Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Monday 12 April 2010 18:33:21 KH wrote: Am 12.04.2010 14:57, schrieb Alan McKinnon: [...] 2. when devs commit to ~arch, they tend to run ~arch on their test boxes. Issues are easy to spot and get fixed quickly. If you have a mixture of the two, then you have a combination that no-one but you is using, and it will not have been tested. The odds are good that you will often run into problems that are hard to trace (conflicting versions of packages). Running ~arch is actually more stable than a mixture as many folk have those packages and there are more eyeballs on it. Hi, someone always brings that up. I think it might be right when mixing packages randomly. But not everybody is doing that. Let's say: I only like to have personas for firefox. Unmasking firefox, xulrunner, nss and two more will not bring you in the problem mentioned. In general I believe this is true for any program as long as it doesn't need a general library or anything like that unmasked. What you say is true enough - I usually recommend folks unmask portage as well to get the automated blocker resolving featurs and sets. But it usually doesn't end there. Once users have a recent Firefox, they probably eventually unmask gnome as well, openrc, etc, etc and before you know it, you have a mess. So, in the rare case of a user who can discipline himself to say within the limits you describe, your advice is fine. But that's a theoretical situation :-) and the real one is quite different in my experience. -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Tue, 2010-04-13 at 09:09 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote: On Monday 12 April 2010 18:33:21 KH wrote: Am 12.04.2010 14:57, schrieb Alan McKinnon: So, in the rare case of a user who can discipline himself to say within the limits you describe, your advice is fine. But that's a theoretical situation :-) and the real one is quite different in my experience. This is exactly how I manage a number of gentoo systems - only unmasking versions I need. Ive actually never done a ~ system :) However, on the other side of the coin is the fact I have also never run a completely stable system either because I have never been able to get the task done a system was built for without at least a few unstable packages. For an extreme example, remember when X was masked for some security problem leaving stable with no X windows system (think it was back in the xfree86 days). You will quite often find that when trying to build even a basic system, you have to keyword a few packages or you get nowhere. And if its a complex 1000 pkg plus system, you are definitely going to have problems. One hint I can give for long term stability is to try and specify versions (either with = or ~) rather than just an open keywording. Otherwise it gets out of hand with many unmasked packages needed and needing maintaining on upgrades. BillK
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 12:30 AM, William Kenworthy bi...@iinet.net.au wrote: On Tue, 2010-04-13 at 09:09 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote: On Monday 12 April 2010 18:33:21 KH wrote: Am 12.04.2010 14:57, schrieb Alan McKinnon: So, in the rare case of a user who can discipline himself to say within the limits you describe, your advice is fine. But that's a theoretical situation :-) and the real one is quite different in my experience. This is exactly how I manage a number of gentoo systems - only unmasking versions I need. Ive actually never done a ~ system :) It's an experience. Like you in the past I've keyworded what I needed and it's worked great for 10 years. OK, so I've been pushing forward and finally I'm emerge -e @world clean. xfce still doesn't work right. It's in fact pretty unusable at the moment as it has no menus at all, but it's only a backup environment so I'm going to ignore that for the moment and build KDE which should be done in about 2 hours. Notes about what I think happened here: 1) I missed the message about running perl-cleaner so I had to do that. 2) I had a gcc build that didn't allow the profile to get set so emerge -1 gcc fixed that. 3) After that I tried emerge -e @system, emerge -e @world which failed with more perl issues, but the same package seemed to be part of @system and emerge -e @system was clean. A second pass at emerge -e @world failed the same way. Thinking back to the old days, and I know folks have negative opinions about this, I did emerge -e @system TWICE in a row, and then emerge -e @world worked. Go figure. I'm going to finish KDE and see if it works. If it does then cool, I'll stick with ~amd64. If not I'm deleting the partitions and starting over with stable. I've invested a day and a half in this experiment and my results are not leaving me comfortable. I need to the machine to work so I can use it starting this afternoon. Thanks, Mark Cheers, Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 7:40 AM, Mark Knecht markkne...@gmail.com wrote: Notes about what I think happened here: 1) I missed the message about running perl-cleaner so I had to do that. 2) I had a gcc build that didn't allow the profile to get set so emerge -1 gcc fixed that. 3) After that I tried emerge -e @system, emerge -e @world which failed with more perl issues, but the same package seemed to be part of @system and emerge -e @system was clean. A second pass at emerge -e @world failed the same way. Thinking back to the old days, and I know folks have negative opinions about this, I did emerge -e @system TWICE in a row, and then emerge -e @world worked. Go figure. I'm going to finish KDE and see if it works. If it does then cool, I'll stick with ~amd64. If not I'm deleting the partitions and starting over with stable. I've invested a day and a half in this experiment and my results are not leaving me comfortable. I need to the machine to work so I can use it starting this afternoon. I think you've gotten through the hard part and it should hopefully work well from here. The gcc-config thing I have run into before after a new gcc version (unrelated to migrating from amd64 to ~amd64), but I don't think the ebuild tells you to do that...
