Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 2:56 AM, John Hodrien j.h.hodr...@leeds.ac.uk wrote: On Thu, 27 Jan 2011, Always Learning wrote: Thanks for the explanation. Now I know why locate never usually worked for me - it hadn't updated. find is fast, especially when I restrict the search paths. But locate is faster still, in all but the smallest of cases. I'd only tend to use find if I had reason to think that changes had made the locate database invalid. locate with a regexp is plain good and fast. Yeah, way back in yesteryear under UNIX, the find and the locate tools were part of one package. Under RHEL/CentOS, locate is in the mlocate package, and some folks making stripped servers rip it out to avoid storing the database. (Think embedded OS's and NFS hosted / and /var partitions.) One *does* have to remember the mlocate package's limitations. It doesn't browse network mounted directories, it doesn't browse /tmp or look for other excluded targets, and it runs with the nightly cron jobs. So if you're looking for files in /var/tmp/ or an NFS share, or files that were created an hour ago, well, it's back to find. I have found it very useful, when checking updates on a machine, to become root and run the updatedb command to get the mlocate database updated. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011, Nico Kadel-Garcia wrote: One *does* have to remember the mlocate package's limitations. It doesn't browse network mounted directories, it doesn't browse /tmp or look for other excluded targets, and it runs with the nightly cron jobs. So if you're looking for files in /var/tmp/ or an NFS share, or files that were created an hour ago, well, it's back to find. All configurable via /etc/updatedb.conf if your local needs differ. I have found it very useful, when checking updates on a machine, to become root and run the updatedb command to get the mlocate database updated. Sure. jh ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Fri, 2011-01-28 at 14:50 +, John Hodrien wrote: All configurable via /etc/updatedb.conf if your local needs differ. How does one remove it ? yum erase updated ? It is not present in any CRON. -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Always Learning wrote: On Fri, 2011-01-28 at 14:50 +, John Hodrien wrote: All configurable via /etc/updatedb.conf if your local needs differ. How does one remove it ? yum erase updated ? It is not present in any CRON. yes it is: /etc/cron.daily/mlocate.cron ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011, Always Learning wrote: On Fri, 2011-01-28 at 14:50 +, John Hodrien wrote: All configurable via /etc/updatedb.conf if your local needs differ. How does one remove it ? yum erase updated ? It is not present in any CRON. If it's installed, it should have a cron job here: /etc/cron.daily/mlocate.cron The package is called mlocate, as has already been mentioned in this thread. jh ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Always Learning wrote, On 01/28/2011 10:25 AM: On Fri, 2011-01-28 at 14:50 +, John Hodrien wrote: All configurable via /etc/updatedb.conf if your local needs differ. How does one remove it ? yum erase updated ? It is not present in any CRON. There is a new cron in town. :) It's name is anacron, and it runs beside|[in addition to] the old cron but with different config files. anacron has some neat features such as, if your box has been of for several days, then ~1 hour after it powers up any missed jobs get ran. /etc/cron.daily/mlocate.cron /etc/anacrontab /etc/updatedb.conf ls /etc/cron.* -- Todd Denniston Crane Division, Naval Surface Warfare Center (NSWC Crane) Harnessing the Power of Technology for the Warfighter ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Nico Kadel-Garcia wrote:
snip
One *does* have to remember the mlocate package's limitations. It
doesn't browse network mounted directories, it doesn't browse /tmp or
look for other excluded targets, and it runs with the nightly cron
jobs. So if you're looking for files in /var/tmp/ or an NFS share, or
files that were created an hour ago, well, it's back to find.
snip
It's not too hard to create auxilliary db's that index specific
directory trees, and to search them when you want eg, just recipies
from /home/food/recipies:
#! /bin/bash
export DBNAME=/usr/local/food/.locatedb
/bin/mv -v ${DBNAME} ${DBNAME}~
/usr/bin/updatedb --output=$DBNAME
--prunepaths='/usr/local/food/recipies/failed-experiments'
or something like that.
Then,
$ locate --database=/usr/local/food/.locatedb -i vanilla
Even better, in .bashrc add:
alias drool=locate --database=/usr/local/food/.locatedb -i
Then,
$ drool vanilla
--
Charles Polisher
___
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Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Fri, 2011-01-28 at 16:36 +0100, Nicolas Thierry-Mieg wrote: yes it is: /etc/cron.daily/mlocate.cron No trace. That is probably why it never worked for me. With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Fri, 2011-01-28 at 15:36 +, John Hodrien wrote: If it's installed, it should have a cron job here: /etc/cron.daily/mlocate.cron The package is called mlocate, as has already been mentioned in this thread. Appears not to have been installed. No trace of anything in /var/lib either. With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
updatedb is not a daemon or package. It's run by cron automatically in the night once you install slocate. Kai ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Always Learning wrote on Fri, 28 Jan 2011 16:18:26 +: Appears not to have been installed. No trace of anything in /var/lib either. It's not clear what you want to express. If you didn't install mlocate there will be no locate or updatedb, of course. Kai ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 11:31 AM, Kai Schaetzl mailli...@conactive.com wrote: updatedb is not a daemon or package. It's run by cron automatically in the night once you install slocate. Kai In CentOS 5.x, and RHEL 5.x, it's in the mlocate package. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 18:44 +1100, Les Bell wrote: Paul, if you want a basic explanation of the rationale behind the Linux Filesystem Hierarchy Standard, you might enjoy this article from a course I wrote years ago - it's a little dated, but still applicable today. http://www.lesbell.com.au/Home.nsf/web/What+Goes+Where+on+a+Linux+System?OpenDocument Thanks Les. Am reading it now. Although one does learn a lot by experimentation and intuition, there are always elements one misses which are essential to a good understanding of the subject. -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 1:01 AM, Always Learning cen...@g7.u22.net wrote: [...] .fs # /bin/bash find /data -iwholename *$1 find /ax -iwholename *$1 find /bx -iwholename *$1 find /cx -iwholename *$1 Obviously with the chmod +x. The last one makes searching times much faster when seeking non-operating system files. [...] Paul. England, EU. You may not be aware of the locate command? Nightly there is a job that runs (updatedb) that scans the disk and saves file locations. Locate searches this database instead of you have to do a 'find'. The only thing it won't get are files that were added since the last 'updatedb' run. You can run that whenever you want to update the db, or use find in those cases. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 10:55 PM, Always Learning cen...@g7.u22.net wrote: On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 14:25 -0800, Benjamin Smith wrote: On Tuesday, January 25, 2011 11:20:34 am Always Learning wrote: Then one day a big bad wolf called Oracle of very expensive Oracle SQL fame swallowed Red Hat, like they swallowed MySQL, Solaris, Open Office and Visual Box. The long term future for these is uncertain. Whaaa...? Facts would seem otherwise Here's an article from just a few months ago! http://www.glgroup.com/News/Oracle-to-Red-Hat--Its-Not-Your-Fathers-Linux- Market-Anymore-51058.html Thank you. Happily I got the 'swallowed Red Hat' wrong. Sadly the long term future for Red Hat, MySQL, Open Office and Visual Box is certainly uncertain. I've seen the changes in the computer world first-hand for 43 years staring when there were no screens, no keyboards and no disks although one installation, a KDF9, did have a magnetic drum. Everything changes. Computer companies and software change, evolve and then eventually disappear. It's 'computer evolution'. [...] Paul. England, EU. Why does Redhat keep getting thrown into the mix with MySQL, OO.org etc...? It's already been said here that Oracle did not buy and doesn't own anything related to Redhat. Oracle may have relaunched a competitor to Redhat Linux (they had to relaunch because, frankly, no one was using OHEL), but that's not the same at all as the situation with MySQL, OpenOffice, etc... They just don't belong in the same sentence. Oracle now owns Sun, which is the company that sponsored and ran those other projects. Oracle is now actively dismantling many of them. They've already killed a bunch, and the ones that seemed like they might be around for a while now also look somewhat shaky. Nothing is certain in any market, but Redhat is the 900lb gorilla in the Linux market, while Oracle has yet to make any significant inroads as an OS vendor. