I would like to request that Dror be moderated on Foundation-L. This
is not an appropriate use of Foundation-L, Dror has one of the more
extensive sockpuppetry histories of any Wikipedia abuse case (
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Drork/Archive
Hoi,
Leave off. Foundation-l is a place where relevant subjects can be raised. It
is a place that has a bad reputation among some because of the aggressive
tone.
When Dror complains about stalking, it is a valid point of concern. It is
the reason why some people I admire left our community. When
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 2:07 AM, George Herbert george.herb...@gmail.comwrote:
I would like to request that Dror be moderated on Foundation-L. This
is not an appropriate use of Foundation-L, Dror has one of the more
extensive sockpuppetry histories of any Wikipedia abuse case (
On 21/05/2011 23:09, Sarah wrote:
On Sat, May 21, 2011 at 16:01, Riskerrisker...@gmail.com wrote:
As to the comments from MZMcBride and Sarah, I would like to see a
significantly higher minimal level of notability for BLPs. In the past few
years of working with the Arbitration Committee, I
2011/5/22 Ryan Lomonaco wiki.ral...@gmail.com:
That said, to me, I don't see any stalking whatsoever. It is common when
investigating sockpuppets to send evidence privately to other trusted users,
so that the (suspected) sockpuppeteer does not change their habits to avoid
detection. I don't
Do we have a referent list of wikis? Although it would be good to have
the list of *all* Wikimedia wikis, just the list of content projects
wikis would be fine.
The page Complete list of Wikimedia projects [1] is not referent at all.
It's not about the fact that it is on wiki, but exactly because
On 05/21/2011 02:12 AM, Erik Moeller wrote:
It's clear that there's a need for community broadcasting tools that
allow for a degree of personal flexibility, whether it's by means of
subscription or otherwise.
I agree, this would fix almost all problem instantly. Although it does
not replace
Well, the CTB Superinjunction is now broken in a number of places on
en.wikipedia.
So there we go.
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Hoi,
Agreed.
Thanks,
GerardM
On 22 May 2011 10:38, Amir E. Aharoni amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il wrote:
2011/5/22 Ryan Lomonaco wiki.ral...@gmail.com:
That said, to me, I don't see any stalking whatsoever. It is common when
investigating sockpuppets to send evidence privately to other
Has anyone notified SD about this discussion? Pretty much essential given
the allegations made by Dror K (which are clearly unfounded, but may be
damaging).
Tom
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Also rather interestingly, it appears that a Scottish newspaper has revealed
the identity of the footballer in question, on the grounds that English
superinjunctions don't apply in Scotland.
Perhaps the WMF should open an office in Edinburgh, if London is too risky
;-)
Chris
2011/5/22 Thomas Morton morton.tho...@googlemail.com:
Has anyone notified SD about this discussion? Pretty much essential given
the allegations made by Dror K (which are clearly unfounded, but may be
damaging).
Notified whom?
--
Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
Supreme Deliciousness, whose actions are being discussed...
I noted that he hadn't been told so dropped him a note as common courtesy.
Tom
On 22 May 2011 11:58, Amir E. Aharoni amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il wrote:
2011/5/22 Thomas Morton morton.tho...@googlemail.com:
Has anyone notified SD
I am preparing document for Wikimania. Presently, I am in process of
analyzing data (SIL [1], Ethnologue [2], Wikimedia projects). I am using
Ethnologue data for population estimates.
Before I started this task, I thought that the situation is not so bad
(or good, if it is about possibility for
Can you also provide at least a rough estimate of the number of humans who
don't have Wikipedia in any language they speak reasonably well (understanding
very well that this is a hard problem of definition)?
Curious.
On May 22, 2011, at 14:15, Milos Rancic wrote:
I am preparing document for
2011/5/22 Thomas Morton morton.tho...@googlemail.com:
Supreme Deliciousness, whose actions are being discussed...
I noted that he hadn't been told so dropped him a note as common courtesy.
Oh.
This initialism may be well-known to some English Wikipedia editors,
but not to all of them, and
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 4:15 AM, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote:
I am preparing document for Wikimania. Presently, I am in process of
analyzing data (SIL [1], Ethnologue [2], Wikimedia projects). I am using
Ethnologue data for population estimates.
