From: Alan McKinnon [mailto:alan.mckin...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2012 6:08 PM
On Tue, 25 Dec 2012 10:56:52 +0700
Pandu Poluan pa...@poluan.info wrote:
In case you haven't noticed, since Windows 7 (or Vista, forget which)
Microsoft has even went the distance of
On Fri, 4 Jan 2013 18:22:37 -0500
Mike Edenfield kut...@kutulu.org wrote:
I have never personally run into any case
where I had a single /+/usr and regretted it, but I *have* encountered
situations where I could not get /usr mounted and ended up merging it
with /. FWIW, YMMV, etc.
And why
On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 3:00 PM, Paul Colquhoun
paul...@andor.dropbear.id.au wrote:
I'd certainly be happy fixing FHS to say that tools for mounting and
recovering essential system partitions be located in /, and that these
essential system partitions contain the tools for mounting and
On Sun, 30 Dec 2012 20:19:44 +0800
Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com wrote:
I'd certainly be happy fixing FHS to say that tools for mounting
and recovering essential system partitions be located in /, and
that these essential system partitions contain the tools for
mounting and
The latest FHS dates from 2004, the same year as the *earliest* FUSE release
I
can see on the FUSE web site. I'd say a good working hypothesis is that FHS
was simply written *before* any user-space file systems were more than an
experimental oddity.
IF the system's /home directory
Should perl be in / or /usr?
Now that is a good question, if only because Perl traditionally _loathes_
being in /bin, for its own philosophical reasons.
Now, as a practical matter? WTF are the scripts written in Perl? Or in
anything other than sh? If they're intended for emergency
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 9:10 AM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
Should perl be in / or /usr?
Now that is a good question, if only because Perl traditionally _loathes_
being in /bin, for its own philosophical reasons.
Now, as a practical matter? WTF are the scripts written in
TLDR: FHS is unrealistic about its promises. if we move our binaries /
libraries to /usr and work it to make sure /usr is mounted, we will
better serve FHS goals and also happen to fix some systemic, but
silent bugs.
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 12:20 PM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu,
On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 01:16:34AM +0800, Mark David Dumlao wrote:
TLDR: FHS is unrealistic about its promises. if we move our binaries /
libraries to /usr and work it to make sure /usr is mounted, we will
better serve FHS goals and also happen to fix some systemic, but
silent bugs.
On
On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 1:33 AM, Bruce Hill
da...@happypenguincomputers.com wrote:
Dang, I got an Excedrin® headache!
Heh. Mike said he was game.
--
This email is:[ ] actionable [ ] fyi[x] social
Response needed: [ ] yes [x] up to you [ ] no
Time-sensitive: [ ]
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 12:46 PM, Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 1:33 AM, Bruce Hill
da...@happypenguincomputers.com wrote:
Dang, I got an Excedrin® headache!
Heh. Mike said he was game.
It's going to have to wait a bit. I'm not going to be able to get to
On 2012-12-28 00:24, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
Well, yeah, that's the point. I want to install Gentoo in my mother's
PC, and never have to go to her house because someting broke.
I really don't have the time nor the inclination to continue this but...
Why would you in that case install Gentoo
On Sat, 29 Dec 2012 01:16:34 +0800
Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com wrote:
whatever filesystem type
it is.
Following this, for any distro to correctly FHS, there needs to be a
package manager switch to copy arbitrary packages (and dependent
libraries) from /usr to /. As of yet not
On Thu, 27 Dec 2012 17:38:15 -0600
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
In SysV, I can *write* the daemon in the init script.
In *that* sense, the init system tells the daemon how to do things,
Please explain, sure there is the environment that tells a daemon what
to do. No shell can
On 12/28/12 13:15, pk wrote:
On 2012-12-28 00:24, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
Well, yeah, that's the point. I want to install Gentoo in my mother's
PC, and never have to go to her house because someting broke.
I really don't have the time nor the inclination to continue this but...
Why
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 12:15 PM, pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-12-28 00:24, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
Well, yeah, that's the point. I want to install Gentoo in my mother's
PC, and never have to go to her house because someting broke.
I really don't have the time nor the inclination
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 12:53 PM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Thu, 27 Dec 2012 17:38:15 -0600
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
In SysV, I can *write* the daemon in the init script.