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 05:37:48AM +, Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 13:27 +0800, Christopher Chan wrote: Surely you mean stuff from the rising sun Illumos and OpenIndiana! Nope. Not convinced by what I read about them. Still have my unused Open Solaris disks from 2008.05 and my single CD of Red Hat Linux v.6 from 1999. :-) Well, FreeBSD is still free from corporate control and interference. jerry -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 09:58 -0500, Brian Mathis wrote: You may not be aware of the locate command? Nightly there is a job that runs (updatedb) that scans the disk and saves file locations. Locate searches this database instead of you have to do a 'find'. The only thing it won't get are files that were added since the last 'updatedb' run. You can run that whenever you want to update the db, or use find in those cases. Thanks for the explanation. Now I know why locate never usually worked for me - it hadn't updated. find is fast, especially when I restrict the search paths. -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Thu, 27 Jan 2011, Always Learning wrote: Thanks for the explanation. Now I know why locate never usually worked for me - it hadn't updated. find is fast, especially when I restrict the search paths. But locate is faster still, in all but the smallest of cases. I'd only tend to use find if I had reason to think that changes had made the locate database invalid. locate with a regexp is plain good and fast. jh ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
[CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
I persuaded a reluctant friend to buy a new computer. I enthusiastically extolled the joys and benefits of Centos and promised to install it on his new machine - dual booting with Micro$oft Windoze 7. His super-duper new laptop arrived. Acer, AMD 4 core, fast etc. but not as nice looking as my impressive HP DV5. The wireless refused to connect. After 8 hours on Saturday I could sometimes see hubs in the neighbourhood but could not connect to my own hub using WPA2. iwlist wlan0 scan produced technical details of local hubs - but still could not connect. NetworkManager sometimes froze. Spent many hours Googling for his wifi adaptor Altheros AR928K which uses a driver known as ATH9K. Many others have had a similar problem. Kernel 2.6.27 apparently includes this driver but Centos 5.5 is 2.6.18. On my Sony Vaio netbook I abandoned XP and installed Centos 5.5. No wifi (yet XP had) but luckily for me I eventually discovered the Altheros AR8132 needed ATL1E which, for Centos 5.5, means a kernel modification. Luckily it is on Elrepo as kmod-atl1e. A quick Yum and I was connected. Many thanks to Elrepo. The netbook comes to life with Centos. Its now a really usable machine. XP on a netbook was pure crap. However ATH9K for Centos 5.5 does not exist. This afternoon I had to tell my friend his brand new computer is incompatible with Centos and wifi. Please can anyone recommend a suitable Linux variant with a kernel = 2.6.27 that is a bit like Centos ? Does anyone know if Centos 5.6 will be on 2.6.18 and whether it will have drivers like ATH9K ? Anyone any idea what kernel version Centos 6 will have ? Thank you. Best regards, Paul GB Centos on 2 VPS, 2 desktops, 1 laptop and 1 netbook. Going cheap : genuine Windoze 95 and 98 installation disks :-) ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On 01/25/2011 09:49 AM, Always Learning wrote: I persuaded a reluctant friend to buy a new computer. I enthusiastically extolled the joys and benefits of Centos and promised to install it on his new machine - dual booting with Micro$oft Windoze 7. [...] For a new laptop your best hope for a successful native install is probably Ubuntu 10.10. Laptops in particular are difficult platforms for hardware support and CentOS5 is not 'cutting edge'. If you want CentOS on it to work well, you will probably need to wait for CentOS6 - which could be a month or two. An alternative I've used is to install VMware Workstation on top of Windows and install Linux into a VM. Running fullscreen the practical difference is nil. Then you by and large get the laptop hardware support gratis from the windows layer including things like wireless and video drivers drivers. -- Benjamin Franz ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Always Learning wrote: snip After 8 hours on Saturday I could sometimes see hubs in the neighbourhood but could not connect to my own hub using WPA2. iwlist wlan0 scan produced technical details of local hubs - but still could not connect. NetworkManager sometimes froze. Spent many hours Googling for his wifi adaptor Altheros AR928K which uses a driver known as ATH9K. Many others have had a similar problem. Kernel 2.6.27 apparently includes this driver but Centos 5.5 is 2.6.18. About 5 years ago, I had to install a wireless card in my tower, and it's an ATH9xx, I *think* - I can check this evening, if that's relevant. I was running SuSE, and had to find drivers from madwifi. A few minutes of googling found... http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/ath9k/RHEL5, where the module's been backported to RHEL5. mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 12:49 PM, Always Learning cen...@g7.u22.net wrote: I persuaded a reluctant friend to buy a new computer. I enthusiastically extolled the joys and benefits of Centos and promised to install it on his new machine - dual booting with Micro$oft Windoze 7. His super-duper new laptop arrived. Acer, AMD 4 core, fast etc. but not as nice looking as my impressive HP DV5. The wireless refused to connect. After 8 hours on Saturday I could sometimes see hubs in the neighbourhood but could not connect to my own hub using WPA2. iwlist wlan0 scan produced technical details of local hubs - but still could not connect. NetworkManager sometimes froze. Spent many hours Googling for his wifi adaptor Altheros AR928K which uses a driver known as ATH9K. Many others have had a similar problem. Kernel 2.6.27 apparently includes this driver but Centos 5.5 is 2.6.18. On my Sony Vaio netbook I abandoned XP and installed Centos 5.5. No wifi (yet XP had) but luckily for me I eventually discovered the Altheros AR8132 needed ATL1E which, for Centos 5.5, means a kernel modification. Luckily it is on Elrepo as kmod-atl1e. A quick Yum and I was connected. Many thanks to Elrepo. The netbook comes to life with Centos. Its now a really usable machine. XP on a netbook was pure crap. However ATH9K for Centos 5.5 does not exist. This afternoon I had to tell my friend his brand new computer is incompatible with Centos and wifi. Please can anyone recommend a suitable Linux variant with a kernel = 2.6.27 that is a bit like Centos ? Does anyone know if Centos 5.6 will be on 2.6.18 and whether it will have drivers like ATH9K ? Anyone any idea what kernel version Centos 6 will have ? Thank you. Best regards, Paul GB CentOS is great for servers, but absolutely not for a new person you're trying to get to try Linux. This approach actually hurts Linux since people think oh I tried Linux and it sucked. Ubuntu is the way to go for this, and I would at least start from a LiveCD (though it is slow) and work from there. VirtualBox is a good next step from the LiveCD, as almost no one wants to be dual-booting. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Mark wrote:- About 5 years ago, I had to install a wireless card in my tower, and it's an ATH9xx, I *think* - I can check this evening, if that's relevant. I was running SuSE, and had to find drivers from madwifi. A few minutes of googling found... http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/ath9k/RHEL5, where the module's been backported to RHEL5. Golly ! I'm a Linux novice (started last June). Can I literally install one of those rpm on the laptop and that should, hopefully, cure everything ? Thank you very much. I would prefer a Centos solution and then everything is the same O/S and simpler to maintain. Thank you. Best regards, Paul GB. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
