Re: Edge: Myth of A.I.

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 16 Nov 2014, at 08:45, LizR wrote: On 16 November 2014 07:42, John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Nov 15, 2014 at 12:39 PM, zibb...@gmail.com wrote: The idea that computers are people has a long and storied history. I would maintain that from a long term operational viewpoint

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 16 Nov 2014, at 05:06, zibb...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, November 16, 2014 2:48:33 AM UTC, zib...@gmail.com wrote: On Saturday, November 15, 2014 10:55:45 PM UTC, Russell Standish wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 02:40:39PM -0800, zib...@gmail.com wrote: On Friday, November 14,

Re: Methusalem problem for MWI?

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 08 Nov 2014, at 04:55, LizR wrote: On 8 November 2014 11:50, zibb...@gmail.com wrote: Sure, but in the same vein as where Peter goes, photosynthesis in this universe always finds the most efficient path where there are many others. I have'n't heard an answer to that yet, that addresses

Re: Spontaneous creation of the Universe Ex Nihilo

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 15 Nov 2014, at 23:19, Russell Standish wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 11:27:50PM -0800, Peter Sas wrote: Hi Russell, thanks for your answer... I will definitely give your book a closer reading in the near future, if I can get my poor philosopher's head to understand the mathematics :)

Re: Two apparently different forms of entropy

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 15 Nov 2014, at 17:02, John Clark wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 4:54 PM, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Along these lines of thought, the universe splitting or differentiation in MWI is said to be irreversible even though the equation of QM are time reversible. The Many

Re: Spontaneous creation of the Universe Ex Nihilo

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 15 Nov 2014, at 13:44, Peter Sas wrote: Haha... a glas of wine and a lie down seems like the appropriate response either way! But your response is clarifying... It's like the idea of the zero- energy universe but in informational terms... The universe is 'substantially' nothing, and

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 14 Nov 2014, at 23:18, Russell Standish wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 01:33:15PM -0500, John Clark wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: OK, I will accept that information cannot be communicated faster than the speed of light. However, even in single

Re: Two apparently different forms of entropy

2014-11-16 Thread Richard Ruquist
On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 6:31 AM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 15 Nov 2014, at 17:02, John Clark wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 4:54 PM, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Along these lines of thought, the universe splitting or differentiation in MWI is said to be

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 14 Nov 2014, at 23:14, Richard Ruquist wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 5:18 PM, Russell Standish li...@hpcoders.com.au wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 01:33:15PM -0500, John Clark wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: OK, I will accept that information

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 14 Nov 2014, at 23:35, Richard Ruquist wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 5:35 PM, Russell Standish li...@hpcoders.com.au wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 05:14:24PM -0500, Richard Ruquist wrote: But QM equations are time reversible, The differentiation of the universe is not Your

Re: QM non local? (was Re: The Span of Infinity)

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 14 Nov 2014, at 23:34, Russell Standish wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 07:55:04PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: Thinking on this, I begin to see more clearly the MW picture of the singlet state. The explanation is not that obvious. Let me proceed by giving an argument which seems to imply

Re: I assume everyone's up to speed with this?

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 15 Nov 2014, at 06:48, Samiya Illias wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 9:14 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 14 Nov 2014, at 13:33, Samiya Illias wrote: On 14-Nov-2014, at 4:27 pm, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 14 Nov 2014, at 11:18, Samiya Illias wrote:

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread zibbsey
On Sunday, November 16, 2014 11:08:04 AM UTC, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 16 Nov 2014, at 05:06, zib...@gmail.com javascript: wrote: On Sunday, November 16, 2014 2:48:33 AM UTC, zib...@gmail.com wrote: On Saturday, November 15, 2014 10:55:45 PM UTC, Russell Standish wrote: On Fri, Nov

Re: Two apparently different forms of entropy

2014-11-16 Thread John Clark
On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 6:31 AM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: Latitudes and longitudes do not interfere. Maybe Schrodinger's Wave Equation doesn't interfere either, only other worlds do, and maybe the wave equation is just a way, and certainly not the only way, humans have of

Re: Universal Inflation

2014-11-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 16 Nov 2014, at 03:31, Kim Jones wrote: I wonder if by now it's worth considering in information-theoretic terms how the evolution of academe tends to result in universes in which most and possibly all information becomes increasingly self- referential and redundant ie uncreative. I

Re: Two apparently different forms of entropy

2014-11-16 Thread LizR
On 17 November 2014 00:31, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: Heisenberg was influenced by the positivism of the time (The Vienna circles, the young Wittgenstein, etc.). That was very bad philosophy, and we can say that is is virtually abandoned. Positivism is easily shown self-defeating

Re: Edge: Myth of A.I.