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 7:40 AM, Mark Knecht markkne...@gmail.com wrote: OK, so I've been pushing forward and finally I'm emerge -e @world clean. xfce still doesn't work right. It's in fact pretty unusable at the moment as it has no menus at all, but it's only a backup environment so I'm going to ignore that for the moment and build KDE which should be done in about 2 hours. Double-check that xfce-base/xfdesktop package has the menu-plugin USE flag set (and also double-check that xfdesktop is running at all when you're logged into xfce). Run xfconf, maybe it needs to generate the configuration files, or try creating a new user and logging in as that to see if it's just your user's xfce config that is wacky for some reason. :)
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 8:12 AM, Paul Hartman paul.hartman+gen...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 7:40 AM, Mark Knecht markkne...@gmail.com wrote: Notes about what I think happened here: 1) I missed the message about running perl-cleaner so I had to do that. 2) I had a gcc build that didn't allow the profile to get set so emerge -1 gcc fixed that. 3) After that I tried emerge -e @system, emerge -e @world which failed with more perl issues, but the same package seemed to be part of @system and emerge -e @system was clean. A second pass at emerge -e @world failed the same way. Thinking back to the old days, and I know folks have negative opinions about this, I did emerge -e @system TWICE in a row, and then emerge -e @world worked. Go figure. I'm going to finish KDE and see if it works. If it does then cool, I'll stick with ~amd64. If not I'm deleting the partitions and starting over with stable. I've invested a day and a half in this experiment and my results are not leaving me comfortable. I need to the machine to work so I can use it starting this afternoon. I think you've gotten through the hard part and it should hopefully work well from here. The gcc-config thing I have run into before after a new gcc version (unrelated to migrating from amd64 to ~amd64), but I don't think the ebuild tells you to do that... Hi Paul, The KDE install completed although it did quit in the middle saying a 'make failed!'. I restarted the emerge and it finished clean the second time. The machine is now emerge -DuN @world clean and I'm writing you from within KDE. So good so far. One minor annoyance is that the task bar at the bottom is about 1/3 black on the left. Resolution is 1920x1080 so I'd guess about the first 800 pixels are painted the wrong color. The task bar still works, it just doesn't look right. This install is now running xorg-server-1.8 with all the latest drivers, but there was an announcement last night on LKML about 2.6.34_rc4 which had a number of ati driver improvements so I'll have to wait for someone to update vanilla-sources to support that. I'm currently running vanilla-2.6.34_rc3. I don't really want to deal with git-sources unless I need to. Comments? As this is a very usable environment I'll stick with it for now. However in parallel I'm doing to do a stable build on another partition of my RAID just in case I need to fall back to stable for some reason. Thanks for your help, as well as everyone else. Cheers, Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
Mark Knecht writes: One minor annoyance is that the task bar at the bottom is about 1/3 black on the left. Resolution is 1920x1080 so I'd guess about the first 800 pixels are painted the wrong color. The task bar still works, it just doesn't look right. I think I have the same problem, although not all the time. I happens only sometimes after I run opengl Software like Quake3, or other games that change the graphics resolution. What sometimes works is to turn off compositing with Alt-Shift-F12 and on again. Wonko
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 10:34 AM, Alex Schuster wo...@wonkology.org wrote: Mark Knecht writes: One minor annoyance is that the task bar at the bottom is about 1/3 black on the left. Resolution is 1920x1080 so I'd guess about the first 800 pixels are painted the wrong color. The task bar still works, it just doesn't look right. I think I have the same problem, although not all the time. I happens only sometimes after I run opengl Software like Quake3, or other games that change the graphics resolution. What sometimes works is to turn off compositing with Alt-Shift-F12 and on again. Wonko Thanks. Seems I have this all the time in ~amd64. I didn't see it on (mostly) stable. (Stable system, stable KDE, mostly stable apps, ~amd64 xorg-server drivers) Alt-Shift-F12 isn't doing anything for me. In a few hours I'll have a second (and stable) install on the same system so I can boot into each and compare results. Until then at least ~amd64 is working well enough that I can do a little work. I'll report back when I know anything new. Again, thanks for the ideas. Cheers, Mark
[gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