In *that* sense, the init system tells the daemon how to do things,
Please
On Dec 29, 2012 2:18 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
Stop thinking in sshd. I can write the *whole* daemon in shell, not in
another script file, but inside /etc/init.d/mystupiddaemon (or
/etc/rc.whatever); shell is Turing-complete, I can write in it
anything I can write in C
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 2:17 PM, Pandu Poluan pa...@poluan.info wrote:
On Dec 29, 2012 2:18 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
Stop thinking in sshd. I can write the *whole* daemon in shell, not in
another script file, but inside /etc/init.d/mystupiddaemon (or
/etc/rc.whatever);
On 2012-12-28 20:01, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
Because I prefer Gentoo?
That's what I really don't understand! You say you don't want to care
about the system which implies Fedora or any other install-and-forget
distro. I care about the system which is why I run Gentoo. Do you have
USE=* in
On Fri, 28 Dec 2012 13:14:46 -0600
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 12:53 PM, Kevin Chadwick
ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Thu, 27 Dec 2012 17:38:15 -0600
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
In SysV, I can *write* the daemon in the init
On Thu, 27 Dec 2012 11:02:54 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote:
Again, I don't really care about the pain - in a sick sense I sort of
like it (more if it wore high heels...) - but I'm gonna learn this
initramfs stuff and make it work because I suspect it's at least a
good thing to know.
I said the
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 4:40 PM, pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-12-28 20:01, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
Because I prefer Gentoo?
That's what I really don't understand! You say you don't want to care
about the system which implies Fedora or any other install-and-forget
distro. I care
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 5:23 PM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Fri, 28 Dec 2012 13:14:46 -0600
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 12:53 PM, Kevin Chadwick
ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Thu, 27 Dec 2012 17:38:15 -0600
Canek Peláez Valdés
On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 4:17 AM, Pandu Poluan pa...@poluan.info wrote:
An example: A dev needs a newer version of a package. We upgrade it. It
refuses to startup properly, but going back is out of the question because
the dev *needs* the features only available in the new version. We check the
On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 2:53 AM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2012 01:16:34 +0800
Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com wrote:
whatever filesystem type
it is.
Following this, for any distro to correctly FHS, there needs to be a
package manager switch to copy
On Sat, 29 Dec 2012 12:27:03 Mark David Dumlao wrote:
On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 2:53 AM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk
wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2012 01:16:34 +0800
Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com wrote:
whatever filesystem type
it is.
Following this, for any distro to
On 2012-12-27 02:14, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
I really think that's the crux of the matter Pandou: udev/systemd
serves to the wants of the many. The eudev fork serves to the wants of
systemd+udev serves the large mass (users of mainly Fedora and other
distros using systemd) that doesn't
Mark David Dumlao wrote:
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 4:42 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Mark David Dumlao wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 10:38 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Feel free to set me straight tho. As long as you don't tell me my
system is broken and has not been able to
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 8:13 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
I think your analogy actually proves my point. Instead of just getting
in the car and turning the key, they want to reinvent the engine and how
it works. It doesn't matter that it is and has been working for decades,
Thanks
Again you don't break the spec unless you have to and you don't change
the spec unless it is an improvement or you have no choice. Non of
which is the case. Just like you do not mould a mail RFC to a
widely used technically inferior hotmail implementation.
He's like DJB on crack.
Except DJB
* Finally, and what I think is the most fundamental difference between
systemd and almost any other init system: The service unit files in
systemd are *declarative*; you tell the daemon *what* to do, not *how*
to do it. If the service files are shell scripts (like in
OpenRC/SysV), everything
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 12:13 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Mark David Dumlao wrote:
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 4:42 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Mark David Dumlao wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 10:38 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Feel free to set me straight tho. As long
Mark David Dumlao wrote:
I think your reaction proves my point about angry mobs torching his
home without understanding what's being proposed. Your fine reading
comprehension once again failed to catch the notion that in my
analogy, all he invented was a mechanism that makes sure it was a key,
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 12:28 AM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
Again you don't break the spec unless you have to and you don't change
the spec unless it is an improvement or you have no choice. Non of
which is the case. Just like you do not mould a mail RFC to a
widely used
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 2:15 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
So I guess Linus is confused to?
