[e-gold-list] Re: Ethical refunds
Viking Coder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not arguing backed vs. fiat, or base system denominations, but inter-currency transaction roll-backs. When a transaction is made across non-equivalent currencies, is there an *ethical* means of determining what amount should be refunded? I don't think it's so clear. How is this situation usually handled (fiat - fiat transactions)? Is the merchant/payee's currency used as the basis for refund, or the customer/payer's currency used? I might be mistaken, but I believe no refunds is the normal policy - at least with most cash exchanges. If I were to give 500 USD to a cash exchange provider in Amsterdam in exchange for Euros, I wouldn't expect to be able to go back later and get my USD back. I would have to make another exchange from Euros to USD. It seems the scenario closest to Graham's situation would be if I push my 500 USD across the counter and the person on the other side picks it up and at that point (before I've received the Euros) I say, wait I changed my mind! In that case I'm guessing the person would hand the money back, and say make up your mind. This suggests to me that Graham should have returned the currency given to him (e-gold) in the amount he received (which is measured in weight), less fees extracted by the e-gold system. OR he should have said, sorry, no refunds. OR he should do exactly what he said (on his website) he'd do. It does seem a bit unfair that a customer can cancel an order because the price of dollars in terms of gold went down. If I send you 100 aug and expect 1000 USD for example, it seems a bit cheap and smarmy to cancel the order and redo it because the price of 1000 dollars went down to only 90 aug. Wayne _ Need an experienced programmer who knows both the Unix and Microsoft worlds? Then you need to hire Wayne: http://hirewayne.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ --- You are currently subscribed to e-gold-list as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Use e-gold's Secure Randomized Keyboard (SRK) when accessing your e-gold account(s) via the web and shopping cart interfaces to help thwart keystroke loggers and common viruses.
[e-gold-list] Re: Ethical refunds
the order was reversed because goldLATER sent us usd instead of e-gold. we are faced with a loss in gold because goldLATER delayed our order. we had to wait approximately THREE WEEKS! graham kelly delayed it and should pay the price for this delay. in fact he has not to pay any price for this delay...simple return what you get from us. we gave you gold and expect to get back the same weight of gold. that's all. but i have no hope. this marketing guy has no ethics. you may have a look at the osgold case. he promoted osgold heavily at a time he already knew that it is a scam to get his inventory of osgold funds sold. -- ___ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm --- You are currently subscribed to e-gold-list as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Use e-gold's Secure Randomized Keyboard (SRK) when accessing your e-gold account(s) via the web and shopping cart interfaces to help thwart keystroke loggers and common viruses.
[e-gold-list] Re: Ethical refunds
The ethical way to deal with a situation like this is to return the exact amount of gold by weight to the customer, not the USD value. Sidd. Why is that the case when the transaction was done in USD, and the site/emails contain notices stating such an eventuality? A transaction should be unraveled in the same manner that it was entered. LET'S HAVE A LOOK AT GOLDLATERS TOS: 2. The ecurrency transfer will occur within 72 hours of receipt of ecurrency. WE HAD TO WAIT APPROXIMATELY THREE WEEKS. GRAHAM KELLY BROKE HIS OWN TOS!!! 10. In the event of any changes with the spot price of gold/dollar value, we reserve the right to change our delivery structure between the current dollar volume and purchased gold volume (grams) amount. NICE PROVISION. CUSTOMERS ALWAYS LOOSE. -- ___ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm --- You are currently subscribed to e-gold-list as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Use e-gold's Secure Randomized Keyboard (SRK) when accessing your e-gold account(s) via the web and shopping cart interfaces to help thwart keystroke loggers and common viruses.
