On Monday 12 June 2006 07:15, Mick - wrote:
Through observation, I found that my calculated agl value (as discussed in
my
previous post) was close to that of /position/ground-elev-ft when using
the
current lat/lon values instead of those from
Point3D calc_gc_lon_lat( const Point3D orig,
Am Montag 12 Juni 2006 01:10 schrieb Ampere K. Hardraade:
On Saturday 10 June 2006 13:15, Tony Pelton wrote:
heck, even taking the records, and stuffing those records, as they are
now, into XML would be a start.
Already in XML format...
http://www.cs.yorku.ca/~cs233144/export_cyyz.svg
Thomas Förster wrote:
Don't know wether svg editors will preserve unknown tags and attributes. If
they do, the physical airport layout can then be changed with a standard svg
drawing program (e.g. inkscape).
That's the nice thing about XML: you just have to put your own tags and
Hi
Having edited airports there are a few things that tools like TaxiDraw
provide that are invaluable;
1) super-imposing the airport layout on top of a scaled background image to
allow placement of taxiways etc in proportion to the RL layout.
2) providing lat/long readout for any point on
Hallo Thomas !
Thomas Förster wrote:
Which brings me to an idea. What if the airport format is enriched svg. That
way the physical airport layout is in svg and might be viewed with a standard
svg viever/editor. Converting electronic airport charts to svg works already.
The logical layout
Hi
Hallo Thomas !
Thomas Förster wrote:
Which brings me to an idea. What if the airport format is enriched svg.
That
way the physical airport layout is in svg and might be viewed with a
standard
svg viever/editor. Converting electronic airport charts to svg works
already.
The logical
This idea actually _does_ have appeal - hey, I'm right now busy with
creating an SVG drawing - but I see one drawback here:
Airport-creators or -maintainers are not _forced_ to think of the
logical layout. Let's assume some flight simulation does not honour the
logical layout at all and we'll
On 12/06/2006, at 9:37 PM, Thomas Förster wrote:
snip
Of course this also means that only an svg editor is not enough to
fully
specify an airport.
In the case of Inkscape (I don't know about any of the other SVG
editors), a reasonably simple plugin should suffice for editing the
Hi
This idea actually _does_ have appeal - hey, I'm right now busy with
creating an SVG drawing - but I see one drawback here:
Airport-creators or -maintainers are not _forced_ to think of the
logical layout. Let's assume some flight simulation does not honour the
logical layout at all
Hi,
dene maxwell wrote:
it's not just layout that is important, there have been instances where
people have wanted uni-directional runways... this could just as equally
apply to taxiways (I haven't come across any examples of this YET!)...
defining taxi-ways as unirdirection or
Hi,
Ralf Gerlich schrieb:
However, given proper tools - which is what TaxiDraw is going for - we
can make the tool support the user, by, e.g., automatically placing
lines of borderlights around any new pavement polygon and allow the user
to edit them or remove them as they wish.
Erm...I
Am Montag, 12. Juni 2006 12:28 schrieb Ralf Gerlich:
Hi,
Ralf Gerlich schrieb:
However, given proper tools - which is what TaxiDraw is going for - we
can make the tool support the user, by, e.g., automatically placing
lines of borderlights around any new pavement polygon and allow the
Hi Ralf
Hi,
dene maxwell wrote:
it's not just layout that is important, there have been instances where
people have wanted uni-directional runways... this could just as equally
apply to taxiways (I haven't come across any examples of this YET!)...
defining taxi-ways as unirdirection or
Hi Guys,
First I must say I have not read the past FG-dev discussion on this ...
if someone can point me to a thread title name or date range I will
catch up. The 850 apt.dat format came out of about 3 years of banging
our head on the problem inside LR, but I suspect that the things we've
Hi,
Thomas Förster schrieb:
Ralf Gerlich schrieb:
Erm...I just wanted to add, that I don't mean that TaxiDraw isn't a
proper tool right now %-) The intention was to express the direction of
TaxiDraw towards a more flexible tool with the possibility for more
high-level support in airport editing.
