Re: [WSG] Keyboard Tabbing no longer working in FF v11/Mac
On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 11:22 PM, tee weblis...@gmail.com wrote: Can anyone please confirm. http://jsbin.com/inayes/2 Tabbing through the links on a page works fine for me on FF11/Mac, both on your example page and on Facebook.com. I've never altered the default accessibility settings. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
[WSG] Matthew J Robinson is out of the office.
I will be out of the office starting 28/11/2011 and will not return until 30/11/2011. I will respond to your message when I return. If it's important, the other capable members of the Content Team may be able to help you - approach with caution! Please send any urgent requests to Content Services via go/online The information contained in this email and its attachments may be confidential. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete this email and destroy any copy. Any advice contained in this email has been prepared without taking into account your objectives, financial situation or needs. Before acting on any advice in this email, National Australia Bank Limited (NAB) recommends that you consider whether it is appropriate for your circumstances. If this email contains reference to any financial products, NAB recommends you consider the Product Disclosure Statement (PDS) or other disclosure document available from NAB, before making any decisions regarding any products. If this email contains any promotional content that you do not wish to receive, please reply to the original sender and write Don't email promotional material in the subject. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Using ellipsis to indicate truncated overflow content
On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 6:49 AM, Grant Bailey grant_malcolm_bai...@westnet.com.au wrote: Is anyone able to offer suggestions as to how demonstrate to the user that overflow content has been truncated, like this (see attachment). text-overflow: ellipsis? http://www.quirksmode.org/css/textoverflow.html - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
[WSG] Matthew J Robinson is out of the office.
I will be out of the office starting 31/10/2011 and will not return until 09/11/2011. I will respond to your message when I return. I have gone tropo! Please send any urgent requests to Content Services The information contained in this email and its attachments may be confidential. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete this email and destroy any copy. Any advice contained in this email has been prepared without taking into account your objectives, financial situation or needs. Before acting on any advice in this email, National Australia Bank Limited (NAB) recommends that you consider whether it is appropriate for your circumstances. If this email contains reference to any financial products, NAB recommends you consider the Product Disclosure Statement (PDS) or other disclosure document available from NAB, before making any decisions regarding any products. If this email contains any promotional content that you do not wish to receive, please reply to the original sender and write Don't email promotional material in the subject. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Desktop. Tablet. Mobile.
On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 7:28 PM, tee weblis...@gmail.com wrote: Oh do you want it HTML5? That will be 20% extra fee sir. ( the iwe designeri does is change the doctype). Of course not - apparently just adding a gradient is enough to catapult any web design into the stratosphere... - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
[WSG] Matthew J Robinson is out of the office.
I will be out of the office starting 15/12/2010 and will not return until 03/01/2011. I will respond to your message when I return. I have been away since the 3rd Dec 2010, please send any urgent requests to Content Services The information contained in this email and its attachments may be confidential. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete this email and destroy any copy. Any advice contained in this email has been prepared without taking into account your objectives, financial situation or needs. Before acting on any advice in this email, National Australia Bank Limited (NAB) recommends that you consider whether it is appropriate for your circumstances. If this email contains reference to any financial products, NAB recommends you consider the Product Disclosure Statement (PDS) or other disclosure document available from NAB, before making any decisions regarding any products. If this email contains any promotional content that you do not wish to receive, please reply to the original sender and write Don't email promotional material in the subject. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Korean fonts
On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 12:33 AM, Brett Goulder brett.goul...@gmail.comwrote: font-family:돋움, Dotum, sans-serif; This should work, this is from Cyworld. ^^^ This. It's what we use for our Korean site; when we put it on I did a little research on the top Korean sites, and those selections (the first one is 'Dotum' in Korean) are common across many of the top Korean-language websites. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] RE: Poetry needing block format but with line-breaks
On Tue, Feb 16, 2010 at 10:54 PM, Susie Gardner-Brown susi...@uq.edu.auwrote: Oh, thanks Jens – I forgot about that option!! I’ll give it a go . And Brad – yes I am using the br / tag, but that stops it being block-formatted ... I did some work for a poetry trust recently, and I set up two different templates for displaying poems. One allowed for line breaks (so lines would break correctly), and the other one used pre to preserve formatting for poems where the shape of the text was important. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] e-mail link
On Tue, Feb 2, 2010 at 4:29 AM, Marvin Hunkin startrekc...@gmail.comwrote: what is the correct code for the subject line to appear in e-mail. please let me know. Hi Marvin, To include the email subject in a link, the code should be like this: a href=mailto:st...@apple.com?subject=nice iPadSend email/a You can also include cc and body information in there too. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Accessibility does not matter!
On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 1:16 AM, Jason Grant ja...@flexewebs.com wrote: @Thierry I don't see how breaking a wrist has much to do with accessibility? Broken wrist = inability to use a mouse. If your site/intranet/app is not keyboard-accessible, how is that person supposed to use it? Now you've exposed your naivety, I suggest you let the good people of this thread educate you so you can create better work in the future. :) - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] How to resolve z-index problem for select box in IE 6
On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 7:02 AM, Brajesh Patel brajeshpate...@gmail.comwrote: I am getting Z-index problem in IE 6. back ground select box are displaying on the popup when popup appear It's nothing to do with z-index. Select dropdowns are rendered by the browser's internal system last (as they are system controls), so they don't respect the stacking order. Google for something like ie6 select iframe for details of how to fix it with a positioned iframe (as they are the only element that will cover up a select). - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] css tutorial
On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 7:03 AM, Chris F.A. Johnson ch...@cfajohnson.comwrote: Every other discussion group I participate in regards clagnut with derision. There is no good reason for anything other than font-size: 100%. That's not an explanation. ALA published a follow-up by Richard on the same topic, do they not know what they're talking about either? - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] css tutorial
On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 6:17 AM, Chris F.A. Johnson ch...@cfajohnson.comwrote:
I find it hard to take it seriously when it has
body { font-size:62.5%; } in http://dev.opera.com/css/screen.css
If you're going to snipe, it's a good idea to provide an explanation and say
why you think something is a bad idea.
