Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-04 Thread Jarry

Joseph wrote:


I have port knocking installed on firewall, to further protect any SSH
attacks. 
So port 22 is closed (in stealth mode) and only opens if it received the

right knock sequence, moreover it is only opened to an IP address from
which received successful knock sequence; all others see this port as
closed (in stealth mode).


Hm, never heard of it...
How can this methot be installed and used with gentoo/iptables?
Any more info about it?

Jarry

--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list




Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-04 Thread Peter De Zutter
This document should give you some info

http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_Port_Knocking
Peter

On 8/4/05, Jarry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Joseph wrote: I have port knocking installed on firewall, to further protect any SSH attacks. So port 22 is closed (in stealth mode) and only opens if it received the right knock sequence, moreover it is only opened to an IP address from
 which received successful knock sequence; all others see this port as closed (in stealth mode).Hm, never heard of it...How can this methot be installed and used with gentoo/iptables?Any more info about it?
Jarry--gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list-- I have plenty of common sense, I just choose to ignore it. 
--- Calvin


Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-03 Thread Eric S. Johansson

Colin wrote:


On Aug 2, 2005, at 7:50 PM, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales wrote:


Hi there,

   I was wondering what tools should I use to detect security flaws to
my server and a few tips on how to use them. What are the most common
forms of attack and how do I avoid being attacked by one of them?

   The services avaliable are only Apache - SSL and SSH. I've
installed an firewall, iptables and firestarter to control it, and
blocked all ports except 443 and 8080, where the SSH is listening.
Apache has PHP installed as a module.



Want to know how secure your server is?  Try and hack it!


a better place to start would be a simple inventory of what you are 
running, its version, configuration and what you want to run.  If 
there's a delta, justify or fix.  no need to do any sort of Port 
scanning or penetration testing 80% of the time.


a simple inventory most of your security questions right off the bat. 
Of course it's not as sexy or ego inflating as running penetration tools 
but it gives you one thing the others don't.  And audit trail. 
Something you can show to your lawyers and insurance people that you 
practiced due diligence in knowing your system vulnerabilities.


if you are running Apache however you do need to run some form of attack 
because it is trivially easy to write an Apache configuration which 
leaves you butt naked to the world and not know it until you've been had.


there are similarly complex services (i.e. Samba) that leave you easily 
vulnerable.


so my advice would be to use more secure and easily secured alternatives 
whenever possible.


A good port scanner like nmap should be a basic check of your  
firewall.  I would also set nmap (if it can do this) to perform a SYN  
flood as it scans, to see if your server can withstand that basic DoS  
attack.  (Adding --syn to your TCP rules in iptables can prevent SYN  
flooding when used with SYN cookies.)  When you break in, find out  why 
it worked and how it can be patched.


Some things I would advise (I'm currently working on a server at the  
moment as well):
 - If the server is really important (or if you're paranoid), use  the 
hardened-sources with PIE/SSP to prevent badly-written programs  from 
arbitrarily executing code.


you should run this no matter what.  There is no excuse to leaving 
yourself vulnerable to these kinds of attacks if there is a method of 
catching them.  Security is not just a single layer.  It's multiple 
layers of good coding, language used, and operating system provided 
barriers.  Since developers insist on using languages like C, C++ 
providing features behind most security problems, you really need 
PIE/SSP in place for when the inevitable mistake happens.


 - Enable SYN flood protection.  There's a kernel option somewhere  
about IPv4 SYN cookies, enable that, and couple it with --syn  attached 
to your TCP rules in iptables.  It's a very popular denial- of-service 
attack.


again, never run without it.  That way you don't need to do any testing 
because the problem is handled.


 - Whenever you need to login or authenticate yourself, make the  system 
delay five seconds after a bad password is entered.  This will  make a 
brute-force attack much much slower (0.2 passwords/sec as  opposed to 
millions passwords/sec without a delay, depending on your  server's speed).


again should be built-in to system services.  Why do it yourself and 
risk error?