2014-11-16 Thread meekerdb
On 11/16/2014 2:56 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 16 Nov 2014, at 08:45, LizR wrote: On 16 November 2014 07:42, John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com mailto:johnkcl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Nov 15, 2014 at 12:39 PM, zibb...@gmail.com mailto:zibb...@gmail.com wrote: The idea that

RE: Can we test for parallel worlds?

2014-11-16 Thread 'Chris de Morsella' via Everything List
Interesting speculative physics. that makes claims that parallel worlds may be testable. A new theory, proposed by Howard Wiseman, Director of the Centre of Quantum Dynamics at Griffith University, is different. No new universes are ever created. Instead many worlds have existed, side-by-side,

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread Russell Standish
On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 12:42:51PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 14 Nov 2014, at 23:18, Russell Standish wrote: I also like to point out that unitarity is also equivalent to conservation of information, or in other words if something can happen, it will happen, somewhere in the

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread Russell Standish
On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 02:13:51PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 14 Nov 2014, at 23:35, Richard Ruquist wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 5:35 PM, Russell Standish li...@hpcoders.com.au wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 05:14:24PM -0500, Richard Ruquist wrote: But QM equations are time

Re: Can we test for parallel worlds?

2014-11-16 Thread LizR
The MWI can also be viewed as not positing that any new worlds are created, but that the multiverse is a continuum that can differentiate between previously identical worlds, and can continue to do this forever, that being a property of a continuum. How does Wiseman (appropriate name!)

Re: Can we test for parallel worlds?

2014-11-16 Thread spudboy100 via Everything List
If we can't interact with world 2, then its as if it doesn't exist. Just as if there was a super civilization in the Sombrero Galaxy, but they can never interact with us, nor we, with them. It resolves, from a human point of view to Never-Never Land. On the other hand if we somehow can do FTL

Re: Universal Inflation

2014-11-16 Thread Kim Jones
On 17 Nov 2014, at 4:53 am, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 16 Nov 2014, at 03:31, Kim Jones wrote: I wonder if by now it's worth considering in information-theoretic terms how the evolution of academe tends to result in universes in which most and possibly all information

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread John Mikes
Dear Russell, I try to be polite and smooth in my communications not only with you. Here a question emerges in my mind: how diffrent is your perception of the MV (and the arising of such VERY human connotations) from the concept of 'GOD in religious minds? Is the Schroedinger equation stuff

Re: I assume everyone's up to speed with this?

2014-11-16 Thread LizR
Nice post, Bruno. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread LizR
Isn't that the sort of thing religious people often say? They try to use their language applied to science. You believe in evolution, I believe in the Bible. What's the difference? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe

Re: Two apparently different forms of entropy

2014-11-16 Thread meekerdb
On 11/16/2014 10:51 AM, LizR wrote: On 17 November 2014 00:31, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be mailto:marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: Heisenberg was influenced by the positivism of the time (The Vienna circles, the young Wittgenstein, etc.). That was very bad philosophy, and we can say

Re: Two apparently different forms of entropy

2014-11-16 Thread Bruce Kellett
meekerdb wrote: On 11/16/2014 10:51 AM, LizR wrote: On 17 November 2014 00:31, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be mailto:marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: Heisenberg was influenced by the positivism of the time (The Vienna circles, the young Wittgenstein, etc.). That was very bad

Re: Can we test for parallel worlds?

2014-11-16 Thread meekerdb
One advantage of supposing there are pre-existing worlds which are identical up the point of differentiation is that it resolves the seeming paradox that an quantum measurement that two outcomes with probabilities x and 1-x differentiates into two worlds when x=0.5 and ten worlds when x=0.1

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread meekerdb
On 11/16/2014 1:49 PM, Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 02:13:51PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 14 Nov 2014, at 23:35, Richard Ruquist wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 5:35 PM, Russell Standish li...@hpcoders.com.au wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 05:14:24PM -0500, Richard

Re: The Span of Infinity

2014-11-16 Thread meekerdb
On 11/16/2014 4:07 PM, LizR wrote: Isn't that the sort of thing religious people often say? They try to use their language applied to science. You believe in evolution, I believe in the Bible. What's the difference? Here's how a guy treats his religion with respect - he challenges it to

Re: Two apparently different forms of entropy

2014-11-16 Thread meekerdb
On 11/16/2014 7:15 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: meekerdb wrote: On 11/16/2014 10:51 AM, LizR wrote: On 17 November 2014 00:31, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be mailto:marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: Heisenberg was influenced by the positivism of the time (The Vienna circles, the young