pathname of the
directory?
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ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: +1.603.293.8485
Mobile: +1.603.998.6958
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within the context of the new backup system.
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Landline: +1.603.293.8485
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d set of copies.
Which, I note, is what I do ANYWAY, just in case something goes wrong
and I have to *rerun* the copy job.
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ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: +1.603.293.8485
Mobile: +1.603.
f they are mission-critical, this would likely be a problem
and you would need to implement a failsafe mechanism for restarting them
after the backup if not running (a cron job perhaps).
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: +1.60
A Fileset can be the output of a script. So you could create a script
thatfinds and returns just that one location.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: +1.603.293.8485
Mobile: +1.603.998
ent away.
I had similar problems at one point with an nVidia nForce chipset NIC,
until I discovered the magic configuration trick to fix the problem.
Once I figured that out, the problem went away for good.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllew
On 11/30/12 04:40, lst_ho...@kwsoft.de wrote:
>
> Zitat von Phil Stracchino :
>
>> On 11/29/12 16:45, lst_ho...@kwsoft.de wrote:
>>> Try with another NIC. We first had problems with our Bacula Server
>>> failing two clients out of ~20 with connection failures
election in BAT's restore job dialog at the default. Shouldn't it be
auto-selecting the correct Storage based on where the files to be
restored are? It seems to me there's something wrong in the interface
logic here. Do we need to have some kind of "AUTOSELECT STORAGE"
de
(s) - and therefore which pool(s) and hence which sd(s) - will be
required to complete the restore *is in the BSR file anyway*.
Specifying an SD on a restore by default not only contributes nothing,
it actually *breaks* the restore.
BAT should default to *not* specifying a SD for restores unless t
the largest schema in my DB
anyway (96% of both total application data and total application data
rows). I just back up the DB last and have redundant, replicated DB
servers.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metroc
On 12/11/12 19:44, Dan Langille wrote:
>
> On Dec 11, 2012, at 7:11 PM, Phil Stracchino wrote:
>
>> On 12/11/12 16:47, ccspro wrote:
>>> And make sure your Catalog backup has the lowest priority (say 99) so
>>> it will be completed after all Jobs are done for t
e mailing list?
You know you want to. :)
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL wrangler, Free Stater
tool, possibly the most
important single difference being that it is inherently aware of
transactional and non-transactional storage engines, and automatically
just Does The Right Thing for both types of tables on a table-by-table
basis in a single dump, something which is literally impossib
contains tools that require
knowledge of the DB back-end.
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL wrangler, Free Stater
It's
ing used for both.
>
> What magic are you expecting?
Keep in mind that ZFS block-level deduplication is very expensive in
terms of RAM.
--
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Un
On 01/03/13 08:22, Gary R. Schmidt wrote:
> On 3/01/2013 11:44 PM, Phil Stracchino wrote:
> [SNIP]
>
>> Keep in mind that ZFS block-level deduplication is very expensive in
>> terms of RAM.
> I'd put it as *any* block-level de-duplication is RAM intensive... I'
qldump and mydumper.
One last footnote: *SOLELY* setting MySQL read-only does NOT guarantee
a consistent backup. You must FLUSH TABLES, and even then you're still
not 100% safe on InnoDB.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.
l from
write-contention bottlenecks.
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Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL wrangler, Free Stater
I
e volume in BAT and select List Jobs From
Volume, no records are returned.
Has anyone else observed this behavior?
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl
and write a new one from scratch. They
are uniformly worthless, and most actually *introduce* security weaknesses.
(The *second* thing you should do, if it hasn't already been done, is
run the mysql_secure_installation script.)
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#29979245
volume retention on a pool-by-pool basis.
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL wrangler, Free Stater
etware-286 boxes would run a close second.
Arkeia. The design was *fundamentally* flawed.
I've used a number of singularly wretched backup tools over the years.
The original Conner Backup Exec was awful too.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerll
o a current MySQL version while you're at it.
I'm guessing you probably have, at best, MySQL 5.0.95. 5.0 was EOL'd in
2011, 5.1 will be EOL'd this year, current most recent versions are
5.5.30 and 5.6.10.)