...is not so good actually. Certainly not the way I'd want others to experience Gentoo. OK, the ~amd64 upgrade to @system was easy and relatively painless. The documents were fairly clear. There are things to learn, and old friends like rc-update and df look different, but it worked and didn't take long - less than an hour to reboot including editing - so that's good. Unfortunately, simply allowing all environments apps on the system to go ~amd64 isn't working out as nicely. 1) xfce4 had one build failure. I masked it and the build finished. xfce starts and seems to mostly work, but I get no wallpaper and the right click for a menu on the desktop doesn't work. It's usable, but clearly 'not stable'. 2) gnome-2.28 simply doesn't build. 3) I'm currently left with lots of things in emerge @preserved-rebuild that don't build. emerge -DuN @world is not clean. QUESTION: Assume I'm happy with ~amd64 on @system, but want to build the stable version of gnome or kde. How do I get it? Since gnome-2.26 worked yesterday I tried masking =gnome-2.28. emerge -DuN gnome. Portage then didn't try to emerge the meta-package but doesn't take all of gnome back to 2.26. There's no point trying kde as gnome pulled in kde components that doesn't build either. Hopefully it's not 'mask every package in gnome by hand'. At this point I'm left with a system that's not clean and to me not terribly useful. Yesterday as stable I built xfce, gnome and kde in under 4 hours and all 3 worked. Today both gnome and xfce aren't right and I don't have kde. Probably this is some matter of learning to hold back portage that I've never done before, rather than unleashing new packages like you do on a stable system. How does one accomplish this? Thanks, Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
Are you merely ranting or asking for help? If the former, well, OK i Hear you. But I don't care. If the latter, then you need to provide info like logs, output etc. ~amd64 works like a charm for me here. On Monday 12 April 2010 13:57:39 Mark Knecht wrote: ...is not so good actually. Certainly not the way I'd want others to experience Gentoo. OK, the ~amd64 upgrade to @system was easy and relatively painless. The documents were fairly clear. There are things to learn, and old friends like rc-update and df look different, but it worked and didn't take long - less than an hour to reboot including editing - so that's good. Unfortunately, simply allowing all environments apps on the system to go ~amd64 isn't working out as nicely. 1) xfce4 had one build failure. I masked it and the build finished. xfce starts and seems to mostly work, but I get no wallpaper and the right click for a menu on the desktop doesn't work. It's usable, but clearly 'not stable'. 2) gnome-2.28 simply doesn't build. 3) I'm currently left with lots of things in emerge @preserved-rebuild that don't build. emerge -DuN @world is not clean. QUESTION: Assume I'm happy with ~amd64 on @system, but want to build the stable version of gnome or kde. How do I get it? Since gnome-2.26 worked yesterday I tried masking =gnome-2.28. emerge -DuN gnome. Portage then didn't try to emerge the meta-package but doesn't take all of gnome back to 2.26. There's no point trying kde as gnome pulled in kde components that doesn't build either. Hopefully it's not 'mask every package in gnome by hand'. At this point I'm left with a system that's not clean and to me not terribly useful. Yesterday as stable I built xfce, gnome and kde in under 4 hours and all 3 worked. Today both gnome and xfce aren't right and I don't have kde. Probably this is some matter of learning to hold back portage that I've never done before, rather than unleashing new packages like you do on a stable system. How does one accomplish this? Thanks, Mark -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 04:57:39AM -0700, Mark Knecht wrote: ...is not so good actually. Certainly not the way I'd want others to experience Gentoo. OK, the ~amd64 upgrade to @system was easy and relatively painless. The documents were fairly clear. There are things to learn, and old friends like rc-update and df look different, but it worked and didn't take long - less than an hour to reboot including editing - so that's good. Unfortunately, simply allowing all environments apps on the system to go ~amd64 isn't working out as nicely. 