuum chamber and are less than 100 nm in diameter, then nano-thermite is formed. When they get down to 10 nm, quien sabe? Even 100 nm changes the situation qualitatively and quantitatively and the result is not just an incendiary – it is a weapons grade explosive. This nanomaterial may well be one of the so-called ballotechnics, such as the infamous red mercury was once thought to be. In fact there are a few who will say that this is, and always was, the true identity of that strange material ... ... if it were not fully composed of red herrings, that is ;-) In one of Dr Steven Jones' papers he says: Researchers can greatly increase the power of weapons by adding materials known as superthermites that combine nanometals such as nanoaluminum with metal oxides such as iron oxide, according to Steven Son, a project leader in the Explosives Science and Technology group at Los Alamos. The advantage (of using nanometals) is in how fast you can get their energy out, Son says. Son says that the chemical reactions of superthermites are faster and therefore release greater amounts of energy more rapidly... Son, who has been working on nanoenergetics for more than three years, says that scientists can engineer nanoaluminum powders with different particle sizes to vary the energy release rates. This enables the material to be used in many applications, including underwater explosive devices… However, researchers aren't permitted to discuss what practical military applications may come from this research. Dr Son has now apparently been silenced by the powers that be, and has no further comment. Kevin Ryan’s paper connects the dots of all of this hocus-pocus with the feared connection of thermite -- nanothermite and beyond to a few bigwigs at NIST who DO NOT want this connection to be known (he was fired from UL at the insistence of NIST following his revelation that UL had actually test a model with the same steel used in WTC7 and certified that it would not fail). It is Ryan's contention that had NIST investigated thermite at all, it would open up the Pandora's box of nano-thermite, ballotechnics and red-mercury and probably a few mad-hatters. Look for Ryan to be Vinced very soon, if this story ever gets a foothold in the national press. As for me, I'm late / I'm late / For a very important date... No time to say Hello / Goodbye