 - Make sure iptables is set to deny all traffic that isn't  explicitly 
allowed.


apparently good statement but let's look at the implications.

if the services aren't on and there is nothing listening on the port, 
this isn't really necessary.  if the services are on but not needed, see 
recommendation above about turning them off.


if services are needed on one interface but not the other, bind to the 
right interface.  It would make sense to use a deny rule in case 
something goes wrong.


if you are providing services to the net at large, deny rules are not 
practical.


If you're providing services to a limited number of people on the net at 
large, you need to worry more about authentication and communications 
confidentiality.


If you are providing services internally, may be practical in some 
cases, but more likely to bite you in the butt when things change on the 
internal network.


that's all the cases I can think of, any others?

 - Read through your logs every now and then.  I highly advise  having 
the server burn them to a CD/floppy every now and then for an  instant 
backup.  Get a log reader/parser, too.


very good advice.  I personally like the idea of storing logs on another 
machine.  But a log reader/parser to bring out the highlights.  Also be 
prepared to spend hours every day verifying each log quirk.  Whenever 
possible, try to eliminate noise from the logs so you can pull out the 
real information necessary to detect problems.




Naturally, hide the server in the attic or basement.  Chain it to  

Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-03 Thread Eric S. Johansson

Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales wrote:

He claims that if someone invades my machine, it will have direct
access to all data. That I have to distribute the database, put it in
another machine and have the web application access that database over
the network. I feel this is a bit overkill. Not only it would force
the data travel through the network, slowing it down, but would also
increase the complexity of the security layout, forcing to make the
two machines very secure, unstead of just one of them. Besides, I
might be wrong, but I feel that a Local Socket is faster and safer
than Corba trasmitting data over the internal network.

If anybody has any comments, I'd be more than happy to hear it.


first, on the issue of distributing, yes, you will have a nominally more 
secure application.  This assumes of course that the attacker cannot 
take any part of your application and use it against you by accessing 
the database themselves.


the interesting paradox is that by moving your application to another 
machine and using a network between them for communicating data, the 
application usually runs faster.


Think carefully about the RPC mechanism.  Don't try to reinvent the 
wheel with your own socket connection because you will spend a lot of 
time getting it right and validating it when you could be doing other 
things that are more fun, productive, and impressing your boss with your 
lack of not invented here attitude.


corba is complex to get started but it is one of the faster RPC 
mechanisms available (if memory serves).  XML RPC is trivially easy to 
use but is much slower because of XML.  Sun RPC.  Well, it's a gray 
beard.  Try not to use it.


On the security profile, don't sweat it.  The best you can do is set out 
the local machine firewalls to deny access from each other except for 
the database connection.  ssh should only be permitted from your green 
network.  Everything else really depends on what you need exposed and where.


connection security can be handled with SSL.  Many database engines 
support this (if memory serves).



---eric
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-03 Thread Joseph
On Tue, 2005-08-02 at 23:50 +, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales
wrote:
 Hi there,
 
I was wondering what tools should I use to detect security flaws to
 my server and a few tips on how to use them. What are the most common
 forms of attack and how do I avoid being attacked by one of them?
 
The services avaliable are only Apache - SSL and SSH. I've
 installed an firewall, iptables and firestarter to control it, and
 blocked all ports except 443 and 8080, where the SSH is listening.
 Apache has PHP installed as a module.
 
 Thanks for the attention,
 
 Raphael.

I have port knocking installed on firewall, to further protect any SSH
attacks. 
So port 22 is closed (in stealth mode) and only opens if it received the
right knock sequence, moreover it is only opened to an IP address from
which received successful knock sequence; all others see this port as
closed (in stealth mode).

-- 
#Joseph
-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-03 Thread Ryan Viljoen
Joseph could you direct me toward a how to on how to set that up, please.

Raphael have you gone through
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/security/index.xml it has some good
points and worth going through and ticking off each one.