In your head, and only in your head, you're agreeing with Linus. Linus
was talking about a different bug entirely from the one you're talking
about.
The bug you're talking about: you go on and on
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 1:22 PM, Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.comwrote:
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 12:28 AM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk
wrote:
Again you don't break the spec unless you have to and you don't change
the spec unless it is an improvement or you have no choice. Non
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 1:31 PM, Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.comwrote:
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 2:15 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
So I guess Linus is confused to?
In your head, and only in your head, you're agreeing with Linus. Linus
was talking about a different bug entirely
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 10:41 AM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
SNIP
1) initramfs. It's not that hard
2) early mount script. It's not that hard.
3) modify your udev ebuild to install to /. It's not that hard.
If you'd read the thread (and/or related ones), you'd know he tried to go
Am Sonntag, 23. Dezember 2012, 19:03:25 schrieb Nuno J. Silva:
Then I suppose you can surely explain in a nutshell why can't init
scripts simply do that?
because some people decided, that fsck or that dynamic /dev/ populator depends
on stuff in /usr? which is the reason for this thread?
How
Am Sonntag, 23. Dezember 2012, 19:44:43 schrieb Nuno J. Silva:
On 2012-12-23, Alan Mackenzie wrote:
On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 07:03:25PM +0200, Nuno J. Silva wrote:
On 2012-12-23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
On Sun, 23 Dec 2012 12:22:24 +0200
nunojsi...@ist.utl.pt (Nuno J. Silva) wrote:
On Thu, 27 Dec 2012 20:43:12 +0100, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
and a device node in /dev - like /dev/sda2. And how do you get that one
without udev?
CONFIG_DEVTMPFS=y
Of course, that only helps if /usr is on a plain old disk block device.
--
Neil Bothwick
No, you *can't* call 999 now.
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 2:43 PM, Volker Armin Hemmann
volkerar...@googlemail.com wrote:
Am Sonntag, 23. Dezember 2012, 19:44:43 schrieb Nuno J. Silva:
On 2012-12-23, Alan Mackenzie wrote:
On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 07:03:25PM +0200, Nuno J. Silva wrote:
On 2012-12-23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
On 2012-12-27, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
Am Sonntag, 23. Dezember 2012, 19:44:43 schrieb Nuno J. Silva:
On 2012-12-23, Alan Mackenzie wrote:
On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 07:03:25PM +0200, Nuno J. Silva wrote:
On 2012-12-23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
On Sun, 23 Dec 2012 12:22:24 +0200
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 2:40 AM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
or the fact that some udev programs tend to
be located in /usr,
That's either a bug with those programs, or a need for architectural
improvements within udev. Both plausible answers.
The most obvious architectural
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 2:40 AM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
or the fact that some udev programs tend to
be located in /usr,
That's either a bug with those programs, or a need for architectural
Mark Knecht wrote:
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 10:41 AM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
SNIP
1) initramfs. It's not that hard
2) early mount script. It's not that hard.
3) modify your udev ebuild to install to /. It's not that hard.
If you'd read the thread (and/or related ones), you'd
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 4:59 AM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 2:40 AM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
or the fact that some udev programs tend to
be located in /usr,
That's
On Tue, 25 Dec 2012 10:56:52 +0700
Pandu Poluan pa...@poluan.info wrote:
In case you haven't noticed, since Windows 7 (or Vista, forget which)
Microsoft has even went the distance of splitting between C:
(analogous to /usr) and 'System Partition' (analogous to /). The boot
process is actually
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 10:00 AM, pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-12-27 02:14, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
I really think that's the crux of the matter Pandou: udev/systemd
serves to the wants of the many. The eudev fork serves to the wants of
systemd+udev serves the large mass (users
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 10:29 AM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
* Finally, and what I think is the most fundamental difference between
systemd and almost any other init system: The service unit files in
systemd are *declarative*; you tell the daemon *what* to do, not *how*
to do
On Mon, 24 Dec 2012 15:14:11 +
Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
Are there any other cases, apart from emotional attachment based on
inertia, where a separate / and /usr are desirable? As I see it,
there is only the system, and it is an atomic unit.