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
a
ssible. On MySQL 5.5 or later you probably want to set
innodb_buffer_pool_instances (which should be called
innodb_buffer_pool_partitions) to partition the buffer pool into 3GB-4GB
chunks for best InnoDB performance. Also look into the
innodb_io_capacity settings; the default is 100 IOPS, but m
in place?
The index file is of no use without the data. MySQL will only have to
truncate it anyway.
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Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL wrangl
rtable and
can be moved and imported into another MySQL server.
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL wrangler, Free State
On 02/27/13 17:58, etanneh...@godaddy.com wrote:
> I am looking to see if it is possible to run two storage directors both
> talking to the same robotic library?
My first reaction is that it sounds like a really bad idea.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -
them into the new catalog. In general, the best time to
clone an old Bacula server to a new one is before you start writing
production jobs to the new server.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
bly-required, and the documentation is terrible.
Probably the best tool currently available is MySQL Enterprise Backup,
but as the name implies it requires a MySQL Enterprise license.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metroca
ckup
schemes using Linux LVM, and frankly, they really don't work well at all
by comparison. LVM snapshots are too slow and require too much reserved
disk space to make the technique viable on a large DB.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@ca
started (or possibly at the time it was scheduled, I'm not 100% certain
of that detail). An Incremental backup is always based off the most
recent completed successful backup of that Job at *any* level.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
On 03/20/13 13:33, Novosielski, Ryan wrote:
> On 03/20/2013 11:34 AM, Phil Stracchino wrote:
>> tl;dr version: A Differential backup is always based off the most
>> recent completed successful Full backup of that Job at the time the
>> Differential was started (or possib
faster method:
CREATE TABLE NewFile LIKE File;
INSERT INTO NewFile (SELECT * FROM File);
DROP TABLE File;
RENAME TABLE NewFile TO File;
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Ma
On 03/21/13 08:43, Konstantin Khomoutov wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Mar 2013 07:40:01 -0400
> Phil Stracchino wrote:
>
> [...]
>> Try this for a faster method:
>>
>> CREATE TABLE NewFile LIKE File;
>> INSERT INTO NewFile (SELECT * FROM File);
>> DROP TABLE Fil
n which an image backup completes in maybe 30
minutes, it was estimating five and a half days to complete). Two of
the four test clients immediately configured to use the desired NAS
backup share on the first try; the remaining two, I had to fight with
for an hour on that point alone.
--
Phil
And to make it worse, neither VSS nor NTBackup would reliably,
consistently read open registry hives, meaning if anyone was logged in
when the backup ran, the registry would be incomplete.)
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@me
urge files jobid=nnn but
> not sure)
Is it feasible for you to purge the applicable tapes, then run new full
backups of the affected hosts? If you do that and you STILL run out of
space, you need more storage capacity, and you have proof of it for the
people who approve the purchase orders.
the other hand, if you have jobs failing because they're not
correctly being continued on the next tape, then you have a
configuration problem somewhere that you need to fix.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net
up correctly. the problem is that I need the original name. As
> soon I renamed the another_name back to Directoryname, it backed up
> empty again. What's wrong?
Jeff,
If you touch all the files in the target directory to update their
modification dates, then run another incremental
t on the machine you're now
backing up via NFS mounts and back it up directly.
(Truth to tell, this is even more true of the machine in question is
running Linux. The Linux nfsd, honestly, is and always has been a poor
implementation.)
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458
ge looks incomplete, and lacks context, but it doesn't look as
though a pool name is the problem.
Are you certain you changed NOTHING else?
Do you know that Bacula was working before? You said it was "mostly"
configured. Depending what parts *aren't* configured, that can be a bi
earch the catalog and tell
you what media you will need to perform the restore.
Also remember that you always have the ability at any time to create a
"virtual full" job from the most recent Full, Differential, and
applicable incrementals.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 D
ata at file
level; perform consistent dumps of the data and then back up the dumps.