http://www.clagnut.com/blog/348/
- Matthew
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Re: [WSG] wrap in print
On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 11:02 AM, Naveen Bhaskar naveenbhas...@live.inwrote: Is there any way to wrap the text around an image while printing. my structure is like this You mean you want to float the image? Or something more complicated? You can't wrap text completely around an image (i.e. all four sides). - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] elasticity and floats
On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 11:28 AM, designer desig...@gwelanmor-internet.co.uk wrote: I want to make a banner/masthead with 4 divs. Nos 1,2 and 4 are fixed width and I want div 3 to be flexible width and fill the gap: Have you tried here? http://blog.html.it/layoutgala/ - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] mouse rollovers how to fix them
On Fri, Sep 18, 2009 at 6:35 AM, Marvin Hunkin startrekc...@gmail.comwrote: for the fruit shop site. still want to keep the menus. and now was told that the mouse rollovers are not working. so how to fix them. We don't all keep a record of all your links. ;) Can you provide a URL? - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Fwd: Auction Auto Bidder
On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 5:50 AM, Mohamed Shamveel sham...@gmail.com wrote: Please send this massage to all your members. Massages over the internet, now there's a way to really make money online... - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Looking For Images
On Mon, Aug 24, 2009 at 1:35 PM, Marvin Hunkin startrekc...@gmail.comwrote: looking for the following images. Sorry, I only have image001.gif and image003.gif. If I find image002.gif I'll pop it in the post straight away. :) - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Outlook 2010
On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 5:15 AM, Joshua Street josh.str...@gmail.comwrote: We have a problem! Outlook 2010, according to Campaign Monitor [1], is going to continue to use the crippled MS Word layout engine. FixOutlook.org aims to collate the community's discontent with this decision using Twitter to change Microsoft's policy decision on this one before it's too late and we're stuck with yet another five-ten years of inferior email authoring! This is so stupid - the reason that Outlook uses Word instead of a decent rendering engine is because of the same standards advocates complaining so much about IE6 being bundled with Windows! You can't have your cake and eat it too... - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Possible layout problems with using this CSS code?
On Sun, Apr 19, 2009 at 6:31 PM, Brett Patterson
inspiron.patters...@gmail.com wrote:
Would using:
* {
margin: 0;
padding: 0;
border: 0;
}
before the body to zero out all margins, paddings and borders, cause any
accessibility problems or any problems one should be made aware of before
using it for layout?
Not accessibility problems per se, but removing margins and padding from
absolutely every single element can cause issues with things like select
and option. Much better to use a reset stylesheet like Yahoo!'s or Eric
Meyers.
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=reset+stylesheet
- Matthew
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Re: [WSG] Where is browser compatibility in wcag?
On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 1:31 AM, Andreas Boehmer [Addictive Media] aboeh...@addictivemedia.com.au wrote: I went through WCAG 1 and WCAG 2, and I expected an appropriate guideline to show up under Priority 1 (or Level A), but nothing. Or am I missing something in the obscure wording of the document that is WCAG? A user's choice of technology is not an accessibility issue. If people want to view content on the web, they have to make sure they are using suitable hardware and software - using a 10-year-old browser doesn't qualify, IMO. Should I be able to view a site on my Commodore 64? - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Chrome now higher traffic than IE
On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 11:40 AM, Mike Kear w...@afpwebworks.com wrote: In my case, the sample is fairly small, and I never suggested it was representative of the internet as a whole. The bigger of the two sites I've used is a radio station. It has 54,000 user sessions in that set of stats. More stats (30m visits over a month, demographic of pretty much everyone): IE7 - 52% IE6 - 23% FF3 - 17% Safari - 3% FF2 - 2.5% Chrome - 0.8% Opera - 0.5% - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Chrome now higher traffic than IE
On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 11:53 AM, William Donovan donovan.will...@gmail.comwrote: You don't by any chance use chrome yourself while you're developing? I noticed that I mainly use Firefox and I had to stop going back to the site after it was built to allow the data / statistics to clean themselves of my bias. You can (and should) filter out your own visits by IP address within Analytics reports. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Classes---Adding multiple classes to an element, is there a downfall???
On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 2:18 PM, Brett Patterson
inspiron.patters...@gmail.com wrote:
Note the space in the second paragraph class attribute...from what I have
heard this allows multiple classes to be applied to a single element. Is
there a downfall to applying multiple classes to an element, like the one
above? How does it affect UAs?
There are no negative effects to applying multiple classes to a single
element. The only problem is when you try to style an element that matches
two (or more) classnames, e.g.:
#content .primary.highlighted {
background: #ff0;
}
That will work in Firefox/Safari, and apply the rule to any element with
both the primary and highlighted classes; but in IE6 it doesn't work, it
will just see it as .highlighted.
- Matthew
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Re: [WSG] A Semi-Transparent Background Color?
There is this article: http://css-tricks.com/css-transparency-settings-for-all-broswers/ On 12/02/2009, at 1:04 PM, Brett Patterson wrote: Hi all, I was wondering why there was no implementation to allow a semi- transparent background color using CSS? If there is, is there a link that would point me in the direction to figure out how to go about implementing it on a Web page? -- Brett P. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Re: Users who deliberately disable JavaScript
On Fri, Jan 30, 2009 at 12:05 PM, Rimantas Liubertas riman...@gmail.comwrote: Exactly, only this can mean the opposite of what you state: more tech savy users know how to turn Javascript off, unlike the general public. One other thing to bear in mind is that we are mostly thinking of users as being sat at home surfing the web - but a large proportion of web traffic will be people surfing from work, where they have no control over the configuration or restrictions placed on either their browser or at the firewall level. There are bound to be some sysadmins who lockdown script access for all employees, which will contribute to the 5-10% of non-JS enabled users. It's not always a conscious choice on the part of the user. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Failed A Job :(
On 30/01/2009, at 2:36 AM, Simon Pascal Klein wrote: I’d expect clean, accessible, and semantic code from a front-end developer. Bah—sorry to hear you had such a negative experience. I think we all end up taking a bite from the sour end of the pie at some point in our profession, and, in the end I guess the best thing to do is consider it an experience worth not repeating and learning from it. Lessons learnt. I always check the source first because as they say, you can't polish a turd. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Federal Court hearing re Virgin Blue website accessiblity
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 8:03 AM, Nick Cowie cowie.n...@gmail.com wrote: Apparently I have a different opinion from Mr Kerr on what makes a web site accessible under the Disabilities Discrimination Act. Care to expand on that point? Do his views jibe with what most web developers would consider 'accessible'? - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] Website review : http://webprocafe.com
On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 4:41 PM, Stewart Griffiths stewartmgriffi...@gmail.com wrote: Please can you provide feedback on the following website http://webprocafe.com/ We are looking for thoughts on the design and usability of the site, plus any general feedback you want to provide. Design, Development, Coffee ...? - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] High-Pass Filter and Yahoo's reset stylesheet (question regarding validation)
On Thu, Nov 20, 2008 at 10:45 AM, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Was just wondering. I always use Yahoo's reset.css file to reset elements, but I have just noticed there is a CSS parse error in it (purposely put there for browser selecting). I can't see any parse errors in reset.css: http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/reset/ I use it myself as the basis for all stylesheets, and have never had a validation problem. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] High-Pass Filter and Yahoo's reset stylesheet (question regarding validation)
On Thu, Nov 20, 2008 at 11:06 AM, James Jeffery
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
20 input, textarea, select Parse Error {*font-size:100%; 20 input,
textarea, select Parse error - Unrecognized ;}
Test it:
http://mi-linux.wlv.ac.uk/~0802390/reset.csshttp://mi-linux.wlv.ac.uk/%7E0802390/reset.css
That's not in reset.css, it's from fonts.css. It's also not the High Pass
filter - see here for an explanation:
http://tantek.com/CSS/Examples/highpass.html
If you're worried about it, extract the IE-only code out of the file and
wrap it in conditional comments.