1) xfce4 had one build failure. I masked it and the build finished. xfce starts and seems to mostly work, but I get no wallpaper and the right click for a menu on the desktop doesn't work. It's usable, but clearly 'not stable'. Are there any bugs on this? Perhaps it's a configurations thing :-) 2) gnome-2.28 simply doesn't build. Attatch the log? I doubt I can help you, but I'm pretty sure someone else on the list will be able to :-) 3) I'm currently left with lots of things in emerge @preserved-rebuild that don't build. emerge -DuN @world is not clean. it isn't? The way I see it, it's every bit as clean as emerge -DuN world, the difference is that now there's a set to take care of what revdep-rebuild did. I could be mistaken then ;) QUESTION: Assume I'm happy with ~amd64 on @system, but want to build the stable version of gnome or kde. How do I get it? Since gnome-2.26 worked yesterday I tried masking =gnome-2.28. emerge -DuN gnome. Portage then didn't try to emerge the meta-package but doesn't take all of gnome back to 2.26. There's no point trying kde as gnome pulled in kde components that doesn't build either. Hopefully it's not 'mask every package in gnome by hand'. The way to hold packages back would be adding foo/bar -~arch to your package.keywords file. That way portage will only look at the stable packages. It's tedious to do it by hand (and I don't know any automated process), but if most of your system will be running ~arch then I'd suggest that you stay ~arch, and vice versa if most of the system is running arch. At this point I'm left with a system that's not clean and to me not terribly useful. Yesterday as stable I built xfce, gnome and kde in under 4 hours and all 3 worked. Today both gnome and xfce aren't right and I don't have kde. Probably this is some matter of learning to hold back portage that I've never done before, rather than unleashing new packages like you do on a stable system. How does one accomplish this? Thanks, Mark Hope it helps :-) -- Zeerak Waseem pgpg5d5RuLYNb.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 5:00 AM, Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com wrote: Are you merely ranting or asking for help? If the former, well, OK i Hear you. But I don't care. If the latter, then you need to provide info like logs, output etc. ~amd64 works like a charm for me here. Neither. I think I asked a simple question. How does one get ~amd64 @system and stable everything else? If the answer is 'you can't' or 'it's immensely hard because you have to -~arch everything by hand' then I'll just go back to stable, whether it is easy or requires me to rebuild the system from scratch. I'm certainly not ranting. I don't think that tone should came across in what I wrote and if you're reading that in then it's on your end not mine. (Although I apologize for writing anything that made that happen!) I have __nothing__ on this system. The hardware is brand new. It's been said time and time again that running all ~arch on other people's systems (like yours) works great and I wanted to try it. It's certainly not working for me at this point but I'm not upset, mad, or anything like that. I'm asking a simple question. That's it. Nothing more. I am however documenting my experiences for others than come after me to this question of to ~amd64 or not ~amd64. Nothing more. It worked for Alan who is a __very__ experienced and capable person. It didn't work for Mark (at this point) who is a 10 year Gentoo user but __nothing__ more than a user type Those people can decide who they are closer to in capabilities and make their choice a bit more informed. I didn't wake up this morning thinking I could do what you and Neil and others on this list can with this distro. I'm not that silly! I just wanted to try ~amd64 to see what happened. It will take me less than 90 minutes to get to a new clean install if I blow everything away and start over. It's not a big deal. - Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 5:14 AM, Zeerak Mustafa Waseem zeera...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 04:57:39AM -0700, Mark Knecht wrote: ...is not so good actually. Certainly not the way I'd want others to experience Gentoo. OK, the ~amd64 upgrade to @system was easy and relatively painless. The documents were fairly clear. There are things to learn, and old friends like rc-update and df look different, but it worked and didn't take long - less than an hour to reboot including editing - so that's good. Unfortunately, simply allowing all environments apps on the system to go ~amd64 isn't working out as nicely. 1) xfce4 had one build failure. I masked it and the build finished. xfce starts and seems to mostly work, but I get no wallpaper and the right click for a menu on the desktop doesn't work. It's usable, but clearly 'not stable'. Are there any bugs on this? Perhaps it's a configurations thing :-) Between xfce4 gnome I've seen about a dozen packages fail to build this morning and haven't yet checked bug reports. I suspect that many or more kde packages would get added to the list if I tried ~amd64 kde. I'm sure you're possibly right about it being a 'configuration thing'. SNIP QUESTION: Assume I'm happy with ~amd64 on @system, but want to build the stable version of gnome or kde. How do I get it? Since gnome-2.26 worked yesterday I tried masking =gnome-2.28. emerge -DuN gnome. Portage then didn't try to emerge the meta-package but doesn't take all of gnome back to 2.26. There's no point trying kde as gnome pulled in kde components that doesn't build either. Hopefully it's not 'mask every package in gnome by hand'. The way to hold packages back would be adding foo/bar -~arch to your package.keywords file. That way portage will only look at the stable packages. It's tedious to do it by hand (and I don't know any automated process), but if most of your system will be running ~arch then I'd suggest that you stay ~arch, and vice versa if most of the system is running arch. Thanks. The -~arch thing is what I was looking for info wise. However doing that to all of gnome or kde's packages is too much work. SNIP Hope it helps :-) -- Zeerak Waseem It does, very much! Thanks! Cheers, Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