You should really read
Am Donnerstag, 27. Dezember 2012, 07:45:24 schrieb Pandu Poluan:
On Dec 26, 2012 1:05 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
Even Linus piped up at one point, sharply reminding
Greg KH that even though udev was at one time Greg's 'baby', at this point
udev serves only the wants of the
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 02:06:27AM +0100, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
Am Donnerstag, 27. Dezember 2012, 07:45:24 schrieb Pandu Poluan:
On Dec 26, 2012 1:05 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
Even Linus piped up at one point, sharply reminding
Greg KH that even though udev was
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 5:37 PM, Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com
wrote:
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 4:59 AM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com
wrote:
On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 2:40 AM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, 25 Dec 2012 17:26:12 -0600, Bruce Hill wrote:
Try reading the kernel Documentation. (e.g.,
/usr/src/linux/Documentation/filesystems/ramfs-rootfs-initramfs.txt.)
initramfs is an improvement over initrd.
Having read it years ago it still fails to give me a good reason for
using
On Wed, 26 Dec 2012 09:54:49 +1100, Paul Colquhoun wrote:
Also, if you actually read the linked URL, it does explain it won't
fail to boot. You do realize these are two different issues here,
right? One is people saying that udev-181 will fail to boot, other is
the issue described on the
On 2012-12-26 12:55, Neil Bothwick wrote:
That all makes sense, although it may well be harder to implement
than to suggest. To be fair to the udev developers, we owe them
nothing and they are free to take their project in whichever
direction they like and spend their time on whatever
* Bruce Hill da...@happypenguincomputers.com [121225 18:30]:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 11:51:43AM -0500, Todd Goodman wrote:
Same question ... initrd.gz and initramfs are *not* the same thing; and
there
was a package called mkinitrd in Gentoo that was retired to attic some
time
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 9:54 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Mark David Dumlao wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 1:15 AM, Bruce Hill
da...@happypenguincomputers.com wrote:
On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 11:05:25AM -0600, Dale wrote:
Bruce Hill wrote:
SNIP
No initrd...
YET!!! ROFL
When
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 10:38 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Feel free to set me straight tho. As long as you don't tell me my
system is broken and has not been able to boot for the last 9 years
without one of those things. ROFL
Nobody's telling you _your_ system, as in the collection
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 09:24:20AM -0500, Todd Goodman wrote:
* Bruce Hill da...@happypenguincomputers.com [121225 18:30]:
Try reading the kernel Documentation. (e.g.,
/usr/src/linux/Documentation/filesystems/ramfs-rootfs-initramfs.txt.)
initramfs is an improvement over initrd.
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 09:24:55PM -0600, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
snip systemd fanboi text
And then months later has the nerve of calling my use of the word
fuck (in which I wasn't insulting anyone) as offensive:
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.user/261318
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 9:03 AM, Bruce Hill
da...@happypenguincomputers.com wrote:
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 09:24:20AM -0500, Todd Goodman wrote:
* Bruce Hill da...@happypenguincomputers.com [121225 18:30]:
Try reading the kernel Documentation. (e.g.,
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 11:13 AM, Bruce Hill
da...@happypenguincomputers.com wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 09:24:55PM -0600, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
snip systemd fanboi text
And then months later has the nerve of calling my use of the word
fuck (in which I wasn't insulting anyone) as
Mark Knecht wrote:
One interesting small point I got out of the docs that Neil pointed me
toward: That since linux-2.6 we're all using an initramfs The 2.6
kernel build process always creates a gzipped cpio format initramfs
archive and links it into the resulting kernel binary. By default,
Mark David Dumlao wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 10:38 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Feel free to set me straight tho. As long as you don't tell me my
system is broken and has not been able to boot for the last 9 years
without one of those things. ROFL
Nobody's telling you _your_
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 12:34 PM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Mark Knecht wrote:
One interesting small point I got out of the docs that Neil pointed me
toward: That since linux-2.6 we're all using an initramfs The 2.6
kernel build process always creates a gzipped cpio format initramfs
On Tue, 25 Dec 2012 02:01:13 -0600
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
To the OP of this OT sub-thread. The main difference for me is OpenRC
removes some of the symlink mess and uncertainty compared to for
example debians init. I very much like OpenRC but my fav is still
OpenBSD that
On Tue, 25 Dec 2012 07:09:49 +0800
William Kenworthy bi...@iinet.net.au wrote:
Not all the proposed changes are bad ... a read only /usr would be
nice, but I object to being forced into what I regard as an unreliable
configuration (or use unreliable, crappy software, eg pulse audio!)