- Matthew
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Re: [WSG] High-Pass Filter and Yahoo's reset stylesheet (question regarding validation)
On Thu, Nov 20, 2008 at 12:42 PM, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dude, I didn't say that was the high pass filter. I said that was the error in the reset.css. The high pass filter is a different issue unrelated to the Yahoo reset stylesheet. Ah, sorry - I must have read your original email wrong. Also, if you look at the source code for reset-min.css you will see it isn't nothing to do with the fonts stylesheet and is infact in the reset-min.css stylesheet. That's weird (and a bit crap of Yahoo!) - it's in the reset-min stylesheet, but not in the plain view version of the stylesheet shown on the main YUI Reset page. Guess they haven't updated all the different places it appears as they have added bits. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Big Browsing Issues on clients PC Laptop AOL
On Sat, Oct 18, 2008 at 7:19 PM, Kristine Cummins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just launched a site, and it's *browsing* *fine on my PC Mac laptop from IE5-8** browsers to** FF* etc. However, when my client visits her site on her *PC laptop using AOL*, it is browsing (as if) the stylesheet is applying only half way. I've recommended her to download the latest IE or FF, but she hasn't done it yet. When she goes to her place of work, it looks fine. How could there be this huge discrepancy on her PC Laptop using AOL? I can't speak for recently, but years ago AOL used to basically install itself *as* your browser. The browser would be badged AOL, and it wouldn't render quite like anything else that was around at the time. Now this was probably around the time of IE4, so I would hope that things have changed - I just checked the analytics account for a huge (180m pageviews/month) site, and there are zero records of any browser with the string AOL in the identification string, which suggests that there is currently no such thing as an AOL browser. Perhaps your stylesheet is cached by an AOL proxy? - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] WCAG2 in govt
Hi there - was wondering if there's anyone on the list who works in government and is considering WCAG2. We're looking at this in NZ, and I'd be keen to have a chat about your experiences (and offer my own). How about first considering and then implementing the inclusion of Local Government and all receivers of Government funding in the mandate to comply. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Dev. For Mobile Browsers
On Sat, Sep 13, 2008 at 3:13 AM, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone got any good resources on developing for mobile browsers? It's an area I have never really looked into, but am interested in. http://www.thewatchmakerproject.com/journal/446/mobile-web-development-research - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Copycat site
On Mon, Sep 8, 2008 at 1:48 PM, Joseph Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just a reminder about the purpose of this list and some of the things that happen on here you should be aware of: You missed out Don't top-post and trim replies... ;) -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: WSG promoting standards via teaching? Re: [WSG] Positioning was Extra white line on the top of my list
What would be more a productive use of your time David is validating your pages. And there is plenty of We are still moving into our new site... please bear with us... stuff that still needs to be written. Just a suggestion. On 5/08/2008, at 12:34 PM, David Fuller - magickweb wrote: Well hey everybody... It would appear Andrew has decided to take his comments out of the public view and turn them personal... Please read.. On Aug 1, 2008, at 2:31 PM, David Fuller - magickweb wrote: group does NOT have to be SPECIFICALLY about web standards Perhaps not, but totally irrelevant attacks on any platform are a waste of everyone's time and energy. Frankly I don't believe anyone on this list learned anything useful from the fact that you don't like macs. So as one professional to another, please keep your comments constructive at least. If you have a reasoned argument as to why the macintosh platform is inimical to web standards, I for one would be interested to hear what you have to say. Otherwise your remark is as useful and informative to this list as your tastes in ice-cream would be. List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Andrew http://www.andrewmaben.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a well designed user interface, the user should not need instructions. Andrew if you are so afraid of negative comments, don't post at all. My comments were not aimed @ macs or any other platform - get your facts right before you start sprouting your mouth off... I used that development platform as an EXAMPLE of similar discussions had in the past where people got uppity... I was not referring to now.. To paraphrase yourself Andrew If you have something of value, then don't bring it to the forum Why can people not realize that they are not the end all and be all, and my main point was this. Those with less skills than professionals like myself (and Andrew I don't know I haven't seen his work) will ask questions to learn and to grow as developers... If we as a community want a unified web standard and it to be widely used and accepted, we need to encourage, help and support those who are still learning... Why is that so hard for you to fathom Andrew? David Fuller Developer magickweb Web:http://www.magick.com.au Tel: 0434 728 267 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ian Chamberlain Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 10:08 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: WSG promoting standards via teaching? Re: [WSG] Positioning was Extra white line on the top of my list I suspect there is more than a grain of truth in both David and Adams views. If places like this are to reach the widest possible audience they must be accessible to all (with reason); ditto to be a usable standards debating forum we should be debating the finer points not spending ALL our time on what the experts among us may consider to be trivial. Two suggestions; [1]That we all take a moment to consider those who may know a little less than we on a specific subject and attempt to use plain English when replying; thus to help others along the way. [2]When responding to eager questioners such as Michael suggest that they take the conversation off the forum; but please bring it back when a conclusion has been reached as I suspect I lot of equally eager thread watchers may be keen to know the answer too. I will now return to lurking Regards Ian Chamberlain ex-Head of Web Strategy BT Global Services; now Freelancing and having a ball. www.chamberlainsofharrogate.co.uk - Original Message - From: David Fuller - magickweb [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 11:23 PM Subject: RE: [WSG] Positioning was Extra white line on the top of my list Adam... I am sorry but I have to disagree whole heartedly... What is the standards group, if not a place where all people can who choose to, can come and gain guidance and learning to become STANDARDS COMPLIANT??? It would appear that this is exactly what the group is for... I've mentioned this in another thread, where people get all uppity about not exactly web standards content (I think in that example it was discussing Development Platforms...) Regardless we are all professionals, and we are here to help, to learn and to keep up to date, so if somebody with slightly less experience than you asks for assistance, what's the harm in giving that assistance? It doesn't cost you anything and you do end up with a grateful developer/ designer - and that's positive networking - again a very big plus for any business. /endOfRant Enjoy all :) David Fuller Developer magickweb Web:http://www.magick.com.au Tel: 0434 728 267
Re: [WSG] What is the best solution for IE6 png issue?
as to say look at the theory of developing specifics for IE6. There is a gaining movement around to start phasing out IE6 support - look at 37signals, I think they begin IE6 phase out this week or next. They've done their maths and taken a gamble. Hopefully it'll spark something. [snip...] In the end, do you want to spend hours developing hacks for IE6 or just nicely push people into an upgrade path? OT and not much to do with IE6 .png solutions but instead, the ongoing support of IE6 aspect of this thread. I was advised by a lesser Microsoft management bot that many corporate organisations have a 'latest minus one' policy, which means only running up to the previous version of any current browser. This will hopefully mean that when IE8 is fully released many corporate techs will then upgrade to IE7, ideally resulting in a bulk upgrade of the costly IE6. I hope this has some truth. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] What is the best solution for IE6 png issue?
