Re: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-08-16 Thread Richard Bornat
On 31 Jul 2007, at 16:33, Alan Blackwell wrote: Marian Petre and I have written a paper, to be presented at VL/ HCC 2007, which sets out to describe what kids *actually* want to program, as opposed to what adults think would be good for them. Anyone who wants a preview, I'm sure Marian won't

RE: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-08-02 Thread Walter Milner
John Pane wrote: Why shouldn't programming be included in the mix of experiences a child has? I think we need to be clear whether we are talking about informal education in the home led by parents, or a national curriculum for delivery by teachers in schools. I think the OP was concerned

RE: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-08-02 Thread Guzdial, Mark
Nice response, John! I agree -- there's value in exploring, playing with, and learning programming for its own sake. I've been recently gathering examples of undergraduate courses outside of computing disciplines where programming is used (and typically taught, too, because rarely are CS

Re: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-08-01 Thread Yishay Mor
funnily, this just came in on another list: On 01/08/07, Bill Kendrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I wanted to make a short pre-release announcement about the next version of Tux Paint (my OSS drawing app for young kids). Note: This is directed to folks here who are teaching _older_ kids

Re: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-08-01 Thread Jeffrey Edgington
On Jul 31, 2007, at 11:15 PM, Linda McIver wrote: I'm surprised that no-one has mentioned John Pane's PhD work yet. John actually did research (gasp) on how kids naturally specify problem solutions, and came up with a system that allowed them to do all kinds of neat programming in what was,

Re: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-08-01 Thread John Pane
Ruven E Brooks wrote: Yes, I am really asking the question, why try to teach children programming? ... Walter Milner questions, as do I, whether there is any general benefit in other areas to teaching programming. Yishay Mor gives some references to work that shows that doing programming

RE: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-07-31 Thread Enda Dunican
Hi all We had a discussion regarding this at PPIG 2007 in Joensuu. In my opinion there is too much emphasis on Lego Mindstorms and introducing kids to programming using robots. I was at a meeting once where someone professed that if you aren't interested in Mindstorms or robots you won't be

RE: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-07-31 Thread Guzdial, Mark
We're seeing a lot of use of both Alice and the new MIT Scratch with children. We're successfully using Python for media computation with children as young as 11 years old. Mark

RE: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-07-31 Thread Ruven E Brooks
, Mark [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/31/2007 09:52 AM To Enda Dunican [EMAIL PROTECTED], discuss@ppig.org cc Subject RE: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program We're seeing a lot of use of both Alice and the new MIT Scratch with children. We're successfully using Python

Re: PPIG discuss: teaching kids to program

2007-07-31 Thread Alan Blackwell
Marian Petre and I have written a paper, to be presented at VL/ HCC 2007, which sets out to describe what kids *actually* want to program, as opposed to what adults think would be good for them. Anyone who wants a preview, I'm sure Marian won't mind if I offer preview copies to anyone who