At Tue, 25 Jan 2011 17:49:39 + CentOS mailing list centos@centos.org wrote: I persuaded a reluctant friend to buy a new computer. I enthusiastically extolled the joys and benefits of Centos and promised to install it on his new machine - dual booting with Micro$oft Windoze 7. His super-duper new laptop arrived. Acer, AMD 4 core, fast etc. but not as nice looking as my impressive HP DV5. The wireless refused to connect. After 8 hours on Saturday I could sometimes see hubs in the neighbourhood but could not connect to my own hub using WPA2. iwlist wlan0 scan produced technical details of local hubs - but still could not connect. NetworkManager sometimes froze. Spent many hours Googling for his wifi adaptor Altheros AR928K which uses a driver known as ATH9K. Many others have had a similar problem. Kernel 2.6.27 apparently includes this driver but Centos 5.5 is 2.6.18. On my Sony Vaio netbook I abandoned XP and installed Centos 5.5. No wifi (yet XP had) but luckily for me I eventually discovered the Altheros AR8132 needed ATL1E which, for Centos 5.5, means a kernel modification. Luckily it is on Elrepo as kmod-atl1e. A quick Yum and I was connected. Many thanks to Elrepo. The netbook comes to life with Centos. Its now a really usable machine. XP on a netbook was pure crap. However ATH9K for Centos 5.5 does not exist. This afternoon I had to tell my friend his brand new computer is incompatible with Centos and wifi. Please can anyone recommend a suitable Linux variant with a kernel = 2.6.27 that is a bit like Centos ? Hmm... For a hot new laptop, you are pretty much out-of-luck for something like CentOS. FC14 *might* work, but I don't know how stable or end-user friendly FC14 is. A current release of Ubuntu will likely work, but Ubuntu is not like CentOS -- its admin 'style' is a bit different -- things are in different places and the admin tools are different -- as a CentOS user / admin, you'll find them 'strange. OTOH, it is likely to be more newbie / end-user friendly and likely will work better with hot new hardware. Does anyone know if Centos 5.6 will be on 2.6.18 and whether it will have drivers like ATH9K ? CentOS 5.x will always have a 2.6.18 base kernel, but will have backported drivers and security fixes, etc. But probably not drivers for bleeding edge WiFi. Anyone any idea what kernel version Centos 6 will have ? Probably whatever Fedora Core 12 (?) has. Whether this will work on your friend's laptop is uncertain. Thank you. Best regards, Paul GB Centos on 2 VPS, 2 desktops, 1 laptop and 1 netbook. Going cheap : genuine Windoze 95 and 98 installation disks :-) ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos -- Robert Heller -- 978-544-6933 / hel...@deepsoft.com Deepwoods Software-- http://www.deepsoft.com/ () ascii ribbon campaign -- against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org -- against proprietary attachments ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Jerry Franz wrote: For a new laptop your best hope for a successful native install is probably Ubuntu 10.10. Laptops in particular are difficult platforms for hardware support and CentOS5 is not 'cutting edge'. If you want CentOS on it to work well, you will probably need to wait for CentOS6 - which could be a month or two. I'm eagerly waiting for Centos 6. Is so refreshingly nice to use a real computer operating system. It reminds me of the good old mainframe days long before MS-DOS 1. Thank you for the recommendation. I'll have a look at Ubuntu. Mark suggested http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/ath9k/RHEL5 which might solve the problem and produce a working Centos wifi. Centos is not 'cutting-edge'. It's just solid, reliable, plain boring and just works. Everything a good computer system should be. An alternative I've used is to install VMware Workstation on top of Windows and install Linux into a VM. Running fullscreen the practical difference is nil. Then you by and large get the laptop hardware support gratis from the windows layer including things like wireless and video drivers drivers. I'll keep that as a back-up option. Thank you very much. Best regards, Paul. GB. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Always Learning wrote: Mark wrote:- About 5 years ago, I had to install a wireless card in my tower, and it's an ATH9xx, I *think* - I can check this evening, if that's relevant. I was running SuSE, and had to find drivers from madwifi. A few minutes of googling found... http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/ath9k/RHEL5, where the module's been backported to RHEL5. Golly ! I'm a Linux novice (started last June). Can I literally install one of those rpm on the laptop and that should, hopefully, cure everything ? One should hope. An rpm - R(edhat)P(ackage)M(anager) are packages of files, with configuration, etc, run during the install, meaning you should only need minor tweaks, if at all, to the configuration files to have them go. Kernel modules, AFAIK, during the install, are usually autoconfigured to load. Thank you very much. I would prefer a Centos solution and then everything is the same O/S and simpler to maintain. You do understand the relationship of CentOS to RHEL, right? mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Brian Mathis wrote: CentOS is great for servers, I agree. I have 2 VPS and two desktop servers on it. but absolutely not for a new person you're trying to get to try Linux. This approach actually hurts Linux since people think oh I tried Linux and it sucked. The only thing that 'sucks' is M$ Windoze. M$ is declining. It is time the European Commission breaks the Windoze on every new computer cartel. With 43 years computer experience I loath Windoze and the horrible experience of trying to make what should be a very simple configuration change. Most of the world uses Linux. I started as a new Linux user with Centos and it was a very step learning curve but I persevered and benefited from the experience. Ubuntu is the way to go for this, and I would at least start from a LiveCD (though it is slow) and work from there. VirtualBox is a good next step from the LiveCD, as almost no one wants to be dual-booting. Thanks for the Ubuntu recommendation. I tend to buy the DVD's and install from them. I have VBox running Win98SE on a Centos desktop because I want to run software and applications from 1992 (my own DOS Cobol database) which also runs in DosBox, 1993 (my customised Ami Pro 3) and 1999 (Acrobat Exchange 4) easier than PDFedit. With best regards, Paul. GB. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On 1/25/2011 12:18 PM, Always Learning wrote: An alternative I've used is to install VMware Workstation on top of Windows and install Linux into a VM. Running fullscreen the practical difference is nil. Then you by and large get the laptop hardware support gratis from the windows layer including things like wireless and video drivers drivers. I'll keep that as a back-up option. I've forgotten how I did it now (and searching for a current reference would be better anyway) but my laptop has a bootable ubuntu partition (because Centos didn't see the wireless card) that I can also run under vmware player without rebooting. And I also have a Centos VM in an image file. The VMs use NAT networking and piggyback on whatever connect the host has. I think I installed vmware server to configure things, then removed it and installed player, but that might not be necessary with the current version of player. I don't think you can match windows sleep mode on Centos - not sure about current Ubuntu. I normally just close the lid with applications open, and when I open it again it wakes up in seconds and adapts to the current network connection. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Always Learning wrote: snip Thanks for the Ubuntu recommendation. I tend to buy the DVD's and install from them. I have VBox running Win98SE on a Centos desktop because I want to run software and applications from 1992 (my own DOS Cobol database) which also runs in DosBox, 1993 (my customised Ami Pro Why not install gcc, and recompile your COBOL for Linux? g snip mark, pulling a brown paper bag over his head before admitting to having written a *lot* of COBOL back before I got to Unix ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Mark Roth wrote: You do understand the relationship of CentOS to RHEL, right? Right :-) Once upon a time Red Hat was free. Then they decided to exist purely on support fees. Meanwhile a bunch of supporters invented a downstream variant called Centos. They worked very hard to remove all the Red Hat branding and recompile (is that the correct Linux term?) the software. There was so ugly goings on which were publicised but eventually resolved. The other downstream variant is called Scientific Linux and that is a joint collaboration between Europe's CERN and it's USA equivalent Fermilab. Then one day a big bad wolf called Oracle of very expensive Oracle SQL fame swallowed Red Hat, like they swallowed MySQL, Solaris, Open Office and Visual Box. The long term future for these is uncertain. Pure Centos is identical to Red Hat. However various repositories offer extras and variants which make the installed Centos slightly different from Red Hat. One can sometimes install some Fedora items into Centos. Centos is great. Will that do ? -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Chiming in I find CentOs VERY stable. I need this for my User community (Wife and Daughter) It has to look and work the same always. For the new people to Linux I've noted that NT admins can very easily install ubuntu and get it running (for awhile). From what I remember it had a Windozie feel. Coming from the Solaris, AIX, and HP world I prefer stability. -- Thanks, Gene Brandt SCSA 8625 Carriage Road River Ridge, LA 70123 home 504-737-4295 cell 504-452-3250 Family Web Page | My Web Page | LinkedIn | Facebook | Resumebucket On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 19:20 +, Always Learning wrote: Mark Roth wrote: You do understand the relationship of CentOS to RHEL, right? Right :-) Once upon a time Red Hat was free. Then they decided to exist purely on support fees. Meanwhile a bunch of supporters invented a downstream variant called Centos. They worked very hard to remove all the Red Hat branding and recompile (is that the correct Linux term?) the software. There was so ugly goings on which were publicised but eventually resolved. The other downstream variant is called Scientific Linux and that is a joint collaboration between Europe's CERN and it's USA equivalent Fermilab. Then one day a big bad wolf called Oracle of very expensive Oracle SQL fame swallowed Red Hat, like they swallowed MySQL, Solaris, Open Office and Visual Box. The long term future for these is uncertain. Pure Centos is identical to Red Hat. However various repositories offer extras and variants which make the installed Centos slightly different from Red Hat. One can sometimes install some Fedora items into Centos. Centos is great. Will that do ? ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
For years, I've been using Fedora Core for my desktop/laptop systems and CentOS for my servers. It's a good balance, because upgrading Fedora Core takes about an hour or so, plus a day or two of occasional interruptions to shake out various drivers and stuff. Also, I don't have to keep two different Operating Systems sorted out On my hard disk, I have my /home, /boot, and / directories each on their own partitions, and when I'm upgrading my Fedora, I just format / and /boot, and leave /home alone. Although I've transfered it a few times between hard disk and computer upgrades, I've been using the same /home directory for well over 10 years now, with nary a hitch! Make sure you have backups, etc., especially when upgrading versions, though I've not had much problem. Fedora Core is cutting edge and had no particular trouble shaking out drivers on my recent Dell Precision M4500. -Ben On Tuesday, January 25, 2011 09:49:39 am Always Learning wrote: I persuaded a reluctant friend to buy a new computer. I enthusiastically extolled the joys and benefits of Centos and promised to install it on his new machine - dual booting with Micro$oft Windoze 7. His super-duper new laptop arrived. Acer, AMD 4 core, fast etc. but not as nice looking as my impressive HP DV5. The wireless refused to connect. After 8 hours on Saturday I could sometimes see hubs in the neighbourhood but could not connect to my own hub using WPA2. iwlist wlan0 scan produced technical details of local hubs - but still could not connect. NetworkManager sometimes froze. Spent many hours Googling for his wifi adaptor Altheros AR928K which uses a driver known as ATH9K. Many others have had a similar problem. Kernel 2.6.27 apparently includes this driver but Centos 5.5 is 2.6.18. On my Sony Vaio netbook I abandoned XP and installed Centos 5.5. No wifi (yet XP had) but luckily for me I eventually discovered the Altheros AR8132 needed ATL1E which, for Centos 5.5, means a kernel modification. Luckily it is on Elrepo as kmod-atl1e. A quick Yum and I was connected. Many thanks to Elrepo. The netbook comes to life with Centos. Its now a really usable machine. XP on a netbook was pure crap. However ATH9K for Centos 5.5 does not exist. This afternoon I had to tell my friend his brand new computer is incompatible with Centos and wifi. Please can anyone recommend a suitable Linux variant with a kernel = 2.6.27 that is a bit like Centos ? Does anyone know if Centos 5.6 will be on 2.6.18 and whether it will have drivers like ATH9K ? Anyone any idea what kernel version Centos 6 will have ? Thank you. Best regards, Paul GB Centos on 2 VPS, 2 desktops, 1 laptop and 1 netbook. Going cheap : genuine Windoze 95 and 98 installation disks :-) ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Always Learning wrote: Mark Roth wrote: You do understand the relationship of CentOS to RHEL, right? Right :-) Once upon a time Red Hat was free. Then they decided to exist purely on Actually, you were supposed to buy the CDs, which I did (I really suppose I can get rid of my 5.2, 6, 7, 7.1, 7.2, and 7.3 CDs g). They weren't expensive. However, after 9 (shrike), they'd already become the distro of choice for business use in the US (it was SuSE in Europe), and they rebranded their main branch Red Hat Enterprise Linux, to make PHB's feel warm and fuzzy. support fees. Meanwhile a bunch of supporters invented a downstream variant called Centos. They worked very hard to remove all the Red Hat branding and recompile (is that the correct Linux term?) the software. Yes, you compile *real* software g. My description is they file off the serial numbers (and remove the proprietary stuff), then rebuild the whole shebang. There was so ugly goings on which were publicised but eventually resolved. The other downstream variant is called Scientific Linux and that is a joint collaboration between Europe's CERN and it's USA equivalent Fermilab. No, Fermilab and -its-* equivalent, CERN. Then one day a big bad wolf called Oracle of very expensive Oracle SQL fame swallowed Red Hat, like they swallowed MySQL, Solaris, Open Office and Visual Box. The long term future for these is uncertain. Um, no, not sure where you got that. Oracle bought a license, or something, from RH, and rebranded it, with changes as a VAR, Oracle Unbreakable Linux. RH is still its* company, not owned by Oracle in any way. Pure Centos is identical to Red Hat. However various repositories offer extras and variants which make the installed Centos slightly different from Red Hat. One can sometimes install some Fedora items into Centos. Yup on the latter, but mostly older fedora, which is bleeding edge. snip mark * These notes brought to you in behalf of the Professional Organization of English Majors, who want to remind you that it's == it is, and is not the possessive whatchamacallit, its, as in it's got a shoe on its foot. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Benjamin Smith wrote: snip On my hard disk, I have my /home, /boot, and / directories each on their own partitions, and when I'm upgrading my Fedora, I just format / and /boot, and leave /home alone. Although I've transfered it a few times between hard snip Yep. ALWAYS have /home on its own partition. You *might* want /opt on its own, also. For more on my views on this, here's my copy of the article I had published a few years ago in SysAdmin (now defunct, unfortunately) http://24.5-cent.us/upgrading_linux.doc mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, 25 Jan 2011, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: To: CentOS mailing list centos@centos.org From: m.r...