On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 1:08 PM, Tijmen Smit [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This solution works fine for me - http://24ways.org/2007/supersleight-transparent-png-in-ie6 Another recent one here: http://labs.unitinteractive.com/unitpngfix.php -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] form from hell - difficult redesign
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 1:09 PM, kevin mcmonagle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi I've been asked to redesign the gui on a hotel booking engine / room allocation web app. Its basically the busiest example of tabular data ive ever seen - most data in the cells is input. I think you'll need to give us more information. Is it just a very long form for booking rooms? .. is there a textbox for every room or something? If so could you just replace it with an ajax search for rooms and an add button? Is there any kind of grouping or hierarchy in the data? You could try hierarchical table rows (also known as multi-column treeviews)... I recently wrote a blog post that detailed lots of ways of representing tablular data: http://holloway.co.nz/blog/?p=17 .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Why css settings a background image in the body tag wouldn't work
On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 10:48 AM, Michael Horowitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am finding I am having to put this info instead in my div's Im sure it is some silly problem Could you post some HTML/CSS? If it's a silly problem then it's probably syntax, or that relative paths are different from the HTML to CSS, etc. .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Why css settings a background image in the body tag wouldn't work plus 2nd issue of space between divs
On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 11:29 AM, Michael Horowitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sure happy to give you my current css. Missing semi-colon at the end of the line? .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] XSLT: looping through ancestors looking for a specific node
Hi Grant,
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 3:48 PM, Focas, Grant
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Is there a way in XSLT to loop through the ancestors until I find
the first instance of a node called foo?
For context what I'm trying to do is see if a bookmark is in the same
section as the link/@href (and to find this out when I'm processing
the link).
First I've just got a few questions... you've got nested section tags
so what if the bookmark was in the parent section? Is that the same as
if it's in a following section? (if not then can you give a few more
XML file examples).
If the first ancestor section is all that matters then an approach
would be to compare the generate-id()s of an ancestor section of the
link to the ancestor section of the bookmark. So you'd do something
like (from memory, untested code)
xsl:key name=bookmarkById match=bookmark use=@id/
xsl:template match=link
xsl:choose
xsl:when test=generate-id(ancestor::section[1]) =
generate-id(key('bookmarkById', substring(@href,
1)[1]/ancestor::section[1])it's the same section/xsl:when
xsl:otherwiseit's not the same section/xsl:otherwise
/xsl:choose
/xsl:template
.Matthew Holloway
http://holloway.co.nz/
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Re: [ADMIN] THREAD CLOSED [WSG] XSLT: looping through ancestors looking for a specific node
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 4:07 PM, Matt Fellows [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry, Grant, this is off topic for this list. No it's not, The mail list is for web designers developers who are interested in web standards (HTML, XHTML, XML, CSS, XSLT, Javascript, EcmaScript etc.) -- http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Grant was talking about XSLT, thanks :) .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Multiple Firefox on Mac
On Thu, Jul 24, 2008 at 3:33 PM, Paul Collins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does anyone have a link to a decent reference on running Firefox 2 3 simultaneously on Mac? I can't seem to find a decent one out there. AFAIK all you need to do is rename your old Firefox.app to something else (e.g. Firefox2) before installing FF3. Worked fine for me. You can't have them both open at the same time, though, if that's what you mean. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] iphone should not be part of your url
On Sun, Jul 20, 2008 at 3:11 AM, Andrew Boyd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can't see what difference it makes - if someone chooses to create a mobile-device-friendly version of their site and publish it under a separate URL (as opposed to the elegant way - that is, using a mobile-device-friendly stylesheet) then that is probably their business. I know it's not what Lars meant, but I just have to challenge the notion that the elegant (and presumably proper) way to serve mobile devices is with a mobile stylesheet on your regular site. Mobile web use is all about context - visitors don't need your entire site, they need a subset of it (or new content) that is useful for them in the context of use on the go. To that end, you either sniff for devices and/or serve mobile content on a different URL. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Scaling a background image
On Tue, Jul 1, 2008 at 7:04 AM, Matijs [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: SVG is not really suitable for photos though. Which is mostly true but SVG can contain bitmaps and as the goal is to scale the bitmap to 100% anyway then using SVG as a container format would be appropriate (or at least identical to bitmaps, aside from file size). Unrelated, but here's an example of using SVG vectors for a background image... http://holloway.co.nz/wellypug/svg/svg-test2.html .Matthew Holloway http://docvert.org/ http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Please unsubscribe me
On Tue, Jul 1, 2008 at 4:47 PM, Polly Templeton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Many thanks Polly Templeton National Museum of Australia I don't know about you all but I'm maintaining a spreadsheet called People not to hire based on their ability to use the WSG list. .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Scaling a background image
On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 12:12 PM, Chris Pearce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has anyone been able to successfully scale a CSS background image to the current window size? I've done some research via Google and it appears this can't be done purely with CSS (at least not yet), maybe some JavaScript? Here's a CSS and HTML way of doing it for those browsers that understand position:fixed, http://holloway.co.nz/mefi/fullscreenbackground2/ For those browsers that don't you'd need to emulate it with JavaScript... window.onscroll to move the #background down the page with the scroll position. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
not always, but often. esp if it ends in beer and a party From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Paul Bennett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, 20 June 2008 12:12 PM To: 'wsg@webstandardsgroup.org' Subject: RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** NOTICE - This communication is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking any action in reliance on, this communication by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication please delete and destroy all copies and telephone SMS Management Technology on 9696 0911 immediately. Any views expressed in this Communication are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of SMS Management Technology. Except as required by law, SMS Management Technology does not represent, warrant and/or guarantee that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that the communication is free from errors, virus, interception or interference. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] HTML special characters coding
kevin_erickson wrote: Hello, I am looking for advice on if the best way to code for special characters is to use the actual character or the attribute value or the alt code? i.e. for the ampersand should one use or amp;? Does it matter? I know that Dreamweaver automates some of this but what is the best practice? You're always supposed to encode as amp; (even in hrefs) and that's what standards compliance requires. (I use XHTML and I also want to be parseable as XML so aside from XMLs inbuilt entities of lt; gt; amp; quot; and apos; I tend to use NCRs...). -- .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] HTML special characters coding
Andrew Cunningham wrote: LOL, i enjoyed the wording. Considering the document character set of HTML4 is Unicode, if it can't be displayed in UTF-8 in a browser, then it can't be displayed using entitiies or NCRs either ;) Generally I agree, although one good thing about entities (including NCRs of course) is that it'll typically come up as a ? when it's unknown rather than mangled as ’. So it'll break more gracefully. Also there can be other things involved other than the browser when writing HTML, such as bad proxies. I can't remember the name of the software but a few years ago an adblocker proxy that I installed on my parents machine would break UTF-8 horribly... of course that's the proxy's fault but entites would work around their bug. (I don't really have strong opinions either way though) -- .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] HTML special characters coding
Andrew Cunningham wrote: a slight correction: NCRs by definition are always know. Ah, we seem to actually agree but we're talking about what's known to different things. Unknown when I used it was in terms of the ability to render it sucessfully (known to the browser as a whole) not just in terms of expressing characters accurately (which seems to be what yours is known to). And as said NCRs for my use are for HTML *and* XML, not just HTML. Regarding missing glyph characters like boxes or boxes with codepages/codepoints or ? ...different platforms and browsers display different fallbacks. Or as Wikipedia says, Systems that do not offer a fallback font typically display black or white rectangles, question marks, or nothing at all in place of missing characters. Symbols in a fallback font can contain annotations such as the relevant Unicode block and the script system used. Entity errors vs encoding errors like ’ errors are completely different errors, that was the point -- to contrast two completely different ways of encoding characters and the errors that result (’ vs ? vs missing glyph boxes). I have a slight preference for entities because they don't tend to get mangled by stupid non-unicode-aware tools but that's about it. Cheers :) -- .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] IE6/7 not rendering an H1 correctly
Lynette Smith wrote: I've been staring at if for ages and I don't understand this at all and was wondering if this was the reason IE won't render it as intended. Just above the div id=content there's a broken /div tag. -- .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Multiple Language Domains
there's lots of things u can do to ensure that the language is correctly
identified and the right characterset it used
1. as sajan suggests, the setting locale is important. it also helps with
time/date formats
e.g. for php: setlocale(constant,location)
(see also: http://www.w3schools.com/php/func_string_setlocale.asp)
2. define the page's _primary_ language of the page content in the header
html xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml; xml:lang=en lang=en
3. define the language inline when it changes from one language to another
within the content
SPAN id=msg1 class=info lang=fr
4. use the uft-8 characterset and define it in the header through the doctype
?xml version=1.0 encoding=UTF-8?