Cheers
Rav

On 8/3/05, Joseph [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Tue, 2005-08-02 at 23:50 +, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales
 wrote:
  Hi there,
 
 I was wondering what tools should I use to detect security flaws to
  my server and a few tips on how to use them. What are the most common
  forms of attack and how do I avoid being attacked by one of them?
 
 The services avaliable are only Apache - SSL and SSH. I've
  installed an firewall, iptables and firestarter to control it, and
  blocked all ports except 443 and 8080, where the SSH is listening.
  Apache has PHP installed as a module.
 
  Thanks for the attention,
 
  Raphael.
 
 I have port knocking installed on firewall, to further protect any SSH
 attacks.
 So port 22 is closed (in stealth mode) and only opens if it received the
 right knock sequence, moreover it is only opened to an IP address from
 which received successful knock sequence; all others see this port as
 closed (in stealth mode).
 
 --
 #Joseph
 --
 gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
 
 


-- 
When you play a Microsoft CD backwards you can hear demonic Voices...
that's nothing - when you play it forward it installs Windows
Are you fearing my mouse? :3___)

-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-03 Thread Joseph
On Wed, 2005-08-03 at 23:37 +0200, Ryan Viljoen wrote:
 Joseph could you direct me toward a how to on how to set that up, please.

I use freesco firewall and they have small package (add-on) called
knock, you can install it on a floppy see my howto:
http://forums.freesco.org/support/index.php?showtopic=13731
but eventually I moved it to HD (as I had too much problems with 1.68Mb
floppies) 
My intension was to use this setup to print to a remote printer location
over SSH, and it works like a charm.

The knock demon runs on firewall (that is the best setup) and listen for
specific knock sequence.  You can open any port this way.  
If you have a Gentoo based firewall, knock in in portage but your
machine must more mussels to run Gentoo; and Freesco will run on any
door-stopper starting from 486. 

-- 
#Joseph

 Raphael have you gone through
 http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/security/index.xml it has some good
 points and worth going through and ticking off each one.
 
 Cheers
 Rav
 
 On 8/3/05, Joseph [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  On Tue, 2005-08-02 at 23:50 +, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales
  wrote:
   Hi there,
  
  I was wondering what tools should I use to detect security flaws to
   my server and a few tips on how to use them. What are the most common
   forms of attack and how do I avoid being attacked by one of them?
  
  The services avaliable are only Apache - SSL and SSH. I've
   installed an firewall, iptables and firestarter to control it, and
   blocked all ports except 443 and 8080, where the SSH is listening.
   Apache has PHP installed as a module.
  
   Thanks for the attention,
  
   Raphael.
  
  I have port knocking installed on firewall, to further protect any SSH
  attacks.
  So port 22 is closed (in stealth mode) and only opens if it received the
  right knock sequence, moreover it is only opened to an IP address from
  which received successful knock sequence; all others see this port as
  closed (in stealth mode).
  
  --
  #Joseph

-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread Peter De Zutter
Hi,
2 tools nmap and nessus for network/port scanning and others.
For hardering you could use bastille.
Of course all found in portage.
PeterOn 8/3/05, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi there, I was wondering what tools should I use to detect security flaws tomy server and a few tips on how to use them. What are the most commonforms of attack and how do I avoid being attacked by one of them?
 The services avaliable are only Apache - SSL and SSH. I'veinstalled an firewall, iptables and firestarter to control it, andblocked all ports except 443 and 8080, where the SSH is listening.Apache has PHP installed as a module.
Thanks for the attention,Raphael.--gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list-- I have plenty of common sense, 
I just choose to ignore it. --- Calvin


Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread Colin


On Aug 2, 2005, at 7:50 PM, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales wrote:


Hi there,

   I was wondering what tools should I use to detect security flaws to
my server and a few tips on how to use them. What are the most common
forms of attack and how do I avoid being attacked by one of them?