[e-gold-list] Re: Ethical refunds
Garry, Thank you for the opportunity to respond to this... again! You are correct, we were delayed 3 weeks, as we had issues accessing the DMT system. As I recall, so did YOU! As well, one of our suppliers of ecurrency who promised us fast delivery of DMT let us down (very unusual, and now fixed). It's fairly common knowledge that I do make the occassional mistake, just ask my wife! :) I admit I was tardy in the transaction. I admit I stuffed up. Quite rightly you cancelled the order, as anyone would have, myself included. The funds were returned, in full, less the DMT transfer fees. I just have one concern... why did you cancel AFTER the order was completed? Now, let's move on, don't you think? OSGold is dead and buried, I lost a lot of $$$ with my involvement with them, and most valuable lessons learnt. As my good friend from Ft Worth would say, That old dog don't hunt no more! Incidently, how much did YOU personally lose with OSGold? HOWEVER, in any case, I'm prepared to offer you a free virtual Visa debit card. I can issue you this in about 60 seconds, or less. Funding of it can take a tad longer, perhaps less than 5 minutes. Please email me back your name, address, phone, email, and either your SSN, drivers licence number, or passport number. You use this card for internet purchases only, and there is full online access. It also comes with a CVV2 number. Card to Card transfers are easy. Garry, This is my one and only offer to you. Take it, or leave it. To all my customers: we will be selling a combination Virtual Visa Card, as well as an ATM card, same account. There will be a link available on my site within a few days. NEW customers will be able to simply tick a box when placing their order. I'm EXCITED again! Cheers! Graham Kelly CEO On Wed, 03 Dec 2003 09:50:53 -0500, Internet Investment Group LLC Internet Investment Group LLC [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: the order was reversed because GoldNow sent us usd instead of e-gold. we are faced with a loss in gold because GoldNow delayed our order. we had to wait approximately THREE WEEKS! graham kelly delayed it and should pay the price for this delay. in fact he has not to pay any price for this delay...simple return what you get from us. we gave you gold and expect to get back the same weight of gold. that's all. but i have no hope. this marketing guy has no ethics. you may have a look at the osgold case. he promoted osgold heavily at a time he already knew that it is a scam to get his inventory of osgold funds sold. - GoldNow http://www.GoldNow.St Primary Customer Service +61 3 9776-4886 US Phone 1-866-999-1717 US Fax 1-213-559-8555 UK Phone +44 (0) 709 233-7612 UK Phone +44 (0) 709 201-4015 CEO UK Fax +44 (0) 870 135-0279 'I was not born to be a second-hander' - Ayn Rand --- You are currently subscribed to e-gold-list as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Use e-gold's Secure Randomized Keyboard (SRK) when accessing your e-gold account(s) via the web and shopping cart interfaces to help thwart keystroke loggers and common viruses.
[e-gold-list] Re: Ethical refunds
Viking, Viking Coder wrote: Why is that the case when the transaction was done in USD, and the site/emails contain notices stating such an eventuality? Please read my previous message explaining the situation. If the reverse had happened, and the exact weight was returned, the client would be raising hell that $580 was spent, but only ~$567 (minus fees) was refunded. It would be easy to explain the logic of the refund if it was done correctly as I explained. A transaction should be unraveled in the same manner that it was entered. No, that is not correct... see my other message. Or do you mean ... The ethical way is to always take the short end of the stick, regardless of circumstances Which is an extreme version of The customer is always right No, I don't mean that, I mean there is only one correct solution, no matter which way the USD value of gold moves. Sidd. --- You are currently subscribed to e-gold-list as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Use e-gold's Secure Randomized Keyboard (SRK) when accessing your e-gold account(s) via the web and shopping cart interfaces to help thwart keystroke loggers and common viruses.
[e-gold-list] Re: Ethical refunds
Please read my previous message explaining the situation. That message was posted while I composing mine. It would be easy to explain the logic of the refund if it was done correctly as I explained. Yes, but is it a matter of ethics, or of business practices/methods? I'm not arguing backed vs. fiat, or base system denominations, but inter-currency transaction roll-backs. When a transaction is made across non-equivalent currencies, is there an *ethical* means of determining what amount should be refunded? How is this situation usually handled (fiat - fiat transactions)? Is the merchant/payee's currency used as the basis for refund, or the customer/payer's currency used? Viking Coder http://www.2cw.org/?VikingCoder --- You are currently subscribed to e-gold-list as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Use e-gold's Secure Randomized Keyboard (SRK) when accessing your e-gold account(s) via the web and shopping cart interfaces to help thwart keystroke loggers and common viruses.
[e-gold-list] Re: Ethical refunds
Viking Coder wrote: Yes, but is it a matter of ethics, or of business practices/methods? When a transaction is made across non-equivalent currencies, is there an *ethical* means of determining what amount should be refunded? There was no transaction across non-equivalent currencies, gold was paid, and gold should be returned. If the customer had paid Graham 500 USD, Graham would be correct to return USD, but that was not the case, Graham was paid a weight of gold. It is impossible to Spend USD with e-gold, and this is clearly stated on the e-gold site. Quote e-gold Account User Agreement: 1.12. Spend means the act of transferring value between e-gold accounts in fulfillment of a payment order entered by User. Spends are accounted by weight and convey title to that precise fine weight of metal. Spends may not exceed Available Balance. How is this situation usually handled (fiat - fiat transactions)? Is the merchant/payee's currency used as the basis for refund, or the customer/payer's currency used? This is not the issue under discussion, no exchange between different currencies had taken place. Sidd. --- You are currently subscribed to e-gold-list as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Use e-gold's Secure Randomized Keyboard (SRK) when accessing your e-gold account(s) via the web and shopping cart interfaces to help thwart keystroke loggers and common viruses.