I am however documenting my experiences for others than come after me to this question of to ~amd64 or not ~amd64. Nothing more. It worked for Alan who is a __very__ experienced and capable person. It didn't work for Mark (at this point) who is a 10 year Gentoo user but __nothing__ more than a user type Those people can decide who they are closer to in capabilities and make their choice a bit more informed. I didn't wake up this morning thinking I could do what you and Neil and others on this list can with this distro. I'm not that silly! I just wanted to try ~amd64 to see what happened. It will take me less than 90 minutes to get to a new clean install if I blow everything away and start over. It's not a big deal. - Mark Is there a reason why you want to run all @system as ~amd64, and the rest stable. To me it makes more sense (especially for production systems) to run @system as stable and only ~amd64 those apps and dependencies you want/need to be bleeding edge. Anyhow, what I really wanted to say is for more sensible unmasking, check out autounmask: moriah home # esearch autounmask [ Results for search key : autounmask ] [ Applications found : 1 ] * app-portage/autounmask Latest version available: 0.27 Latest version installed: [ Not Installed ] Size of downloaded files: 3 kB Homepage:http://download.mpsna.de/opensource/autounmask/ Description: autounmask - Unmasking packages the easy way License: GPL-2 moriah home #
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 5:42 AM, William Kenworthy bi...@iinet.net.au wrote: I am however documenting my experiences for others than come after me to this question of to ~amd64 or not ~amd64. Nothing more. It worked for Alan who is a __very__ experienced and capable person. It didn't work for Mark (at this point) who is a 10 year Gentoo user but __nothing__ more than a user type Those people can decide who they are closer to in capabilities and make their choice a bit more informed. I didn't wake up this morning thinking I could do what you and Neil and others on this list can with this distro. I'm not that silly! I just wanted to try ~amd64 to see what happened. It will take me less than 90 minutes to get to a new clean install if I blow everything away and start over. It's not a big deal. - Mark Is there a reason why you want to run all @system as ~amd64, and the rest stable. To me it makes more sense (especially for production systems) to run @system as stable and only ~amd64 those apps and dependencies you want/need to be bleeding edge. Anyhow, what I really wanted to say is for more sensible unmasking, check out autounmask: moriah home # esearch autounmask [ Results for search key : autounmask ] [ Applications found : 1 ] * app-portage/autounmask Latest version available: 0.27 Latest version installed: [ Not Installed ] Size of downloaded files: 3 kB Homepage: http://download.mpsna.de/opensource/autounmask/ Description: autounmask - Unmasking packages the easy way License: GPL-2 moriah home # William, In general I agree logically. There was no _strong_ reason for me to run ~arch on anything. I just wanted to try it out since the machine was new and this was a good time to get the experience vs having lots of stuff on the machine and trying to switch later. ~arch @system was mainly to get a jump on the OpenRC migration before I had so much stuff on the system that I couldn't afford to just reformat and start over if I had problems with it. Having done it once I now know it won't be difficult later when it moves to stable. ~arch xfce/gnome/kde on the other hand is not something I needed. It just comes with ~arch and for me didn't work so well. For me the desktop environment is mostly just a platform to get a browser or VMWare up and running. kde and it's brethren move forward but the revision level changes hardly impact me in normal life. Again, based on Alan's response, this isn't about me being upset or anything like that. I'm not upset in the least. Just trying things out. Thanks, Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Monday 12 April 2010 14:29:00 Mark Knecht wrote: On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 5:00 AM, Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com wrote: Are you merely ranting or asking for help? If the former, well, OK i Hear you. But I don't care. If the latter, then you need to provide info like logs, output etc. ~amd64 works like a charm for me here. Neither. I think I asked a simple question. How does one get ~amd64 @system and stable everything else? If the answer is 'you can't' or 'it's immensely