Before I started this task, I thought
Yeh :-) sorry about that
Tom
On 22 May 2011, at 12:26, Amir E. Aharoni
amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il wrote:
2011/5/22 Thomas Morton morton.tho...@googlemail.com:
Supreme Deliciousness, whose actions are being discussed...
I noted that he hadn't been told so dropped him a note as common
On Sun, 2011-05-22 at 13:15 +0200, Milos Rancic wrote:
* Jin Chinese, 45M, China
* Xiang Chinese, 36, China, incubator
* Min Bei Chinese, 10.3M, China, incubator
Aren't these languages written with Chinese characters and thus their
speakers can read and write the Chinese Wikipedia?
On 05/22/2011 01:22 PM, Denny Vrandecic wrote:
Can you also provide at least a rough estimate of the number of humans who
don't have Wikipedia in any language they speak reasonably well
(understanding very well that this is a hard problem of definition)?
I would say that the number humans
On 05/22/2011 01:28 PM, George Herbert wrote:
Good work generally, but regarding this last list...
Afghanistan has many languages in use (Pashto, Tajik, Hazara, Uzbek);
Algeria uses Arabic, Berber, and French; Jordan's official language
is Arabic (though the spoken one is a dialect); and
On 05/22/2011 01:37 PM, Nikola Smolenski wrote:
On Sun, 2011-05-22 at 13:15 +0200, Milos Rancic wrote:
* Jin Chinese, 45M, China
* Xiang Chinese, 36, China, incubator
* Min Bei Chinese, 10.3M, China, incubator
Aren't these languages written with Chinese characters and thus their
speakers
On Sun, 2011-05-22 at 14:47 +0200, Milos Rancic wrote:
On 05/22/2011 01:37 PM, Nikola Smolenski wrote:
On Sun, 2011-05-22 at 13:15 +0200, Milos Rancic wrote:
* Jin Chinese, 45M, China
* Xiang Chinese, 36, China, incubator
* Min Bei Chinese, 10.3M, China, incubator
Aren't these
On Sun, 2011-05-22 at 14:32 +0200, Milos Rancic wrote:
On 05/22/2011 01:28 PM, George Herbert wrote:
Can you break this out by which languages we are missing, not just
by
country, as country isn't specific enough?
Waiting for list admins to allow ~250k mail :)
If only someone would make
On 05/22/2011 03:22 PM, Nikola Smolenski wrote:
On Sun, 2011-05-22 at 14:32 +0200, Milos Rancic wrote:
On 05/22/2011 01:28 PM, George Herbert wrote:
Can you break this out by which languages we are missing, not just
by
country, as country isn't specific enough?
Waiting for list admins to
On 05/22/2011 03:20 PM, Nikola Smolenski wrote:
Yea, but how much is any of these different? They may be practically the
same or possible to be added as a variant of Chinese.
I don't know, but the known fact is that even the languages in the
closest families, like Slavic languages are, have
Tom, since you did not respect my last message here, you force me to
react. There seem to be anti-Dror and pro-Dror camps here, and I
don't like this idea at all. The issue is not entirely personal, even
though I am personally attacked here by certain people based on their
mere speculations.
Hi Milos, thanks for those interesting facts!
On 05/22/2011 01:15 PM, Milos Rancic wrote:
Those are preliminary results. We have two chapters (and strategic
focus) in countries of the list above. Inside of the longer list,
which should be verified, we have more chapters. I noted that there
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 1:15 PM, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote:
Those are preliminary results. We have two chapters (and strategic
focus) in countries of the list above. Inside of the longer list, which
should be verified, we have more chapters. I noted that there are even
two
Dror, this is not about anti- or pro- whoever camps. But you have
made a serious allegation on a public and archived mailing list. It's
only fair that Supreme Deliciousness is informed and allowed a right
of reply.
Pete / the wub
On 22 May 2011 14:40, Dror Kamir dqa...@bezeqint.net wrote:
Tom,
Apparently, this has already been done by others. SD preferred to erase
this head-up along with some other notifications about complaints
against him.
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Supreme_Deliciousnessdiff=nextoldid=430329545
Dror K
בתאריך 22/05/11 14:00, ציטוט Thomas
Yes. That was me, I notified him after asking on the list if anyone else
had.