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL wrangler,
oose. But why on earth would you split your volumes into 5GB
chunks? That's just a little too big to fit onto a DVD, and
impractically small for any other purpose.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p
y,
on a system that you don't understand. This is not a recipe for success.
Unfortunately, it also suggests that your employer not only has a basic
lack of understanding of the problem, but a lack of understanding that
they don't understand the problem.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299
."
What you will need to do is to separately run the scripts to update from
catalog version 12 to version 13, then from 13 to 14. There should be a
directory installed along with Bacula containing previous versions of
the update script.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458
robably intend.
(Note that /usr/sbin/sendmail is almost certainly NOT going to be the
Sendmail MTA, mail-mta/sendmail, unless you manually chose to replace
the system MTA with Sendmail yourself, and if you knew enough Sendmail
to make that decision, you probably wouldn't be asking this
restore from BAT to the same client, BAT
will tell me that no Full job was found prior to the last incremental,
and refuse to restore. It's as though BAT is generating an incorrect
query that can see only the most recent few jobs.
Has anyone else encountered this problem?
--
Phil Strac
;s privileges, and if you want Bacula
to be able to back up and restore all data on the system it must run as
root, so if your Director is compromised, it can almost certainly be
used to gain access to the clients. However, it should already go
without saying that your Director, since it has access
n of the configuration and
versions for both DB installations. I find it implausible that a switch
from community-edition MySQL to a comparable-version MariaDB, *with no
other changes*, could yield a three-orders-of-magnitude performance gain
for the same query.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#2
ile per job is that unless you get into multiple virtual Storage
devices, you can only run one job at a time because you can only have
one Volume open per storage device at a time. That gets messy fast.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerll
de Set"
Include {
Options {
signature = SHA1
File = "|sh -c 'find /home -size +10G'"
Exclude = yes
}
File = /
File = /home
File = /var
}
}
This example should result in automatically excluding any file 10GB or
larg
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA256
On 08/20/13 16:43, Dimitri Maziuk wrote:
> On 08/20/2013 03:03 PM, Phil Stracchino wrote:
>> On 08/20/13 15:02, Dimitri Maziuk wrote:
>>> On 08/19/2013 12:41 PM, Jonathan Bayer wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA256
On 08/20/13 18:17, Dimitri Maziuk wrote:
> On 08/20/2013 04:49 PM, Phil Stracchino wrote:
>
>> Dmitri, if you look at the approach I proposed, it would back up
>> the entire tree and only exclude specific files, which entirel
with twelve months
retention; a Differential pool on disk, run weekly with three months'
retention; and an Incremental pool ondisk, run daily with one month
retention; and it's easy to automatically expire and delete opr recycle
(as appropriate) each volume as it gets past its sell-by date.
ly slower, core
for core and RAM for RAM, than 5.1 on older hardware with the same data.
--
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL wrangle
gains in the latest version seem
improbable without a much better stipulation of what is being compared
to what.
--
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL w
cleaning
cycles in succession. Next run completed perfectly with zero errors.
--
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hacker, SQL wrangler, Free Stater
rtain that there is
> nothing wrong with my Job, Files, Client, and Volume retention periods.
>
> This happens for any/every client I choose.
>
> Can anyone offer any insight to this issue? I'd really like to get to the
> bottom of this.
I've been seeing similar b
incrementals on all other days.
I am doing the same with about a 1TB-1.2TB backup set on my home
network. The only time I have a problem is when there's a tape error.
I could probably eliminate those by replacing all of my older tapes.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458
o your DB server and workload.
The "sample" configurations will lead you astray. They are uniformly bad.