Hi Ralf,
Ralf Gerlich wrote:
As it seems, the X-Plane authors are not keen to go away from the
apt.dat format, so if FlightGear would go away from bidirectional
compatibility with apt.dat, this would result in a clear split of the
databases and in ceasing the up to now fruitful exchange
Hi,
BTW: Durk Talsma's AI-extension using external XML-files shows us that
we _can_ extend the format without changing apt.dat at all. However, we
still have the problem of keeping extensions like that in sync with
changes from Robin Peel's database.
Cheers,
Ralf
* Ralf Gerlich -- Monday 12 June 2006 13:42:
BTW: Durk Talsma's AI-extension using external XML-files shows us that
we _can_ extend the format without changing apt.dat at all.
Of course, this is a bad example, as those extensions make the format
basically useless for any other purpose than for
Hi Ralf,
Ralf Gerlich wrote:
There was criticism of the physical storage model of apt.dat, as it has
been and probably will continue to be in version 850. I just wanted to
say that, if the FlightGear project were to invent its own format -
let's call it FGAPT for simplicity - and would
Hi Ben,
bsupnik schrieb:
Ralf Gerlich wrote:
There was criticism of the physical storage model of apt.dat, as it has
been and probably will continue to be in version 850. I just wanted to
say that, if the FlightGear project were to invent its own format -
let's call it FGAPT for simplicity -
Hello Ben,
bsupnik wrote:
X-Plane has ended up more and more using a 'compiler' approach to our
scenery, where we view the process of making scenery as a series of
transformations on data.
FlightGear uses this compilation aproach for ages and we're currently
working on improving the
Hi Ralf,
Ralf Gerlich wrote:
Well, there is the problem: if you want to database the highest level
layout info, you need to standardize the high level model.
Then that's where we need to work with you and Robin Peel regarding the
next generation database ;-)
Just to play devil's advocate:
On Sun, 11 Jun 2006 14:53:13 -0400, Ampere wrote in message
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
On Friday 09 June 2006 21:50, Arnt Karlsen wrote:
..Roberto _ is_ stretching understatement as concept, last years
AirVenture put over 10 000 planes on KOSH. My initial idea
was paint parked planes with copies
Hello Ben,
bsupnik wrote:
Martin Spott wrote:
100 08x 49 02 2 0.25 1 2 1 35.04420900 -106.59855700 300 200 3 2 1 1 2 \
2 3.00 35.04420900 -106.59855700 0300 3 2 0 1 1 2 3.50
How is this gonna work when the thresholds of the opposing runway ends
are situated at the same location ?
dene maxwell wrote:
Rule #5 Until you can hover indefinitely over the same point on the ground
and and climb and descend without moving from that point, don't try anything
fancier...ie practice hovering.
Rule #6 When you can hover, practice pulling up from level flight to a
stationary
On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 09:24:05 -0400, bsupnik wrote in message
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Martin Spott wrote:
It would be extremely nice to have at least one single, completely
working example that really matches the proposed spec. This would
significantly help to understand the schema by having
Is anyone working on a plugin / client to enable us FG users to use the vatsim
network with voice too ?
I myself can't find anything at all , maybe some of us could get together and
start such a project ?
Regards,
Justin Smithies
___
Hi,
Sorry to barge in again, but I work with the VATSIM guys and can tell
you: you may have licensing issues...email Lefteris to find out about
such a thing, but you may want to find out up-front if the licensing on
the VATSIM VoIP stuff is compatible with FG (either legally or
Melchior FRANZ wrote:
* Melchior FRANZ -- Monday 12 June 2006 13:53:
Of course, this is a bad example, as those extensions make the format
basically useless for any other purpose than for the AI subsystem. No
other subsystem in fgfs can load them, which is why I would rather get
rid of
Arnt Karlsen wrote:
..any chance these _timed_ entries versions of KOSH can replace
your current version of KOSH?