Tom
On 22 May 2011 15:01, Dror Kamir dqa...@bezeqint.net wrote:
Apparently, this has already been done by others. SD preferred to erase
this head-up along with some other notifications about complaints
against him.
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 5:29 AM, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote:
Just because of three letters code conflict between Swiss German and
Albanian (als), I've realized that somebody listed Swiss German to have
Wikinews edition (it is, actually, news portal at Wikipedia) and nobody
bothered
On Sun, 22 May 2011 14:08:14 +0200, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com
wrote:
On 05/22/2011 01:22 PM, Denny Vrandecic wrote:
Can you also provide at least a rough estimate of the number of humans
who don't have Wikipedia in any language they speak reasonably well
(understanding very well that
Le 22/05/2011 10:54, Thomas Morton a écrit :
we have no
rights to participate in Wikipedia.
Regardless of the debate from where it comes, is this an accurate
decription of the rules and policies of Wikipedia?
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On 05/22/2011 04:57 PM, Yaroslav M. Blanter wrote:
On Sun, 22 May 2011 14:08:14 +0200, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com
wrote:
On 05/22/2011 01:22 PM, Denny Vrandecic wrote:
Can you also provide at least a rough estimate of the number of humans
who don't have Wikipedia in any language they
Yes. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:FREESPEECH
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:FREESPEECHObviously you have your
normal legal rights (i.e. if someone does something illegal, then it is a
courts matter). But the idea that I have a right to edit Wikipedia or You
have no right to
Dead wood has been suggested, but I strongly disagree with it. While there
are issues and it needs careful work (nobody's denying that) I'm not seeing
hard evidence that so many BLPs - even minor BLPs - are the train wreck that
some represent nor as hard to manage as some portray.
What I wouldn't
In a message dated 5/22/2011 1:35:51 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
wiki-l...@phizz.demon.co.uk writes:
There are many core problems that affect this issue. One of which is
'Verifiability not truth' which seems a laudable concept when applied to
hearsay, and to allow articles on the paranormal
Le 22/05/2011 10:54, Thomas Morton a écrit :
we have no
rights to participate in Wikipedia.
Regardless of the debate from where it comes, is this an accurate
decription of the rules and policies of Wikipedia?
Anyone who is willing and able to edit constructively and more or less
follow our
On 22 May 2011 11:58, Chris Keating chriskeatingw...@gmail.com wrote:
Also rather interestingly, it appears that a Scottish newspaper has revealed
the identity of the footballer in question, on the grounds that English
superinjunctions don't apply in Scotland.
I rather doubt that is their
If the consensus of the community is to ban you from the project, even
under
spurious grounds, there is nothing to stop them from doing so.
Tom
Community consensus will not permit that.
Fred
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In a message dated 5/22/2011 8:23:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
morton.tho...@googlemail.com writes:
But the idea that I have a right to edit Wikipedia or You
have no right to do that is incorrect, because WP is a private website.
You make the word private have no meaning.
What would be a
On 22 May 2011 11:58, Chris Keating chriskeatingw...@gmail.com wrote:
Also rather interestingly, it appears that a Scottish newspaper has
revealed
the identity of the footballer in question, on the grounds that English
superinjunctions don't apply in Scotland.
I rather doubt that is their
Thank you for your answer.
I discovered that Wikipedia was not a bureaucracy[1] in the link you
gave, that's encouraging. :)
[1]:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:NOT#Wikipedia_is_not_a_bureaucracy
Le 22/05/2011 12:23, Thomas Morton a écrit :
Yes. See:
In a message dated 5/22/2011 8:23:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
morton.tho...@googlemail.com writes:
But the idea that I have a right to edit Wikipedia or You
have no right to do that is incorrect, because WP is a private
website.
You make the word private have no meaning.
What would be
I'm note sure I understand... Wikipedia is privately owned by the
foundation. There is no real definition of public website, but I suppose a
government website would be publicly owned (although that raises an
interesting question as to your rights to access/contribute to such a
website).
