Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-09 Thread John Bohnovic
How could Yaesu release the radio, with the original CW bandwidth, for production in the first place? 73..de John/K4WJ On 7/8/2015 9:43 PM, Jim Brown wrote: On Wed,7/8/2015 10:28 AM, Mike Harris wrote: The transceiver in question is an FTDX5000. According to FCC measurments, it's one of

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-09 Thread Jim Brown
Bob, Correcting my original post, I meant to say According to ARRL Lab measurements. I don't know enough about Yaesu history to know the answer to that. On Wed,7/8/2015 7:01 PM, Richard W. Solomon wrote: So you are saying the FTDX-5KMP is no longer one of the worst ??? No, just not as bad

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-09 Thread Guy Olinger K2AV
Oh, that's easy to explain. Overheard: CW? What's CW? ... Really? ... Nobody uses that anymore. You actually going to spend money on THAT??? 73, Guy K2AV On Thursday, July 9, 2015, John Bohnovic k...@att.net wrote: How could Yaesu release the radio, with the original CW bandwidth, for

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Don Wilhelm
Robert, There is a significant reduction in phase noise. That means you can work closer to the frequency of another station without him interfering with the station you are trying to copy. On transmit, it means your signal is more 'pure' and the sideband 'clutter' on your signal is

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread David Cole
Al, Let me pose a set of conditions, and see if I understand this... Is the smearing caused mostly by the phase noise sidebands, as a resultant of phase flicker? i.e. If the phase noise were reduced on a transmitting VFO, then the smearing would also be reduced, because the sidebands would no

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Guy Olinger K2AV
Hi, Dave. Well, there is one thing you did not do. A fourth condition, which would be difficult, a lot more work given what you were doing. That would be changing his syn first and noting the difference. It might be that the TX change first would create a different middle picture in the series.

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread David Cole
Hi, Thanks, I need to think about this a bit prior to commenting on it. :) -- Thanks and 73's, For equipment, and software setups and reviews see: www.nk7z.net For MixW support see; http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mixw/info For Dopplergram information see:

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Walter Underwood
It would help a lot when your neighbor is not transmitting or transmitting on a different band. Plus, it is courteous to transmit a cleaner signal. wunder K6WRU CM87wj http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog) On Jul 8, 2015, at 9:04 AM, Alan n...@sonic.net wrote: By the way, a corollary to

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Alan
On 07/08/2015 06:02 AM, David Cole wrote: It occurs to me that the the the RX VFO phase noise would be less influencing, (on phase noise sidebands), than the transmit VFO phase noise... Is that correct? If so, then that would explain why the largest change occurred when K7OLN got his new

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Alan
By the way, a corollary to this is that it doesn't help much to improve the phase noise of your radio if your neighbor's radio is dirty. Alan N1AL On 07/08/2015 08:45 AM, Alan wrote: On 07/08/2015 06:02 AM, David Cole wrote: It occurs to me that the the the RX VFO phase noise would be less

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Edward R Cole
Phase noise in oscillators is a subject much discussed amongst microwave hams and eme'rs who are trying to obtain optimum reception. It is not totally agreed but much thought is that MDS is lowered by having low phase-noise (even in a completely quiet band (no adjacent signals). Thinking is

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread David Cole
My most active neighbor, (I have 5 hams in less than 1/2 mile from me), runs an Icom 706MKII G, that is a real POS if I have ever seen one... It takes out most of the band when he is on, and running 100W, as opposed to the K7OLN's K3, (750 feet form me), when running a KW and I am able to

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Al Lorona
I think that once your receiver's phase noise is about 1/10 (-10 dB) of the incoming transmitted signal's phase noise, the incoming will dominate and you'll no longer see an improvement no matter what you do to the receiver. (This is a famous rule-of-thumb we use in any measurement.) From the

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Mike Harris
I have a neighbour approximately 300 metres away who causes significant noise QRM on the next two bands LF, S3-5. Less so if I'm working a higher higher band which I assume is due to cut-off of the TX BPFs in both the transceiver and the linear. The transceiver in question is an FTDX5000.

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Jim Brown
On Wed,7/8/2015 9:04 AM, Alan wrote: By the way, a corollary to this is that it doesn't help much to improve the phase noise of your radio if your neighbor's radio is dirty. I can testify to that! My neighbor 8 miles away runs an IC7600. Real POS. 73, Jim K9YC

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Martin Sole (HS0ZED)
The solution is becoming clear. We all need to buy our near neighbours shiny new K3S's. Costly maybe but what price for some RF sanity. Cheers Martin, HS0ZED Who has no obvious nearby hams :) On 08/07/2015 20:28, Mike Harris wrote: I have a neighbour approximately 300 metres away who causes

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Jim Brown
On Wed,7/8/2015 10:28 AM, Mike Harris wrote: The transceiver in question is an FTDX5000. According to FCC measurments, it's one of the worst of the expensive modern rigs for CW bandwidth. BUT -- Yaesu issued a firmware update last fall, and my before/after measurements of a N6TA's FTDX5000

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Greg Troxel
David Cole d...@nk7z.net writes: It occurs to me that the the the RX VFO phase noise would be less influencing, (on phase noise sidebands), than the transmit VFO phase noise... Is that correct? If so, then that would explain why the largest change occurred when K7OLN got his new

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-08 Thread Richard W. Solomon
@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3 On Wed,7/8/2015 10:28 AM, Mike Harris wrote: The transceiver in question is an FTDX5000. According to FCC measurments, it's one of the worst of the expensive modern rigs for CW bandwidth. BUT -- Yaesu issued a firmware

[Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-07 Thread David Cole
Hello, I had what I believe to be a unique opportunity to test the new synthesizer in a high signal level environment, under some controlled conditions. K7OLN lives about 750 feet from me, and we both have static antenna setups, and because he is running WSPR K7OLN also has static power levels

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-07 Thread Don Wilhelm
David and all, Eric's words at his early morning presentation at FDIM (Dayton) were that the improvement surprised everyone at Elecraft - the results were much better than expected. So all K3 owners can benefit from that part of the K3S development. 73, Don W3FPR On 7/7/2015 6:32 PM,

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-07 Thread Robert Clark
Interesting reading. What does the synthesizer actually do? How is the new one better than the old one? NJ4J Robert W. Clark Executive Director Center for Personnel Development In CTE Temple University Philadelphia, Pa On Jul 7, 2015, at 6:56 PM, Don Wilhelm w3...@embarqmail.com wrote:

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-07 Thread Al Lorona
We like to think that a VFO exists only at one frequency -- the frequency on the receiver display. But in reality every VFO has width, and it occupies not only it's nominal frequency but is smeared both lower and higher in frequency, too. This is because of the phase noise of the synthesizer or

Re: [Elecraft] Observation on new Synthesizers for K3

2015-07-07 Thread David Cole
Hi, I would be interested in a detailed explanation as to why things are tighter with the new synths, as opposed to the old ones as well... -- Thanks and 73's, For equipment, and software setups and reviews see: www.nk7z.net For MixW support see; http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mixw/info For