@5-cent.us Subject: Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster Always Learning wrote: snip After 8 hours on Saturday I could sometimes see hubs in the neighbourhood but could not connect to my own hub using WPA2. iwlist wlan0 scan produced technical details of local hubs - but still could not connect. NetworkManager sometimes froze. Spent many hours Googling for his wifi adaptor Altheros AR928K which uses a driver known as ATH9K. Many others have had a similar problem. Kernel 2.6.27 apparently includes this driver but Centos 5.5 is 2.6.18. I came from Fedora 10 to Centos, and the learning curve was basically a flat line. Using Centos is like stepping back in time to FC8 for me. So I recommend Fedora as it's cutting edge, and I had no major problems apart from not being able to print from Java apps - but that got sorted a long time ago AFAIR. Kind Regards, Keith - Websites: http://www.karsites.net http://www.php-debuggers.net http://www.raised-from-the-dead.org.uk All email addresses are challenge-response protected with TMDA [http://tmda.net] - ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 2:27 PM, Gene Brandt bran...@bellsouth.net wrote: Chiming in I find CentOs VERY stable. I need this for my User community (Wife and Daughter) It has to look and work the same always. For the new people to Linux I've noted that NT admins can very easily install ubuntu and get it running (for awhile). From what I remember it had a Windozie feel. Coming from the Solaris, AIX, and HP world I prefer stability. -- Thanks, Gene Brandt SCSA I need to call you on this one. Windozie (implying some kind of decent user interface) and stability are not mutually exclusive, as your comment suggests. In the old days you may have had to choose, but that's long past. Windows 7 is very stable, as is Mac OS X. This is the type of false dichotomy that a certain US-based news network (rhymes with Blox Fews) uses to misinform a naive public. Please don't bring that kind of logic into tech discussions. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Where did I say that! From what I remember it had a Windozie feel In MY opinion ( only an opinion) Winblows will never be stable. -- Thanks, Gene Brandt SCSA 8625 Carriage Road River Ridge, LA 70123 home 504-737-4295 cell 504-452-3250 Family Web Page | My Web Page | LinkedIn | Facebook | Resumebucket On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 15:04 -0500, Brian Mathis wrote: On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 2:27 PM, Gene Brandt bran...@bellsouth.net wrote: Chiming in I find CentOs VERY stable. I need this for my User community (Wife and Daughter) It has to look and work the same always. For the new people to Linux I've noted that NT admins can very easily install ubuntu and get it running (for awhile). From what I remember it had a Windozie feel. Coming from the Solaris, AIX, and HP world I prefer stability. -- Thanks, Gene Brandt SCSA I need to call you on this one. Windozie (implying some kind of decent user interface) and stability are not mutually exclusive, as your comment suggests. In the old days you may have had to choose, but that's long past. Windows 7 is very stable, as is Mac OS X. This is the type of false dichotomy that a certain US-based news network (rhymes with Blox Fews) uses to misinform a naive public. Please don't bring that kind of logic into tech discussions. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
At Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:45:44 -0500 CentOS mailing list centos@centos.org wrote: Always Learning wrote: Mark Roth wrote: You do understand the relationship of CentOS to RHEL, right? Right :-) Once upon a time Red Hat was free. Then they decided to exist purely on Actually, you were supposed to buy the CDs, which I did (I really suppose I can get rid of my 5.2, 6, 7, 7.1, 7.2, and 7.3 CDs g). They weren't expensive. However, after 9 (shrike), they'd already become the distro of choice for business use in the US (it was SuSE in Europe), and they rebranded their main branch Red Hat Enterprise Linux, to make PHB's feel warm and fuzzy. support fees. Meanwhile a bunch of supporters invented a downstream variant called Centos. They worked very hard to remove all the Red Hat branding and recompile (is that the correct Linux term?) the software. Yes, you compile *real* software g. My description is they file off the serial numbers (and remove the proprietary stuff), then rebuild the whole shebang. There was so ugly goings on which were publicised but eventually resolved. The other downstream variant is called Scientific Linux and that is a joint collaboration between Europe's CERN and it's USA equivalent Fermilab. No, Fermilab and -its-* equivalent, CERN. Then one day a big bad wolf called Oracle of very expensive Oracle SQL fame swallowed Red Hat, like they swallowed MySQL, Solaris, Open Office and Visual Box. The long term future for these is uncertain. Um, no, not sure where you got that. Oracle bought a license, or something, from RH, and rebranded it, with changes as a VAR, Oracle Unbreakable Linux. RH is still its* company, not owned by Oracle in any way. Right. Oracle bought *Sun Microsystems*. (Sun Microsystems had come onto 'hard times'.) Sun Microsystems owned the Solaris O/S (originally SunOS), and provided the major support for MySQL and Open Office. Now Oracle owns the Solaris O/S and is in the position of providing major support for MySQL and Open Office. Since MySQL is a nominal Open Source 'competitor' of Oracle's (closed source) DB, it is uncertain what Oracle will do with MySQL (or what the MySQL developers will do, etc.). Oracle's owner is just as much anti-Microsoft as the former owner/founder of Sun Microsystems, so it is likely that Oracle will continue to support Open Office (if only as a anti-Microsoft gesture). Pure Centos is identical to Red Hat. However various repositories offer extras and variants which make the installed Centos slightly different from Red Hat. One can sometimes install some Fedora items into Centos. Yup on the latter, but mostly older fedora, which is bleeding edge. snip mark * These notes brought to you in behalf of the Professional Organization of English Majors, who want to remind you that it's == it is, and is not the possessive whatchamacallit, its, as in it's got a shoe on its foot. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos -- Robert Heller -- 978-544-6933 / hel...@deepsoft.com Deepwoods Software-- http://www.deepsoft.com/ () ascii ribbon campaign -- against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org -- against proprietary attachments ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Any version of Windows is stable - its only when ppl start adding the pretty butterfly screen savers, or open email attachments that things go wrong. It is very vulnerable, especially IE, but with a little education, preventive steps, and decent backups, the majority of businesses in the world that use it manage fine.. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Gene Brandt wrote: On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 15:04 -0500, Brian Mathis wrote: On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 2:27 PM, Gene Brandt bran...@bellsouth.net wrote: Chiming in I find CentOs VERY stable. I need this for my User community (Wife and Daughter) It has to look and work the same always. For the new people to Linux I've noted that NT admins can very easily install ubuntu and get it running (for awhile). From what I remember it had a Windozie feel. Coming from the Solaris, AIX, and HP world I prefer stability. I need to call you on this one. Windozie (implying some kind of decent user interface) and stability are not mutually exclusive, as your comment suggests. In the old days you may have had to choose, but that's long past. Windows 7 is very stable, as is Mac OS X. This is the type of false dichotomy that a certain US-based news network (rhymes with Blox Fews) uses to misinform a naive public. Please don't bring that kind of logic into tech discussions. Where did I say that! From what I remember it had a Windozie feel In MY opinion ( only an opinion) Winblows will never be stable. I've got 7 on my work laptop, and my lady's got Vista at home. I *despise* both of them: they do their best to hide what you need to do, if it's anything other than looking at pictures, playing music, email, and web. And, IMO, part of the time they have problems with that. We won't even *begin* to talk about how the work laptop is so locked down that even wtih a local admin account, I can't do almost anything mark, yes, I do loathe WinDoze ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