The
On Fri, May 20, 2011 at 6:14 PM, Thomas Morton
morton.tho...@googlemail.com wrote:
Also; hard to see anyone suing you for communicating the info for the
purposes of supressing it :-)
Tom Morton
A few years ago, I would have said the same about communicating the
info for the purposes of free
As it is the community does regulate it in that way.
No. People are banned or restricted all the time. The point of WP:FREESPEECH
is to point out that those bannings can't be contested under the premise
that the banned party has a right to edit.
Yes, the community does regulate it this way.
I'm note sure I understand... Wikipedia is privately owned by the
foundation. There is no real definition of public website, but I
suppose a
government website would be publicly owned (although that raises an
interesting question as to your rights to access/contribute to such a
website).
An interesting aside on this would be...
What is the quality of the foreign-language Wiki's that currently exist. For
example; the articles in my specific technical topic area have a few foreign
language equivalents. Most are two or three lines.
It would be interesting to see this question
In a message dated 5/22/2011 4:38:09 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
smole...@eunet.rs writes:
Aren't these languages written with Chinese characters and thus their
speakers can read and write the Chinese Wikipedia?
All the Latin languages: Italian, French, Spanish, English, and so on are
In a message dated 5/22/2011 9:31:30 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
fredb...@fairpoint.net writes:
Legally, Wikipedia is private property belonging to a nonprofit
corporation. If the United States government, or some other government,
owned it and regulated it in such a way as to guarantee public
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 12:42 PM, wjhon...@aol.com wrote:
Aren't these languages written with Chinese characters and thus their
speakers can read and write the Chinese Wikipedia?
All the Latin languages: Italian, French, Spanish, English, and so on are
written with Latin characters: a, b,
On 22 May 2011 17:22, geni geni...@gmail.com wrote:
On 22 May 2011 11:58, Chris Keating chriskeatingw...@gmail.com wrote:
Also rather interestingly, it appears that a Scottish newspaper has revealed
the identity of the footballer in question, on the grounds that English
superinjunctions don't
On 22/05/2011 11:58, Chris Keating wrote:
Also rather interestingly, it appears that a Scottish newspaper has revealed
the identity of the footballer in question, on the grounds that English
superinjunctions don't apply in Scotland.
Perhaps the WMF should open an office in Edinburgh, if
In a message dated 5/22/2011 9:53:08 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
li...@caseybrown.org writes:
Indeed, it doesn't mean that necessarily. However, your analogy
doesn't apply in this situation and Nikola was right. Many of the
Chinese languages share a common writing system and only differ in
Hoi,
Please read about the Chinese language and writing system. It helps you to
understand.
Thanks,
GerardM
On 22 May 2011 18:42, wjhon...@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 5/22/2011 4:38:09 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
smole...@eunet.rs writes:
Aren't these languages written with
I agree Meta would be the right place for such a table. But a few
other columns would be helpful:
1 Technical barriers. Do we need to make changes to Media Wiki
Software, and are we dependent on changes to Lynux etc in order to
enable people to edit in that language?
2 Literate population. This
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 7:13 PM, wjhon...@aol.com wrote:
You're missing my point.
All the Latin languages share a common writing system and only differ in
the way the language is spoken.
Address the point that the words within the system have the same semantic
*meaning* and are formed with
In a message dated 5/22/2011 9:31:30 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
fredb...@fairpoint.net writes:
Legally, Wikipedia is private property belonging to a nonprofit
corporation. If the United States government, or some other government,
owned it and regulated it in such a way as to guarantee
In a message dated 5/22/2011 10:39:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
andreeng...@gmail.com writes:
In Chinese writing a character shows a word, irrespective of how the
word is pronounced. So if we would use a Chinese style writing system,
you could write [your] [dog] [is] [dead], and a Frenchman
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 11:00, wiki-l...@phizz.demon.co.uk wrote:
On 22/05/2011 11:58, Chris Keating wrote:
Also rather interestingly, it appears that a Scottish newspaper has revealed
the identity of the footballer in question, on the grounds that English
superinjunctions don't apply in
On Sat, May 21, 2011 at 21:22, Philippe Beaudette
phili...@wikimedia.org wrote:
I asked Christine to do a quick scan, what follows is her response:
*There isn't an exact BLP queue in OTRS; there is one for overall quality
(called, what else, Quality) which is where a lot of the BLP concerns
Дана Sunday 22 May 2011 19:53:20 wjhon...@aol.com написа:
So if you are claiming that the sole differences are pronunciation, then
this language should be removed from the list of ones lacking a project.