--
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ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinate.org
Renaissance Man, Unix ronin, Perl hac
'show tables from bacula'); do echo Converting
table bacula.${T} ; mysql -BNe "alter table bacula.${T} engine=InnoDB" ;
done
Any time you're working with InnoDB or converting tables to InnoDB,
remember that within limits, the more memory you have allocated to the
InnoDB buf
SQL on top of
DRBD would be "Just don't." I could cite lists of customers who have
had complete unrecoverable DB losses as a result of problems or
interactions involving DRBD, and had to rebuild from DB backups. If
you're going to cluster MySQL, use a shared-nothing configurati
On 11/04/13 16:10, Josh Fisher wrote:
> On 11/4/2013 1:27 PM, Phil Stracchino wrote:
>> Honestly, based upon experience as a DBA at a hosting company that hosts
>> MANY customers using MySQL, my first advice on using MySQL on top of
>> DRBD would be "Just don't.&qu
On 11/04/13 18:55, Dimitri Maziuk wrote:
> On 11/04/2013 04:17 PM, Phil Stracchino wrote: ... In at least one
> of the
>> cases I know about, though, the problem was not a failure of DRBD
>> per se, it was that someone accidentally started up mysqld on the
>> second no
itten back when a "large" server was
one that might have as much as a whole 32MB of RAM. These days, that is
less than the compiled-in default size of some individual MySQL
*buffers*. So the unwary install the "suggested" configurations, and
can't understand why MySQL i
data be lost, ever.
With that value, MySQL will attempt to flush the log once per second,
which is a very good compromise between performance and risk of data loss.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.net ala...@metrocast.net p...@co.ordinat
FS are about on par. All three perform
*ridiculously* better than ext3, so much so that PostgreSQL recommends
XFS over ext3 for PostgreSQL installations. In my experience, for
typical database I/O JFS outperforms XFS, but it is less widely supported.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299
Bacula Systems lawsuit. If
>> you wish to read it please see:
>>
>> http://www.bacula.org/en/?page=news
>>
>
> That?s one load of stress that nobody needs in their life. Here?s
> to a speedy fix and for Bareos to own up.
Seconded.
- --
Phil St
, if you upgrade to kernel 3.12, and your DB dumps suddenly start
failing with "Unable to connect (Using password: No)" errors, it's not
your dump tool that's failing. Recompile Bacula, restart the Director,
and you should be all set.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon
compile
> against on my new server? I remember there once being some issues of
> slowness or memory leaking when compiled against 5.x
At this point, if at all possible, you should probably be using 5.5,
5.5.35 if you can get it. I would probably not advise 5.6 at this point.
--
P
uces better code for Solaris,
particularly on Sparc architectures, and it's MUCH easier to get it to
emit a proper 64-bit build for Solaris.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: 603.293.8485
-
to larger numbers of cores. (MySQL 5.1 really didn't scale
efficiently beyond four cores; MySQL 5.5 scales pretty well to 16; MySQL
5.6 is claimed to scale well to 64 cores.) We have feedback from
several customers of my employer that on the same hardware, they feel it
is slower than 5.5.
new, empty catalog and using bscan
to read all of the metadata back into it by scanning the backup media.
If at all possible, you want to do this as a single job.
It should also be noted that the current version of Bacula is 5.2.13.
You are two full major branches behind. You might want to consid
k into the database.
> I've used bscan before, but never restored from a bootstrap file.
That sounds like probably a good procedure, yes. I'd try to figure out
what happened to the DB first, but if there's just no trace of it,
create a new database, bscan the last night's
On 12/31/13 11:48, Alan Brown wrote:
> On 31/12/13 15:37, Phil Stracchino wrote:
>>
>> That sounds like probably a good procedure, yes. I'd try to figure out
>> what happened to the DB first, but if there's just no trace of it,
>> create a new database,
-- on Linux, it
> doesn't seem
> to have one, which means that it is not so simple. If anyone has some
> simple
> OS API call for Linux or Mac OSX that will do this, please let me know.
I've never seen Linux suspend with an active task running in the first
place.
--
TO4
tapes which I get around 780GB-820GB per tape onto. Bacula simply
requests a new tape at the point that the first one fills up, without me
having to do anything special to enable that behavior.
Perhaps you could post your configuration (properly sanitized of course)...?
--
P
time to manage client disk
quotas is at the disk-usage quota level, not at the backup level.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: 603.293.8485
--
Andro
on the new server and configure it like your
existing one. You can either make it a second sd, or you can move all
of your existing data to the new server and update the existing sd
definition to point to it, then restart the Director.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph..
small server shared with other applications, at a time when a
"large" server was one that might have a full 32MB of RAM. That is
now smaller than the current default size of some individual MySQL
*buffers*.