compdoc wrote: Any version of Windows is stable - its only when ppl start adding the pretty butterfly screen savers, or open email attachments that things go wrong. It is very vulnerable, especially IE, but with a little education, preventive steps, and decent backups, the majority of businesses in the world that use it manage fine.. Hah. Hah. And hah. Feel free to talk to me offlist about what I went through, for example, to use a barcode scanner, or to install ocsinventory. mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On 01/25/2011 03:04 PM, Brian Mathis wrote: I need to call you on this one. Windozie (implying some kind of decent user interface) and stability are not mutually exclusive, as your comment suggests. In the old days you may have had to choose, but that's long past. Windows 7 is very stable, as is Mac OS X. This is the type of false dichotomy that a certain US-based news network (rhymes with Blox Fews) uses to misinform a naive public. Please don't bring that kind of logic into tech discussions. I have to agree here as well. Too many times do I see people just blasting other operating systems for these reasons. I'd even go as far as argue that Windows XP is stable too, so long as it's managed, administered, and setup securely and correctly. I don't notice any more crashes on the Ubuntu systems I have set up, compared to those of CentOS/RHEL, or to even Windows XP and 7 systems. And I administer all of the above in the same network. People mix these perceptions up all to frequently, or personally because I simply believe they like to bash other operating systems that they don't like or want to use. Just my 0.02 cents. Regards, Max ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Windows CAN be plenty stable... I used a very stable windows box just like this one this morning! http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=19991001 On Jan 25, 2011, at 12:23 PM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: compdoc wrote: Any version of Windows is stable - its only when ppl start adding the pretty butterfly screen savers, or open email attachments that things go wrong. It is very vulnerable, especially IE, but with a little education, preventive steps, and decent backups, the majority of businesses in the world that use it manage fine.. Hah. Hah. And hah. Feel free to talk to me offlist about what I went through, for example, to use a barcode scanner, or to install ocsinventory. mark -- Don Krause This message represents the official view of the voices in my head. smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
I do IT for local businesses in Denver. I build workstations and servers, do hardware upgrades, networking, VPNs, firewalls, virtual machines - anything a business might need. Windows and linux. Any tech worth his salt will have learned how windows works and how to repair it. It is possible to repair. Same is true of any Linux technician. My first 'real' computer was a Fat Mac, so I still love a good GUI. And Windows has a nice GUI. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tuesday, January 25, 2011 12:21:35 pm m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: I've got 7 on my work laptop, and my lady's got Vista at home. I *despise* both of them: they do their best to hide what you need to do, if it's anything other than looking at pictures, playing music, email, and web. And, IMO, part of the time they have problems with that. We won't even *begin* to talk about how the work laptop is so locked down that even wtih a local admin account, I can't do almost anything mark, yes, I do loathe WinDoze When did this become a Windows discussion list? Sure, I loathe Windows, too. (until I want to play a game!) But I'm not here to read about Windows' many faults -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Max Hetrick wrote: On 01/25/2011 03:04 PM, Brian Mathis wrote: I need to call you on this one. Windozie (implying some kind of decent user interface) and stability are not mutually exclusive, as your comment suggests. In the old days you may have had to choose, but that's long past. Windows 7 is very stable, as is Mac OS X. This is the type of false dichotomy that a certain US-based news network (rhymes with Blox Fews) uses to misinform a naive public. Please don't bring that kind of logic into tech discussions. I have to agree here as well. Too many times do I see people just blasting other operating systems for these reasons. I'd even go as far as argue that Windows XP is stable too, so long as it's managed, administered, and setup securely and correctly. So what happens when one does the monthly tuesday patches for windoze and your security door controller running on SQLserver (micro$oft) fails. Back out all the patches - inform micro$oft - wait - wait some more - never get a response - call the security software vendor - aware of patch problem - no fix planned - buy the newest version. All this on a stable windoze XP prof. Dell box. that's all that matters. I don't notice any more crashes on the Ubuntu systems I have set up, compared to those of CentOS/RHEL, or to even Windows XP and 7 systems. And I administer all of the above in the same network. People mix these perceptions up all to frequently, or personally because I simply believe they like to bash other operating systems that they don't like or want to use. Just my 0.02 cents. Regards, Max ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos attachment: rkampen.vcf___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 11:45 AM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: : * These notes brought to you in behalf of the Professional Organization of English Majors, who want to remind you that it's == it is, and is not the possessive whatchamacallit, its, as in it's got a shoe on its foot. So, it is got a shoe on its foot? Hmm :-) ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Mark wrote: On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 11:45 AM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: : * These notes brought to you in behalf of the Professional Organization of English Majors, who want to remind you that it's == it is, and is not the possessive whatchamacallit, its, as in it's got a shoe on its foot. So, it is got a shoe on its foot? Hmm Right, but I wasn't the English major, y'know It can also be it has. mark defeet went over defence before detail ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
compdoc wrote: snip My first 'real' computer was a Fat Mac, so I still love a good GUI. And Windows has a nice GUI. Windows was ok. Oh, sorry, Windows 3.x. One reason I dispise Window (post 3.x) is the incredibly stupid design decision to put the GUI into ring 0. Something goes wrong with the GUI, you're toast. Win 3.x, *Nix (including OS X), oh, well, restart the GUI. And because it's all in there, lessee, I just read the other week that an average laptop these days has the processing power of a mid-nineties Cray supercomputer... and they run like an 8088 (ok, maybe an 80286), just for all the eye candy: style, not content. mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On 1/25/2011 2:49 PM, Rob Kampen wrote: So what happens when one does the monthly tuesday patches for windoze and your security door controller running on SQLserver (micro$oft) fails. Back out all the patches - inform micro$oft - wait - wait some more - never get a response - call the security software vendor - aware of patch problem - no fix planned - buy the newest version. All this on a stable windoze XP prof. Dell box. that's all that matters. Running XP as a server??? You do know there are Windows server products, right? -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com wrote: Running XP as a server??? There are lots of bloatware Windows products which use MS SQL server as an embedded database, Les. My personal favourite was the software for a TV tuner card (Pinnacle) which used SQL Server to store its program schedule. Bloatware of the first order, and unstable as hell, too. Meanwhile, for those who a spot of schadenfreude: http://failblog.org/2011/01/25/m-thru-f-why-so-blue/ Best, --- Les Bell [http://www.lesbell.com.au] Tel: +61 2 9451 1144 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 16:01 -0500, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: processing power of a mid-nineties Cray supercomputer... and they run like an 8088 (ok, maybe an 80286), just for all the eye candy: style, not content. Give me the good old 6502 any day and its mainframe predecessor with a 36 bit word which was 4 Ascii or 6 BCD characters. -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Les