Re: axis and caching
Hi Steve, May I take a rollback in this issue ? What's the "HTTP spec." ? Which are you talking about HTTP/1.0, or HTTP/1.1 ? The followings are extracts form the RFCs of IETF what was said during the POST method in HTTP. .*.*.*.*.*.*.* |RFC 2616(Draft Standard): HTTP/1.1 | | Responses to this method are not cacheable, unless the response | includes appropriate Cache-Control or Expires header fields. However, | the 303 (See Other) response can be used to direct the user agent to | retrieve a cacheable resource. | |RFC 1945(Informational): HTTP/1.0 | | Applications must not cache responses to a POST request because the | application has no way of knowing that the server would return an | equivalent response on some future request. .*.*.*.*.*.*.* In case of HTTP/1.0, "POST" method is *NOT* cacheable. However, "POST method in HTTP/1.1" may cacheable if the http header (of soap response message) has appropriate Cache-Control or Expires fields. Now, AXIS (AxisServlet.java) may not add some header for cache control. If an AIXS user want to turn on the cache mechanism (with any reason) aware of the side effect, is it effective , or not ??? I'm not sure, but the spec. will allow it. How do you think ? In the future, SOAP 1.2 will activate the "SOAP HTTP GET usage". How do you support it ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Steve Loughran [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 1:49 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: axis and caching Can I repeat somethign here. Axis does not specify caching on the results of a POSTed SOAP request, because POST requests are not cacheable or idempotent, according to the HTTP spec. Indeed, the fact that SOAP calls are inherently uncacheable is one of the complaints about SOAP; even side effect free reads need to round trip all the way to the server Anything that caches posted requests is breaking the rules of an HTTP impl. So I dont think we should make any changes to Axis even if someone has a problem; they need to fix their proxy server or client app to understand http. Now GET messages, using the GET endpoint?method=foo technique is a different story; after the first email on the subject I have turned caching off there; the patch will go into CVS and nightly builds this week. -steve - Original Message - From: "Toshiyuki Kimura" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 02:26 Subject: RE: axis and caching Hi Calvin, Oh, okey! You *don't* want to refer the cached message !! Could you snoop on both request and respnse message including http protocol headers ? And please open up it for us. You'll be able to take these messages by using TCP Monitor (org.apache.axis.utils.tcpmon). A proxy won't meddle with your transport messages, if you don't specify as a proxy server. So, are you using a secure network via firewalls ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 3:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Now you confused me Currently Axis server does not specify any kind of caching, so the client is free to cache or not What I would like is for Axis to specify that the results are NOT cachable. My problem now is that the result is getting cached by someone in the middle (proxy? not sure) Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I think it's dangerous to implement the way what you proposed. The WebServices are *NOT* static contents, so your client will get some wrong message ( i.e. old message cached by various network devices including proxys ) if you use the mechanism. Is it acceptable for you ? I wouldn't prefer the methods if so. In this situation, do you still want to have a cache for WS ? What's the root problems in your system ? I mean that do you have any actual troubles ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 2:11 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Each time a repsonse is sent from axis it needs these two lines in the HTTP header: Cache-Control
RE: axis and caching
Hi Calvin, Oh, okey! You *don't* want to refer the cached message !! Could you snoop on both request and respnse message including http protocol headers ? And please open up it for us. You'll be able to take these messages by using TCP Monitor (org.apache.axis.utils.tcpmon). A proxy won't meddle with your transport messages, if you don't specify as a proxy server. So, are you using a secure network via firewalls ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 3:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Now you confused me Currently Axis server does not specify any kind of caching, so the client is free to cache or not What I would like is for Axis to specify that the results are NOT cachable. My problem now is that the result is getting cached by someone in the middle (proxy? not sure) Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I think it's dangerous to implement the way what you proposed. The WebServices are *NOT* static contents, so your client will get some wrong message ( i.e. old message cached by various network devices including proxys ) if you use the mechanism. Is it acceptable for you ? I wouldn't prefer the methods if so. In this situation, do you still want to have a cache for WS ? What's the root problems in your system ? I mean that do you have any actual troubles ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 2:11 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Each time a repsonse is sent from axis it needs these two lines in the HTTP header: Cache-Control: no-cache Pragma: no-cache This is so that the various gateways/routers/vpn servers/whatever else knows not to cache the result of a soap message NOTE: these lines are included in the client, so only the server(servlet?) needs fixing. Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I guess that the current AXIS doesn't have the optoin for caching control. What's your problems ? I might provide a solution depends on your condition. Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2003 5:21 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: axis and caching I'm testing with axis 1.0 and have noticed that axis does not specify that the soap response is not cachable, which causes me some problems. Is there an option for axis to suppy the caching control in the response? _ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup
Re: axis and caching
Can I repeat somethign here. Axis does not specify caching on the results of a POSTed SOAP request, because POST requests are not cacheable or idempotent, according to the HTTP spec. Indeed, the fact that SOAP calls are inherently uncacheable is one of the complaints about SOAP; even side effect free reads need to round trip all the way to the server Anything that caches posted requests is breaking the rules of an HTTP impl. So I dont think we should make any changes to Axis even if someone has a problem; they need to fix their proxy server or client app to understand http. Now GET messages, using the GET endpoint?method=foo technique is a different story; after the first email on the subject I have turned caching off there; the patch will go into CVS and nightly builds this week. -steve - Original Message - From: "Toshiyuki Kimura" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 02:26 Subject: RE: axis and caching Hi Calvin, Oh, okey! You *don't* want to refer the cached message !! Could you snoop on both request and respnse message including http protocol headers ? And please open up it for us. You'll be able to take these messages by using TCP Monitor (org.apache.axis.utils.tcpmon). A proxy won't meddle with your transport messages, if you don't specify as a proxy server. So, are you using a secure network via firewalls ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 3:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Now you confused me Currently Axis server does not specify any kind of caching, so the client is free to cache or not What I would like is for Axis to specify that the results are NOT cachable. My problem now is that the result is getting cached by someone in the middle (proxy? not sure) Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I think it's dangerous to implement the way what you proposed. The WebServices are *NOT* static contents, so your client will get some wrong message ( i.e. old message cached by various network devices including proxys ) if you use the mechanism. Is it acceptable for you ? I wouldn't prefer the methods if so. In this situation, do you still want to have a cache for WS ? What's the root problems in your system ? I mean that do you have any actual troubles ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 2:11 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Each time a repsonse is sent from axis it needs these two lines in the HTTP header: Cache-Control: no-cache Pragma: no-cache This is so that the various gateways/routers/vpn servers/whatever else knows not to cache the result of a soap message NOTE: these lines are included in the client, so only the server(servlet?) needs fixing. Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I guess that the current AXIS doesn't have the optoin for caching control. What's your problems ? I might provide a solution depends on your condition. Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2003 5:21 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: axis and caching I'm testing with axis 1.0 and have noticed that axis does not specify that the soap response is not cachable, which causes me some problems. Is there an option for axis to suppy the caching control in the response? _ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup
Re: axis and caching
ok thanks, i'll grab the next release when it's available Original Message Follows Can I repeat somethign here. Axis does not specify caching on the results of a POSTed SOAP request, because POST requests are not cacheable or idempotent, according to the HTTP spec. Indeed, the fact that SOAP calls are inherently uncacheable is one of the complaints about SOAP; even side effect free reads need to round trip all the way to the server Anything that caches posted requests is breaking the rules of an HTTP impl. So I dont think we should make any changes to Axis even if someone has a problem; they need to fix their proxy server or client app to understand http. Now GET messages, using the GET endpoint?method=foo technique is a different story; after the first email on the subject I have turned caching off there; the patch will go into CVS and nightly builds this week. -steve - Original Message - From: Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 02:26 Subject: RE: axis and caching Hi Calvin, Oh, okey! You *don't* want to refer the cached message !! Could you snoop on both request and respnse message including http protocol headers ? And please open up it for us. You'll be able to take these messages by using TCP Monitor (org.apache.axis.utils.tcpmon). A proxy won't meddle with your transport messages, if you don't specify as a proxy server. So, are you using a secure network via firewalls ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 3:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Now you confused me Currently Axis server does not specify any kind of caching, so the client is free to cache or not What I would like is for Axis to specify that the results are NOT cachable. My problem now is that the result is getting cached by someone in the middle (proxy? not sure) Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I think it's dangerous to implement the way what you proposed. The WebServices are *NOT* static contents, so your client will get some wrong message ( i.e. old message cached by various network devices including proxys ) if you use the mechanism. Is it acceptable for you ? I wouldn't prefer the methods if so. In this situation, do you still want to have a cache for WS ? What's the root problems in your system ? I mean that do you have any actual troubles ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 2:11 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Each time a repsonse is sent from axis it needs these two lines in the HTTP header: Cache-Control: no-cache Pragma: no-cache This is so that the various gateways/routers/vpn servers/whatever else knows not to cache the result of a soap message NOTE: these lines are included in the client, so only the server(servlet?) needs fixing. Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I guess that the current AXIS doesn't have the optoin for caching control. What's your problems ? I might provide a solution depends on your condition. Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2003 5:21 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: axis and caching I'm testing with axis 1.0 and have noticed that axis does not specify that the soap response is not cachable, which causes me some problems. Is there an option for axis to suppy the caching control in the response? _ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup _ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail
Re: axis and caching
- Original Message - From: Calvin Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 09:28 Subject: Re: axis and caching ok thanks, i'll grab the next release when it's available I still need you to clarify something. Are you having caching problems with normal SOAP requests, issued by axis or other soap clients? because these are posted and nothing I have done will have changed their behaviour. -steve
RE: axis and caching
Each time a repsonse is sent from axis it needs these two lines in the HTTP header: Cache-Control: no-cache Pragma: no-cache This is so that the various gateways/routers/vpn servers/whatever else knows not to cache the result of a soap message NOTE: these lines are included in the client, so only the server(servlet?) needs fixing. Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I guess that the current AXIS doesn't have the optoin for caching control. What's your problems ? I might provide a solution depends on your condition. Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2003 5:21 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: axis and caching I'm testing with axis 1.0 and have noticed that axis does not specify that the soap response is not cachable, which causes me some problems. Is there an option for axis to suppy the caching control in the response? _ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup _ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
Re: axis and caching
POSTs are inherently non-cacheable, unless there is a bug on yor side. Is it GET you are using? If so, file a bugrep... - Original Message - From: Calvin Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 06, 2003 12:20 Subject: axis and caching I'm testing with axis 1.0 and have noticed that axis does not specify that the soap response is not cachable, which causes me some problems. Is there an option for axis to suppy the caching control in the response? _ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup
RE: axis and caching
Hi Calvin, I think it's dangerous to implement the way what you proposed. The WebServices are *NOT* static contents, so your client will get some wrong message ( i.e. old message cached by various network devices including proxys ) if you use the mechanism. Is it acceptable for you ? I wouldn't prefer the methods if so. In this situation, do you still want to have a cache for WS ? What's the root problems in your system ? I mean that do you have any actual troubles ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 2:11 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Each time a repsonse is sent from axis it needs these two lines in the HTTP header: Cache-Control: no-cache Pragma: no-cache This is so that the various gateways/routers/vpn servers/whatever else knows not to cache the result of a soap message NOTE: these lines are included in the client, so only the server(servlet?) needs fixing. Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I guess that the current AXIS doesn't have the optoin for caching control. What's your problems ? I might provide a solution depends on your condition. Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2003 5:21 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: axis and caching I'm testing with axis 1.0 and have noticed that axis does not specify that the soap response is not cachable, which causes me some problems. Is there an option for axis to suppy the caching control in the response? _ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup
RE: axis and caching
Now you confused me Currently Axis server does not specify any kind of caching, so the client is free to cache or not What I would like is for Axis to specify that the results are NOT cachable. My problem now is that the result is getting cached by someone in the middle (proxy? not sure) Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I think it's dangerous to implement the way what you proposed. The WebServices are *NOT* static contents, so your client will get some wrong message ( i.e. old message cached by various network devices including proxys ) if you use the mechanism. Is it acceptable for you ? I wouldn't prefer the methods if so. In this situation, do you still want to have a cache for WS ? What's the root problems in your system ? I mean that do you have any actual troubles ? Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 2:11 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: axis and caching Each time a repsonse is sent from axis it needs these two lines in the HTTP header: Cache-Control: no-cache Pragma: no-cache This is so that the various gateways/routers/vpn servers/whatever else knows not to cache the result of a soap message NOTE: these lines are included in the client, so only the server(servlet?) needs fixing. Original Message Follows Hi Calvin, I guess that the current AXIS doesn't have the optoin for caching control. What's your problems ? I might provide a solution depends on your condition. Regards, Toshiyuki Kimura [EMAIL PROTECTED] RD Headquarters NTT DATA Corp. -Original Message- From: Calvin Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2003 5:21 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: axis and caching I'm testing with axis 1.0 and have noticed that axis does not specify that the soap response is not cachable, which causes me some problems. Is there an option for axis to suppy the caching control in the response? _ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup _ Help STOP SPAM: Try the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