I'm not certain however that that claim can be supported.
Given that no one of us is
Dear all fellow wikipedian and wikimedians
I am so pleased to announce some minutes ago Farsi wikipedia has reached
15 articles.
Mardetanha
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On 22/05/2011 19:32, Sarah wrote:
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 11:00, wiki-l...@phizz.demon.co.uk wrote:
On 22/05/2011 11:58, Chris Keating wrote:
Also rather interestingly, it appears that a Scottish newspaper has revealed
the identity of the footballer in question, on the grounds that
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 13:33, wiki-l...@phizz.demon.co.uk wrote:
On 22/05/2011 19:32, Sarah wrote:
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 11:00, wiki-l...@phizz.demon.co.uk wrote:
On 22/05/2011 11:58, Chris Keating wrote:
Also rather interestingly, it appears that a Scottish newspaper has
On May 22, 2011, at 3:20 PM, Mardetanha wrote:
Dear all fellow wikipedian and wikimedians
I am so pleased to announce some minutes ago Farsi wikipedia has reached
15 articles.
Mardetanha
Congratulations!
-Dan
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On 22 May 2011 20:39, Sarah slimvir...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 13:33, wiki-l...@phizz.demon.co.uk wrote:
On 22/05/2011 19:32, Sarah wrote:
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 11:00, wiki-l...@phizz.demon.co.uk wrote:
On 22/05/2011 11:58, Chris Keating wrote:
Also rather
Well, whatever he meant, it isn't his decision. The WMF's legal dept
has recently published their draft policies, which includes one on
subpoenas [1]. It basically says that, unless lives are at stake, they
will only comply with US subpoenas. For US subpoenas, they'll decide
whether to
On 05/22/2011 06:41 PM, Thomas Morton wrote:
An interesting aside on this would be...
What is the quality of the foreign-language Wiki's that currently exist. For
example; the articles in my specific technical topic area have a few foreign
language equivalents. Most are two or three lines.
On 22 May 2011 19:58, Sarah slimvir...@gmail.com wrote:
The BLP problem is a very divisive one on the English Wikipedia, but
it's not entirely clear how grounded it is in fact. Sometimes we're
told OTRS is overwhelmed by the number of BLP complaints, but no
figures are given.
Some hard
Milos Rancic, 22/05/2011 11:29:
Do we have a referent list of wikis? Although it would be good to have
the list of *all* Wikimedia wikis, just the list of content projects
wikis would be fine.
Do you mean something like
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:SiteMatrix ?
Nemo
On 22 May 2011 23:03, Andrew Gray andrew.g...@dunelm.org.uk wrote:
Writing to someone involved with the issue personally is always more
complicated, especially if they're - justifiably - angry or worried
about the situation. The problems are often quite complex, so can sit
longer while people
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 11:18 PM, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote:
On 05/22/2011 06:41 PM, Thomas Morton wrote:
An interesting aside on this would be...
What is the quality of the foreign-language Wiki's that currently exist. For
example; the articles in my specific technical topic area
On Sun, May 22, 2011 at 5:30 AM, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote:
(excellent long form work)
Thank you, Milos. Very informative.
Out of curiosity - I assume those are the native speakers counts for
that language. Do we have exclusive speakers counts as well?
I don't know for sure what
my personal interpretation is that BLP failings were more likely to
be seen and more likely to cause some kind of real or perceived
harm, leading to a greater response rate.
I suppose that if your a notable figure... you probably take a look to see
if a Wikipedia article exists... and even
Sorry Milos, systematic bias at work there :)
I mean... English Wikipedia has the largest collection of content, and on
average I would guess that the content is of a higher, or at least a more
complete, quality than most other language wiki's. Computer forensics... is
relatively decent on en-wp;
On 23 May 2011 00:03, FT2 ft2.w...@gmail.com wrote:
Out of interest, when a BLP is created and not speedy deleted, could we not
write a standard email to the subject stating that a biographical article
has been created on them on the online encyclopedia Wikipedia, inviting
them to review it,
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