!DOCTYPE html
PUBLIC -//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN
http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-strict.dtd;
html xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml; xml:lang=en lang=en
5. use css to define the font to use for different languages.
p lang=zh class=zh(some Chinese text)/p
/* in the css */
[lang=zh],
* html .zh {
font: 800 14pt/16.5pt Li Sung, serif
}
viola!
M :)
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sajan Franco [EMAIL
PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, 14 June 2008 6:42 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Multiple Language Domains
Hi Paul,
one way is to ask the user to choose a Locale on the landing page such en_EN or
en_US , where en is the language chosen by the user and EN would represent the
country.
For instance in countries like Belgium and Switzerland, most of the websites
ask the user to choose their locale before proceeding so that the website can
serve content of their choice in the language they prefer.
An example of this is http://www.nissan.ch/ or http://www.sunsilk.com where the
user can chose the locale and proceed further. Since the translations are in
different directories it is search engine friendly too. So when a user choose a
locale he is taken to the respective homepage which serves the user in the
language of his preference.
But as far as usability is concerned I am not sure because both of cited
examples feature flash, which I suppose is not that user friendly when you take
accessibility into consideration.
Warm Regards
Sajan Franco
On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 12:39 AM, Paul McCann [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL
PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi Guys,
I am currently in the middle of building a site which has to be bi-lingual. We
have two domains for the site www.ourwales.org.ukhttp://www.ourwales.org.uk
and www.cymruni.org.ukhttp://www.cymruni.org.uk
I am looking for suggestions/help on how to handle the two domains.
Currently ourwales is the prominant/main domain and the one to which the IP
details of the site are set. We are then using an alias within apache to also
point cymruni to the same site. So you see the same site when you visit, but
have two different domains. Both these domains are advertised.
I have a few worries though, currently both domains point to the english
language version of the site, this will be changed so cymruni goes to the Welsh
language side. Although the language is the same and its possible for people to
flip between the two languages is it possible that google will see the site as
duplicate content?
Also we are having trouble getting the alias to append the lang=cy to it on
first visit. My thought was to make the ourwales domain the prominant one, and
set up a folder with a 301 redirect in it which says
cymruni.orghttp://cymruni.org has moved permanantly to
ourwales.org.uk/lang=cyhttp://ourwales.org.uk/lang=cy that way we have only
one domain indexed.
The reason for writing to this group is two fold
1, how does this affect usability and what is 'best practice' in this situation?
2, How have/would you implement a problem like this?
Ideally we want to provide the smoothest and friendliest experience to both the
user and SE whichever domain they use.
thanks
Paul
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RE: [WSG] Should we design for 800x600 screens?
I've also seen a lot of people with big screens re-size their browser windows to about 1024x768/800x600-ish. M From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Hucklesby [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, 11 June 2008 3:46 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Cc: IceKat Subject: Re: [WSG] Should we design for 800x600 screens? On Tue, 10 Jun 2008 13:28:18 +1000, IceKat wrote: Hi, I have a question I'd like to poll people about. Should we still bother designing to fit in with 800x600 screen resolutions or is it Ok to just design for 1024x768 and not worry about smaller resolutions? I know applications like Google Desktop make it more complicated and am interested to hear people's views. FWIW - I work at a computer training lab, teaching computer skills to a very wide age group. A significant number of students switch the nominally 1280 x 960 19 display to 800 x 600. Just my 41 cents. Cordially, David -- *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** NOTICE - This communication is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking any action in reliance on, this communication by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication please delete and destroy all copies and telephone SMS Management Technology on 9696 0911 immediately. Any views expressed in this Communication are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of SMS Management Technology. Except as required by law, SMS Management Technology does not represent, warrant and/or guarantee that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that the communication is free from errors, virus, interception or interference. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Should we design for 800x600 screens?
what about mobile browsing? the iphone is having quite the impact on mobile computing and designing to 800x600 is going to mean you're likely making information inaccessible and un-usable designing to a screen size is like designing to one browser my advice - 1. profile your users and know who they are, what they want, what they need, what their online behaviour 2. turn profile information into functional and non-functional (design) requirements 3. design to meet those needs 4. validate design solutions with those users 5. re-assess needs on a regular basis m From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Anton Babushkin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 10 June 2008 3:39 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Should we design for 800x600 screens? I would say Absolutely, absoutely and absolutely! My reasoning for this is simple: what about the rest of those users who don't browse the internet with the browser in full screen? As a matter of fact I'm doing it right now, so thank god GMail scales gracefully, or I probably wouldn't use it! I think the big question is how scalable your web page becomes beyond 800x600 and that all really depends on the kind of content your web site is providing. If its something which can be extremelly useful for a Google Desktop application then perhaps you need to take that into account. If not, then perhaps rethink your strategy/approach. Thats my two cents. On Tue, Jun 10, 2008 at 1:28 PM, IceKat [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I have a question I'd like to poll people about. Should we still bother designing to fit in with 800x600 screen resolutions or is it Ok to just design for 1024x768 and not worry about smaller resolutions? I know applications like Google Desktop make it more complicated and am interested to hear people's views. IceKat PS- If this has been asked before I apologise and ask if it's possible to see mail archives to see the responses. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- - Anton Babushkin *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** NOTICE - This communication is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking any action in reliance on, this communication by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication please delete and destroy all copies and telephone SMS Management Technology on 9696 0911 immediately. Any views expressed in this Communication are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of SMS Management Technology. Except as required by law, SMS Management Technology does not represent, warrant and/or guarantee that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that the communication is free from errors, virus, interception or interference. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Background-position in percentage
On Wed, Jun 4, 2008 at 1:25 PM, Chris Price [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This never occurred to me before you mentioned it. More details on background positioning here: http://www.digital-web.com/articles/web_design_101_backgrounds/ -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Clarification: Is RTF accessible?