Bell wrote: Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com wrote: Running XP as a server??? There are lots of bloatware Windows products which use MS SQL server as an embedded database, Les. My personal favourite was the software for a TV tuner card (Pinnacle) which used SQL Server to store its program schedule. Bloatware of the first order, and unstable as hell, too. Meanwhile, for those who a spot of schadenfreude: http://failblog.org/2011/01/25/m-thru-f-why-so-blue/ Heh. About 10 years ago, in Chicago, there's this huge screen diagonlly on a corner over a restaurant... and it was BSoD, for a while mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tuesday, January 25, 2011 01:45:34 pm Always Learning wrote: Give me the good old 6502 any day and its mainframe predecessor with a 36 bit word which was 4 Ascii or 6 BCD characters. http://www.6502.org/tools/emu/ Done? -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On 01/25/2011 03:49 PM, Rob Kampen wrote: So what happens when one does the monthly tuesday patches for windoze and your security door controller running on SQLserver (micro$oft) fails. Back out all the patches - inform micro$oft - wait - wait some more - never get a response - call the security software vendor - aware of patch problem - no fix planned - buy the newest version. All this on a stable windoze XP prof. Dell box. that's all that matters. Windows aside, my point was that I see it far to often from people that just because something is pretty or has the windozie feel, they automatically dismiss it as a non-stable product. Take Ubuntu for example, it has the prettiness and all the GUI tools, which is what attracts desktop users, but then you have those that say it's not stable and is too cutting edge because of that reason. I personally don't find it to be the case, but that's my experience with working with it. Every OS has an application, it depends on what you're trying to accomplish. Running CentOS for normal user desktops didn't yield good results for me, where Ubuntu did and fit that purpose. Or running Windows XP as a server, where a Windows Server 2003/2008 instance should be. A lot of it is decision making for what is trying to be done. Too many are narrow minded about this kind of stuff, because they don't want to work with something different, or with what is out of their comfort zone. My point was to not fall into that mind frame of GUI is bad or bleeding edge and doesn't work, and therefor is automatic crap. That is certainly not the case. I've seen GUI tools be refused to be used simply because they are GUI tools, and to me that's not 2011 type thinking. Personally, I run CentOS on my laptop. I also like all the guifications, so I spend lots of time setting that GUI pretty feel up for myself. Since my employer runs a lot of RHEL/CentOS on servers, I want and like to have a system similar to use, but I also like my desktop eye candy too. But I also run Ubuntu, SuSE, and Windows. If systems are properly applied to the appropriate applications, and set up and managed correctly, then I don't have problems running many kinds of operating systems. I don't fall victim to the religion of one operating system, I use many kinds to get my job done that I'm paid to do. Again, just my 0.02 cents as I was backing Brian's comments about the divide between thinking nice user interface can't be said in the same sentence as a stable platform to use. Regards, Max ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tuesday, January 25, 2011 11:20:34 am Always Learning wrote: Then one day a big bad wolf called Oracle of very expensive Oracle SQL fame swallowed Red Hat, like they swallowed MySQL, Solaris, Open Office and Visual Box. The long term future for these is uncertain. Whaaa...? Facts would seem otherwise Here's an article from just a few months ago! http://www.glgroup.com/News/Oracle-to-Red-Hat--Its-Not-Your-Fathers-Linux- Market-Anymore-51058.html -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 14:25 -0800, Benjamin Smith wrote: On Tuesday, January 25, 2011 11:20:34 am Always Learning wrote: Then one day a big bad wolf called Oracle of very expensive Oracle SQL fame swallowed Red Hat, like they swallowed MySQL, Solaris, Open Office and Visual Box. The long term future for these is uncertain. Whaaa...? Facts would seem otherwise Here's an article from just a few months ago! http://www.glgroup.com/News/Oracle-to-Red-Hat--Its-Not-Your-Fathers-Linux- Market-Anymore-51058.html Thank you. Happily I got the 'swallowed Red Hat' wrong. Sadly the long term future for Red Hat, MySQL, Open Office and Visual Box is certainly uncertain. I've seen the changes in the computer world first-hand for 43 years staring when there were no screens, no keyboards and no disks although one installation, a KDF9, did have a magnetic drum. Everything changes. Computer companies and software change, evolve and then eventually disappear. It's 'computer evolution'. What is noticeable is the vast number of organisations failing to use computers properly - not extracting the maximum benefit from their computer systems and running incompatible systems which can not exchange basic data. In the UK in 2011 A.D. local authorities (councils) and the territorial police forces operate this way. Despite vast computer budgets, and a supporting bureaucracy which includes computer managers lacking any of the skills possessed by participants on this mailing list, important decisions appear to be made by morons usually assisted by consultants whose shinny shoes and expensive suits are much more conspicuous than technical acumen. Gone are the days when an in-house team of programmers and analysts would design and code customised programmes that fully satisfied the business needs of the organisations. The intelligence services and scientific research are exceptions. In the commercial sphere it is M$ and Oracle applications (especially Oracle Financials) plus proprietary software from third parties. The number of 'computer experts' that know only how to press the correct key in a M$ application yet lack any appreciation of how computer systems work or the logic behind them is increasing. Linux, the BSDs and Solaris continue the good tradition of 'real' computing while expensive Apple demonstrates how good Windoze could be if M$ really tried. Will we one day be dependent on open source Chinese Linux if Western open source Linux dries-up ? -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 13:12 -0500, Robert Heller wrote: At Tue, 25 Jan 2011 17:49:39 + CentOS mailing list centos@centos.org wrote: Anyone any idea what kernel version Centos 6 will have ? Probably whatever Fedora Core 12 (?) has. Whether this will work on your friend's laptop is uncertain. 2.6.31 Linux kernel, Kernel 2.6.32 was pushed to updates repository on 27 February 2010 But no Gnome 3 just 2.28 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fedora_%28operating_system%29#Fedora_12 -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Quoting Always Learning cen...@g7.u22.net: On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 13:12 -0500, Robert Heller wrote: At Tue, 25 Jan 2011 17:49:39 + CentOS mailing list centos@centos.org wrote: Anyone any idea what kernel version Centos 6 will have ? My RHEL 6 machine (fully updated) has kernel 2.6.32-71.14.1. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 13:46 -0500, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: Always Learning wrote: snip Thanks for the Ubuntu recommendation. I tend to buy the DVD's and install from them. I have VBox running Win98SE on a Centos desktop because I want to run software and applications from 1992 (my own DOS Cobol database) which also runs in DosBox, 1993 (my customised Ami Pro Why not install gcc, and recompile your COBOL for Linux? g snip mark, pulling a brown paper bag over his head before admitting to having written a *lot* of COBOL back before I got to Unix Years ago, before I discovered PHP, I might have. Cobol was the second language I leaned in 1967 from a hardware manufacturer's tutor who didn't have a clue. The first was Easycoder (an assembler type) which I loved. Having used Cobol for 30+ years and remembering it with some affection and also remembering a Schiphol airport programmer's 15 page compound IF statement (Hallo Hans! 60 coding lines a page; GO TO was banned) it is a bit long-winded. These days I prefer PHP with the fast MySQL databases. -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wednesday, January 26, 2011 05:24 AM, Les Mikesell wrote: On 1/25/2011 2:49 PM, Rob Kampen wrote: So what happens when one does the monthly tuesday patches for windoze and your security door controller running on SQLserver (micro$oft) fails. Back out all the patches - inform micro$oft - wait - wait some more - never get a response - call the security software vendor - aware of patch problem - no fix planned - buy the newest version. All this on a stable windoze XP prof. Dell box. that's all that matters. Running XP as a server??? You do know there are Windows server products, right? Bah, just hack XP to enable the stuff on Windows 2003 Server. :p ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wednesday, January 26, 2011 11:55 AM, Always Learning wrote: On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 14:25 -0800, Benjamin Smith wrote: On Tuesday, January 25, 2011 11:20:34 am Always Learning wrote: Then one day a big bad wolf called Oracle of very expensive Oracle SQL fame swallowed Red Hat, like they swallowed MySQL, Solaris, Open Office and Visual Box. The long term future for these is uncertain. Whaaa...? Facts would seem otherwise Here's an article from just a few months ago! http://www.glgroup.com/News/Oracle-to-Red-Hat--Its-Not-Your-Fathers-Linux- Market-Anymore-51058.html Thank you. Happily I got the 'swallowed Red Hat' wrong. Sadly the long term future for Red Hat, MySQL, Open Office and Visual Box is certainly uncertain. Ah, I get your drift! Illumos and OpenIndiana is the way to go! Will we one day be dependent on open source Chinese Linux if Western open source Linux dries-up ? ??? Surely you mean stuff from the rising sun Illumos and OpenIndiana! ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On 01/25/11 8:49 PM, Always Learning wrote: Cobol was the second language I leaned in 1967 from a hardware manufacturer's tutor who didn't have a clue. The first was Easycoder (an assembler type) which I loved. do you mean autocoder? that was the 'assembler' on the IBM 1400 series ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wednesday, January 26, 2011 12:41 PM, Barry Brimer wrote: Quoting Always Learningcen...@g7.u22.net: On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 13:12 -0500, Robert Heller wrote: At Tue, 25 Jan 2011 17:49:39 + CentOS mailing listcentos@centos.org wrote: Anyone any idea what kernel version Centos 6 will have ? My RHEL 6 machine (fully updated) has kernel 2.6.32-71.14.1. Alright, that's it, I want Centos 6 now! ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 13:27 +0800, Christopher Chan wrote: Surely you mean stuff from the rising sun Illumos and OpenIndiana! Nope. Not convinced by what I read about them. Still have my unused Open Solaris disks from 2008.05 and my single CD of Red Hat Linux v.6 from 1999. :-) -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 21:29 -0800, John R Pierce wrote: On 01/25/11 8:49 PM, Always Learning wrote: Cobol was the second language I leaned in 1967 from a hardware manufacturer's tutor who didn't have a clue. The first was Easycoder (an assembler type) which I loved. do you mean autocoder? that was the 'assembler' on the IBM 1400 series You're right about Autocoder being on IBM. I remember it mentioned a lot at the time. Easycoder was a Honeywell product and used on the H-200, H-120, H-125, H-1250 etc. In those days we had 'core' memory which really was magnetic cores with wires passing through the cores. A H-120 I worked on has a massive 32K of memory and it took 1 hour to do a Cobol compilation. -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 13:29 +0800, Christopher Chan wrote: On Wednesday, January 26, 2011 12:41 PM, Barry Brimer wrote: My RHEL 6 machine (fully updated) has kernel 2.6.32-71.14.1. Alright, that's it, I want Centos 6 now! Me too. Yes please Mr Centos. -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 14:49 -0500, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: Benjamin Smith wrote: On my hard disk, I have my /home, /boot, and / directories each on their own partitions, and when I'm upgrading my Fedora, I just format / and /boot, and leave /home alone. Although I've transfered it a few times between hard Yep. ALWAYS have /home on its own partition. You *might* want /opt on its own, also. For more on my views on this, here's my copy of the article I had published a few years ago in SysAdmin (now defunct, unfortunately) http://24.5-cent.us/upgrading_linux.doc Thanks for the good advice. I wondered why the installer gave those choices. Now it makes sense. All my production data resides on /data and I tend to leave the standard directories alone but I did create a /root/bin and put in it simple commands like .l # /bin/bash ls -al .f # /bin/bash find / -iwholename *$1 .fs # /bin/bash find /data -iwholename *$1 find /ax -iwholename *$1 find /bx -iwholename *$1 find /cx -iwholename *$1 Obviously with the chmod +x. The last one makes searching times much faster when seeking non-operating system files. Because I'm lazy or perhaps because I firmly believe the computer should do the work for the people not vice versa, I did some links (ln -s) for service and some copies of ipt tables etc. so I can quickly type sv ipt status ipt -I . ipt -nvL Command lines are like what computers used to be like. You know with a fast but noisy Teletype banging-out text at 75 baud or a luxury terminal running at a staggeringly fast 300 baud giving a top speed of 30 characters a second. -- With best regards, Paul. England, EU. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
On Wednesday, January 26, 2011 01:37 PM, Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 13:27 +0800, Christopher Chan wrote: Surely you mean stuff from the rising sun Illumos and OpenIndiana! Nope. Not convinced by what I read about them. Still have my unused Open Solaris disks from 2008.05 and my single CD of Red Hat Linux v.6 from 1999. :-) bsdmag.org Not that I would recommend OpenIndiana for a desktop (only because I do not like GNOME) but I think you will find that quite a lot of basic stuff can be done. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
Always Learning cen...@g7.u22.net wrote: Thanks for the good advice. I wondered why the installer gave those choices. Now it makes sense. All my production data resides on /data and I tend to leave the standard directories alone Paul, if you want a basic explanation of the rationale behind the Linux Filesystem Hierarchy Standard, you might enjoy this article from a course I wrote years ago - it's a little dated, but still applicable today. http://www.lesbell.com.au/Home.nsf/web/What+Goes+Where+on+a+Linux+System?OpenDocument Best, --- Les Bell [http://www.lesbell.com.au] Tel: +61 2 9451 1144 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
-Original Message- From: centos-boun...@centos.org [mailto:centos-boun...@centos.org] On Behalf Of m.r...@5-cent.us Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2011 7:00 PM To: CentOS mailing list Subject: Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster About 5 years ago, I had to install a wireless card in my tower, and it's an ATH9xx, I *think* - I can check this evening, if that's relevant. I was running SuSE, and had to find drivers from madwifi. A few minutes of googling found... I second that, ie OpenSUSE. I've too had two laptops with incompatible wifi-hardware visavi CentOS. Ubuntu kinda' worked in that it found the wifi-hardware, but couldn't connect to my WPA2-AP at home in a stable manner. After having gone through a few other distros, I ventured into OpenSUSE 10 and later 11 and voilá, it both found the hardware and was able to connect to the WPA2-enabled AP, as well as having a stable connection. As good as CentOS is with respect to stability both as a server and as a desktop-solution, it shouldn't maybe be your first choice for a laptop. That's my experience and my five oere... -- /Sorin smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster
-Original Message- From: centos-boun...@centos.org [mailto:centos-boun...@centos.org] On Behalf Of Brian Mathis Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2011 7:03 PM To: CentOS mailing list Subject: Re: [CentOS] Recommendation for a Linux alternative to Centos - ATH9K disaster CentOS is great for servers, but absolutely not for a new person you're trying to get to try Linux. This approach actually hurts Linux since people think oh I tried Linux and it sucked. My 50+-year-old and technically very unsavvy mother manages CentOS just fine on her computer. The trick is to use the Redmond theme... -- /Sorin smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