because
On Tue, 25 Dec 2012 08:56:38 -0500
Joshua Murphy poiso...@gmail.com wrote:
It would still be a (notable, at that) drop
in size if the shell script was redone to provide exactly the same set
of features, then compared, but that size difference wouldn't have the
same shock value as the
On Thu, 27 Dec 2012 00:01:58 +0800
Mark David Dumlao madum...@gmail.com wrote:
Nobody's telling you _your_ system, as in the collection of programs
you use for your productivity, is broken. What we're saying is that
_the_ system, as in the general practice as compared to the
specification, is
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 4:19 PM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Tue, 25 Dec 2012 02:01:13 -0600
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
To the OP of this OT sub-thread. The main difference for me is OpenRC
removes some of the symlink mess and uncertainty compared to for
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 6:01 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
[snip]
I didn't started the thread, Wolfe did. I just answered his question
from my point of view.
And, what community is being divided? Fedora,OpenSuse, and Arch use
systemd by default. Gentoo derivative Exherbo
On Wed, 26 Dec 2012 17:01:17 -0600
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
And, what community is being divided? Fedora,OpenSuse, and Arch use
systemd by default.
From debian and hurd to slackware which will not touch systemd ever and
ubuntu and also embedded with the kernel working on
On Dec 26, 2012 1:05 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
{supersnip}
So, no, I'm not trying to answer if you could create a /usr service
and make things dependent on /usr come after it's been mounted. I
passed almost this entire thread because it's mostly people still
hitting
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 5:51 PM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 6:01 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
[snip]
I didn't started the thread, Wolfe did. I just answered his question
from my point of view.
And, what community is being divided?
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 6:45 PM, Pandu Poluan pa...@poluan.info wrote:
On Dec 26, 2012 1:05 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
{supersnip}
Canek, I distinctly remember, at the very beginning of this brouhaha over
udev requiring /usr to be mounted at boot time, you stated
On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 7:14 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
[ snip ]
I'm sorry if sounded like scoffing (certainly I don't remember
scoffing anyone, at least consciously). I remember I praised Walt for
doing the work for mdev. Do you remember that? I can dig the archives,
but
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 4:42 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Mark David Dumlao wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 10:38 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Feel free to set me straight tho. As long as you don't tell me my
system is broken and has not been able to boot for the last 9 years
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 1:38 AM, G.Wolfe Woodbury redwo...@gmail.com wrote:
[ snip ]
From what has been happening with the systemd stuff, I do not see what
advantages it really offers over the SysV scheme and its successors like
OpenRC. Someone enlighten me please?
I wrote the following some
On 12/25/2012 03:01 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 1:38 AM, G.Wolfe Woodbury redwo...@gmail.com wrote:
[ snip ]
From what has been happening with the systemd stuff, I do not see what
advantages it really offers over the SysV scheme and its successors like
OpenRC.
On Mon, 24 Dec 2012 12:58:57 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:
Are there any other cases, apart from emotional attachment based on
inertia, where a separate / and /usr are desirable? As I see it, there
is only the system, and it is an atomic unit.
Yes, you need to run an encrypted root but don't
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 02:10:28PM +0200, Nuno J. Silva wrote:
No, actually it doesn't. It just has the same kind of very generic claim
that has been repeated several times in this thread (which is why?
because it won't work) and links to an article that explains why some
udev rules would
On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 08:38:30PM -0600, Dale wrote:
Bruce Hill wrote:
On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 06:29:07PM -0600, »Q« wrote:
On Mon, 24 Dec 2012 17:04:13 -0600
Bruce Hill da...@happypenguincomputers.com wrote:
Gentoo had mkinitrd once upon a time, but it's now in attic.