hard because you have to -~arch everything by hand' then I'll just go back to stable, whether it is easy or requires me to rebuild the system from scratch. You can't do that easily, and it certainly is not advisable. The only way I can think of would be to put every package in @system into package.keywords and leave ACCEPT_KEYWORDS at arch. This will cause problems: 1. stable is just that: stable. By and large the full stable set is known to work 2. when devs commit to ~arch, they tend to run ~arch on their test boxes. Issues are easy to spot and get fixed quickly. If you have a mixture of the two, then you have a combination that no-one but you is using, and it will not have been tested. The odds are good that you will often run into problems that are hard to trace (conflicting versions of packages). Running ~arch is actually more stable than a mixture as many folk have those packages and there are more eyeballs on it. I'm certainly not ranting. I don't think that tone should came across in what I wrote and if you're reading that in then it's on your end not mine. (Although I apologize for writing anything that made that happen!) I have __nothing__ on this system. The hardware is brand new. It's been said time and time again that running all ~arch on other people's systems (like yours) works great and I wanted to try it. It's certainly not working for me at this point but I'm not upset, mad, or anything like that. I'm asking a simple question. That's it. Nothing more. I am however documenting my experiences for others than come after me to this question of to ~amd64 or not ~amd64. Nothing more. It worked for Alan who is a __very__ experienced and capable person. It didn't work for Mark (at this point) who is a 10 year Gentoo user but __nothing__ more than a user type Those people can decide who they are closer to in capabilities and make their choice a bit more informed. I didn't wake up this morning thinking I could do what you and Neil and others on this list can with this distro. I'm not that silly! I just wanted to try ~amd64 to see what happened. It will take me less than 90 minutes to get to a new clean install if I blow everything away and start over. It's not a big deal. Considering the kind of software you use, I'd advise you to just run ~amd64 and be done with it. Your usage-profile is of someone who needs recent features. I would only go back to amd64 if some genuine show-stopper blockage pops up, or if the packages you use are updated often (and usually with brand new shiny bugs - enlightenment is a lot like that which is why I had to stop using it) -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Mon, 12 Apr 2010 05:29:00 -0700, Mark Knecht wrote: It's certainly not working for me at this point but I'm not upset, mad, or anything like that. I'm asking a simple question. That's it. Except you didn't really ask a question, at least not in manner that could be answered. Posting the output of the failures would make it a question that could be answered. While you are getting multiple failures, there may only be one or two problems, fix those and everything should fall into place. -- Neil Bothwick I'm not anti-social, I'm just not user friendly signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 6:57 AM, Mark Knecht markkne...@gmail.com wrote:
...is not so good actually. Certainly not the way I'd want others to
experience Gentoo.
OK, the ~amd64 upgrade to @system was easy and relatively painless.
The documents were fairly clear. There are things to learn, and old
friends like rc-update and df look different, but it worked and didn't
take long - less than an hour to reboot including editing - so that's
good.
Unfortunately, simply allowing all environments apps on the system
to go ~amd64 isn't working out as nicely.
1) xfce4 had one build failure. I masked it and the build finished.
xfce starts and seems to mostly work, but I get no wallpaper and the
right click for a menu on the desktop doesn't work. It's usable, but
clearly 'not stable'.
Hi,
I'm using ~amd64 for my whole system (for years). I have a similar
system to yours, but only a Core i7 920, :) and at the moment every
package on my system builds fine.
Which package failed? Which profile and GCC are you using? I just
emerged xfce4-meta and everything worked. Here's my GCC, profile and
xfce versions (I also use unmasked portage):
[ebuild R ] sys-devel/gcc-4.4.3 USE=fortran gcj graphite gtk
mudflap (multilib) nls nptl objc objc++ objc-gc openmp (-altivec)
-bootstrap -build -doc (-fixed-point) (-hardened) (-libffi) -multislot
(-n32) (-n64) -nocxx -test -vanilla 0 kB
$ sudo gcc-config -l
[1] x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-4.4.3 *
$ sudo eselect profile show
Current make.profile symlink:
default/linux/amd64/10.0/desktop
My cflags:
CFLAGS=-march=native -O3 -floop-interchange -floop-strip-mine
-floop-block -ggdb -pipe
CXXFLAGS=${CFLAGS}
LDFLAGS=-Wl,--as-needed
$ emerge -vp xfce4-meta
These are the packages that would be merged, in order:
Calculating dependencies... done!