Rae Buerckner wrote: The following is from the AGIMO website. [...] The preferred format is HTML, followed by Word/RTF, and text. They should change this from Word to doc (because Word 2007 also includes docx and so Word is ambiguous). And obviously they should specify the version of doc (if they don't already) such as doc as implemented in MS Word '97. As with PDF they should encourage the most widely understood version of the format... with some exception to the rule for features only available in later versions of the format (Eg, for accessibility use Microsoft Office 2010, don't use RTF). -- .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Is RTF accessible?
Jessica Enders wrote:
I am trying to work out whether a Rich Text File is considered
accessible, to the extent that Australian federal government agencies
must provide electronic documents in an accessible format.
Is there a list of accessibility features that a format must allow, or
does the Australian federal government merely require accessible?
I am not particularly familiar with RTF however it's my understanding
that RTF may be considered a different serialization of the binary .doc
format, and by different I mean plain text:
{\rtf1\ansi{\fonttbl\f0\fswiss Helvetica;}\f0\pard
This is some {\b bold} text.\par
}
Yet another different serialization of .doc is into XML and this is
called ECMA-376 a.k.a. OOXML, or at least OOXML as it was in 2006 (and
from here on when I write OOXML I do mean OOXML as of 2006).
It's my understanding that RTF is only as accessible as OOXML and
therefore one could take the approach of looking for OOXML accessibility
reviews.
So, taking that approach, here is some criticism of OOXML accessibility
that apply equally to RTF:
http://tinyurl.com/yo6q4y
http://holloway.co.nz/ooxml-accessibility.pdf (an article of mine)
http://blogs.sun.com/korn/entry/talking_with_microsoft_s_gray
http://blogs.sun.com/korn/entry/cotinuing_the_conversation_with_gray
--
.Matthew Holloway
http://holloway.co.nz/
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Re: [WSG] Clarification: Is RTF accessible?
Jessica Enders wrote: Also, if it helps, I'm thinking about RTF for /forms/, not general text documents. Oh, ok -- it certainly cannot represent accessible forms. Even the latest RTF 1.9.1 (March 2008) does not appear to support form field labels, for example. -- .Matthew Holloway http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] [OT] users - IT literate?
On Sat, May 17, 2008 at 8:13 AM, Elizabeth Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The challenge for us as designers/builders is to build sites for the way people really use the internet, not the way we wish they did! Excellently put. :) -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] 5.3 Expansion of abbreviations and acronyms in a document
Unsure about best practice approach for acronym within a link, which may not be ether of these examples... a href=http://.co.nz/rss/; title=Real Simple Syndication News FeedRSS News Feed/a a href=http://.co.nz/rss/; acronym title=Real Simple SyndicationRSS/acronym News Feed/a Many thanks Matt *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] [OT] users - IT literate?
On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 7:01 PM, Michael Horowitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: However when it comes to literacy most people using websites are computer competent or they wouldn't be surfing the web in the first place. Sorry, but that's complete speculation. In my experience, a large proportion of computer/web users struggle to understand online concepts that we expert users take for granted. Many regular surfers have no idea how to interact with a scroll bar - and there are lots of people who don't know how the address bar of their browser works! (Look at Google's top searches, they are all URLs - people use that rather than type in the address bar.) -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] [OT] users - IT literate?
On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 2:01 PM, Stuart Foulstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: its because MOST PEOPLE find it easier to type partial URL's into Google rather than typing the whole URL into the address bar And which user research are you basing your PROCLAMATION on? -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] PHP Standards
On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 4:32 PM, Ian Chamberlain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fingers crossed this is not too far off topic; being a newby to PHP; any clues where I can find how-to's, snippets, libraries or even application suites built from PHP that are built to a good minimum standard please. There's a good ongoing thread in the Sitepoint PHP forum filled with best practices: http://www.sitepoint.com/forums/showthread.php?t=456441 -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Feedback
Dear sir / madam I recently joined this mailing list and signed up for the daily digest however I'm finding the digest hard to skim through to see if there is anything of interest to me. It would be great if you had the subject summary list at the top of the email which shows each of the conversations. This would mean that we could easily skim read this list to see if there is anything of interest. An extra bonus would be if you could just click on the subject name and it takes you through to the thread in the website. Cheers Matthew CAUTION - This message may contain privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this message any use, dissemination, distribution or reproduction of this message is prohibited. If you have received this message in error please notify Rail Plus immediately. - *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] a list apart expired
On Tue, May 13, 2008 at 11:55 AM, Francisco Antunes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can someone who know Zeldman let him know that the domain is expired: http://www.alistapart.com/ He's asleep at the moment. :) Do Happy Cog 'run' Magnolia as well? That lapsed too, I seem to remember. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Printing CSS background
On Mon, May 12, 2008 at 3:03 PM, Léo Siqueira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Someone have a suggestion to make CSS background printable ? You could visit every single one of your site users and explain to them how to turn on background printing on their printer settings. And buy them some printer ink as well. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] The Problem of adjacent links
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 10:03 AM, Designer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 10.5 Until user agents (including assistive technologies) render adjacent links distinctly, include non-link, printable characters (surrounded by spaces) between adjacent links. [Priority 3] What is the current thinking on this? How can I do this WITHOUT putting any characters in there? I don't emwant/em any characters in there! Do not add non-link, printable characters (surrounded by spaces or not) between adjacent links unless the semantics of the document naturally would include such characters. From the WCAG Samurai corrections to WCAG1: http://wcagsamurai.org/errata/errata.html So basically, don't worry about using anything between links. http://www.thewatchmakerproject.com/journal/455/wcag-samurai-question -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Reset the styles on a submit button with CSS
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 1:52 PM, Paul Collins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My issue is that the submit buttons now have this styling also in certain browsers. I'd like to give them a class and set them back to their original look, but background:none; doesn't work. Is there a way of doing this does anyone know? Not quite what you asked, but have you considered using the button element for your submit button instead of an input? Removes this kind of annoyance. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] :: CSS Code Formatting ::
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 2:49 PM, Amrinder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Which approach is better? Should we go for code readability as described by Smashing Magazine or follow what Andy said. Why not do both? Use a coding style that suits you, then compress it for live deployment. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Form best practice
On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 4:36 AM, Jens-Uwe Korff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: we are currently evaluating how we code up forms. In the process I'd like to review form best practices. Please send me any bookmarks you might have of what you consider top of class. I favour this approach: http://www.sitepoint.com/article/fancy-form-design-css form fieldset ol li label/input I've found that this approach gives you a great deal of flexibility in how you can style the form. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Floating model: FF counterintuitive
On Fri, Apr 18, 2008 at 4:02 AM, Jens-Uwe Korff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is how FF aligns them: +---+ |heading| +---+ +---+ ++ | div1 | |div2| | | || +---+ ++ I believe that is correct, according to the spec. A floated element should move up as far as the top of the previously floated element in the source; so div2 has moved up to top-align with the top of div1, the previously floated element. Each floated element creates a new 'top line', above which later floated elements can go no higher. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] SMTP
On Sat, Apr 5, 2008 at 12:58 AM, Alexander Uribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I want to be able to recieve information without Outlook express popping up. One of my lecturer's advised me I needed the SMTP number from the host and then add in some code, however i cant find any information of how to set it all up. Can anyone help? This article might be useful: http://www.digital-web.com/articles/bulletproof_contact_form_with_php/ -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] accessible fluid button
On Fri, Apr 4, 2008 at 8:55 AM, Ted Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: YUI button from Yahoo http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/button/ How exactly is a button created with JavaScript accessible? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] USERS - was [Why is u deprecated?]