Somewhere,
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 10:56:52AM +0700, Pandu Poluan wrote:
When you're in charge of over 100 servers as the back-end of a
multinational company that has a revenue in excess of 10 million USD per
day, even a temporary outage means the CIO, COO, and CEO breathing down
your neck.
Who is in
On Dec 25, 2012 3:04 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 1:38 AM, G.Wolfe Woodbury redwo...@gmail.com
wrote:
[ snip ]
From what has been happening with the systemd stuff, I do not see what
advantages it really offers over the SysV scheme and its
On Dec 25, 2012 8:07 AM, Bruce Hill da...@happypenguincomputers.com
wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 10:56:52AM +0700, Pandu Poluan wrote:
When you're in charge of over 100 servers as the back-end of a
multinational company that has a revenue in excess of 10 million USD per
day, even a
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 3:01 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
[ snip ]
* Really simple service unit files: The service unit files are really
small, really simple, really easy to understand/modify. Compare the 9
lines of sshd.service:
$ cat /etc/systemd/system/sshd.service
On Dec 25, 2012 8:07 PM, Bruce Hill da...@happypenguincomputers.com
wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 10:56:52AM +0700, Pandu Poluan wrote:
When you're in charge of over 100 servers as the back-end of a
multinational company that has a revenue in excess of 10 million USD per
day, even a
Bruce Hill wrote:
On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 08:38:30PM -0600, Dale wrote:
Bruce Hill wrote:
On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 06:29:07PM -0600, »Q« wrote:
On Mon, 24 Dec 2012 17:04:13 -0600
Bruce Hill da...@happypenguincomputers.com wrote:
Gentoo had mkinitrd once upon a time, but it's now in attic.
Nuno J. Silva wrote:
On 2012-12-25, Bruce Hill wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 02:10:28PM +0200, Nuno J. Silva wrote:
No, actually it doesn't. It just has the same kind of very generic claim
that has been repeated several times in this thread (which is why?
because it won't work) and links to
* Bruce Hill da...@happypenguincomputers.com [121224 21:17]:
On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 04:54:08PM -0800, Mark Knecht wrote:
On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 4:29 PM, »Q« boxc...@gmx.net wrote:
On Mon, 24 Dec 2012 17:04:13 -0600
Bruce Hill da...@happypenguincomputers.com wrote:
Gentoo had
Nuno J. Silva wrote:
On 2012-12-25, Dale wrote:
Quoting from Gentoo news item:
Which was exactly the thing I was commenting on above, ok.
[...]
Now are you saying the Gentoo devs are lying to us? Careful now. Could
end up on a slippery slope and bump your head. That says anything BEFORE
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 7:14 AM, Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
On Dec 25, 2012 3:04 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 1:38 AM, G.Wolfe Woodbury redwo...@gmail.com
wrote:
[ snip ]
From what has been happening with the systemd stuff, I do not see
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 7:56 AM, Joshua Murphy poiso...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Dec 25, 2012 at 3:01 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
[ snip ]
* Really simple service unit files: The service unit files are really
small, really simple, really easy to understand/modify. Compare
On Tue, 25 Dec 2012 07:09:49 +0800, William Kenworthy wrote:
I used initrd's many years ago, and separate /usr and/ until on a redhat
system I rebooted with an out of sequence initrd and kernel on a
critical server (the sort of thing that puts your employment at risk
when there are 20 odd
Neil Bothwick wrote:
On Tue, 25 Dec 2012 07:09:49 +0800, William Kenworthy wrote:
I used initrd's many years ago, and separate /usr and/ until on a redhat
system I rebooted with an out of sequence initrd and kernel on a
critical server (the sort of thing that puts your employment at risk
On Mon, 24 Dec 2012 20:33:34 -0600, Dale wrote:
Putting /usr on LVM is not the problem. I have had /usr on LVM for a
good long while now. It has booted just fine. The new udev is what is
going to break it, whether I use LVM or not from what has been said on
this list and elsewhere.
I've
On Mon, 24 Dec 2012 13:23:16 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote:
I don't like, really don't like, the work that currently goes into
making my 'init thingy' work. All the Gentoo docs about creating
hierarchies by hand and populating them with files and then compressing
it. All that drives me nuts. It
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