Wrong thread, please don't always hijack threads that deal with a
totally different topic. This thread is about the structure, not about
the content,
Martin.
--
Unix
Just got a reply from Vatsim ive pasted it it below.
:
it's certainly viable to start such a client. However, in order to
connect to the VATSIM network, it needs to be using libraries whose
source code is proprietary to VATSIM (i.e. its source code is under Non
Disclosure Agreement).
If
Curtis L. Olson wrote:
Vatsim would be a competitor to our native multiplayer system, right?
Well, we might need some more users of our own system to really
compete with VATSIM :-)
It goes against the windows philosophy of cramming everything into a big
monolithic application, [...]
The
On 6/12/06, Martin Spott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Justin Smithies wrote:
On the other hand I was told that certain people didn't care about
licensing and hacked the VATSIM authentication protocol
for reference ...
Hi,
Martin Spott schrieb:
The story _I_ was told reads like this:
They have severe difficulties with their user authentication because
the protocol they use is considered to be braindead (TM). So they try
to hide the drawbacks of their authentication protocol by forcing
people to sign an
On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 12:05:28 -0400, Tony wrote in message
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
On 6/12/06, Martin Spott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Justin Smithies wrote:
On the other hand I was told that certain people didn't care about
licensing and hacked the VATSIM authentication protocol
for reference
Hi Ben,
bsupnik wrote:
- VATSIM could require a FG-client to use their libs (under some terms)
as conditions for network approval. I thikn that VASTIM users are
required as part of their membership agreement with the network to only
use approved clients.
Honestly, I'm really curious to
How about we just use our own system based on data from the FG prop tree.
We already have the google map servers , so all we would need to do is get
other people to host their own too and become controllers for different
areas.
For voip / text we could use a secondary app which would run on Win
On Monday 12 June 2006 20:06, Martin Spott wrote:
Honestly, I'm really curious to know what the _real_ driving force is
behind this protectionism.
Is this stupid arrogance (if they want to participate, they'll have to
follow our rules - not matter if it makes sense), simply incompetence
(one
Curtis L. Olson wrote:
If people don't like Vatsim's approach or their licensing terms, you are
welcome to your opinion, but maybe you should take it up with the vatsim
folks rather than firing random shots in the air around here. But if
you do take it up with vatsim directly, please make
Martin Spott wrote:
Ok, in theory having a closed source interface _might_ serve the
licensing issues, _but_:
- Who likes to have to use a closed source module in order to connect
their OpenSource flight simulation to VATSIM ?
Does the bridge module between flightgear and vatsim need to
dene maxwell wrote:
Rule #5 Until you can hover indefinitely over the same point on the
ground
and and climb and descend without moving from that point, don't try
anything
fancier...ie practice hovering.
Rule #6 When you can hover, practice pulling up from level flight to a
stationary
Curtis L. Olson wrote:
Martin Spott wrote:
- More important, who of the OpenSource developers likes to maintain
a closed source module, compile it at least for half a dozend
different platforms and play the lonesome cowboy to whom bug
reports will be adressed - without having any chance
Question #4: Has anybody tried the Matlab-FlightGear connection without
perishing on the try? If so, is there any documentation?
I don't know if there is any documentation. I kind of remember that
Jon had asked someone to come up with a paper or something... but
there is ofcourse the
On Tue, 13 Jun 2006 07:51:46 +1200, dene wrote in message
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
I agree and that's why I still fly helicopters even though I
can't even follow Rule #5. That's the nice thing about a Sim...
crashes don't hurt :-)
...the bad habits might, mightily too. ;o)
--
..med
Correu PelDavid wrote:
Isn't the FDM much good?
I thought it would be. What fidelity lacks?
I find the helicopter FDM quite reasonable. I've been flying a model
helicopter about the time when I finished school but this is
already 20 years ago, so my memory might play tricks with me.