On Mon, Mar 31, 2008 at 10:02 AM, Designer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is what I find time and time again. Contrary to some of the comments l hear on this list, my experience is such that most computer users haven't got the first clue about how to use their machines, even after ten years . . . I'd agree with this - I once explained to a client over the phone how to copy and paste; he was amazed at how much time he would now be able to save transferring his product details into the CMS... -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] why do some divs shrink wrap and others don't [OT?]
On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 10:30 PM, dwain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: yes, the pix were floated but the nav div was not. i ran a test. i removed the width declaration and floated the nav div. when i check it in ff web dev toolbar the nav div did not shrink wrap or it's contents. I just tried that on your site (removed the width: 30% and added float: left to the #nav div) and it shrinkwraps the nav items as expected. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] why do some divs shrink wrap and others don't [OT?]
On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:07 AM, dwain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: after my experience tonight i was wondering why some divs will shrink wrap their contents while others don't. any takers? Block level elements such as DIV will be 100% of the width of their parent container, unless they are floated - in which case they can either have an explicit width set via CSS, or they will shrinkwrap their contents. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] why do some divs shrink wrap and others don't [OT?]
On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:41 PM, dwain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i had no width set on the nav ul or the nav div and they both went to 100%. the div didn't shrink wrap the div and ul. That would be correct behaviour, unless you are saying that they were floated. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] multiple css style sheets
On Sat, Mar 1, 2008 at 12:47 PM, dwain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: do you have a link for your side? validator.w3.org? -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Out of Office AutoReply: WSG Digest
I am currently out of the office and will return on Thursday, Feb 21. If you're contacting me regarding an urgent web problem please email [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you are looking for GC/event or recording support please email [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanks! Matt Coulter *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] hello - [OT]
On Fri, Feb 15, 2008 at 11:52 AM, Matt Fellows [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Out on a limb here - does anybody else feel the same? I really feel that you could have answered that question elsewhere, or even with a quick search on Google, instead of lazily exploiting the goodwill of this list... -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Styling forms
On Feb 6, 2008 6:03 AM, sri kumar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: FYI, your approach is perfect to my knowledge, but the INPUT element should not wrapped by any LABEL element. It's not compliant/accessible... For somebody labelling themselves Webstandard guy, your knowledge is scarily off-base. FWIW, I think a form can easily be construed as being a list, whether ordered or unordered - it's a list of questions to which you have to provide the answers - so using a UL or OL is absolutely an acceptable solution. DL isn't for reasons that everyone should be aware of. They are also not paragraphs, so wrapping form elements in P is also not a suitable choice. Developers should also be aware of the way in which assistive technology such as screenreaders interacts for forms, specifically the forms mode that many have, where only form-related elements will be read out - this means that paragraphs of text and headings may not be available to screenreader users. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] running ie7 on my mac??
On Jan 25, 2008 6:08 AM, kevin mcmonagle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Whats my cheapest option for getting ie7 to run on my intel based mac. Is it basically an option between boot camp, parallels or virtual pc? Very frustrated with discrepancies at the moment. Yes - Parallels, VMWare Fusion, or Boot Camp. I use Parallels and I love it - you can run Windows as just another application on your desktop, and switching from one OS to the other is as simple as moving the mouse into the Windows window. There is also ies4osx [1] but I was never able to get it to work properly. [1] http://www.kronenberg.org/ies4osx/ -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Where did I come from?
On Jan 22, 2008 3:58 PM, Sarah Peeke [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, if the HTTP headers are changed along the response chain from server to client what is the likely outcome? Where would the user be directed in this case? That depends on the application. It's not a required field, but that doesn't mean that applications shouldn't make decisions based on it. A good example of web software that makes decisions based on referrers are anti-image-leech scripts*. -- .Matthew Cruickshank http://holloway.co.nz/ [*] and image leech scripts are a good response to kids that use your photos http://holloway.co.nz/returnoftheking/ and drain through gigs of traffic... because then you start serving up something like this instead http://holloway.co.nz/image-leech.jpg *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] standards-compliant designers and shoddy work poor QA
On Jan 13, 2008 5:34 AM, Steve Olive [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry to spoil your fun Michael, but 100% of Apple Mac OS X 10.4 or better don't have IE installed at all. There are also 100% of Linux users who don't have IE installed by default. Nokia, Motorola, etc don't have IE installed on mobile devices. The Asus EeePC, the hottest selling bit of technology at the moment, does not have IE installed. IE can't be installed unless the custom-built default OS is replaced by Windows XP, which is not a simple process and unlikely to be be attempted by regular users. Can't seem to find IE installed on my iPhone, either... -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Developing for Mac Browsers
On Jan 13, 2008 5:51 AM, Peter Mount [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm tossing up whether to buy a Mac or to save my money and buy a new PC and just have Linux and Windows on it. I've read that Safari for Windows will help Web Developers without a Mac be able to develop for that. Unless you're a hardcore PC gamer, why not get an Intel Mac? Then you can run Windows (on Parallels or VMWare or Boot Camp), Linux, and MacOS on the same machine. Plus you get a *nix based OS that is much nicer to develop for than Windows. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] standards-compliant designers
On Jan 9, 2008 2:01 PM, Andrew Maben [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: standards-compliant designers represent perhaps 1% of the industry is this really the figure - any sources? It's impossible to say, unless you draw a line in the sand and define what qualifies someone to call themselves a 'web designer'. Does it have to be your job title? Your business? Do you have to be paid for it? Our industry includes everyone from Zeldman to the marketing department struggling with a CMS to back-bedroom solo web agencies to the neighbour's kid with a copy of FrontPage. -- - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] standards-compliant designers