- --
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p
g to let you even reconfigure it, they lost a customer.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: 603.293.8485
--
7;t allow a VPN to the backup server, it's probably too
sensitive to be backed up remotely anyway, and if that's the case they
should consider local backup to removable media and a bonded offsite
archival service. (In the US, Iron Mountain would be such a service.)
--
Phil Stracchino
ok up the old DB to determine which volumes you need, then bscan those
volumes.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: 603.293.8485
--
Put Bad Developer
rise code stolen from Bacula Systems
by a consultant who was under non-disclosure agreement, removed all of
the author attributions from the code in an apparent attempt to disguise
the theft, and then launched a smear campaign against Bacula.
I think you will have to agree this is a very diffe
ll significantly improve performance, especially under heavy
write traffic.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: 603.293.8485
--
Learn Graph Databases
l, though it's nearly worthless for file-level
restore. If you have Windows 7 Home, it's intentionally crippled. I'm
actually considering a hybrid approach - Win7 native image backup for
bare-metal recovery, combined with Bacula for file-level restore of user
data.
--
Phil S
erability
problem, though I haven't actually tried it with Bacula. I have
actually run mixed test clusters with one node MySQL, one node MariaDB,
and one node Percona, without any problems.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline
e
ActionOnPurge = TRUNCATE option. This will truncate volumes to 0 bytes
when they are purged, instead of leaving them their original size
occupying the full disk space of whatever contents they once held.
Unless you are planning to burn your disk volumes to rem
set this directive *SEPARATELY* for the Director,
for each Storage daemon, and for each Client. You probably do not want
them all set to the same value, unless you're just using a strategy of
setting all of them to a value sufficiently large you never expect to
reach it.
--
Phi
grind to a halt, because you can't put any new
jobs on the volume you just used and can't create any new volumes.
Have you actually read the documentation to see what these directives do?
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@
gh I think
"synthetic full backup" might actually be a better term) from the
Differential and the last Full. This would allow you to always have a
recent Full backup on hand without tying up the slow connection for
many hours while a new Full backup runs.
- --
Phil Stracchino
Baby
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Hash: SHA256
On 06/02/14 09:47, Steven Haigh wrote:
> On 02/06/14 23:30, Phil Stracchino wrote:
>> Have you considered virtual full backups? After you run a
>> Differential, you could create a virtual full backup (though I
>> think &
hard links would become your problem, and then you have to be
careful not to update all copies of a hard-linked file when one
original updates...
- --
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: 603.293.8485
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On 06/25/14 12:41, gsmart9214 wrote:
> Does anybody have any recommendations for a NAS software that can support
> CIFS and NFS without having to become a storage guru?
The question is off-topic for this list. But there's lots of them. Try
looking up FreeNAS.
--
Phil Stracchin
:bacula-users-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=unsubscribe
This information has been pointed out to you about three times now.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p...@co.ordinate.org
Landline: 603.293.8485
-
The only
tool I am aware of that can, effectively, compact and shrink the InnoDB
tablespace file is Percona XtraBackup, and it's not the easiest tool in
the world to use.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Commu
've
finished selecting files, instead of saying Yes to the OK To Run prompt,
select Modify instead, and select a different client and a safe location
on that client.
--
Phil Stracchino
Babylon Communications
ph...@caerllewys.net
p..
blems with
it, but I've heard many reports thaqt code from the OpenSolaris project
is of ... shall we say, dubious stability. OpenSolaris is widely
considered not ready for production.
--
Phil Stracchino, CDK#2 DoD#299792458 ICBM: 43.5607, -71.355
ala...@caerllewys.ne
the choice between two user interfaces and I made the bad choice.
"Java Desktop" is what Sun is calling their Gnome-based desktop, afaik.
They do offer two interface choices out of the box: the Gnome "Java
Desktop", or CDE. Much though I detest Gnome, it's the more us
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