On Monday 12 June 2006 04:22, dene maxwell wrote:
Hi
Having edited airports there are a few things that tools like TaxiDraw
provide that are invaluable;
1) super-imposing the airport layout on top of a scaled background image
to allow placement of taxiways etc in proportion to the RL
Why not just duplicate vatsim with independent GPL programming?
On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 5:52 pm, Arnt Karlsen wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 14:39:40 -0500, Curtis wrote in message
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Martin Spott wrote:
Ok, in theory having a closed source interface _might_ serve the
licensing
On Monday 12 June 2006 15:22, Martin Spott wrote:
Ok, in theory having a closed source interface _might_ serve the
licensing issues, _but_:
- Who likes to have to use a closed source module in order to connect
their OpenSource flight simulation to VATSIM ?
- More important, who of the
Hi Y'all,
GWMobile wrote:
Why not just duplicate vatsim with independent GPL programming?
I think the point of VATSIM (and IVAO) is that they are existing
communities with user bases that show up on a regular basis. If you
wrote a pilot client for FG you could then go fly online on any given
On Monday 12 June 2006 05:55, Hugo Vincent wrote:
In the case of Inkscape (I don't know about any of the other SVG
editors), a reasonably simple plugin should suffice for editing the
non-graphical aspects of the airport layout.
There should be no need for a plugin. Just create a new layer,
On Monday 12 June 2006 19:47, dene maxwell wrote:
Unfortunately the data kept by FAA/CAA or what ever the local
administration is called is often out-of-date or just plain wrong.
Experience of the last month has taught me that. Poring over aerial photos
and current third-party documentation
On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 19:47:10 -0400, bsupnik wrote in message
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Hi Y'all,
GWMobile wrote:
Why not just duplicate vatsim with independent GPL programming?
I think the point of VATSIM (and IVAO) is that they are existing
communities with user bases that show up on a
On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 18:56:02 -0400, Ampere wrote in message
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
On Monday 12 June 2006 03:50, Thomas F�rster wrote:
The logical layout (taxiway names, aprons, tower locations etc.) is
then put on top of that (i.e. extra tags and attributes).
You can group objects into
Martin Spott wrote:
Correu PelDavid wrote:
Isn't the FDM much good?
I thought it would be. What fidelity lacks?
I find the helicopter FDM quite reasonable. I've been flying a model
helicopter about the time when I finished school but this is
already 20 years ago, so my memory might
Hi Ampere,
I really don't want to pursue an arguement about right and wrong... the
approaches are different and each has it's merits .. I would have really
liked to have your tools available to me when I started converting the
current FAA diagram
On Monday 12 June 2006 19:47, dene maxwell
On Tuesday 13 June 2006 00:06, dene maxwell wrote:
but I don't want to prove you wrong ... can we agree that TaxiDraw
provides certain functionality at the moment that works with the current
format of apt.dat... any replacement should provide the same functionality
OR a mechanism whereby that
On Tuesday 13 June 2006 00:32, Ampere K. Hardraade wrote:
IIRC the French
CAA diagrams don't even have lat/long references apart from the
various navaid locations.
Yes they do.
Not Toulouse
http://airventure2006.blogspot.com/2006/06/toulouse-aip.html
You are on the wrong
What was ths source URL for that ..?
...it certainly provides that data needed
I would like to add it to my AIP database
Cheers
:-D ene
From: Ampere K. Hardraade [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: FlightGear developers discussions
flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
To: FlightGear developers
dene maxwell wrote:
What was ths source URL for that ..?
French AIP VFR is on:
http://www.sia.aviation-civile.gouv.fr/aip/enligne/UK/home.htm
Martin.
--
Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are !
Josh Babcock wrote:
For instance: translational lift, ground effect, retreating blade stall,
and VRS. I don't think that there is any kind of realism regarding the
energy model for the blades. (AFAIK, all they do is spool up to the
specified rpm when the engines are turned on and then back
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