I tend to agree with Mark. IT guys in my experience tend not to be 'joiners' you work in a corporate IT department and you will quickly realise that people use terms like 'Crypt' and 'Beige' I have worked from both sides of the fence as both an indepentant but also as the main web guy within a large organisation. Yes there are situations where we have had to use external vendors to design websites purely because they have to resources to deliver quickly...and I can see how these agencies can produce very poor code and have the business owner say 'yes'. But there are also organisations where they will impose a set of design guidelines upon these firms and really put the pressure on them to deliver (especially is industries where you are an essential service and need to deliver to a wide audience of both abled and disabled people). Does it make the firm a bunch of non-compliant designers...perhaps. But I say for every poorly design website, there is someone who says 'Yes that is what I want' or 'that'll do'. Steve Green wrote: Of course I made up that 1% figure but I don't suppose it's far out. Just look at the phenomenal number of crap websites out there. There are something like 100,000 people offering web design services in the UK (10,000 in London alone) yet GAWDS membership (which is global) is only around 500 and I believe WSG membership is similar. Don't confuse volume with quantity. Lots of people do. There are a lot of crap sites out there but that doesn't mean there's 1 crap designer for every crap site. A lot of the time, the crapness has to do with the business manager who over-rules any technical considerations because he wants animated pictures of little ponies flying round the product. 1 crap designer can turn out many, many crap sites. The damage done by Sieglal's Designing Killer Websites (1st edition - he recanted later) was huge. Back when I was starting, I bought it and used it as a bible of what not to do, but many used it as a how-to guide, and some of those sites still exist. Also add in the spectrum of experience from people creating websites. Some are just learning, some are doing it on the side for their schools or offices - these are not professional web designers and you shouldn't include them in your 'spurious assessment' ;-) but they are the key people to reach out to, if I could figure out how to do it. I started building web in 1996, when bandwidth was an issue (9600 was common here in New Zealand and 56K was only just arriving) and the techniques I learned were aimed at optimizing for speed and volume. Funnily enough the same principles apply to accessibility but I wasn't learning accessibility per se. I didn't join any groups although there were a few around, but I did get on several mailing lists (some of which I'm still on). Some people just aren't joiners. And I don't see participation in the WSG as joining exactly, as there are no dues, no elections and no formality - it's just a place to come and talk. There may be lots of lone coders out there, religiously adhering to standards we don't know and I can't think of a way to find out for sure. Let's make our talking places more well known and inviting, rather than the fearsome arena that many fora become, with the resident experts snarling at the clueless. (Not saying that about the WSG as it is usually quite civilized) Which is all to say don't make up statistics that others will take as gospel as they'll come back and bit us all in the arse. Those who take standards-compliant design seriously tend to be individuals producing small volumes of work, I call unproven assumption - you may be right but we just don't know. but the large volumes are typically generated by organisations that neither know nor care about standards-compliance. They are invariably tied to enterprise-scale CMSs that guarantee the code will be horrible. Likewise, ASP.Net implementations can be made to be standards-compliant but it takes a huge amount of work so most organisations just use it as it comes out of the box. So the simple answer is 'focus on those manufacturers' - yes? Get THEM to change and you won't need to bemoan those chumps who use their stuff out of the box instead of hiring us bespoke designers at our outrageous rates. Curmudgeonly, Mark Harris *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Rockwell?
On Dec 21, 2007 10:05 AM, Jos Flachs [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I got a font problem: for a site I'm working on I'd like to use rockwell.ttf, in the h1 tag. Rockwell isn't a standard font, but every windows user has them, and it is also available for Mac. But I don't know if this font is in the Mac fontbook. And I'm pretty sure *nix users don't have it at all. It's not a standard Windows font, I'd be surprised if anyone apart from designers had it on their systems (unless it is now bundled with Vista?) Why not use sIFR - the demo even comes with the Rockwell .swf file. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] BBC in Beta
It's not working at all via iPhone, strangely. - Matthew Sent from my iPhone On 18 Dec 2007, at 18:31, Kim Kruse [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well they are on my computer! (we're talking about the 4 colored buttons that changed the colors of the page... right?) John Faulds skrev: Seems like someone is listening! The color buttons is gone No they're not. Unless you're referring to something different. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Styling Submit buttons with JavaScript by making them anchors
On Dec 17, 2007 2:28 PM, James Leslie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I'm trying to use some code so that submit buttons on a form are (using
JavaScript if available) removed and replaced with anchor tags that then
have event handlers added to them to submit a form if clicked. The reason
for this is that I have some tabs I want to style in a similar way though
some are anchors and some are inputs and it means I should be able to style
submit buttons in the same way as anchor tags whilst managing to keep the
text resizable (as opposed to using an image for the submit button).
This might be a stupid question, but why can't you just style your form
submit buttons to look like links using CSS?
button {
border: 0;
background: none;
text-decoration: underline;
color: #006;
cursor: pointer;
}
Your button looks and acts (almost) exactly like a regular link.
- Matthew
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Re: [WSG] Opera files antitrust against MS: standards one part
Michael Horowitz wrote: RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE lol .Matthew Cruickshank http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Opera files antitrust against MS: standards one part
On Dec 14, 2007 8:41 PM, Chris Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why was Silverlight included? As far as I am aware it's a plug-in much like Flash, so why would it be hindering the open web? Of course I don't know why Opera has included Silverlight, but to speculate... It might be because of something like this, http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/roadmap/archives/2007/10/open_letter_to_chris_wilson.html Silverlight has a subset of .Net's CLR called CoreCLR, and one could argue that Microsoft are intentionally trying to stiffle the open web[tm] while advancing Silverlight. -- .Matthew Cruickshank http://docvert.org/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Opera files antitrust against MS: standards one part
Oh, in particular this quote from Brendan Eich, the obvious conflict of interest between the standards-based web and proprietary platforms advanced by Microsoft, and the rationales for keeping the web's language small while the proprietary platforms rapidly evolve support for large languages, does not help maintain the fiction that only clashing high-level philosophies are involved here -- http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/roadmap/archives/2007/10/open_letter_to_chris_wilson.html On Dec 14, 2007 9:01 PM, Matthew Cruickshank [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Dec 14, 2007 8:41 PM, Chris Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why was Silverlight included? [...] -- .Matthew Cruickshank http://holloway.co.nz/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Comment mark
On 12/10/07, krugonN [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To comment a line in PHP code you should use // or you can comment a block using /* */ Or you can also use an octothorpe: # to comment out a single line in PHP. - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] More semantic logos?
On 12/8/07, James Thomson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was hoping to get your feedback on my blog entry regarding a method of marking up logos with using your standard site menu: http://www.digitaloverload.co.uk/blog/2007/11/23/more-semantic-logos/ Great article - like all the best solutions, applying a little common sense gets you a long way. :) - Matthew *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Simple question on forms
On 12/5/07, Minh D. Tran [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I just have a question regarding forms. How do I set the cursor to default
on a certain form input field?
Do you mean you want to automatically give focus to a particular form field
when the page loads? You can simply call the .focus() method on the element:
document.getElementById('myfield').focus();
Consider the accessibility implications, first, though; not everyone will be
happy to have decisions made for them about where they want their cursor to
be. ;)
- Matthew.
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Re: [WSG] Simple question on forms
On 12/5/07, Minh D. Tran [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I just have a question regarding forms. How do I set the cursor to default
on a certain form input field?
Do you mean you want to automatically give focus to a particular form field
when the page loads? You can simply call the .focus() method on the element:
document.getElementById('myfield').focus();
Consider the accessibility implications, first, though; not everyone will be
happy to have decisions made for them about where they want their cursor to
be. ;)
- Matthew.
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