[ebuild N] xfce-base/libxfce4util-4.7.1 USE=-debug 0 kB
[ebuild N] dev-util/xfce4-dev-tools-4.7.2 0 kB
[ebuild N] x11-themes/xfce4-icon-theme-4.4.3 0 kB
[ebuild N] x11-themes/gtk-engines-xfce-2.6.0 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/xfconf-4.7.2 USE=perl -debug -profile 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/exo-0.3.106 USE=hal libnotify python -debug 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/libxfce4menu-4.6.1 USE=-debug 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/libxfcegui4-4.6.3 USE=startup-notification
-debug -glade 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/xfce4-panel-4.6.2-r1
USE=startup-notification -debug 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/xfce-utils-4.6.1 USE=dbus lock -debug 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/xfwm4-4.6.1 USE=startup-notification
xcomposite -debug 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/xfce4-settings-4.6.3-r1 USE=keyboard
libnotify -debug -sound 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/xfce4-session-4.6.1-r1 USE=-debug -fortune
-gnome -gnome-keyring -profile 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/thunar-1.0.1 USE=dbus exif hal pcre
startup-notification trash-plugin -debug -doc -gnome -test 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/xfdesktop-4.6.1-r1 USE=branding
menu-plugin thunar -debug -doc LINGUAS=-be -ca -cs -da -de -el -es
-et -eu -fi -fr -he -hu -it -ja -ko -nb_NO -nl -pa -pl -pt_BR -ro -ru
-sk -sv -tr -uk -vi -zh_CN -zh_TW 0 kB
[ebuild N] xfce-base/xfce4-meta-4.6.1 USE=session -minimal 0 kB
The xfce wallpaper thing sounds like what I experienced with xfce
during the jpeg-6-to-7 upgrade process. At the time, jpeg was not
slotted and there was jpeg-compat for programs that were incompatible
with jpeg-7. Now we have jpeg-8 as well, and 6/7/8 are in slots, so
maybe the solution is different. Back then, I unmerged and masked
jpeg-6, revdep-rebuild everything that depended on jpeg so that it was
built against jpeg-7 and then everything was fine. (Maybe there was a
gtk+ patch I had to apply on day 0, but that was long ago made
obsolete by newer versions of gtk+ in portage)
2) gnome-2.28 simply doesn't build.
I'm not a gnome user but I can try this if you want (135 packages to
emerge in my case), or if you have more specific info about which part
doesn't build I can try only the specifics.
3) I'm currently left with lots of things in emerge @preserved-rebuild
that don't build. emerge -DuN @world is not clean.
Maybe you can unmerge those packages, allowing emerge to get rid of
the preserved libs, then emerge world to bring those packages back.
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
Am 12.04.2010 14:57, schrieb Alan McKinnon: [...] 2. when devs commit to ~arch, they tend to run ~arch on their test boxes. Issues are easy to spot and get fixed quickly. If you have a mixture of the two, then you have a combination that no-one but you is using, and it will not have been tested. The odds are good that you will often run into problems that are hard to trace (conflicting versions of packages). Running ~arch is actually more stable than a mixture as many folk have those packages and there are more eyeballs on it. Hi, someone always brings that up. I think it might be right when mixing packages randomly. But not everybody is doing that. Let's say: I only like to have personas for firefox. Unmasking firefox, xulrunner, nss and two more will not bring you in the problem mentioned. In general I believe this is true for any program as long as it doesn't need a general library or anything like that unmasked. kh
Re: [gentoo-user] ~amd64 - my experience so far...
On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Paul Hartman paul.hartman+gen...@gmail.com wrote: I'm not a gnome user but I can try this if you want (135 packages to emerge in my case), or if you have more specific info about which part doesn't build I can try only the specifics. I went ahead and emerged gnome-base/gnome-2.28.2 while I was at lunch. All packages emerged properly without any issues. So the good news is there's nothing apparently wrong with ~amd64 in general, and it's probably a configuration difference between my system and yours, or maybe growing pains if you have still got some packages at amd64 and some at ~amd64. If you'd like to compare set-ups I'd be happy to try to help you get it sorted out (either on list or in email).