   The services avaliable are only Apache - SSL and SSH. I've
installed an firewall, iptables and firestarter to control it, and
blocked all ports except 443 and 8080, where the SSH is listening.
Apache has PHP installed as a module.



Want to know how secure your server is?  Try and hack it!

A good port scanner like nmap should be a basic check of your  
firewall.  I would also set nmap (if it can do this) to perform a SYN  
flood as it scans, to see if your server can withstand that basic DoS  
attack.  (Adding --syn to your TCP rules in iptables can prevent SYN  
flooding when used with SYN cookies.)  When you break in, find out  
why it worked and how it can be patched.


Some things I would advise (I'm currently working on a server at the  
moment as well):
 - If the server is really important (or if you're paranoid), use  
the hardened-sources with PIE/SSP to prevent badly-written programs  
from arbitrarily executing code.
 - Enable SYN flood protection.  There's a kernel option somewhere  
about IPv4 SYN cookies, enable that, and couple it with --syn  
attached to your TCP rules in iptables.  It's a very popular denial- 
of-service attack.
 - Whenever you need to login or authenticate yourself, make the  
system delay five seconds after a bad password is entered.  This will  
make a brute-force attack much much slower (0.2 passwords/sec as  
opposed to millions passwords/sec without a delay, depending on your  
server's speed).
 - Make sure iptables is set to deny all traffic that isn't  
explicitly allowed.

 - Turn off any services you don't need.
 - Read through your logs every now and then.  I highly advise  
having the server burn them to a CD/floppy every now and then for an  
instant backup.  Get a log reader/parser, too.


Naturally, hide the server in the attic or basement.  Chain it to  
something, or if it has a security slot, use a security cable.  Put a  
lock on the case door.  Unplug your floppy/CD drives if you're not  
using them.  As of this writing, there is no kernel option to keep  
your computer or its innards from walking away. :-)

--
Colin
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales
Thanks Peter.  I'm just finishing visiting the home page of almost
every package on the net-analyzer category. If I didn't have such a
short dead line, I'd test them all. ;)

2005/8/3, Peter De Zutter [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Hi,
  2 tools nmap and nessus for network/port scanning and others.
  For hardering you could use bastille.
  Of course all found in portage.
  Peter
 
 
 On 8/3/05, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
  
  Hi there,
  
 I was wondering what tools should I use to detect security flaws to
  my server and a few tips on how to use them. What are the most common
  forms of attack and how do I avoid being attacked by one of them? 
  
 The services avaliable are only Apache - SSL and SSH. I've
  installed an firewall, iptables and firestarter to control it, and
  blocked all ports except 443 and 8080, where the SSH is listening.
  Apache has PHP installed as a module. 
  
  Thanks for the attention,
  
  Raphael.
  
  --
  gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
  
  
 
 
 
 -- 
 I have plenty of common sense, 
 I just choose to ignore it. 
 --- Calvin


-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales
Hey Colin,

I was looking at the /etc/ssh/sshd_config file and found these:

LoginGraceTime 600
MaxAuthTries 6

Is the first one what you meant?

The second seems like an attempt to avoid brute force login. 

Also, does Grub need any kind of password protection? I don't know if
it was Grub or Lilo that allowed root access unless password
protected. Am I mistaken?

As you can see, I still have a lot to learn. ;)

2005/8/3, Colin [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 
 On Aug 2, 2005, at 7:50 PM, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales wrote:
 
  Hi there,
 
 I was wondering what tools should I use to detect security flaws to
  my server and a few tips on how to use them. What are the most common
  forms of attack and how do I avoid being attacked by one of them?
 
 The services avaliable are only Apache - SSL and SSH. I've
  installed an firewall, iptables and firestarter to control it, and
  blocked all ports except 443 and 8080, where the SSH is listening.
  Apache has PHP installed as a module.
 
 
 Want to know how secure your server is?  Try and hack it!
 
 A good port scanner like nmap should be a basic check of your
 firewall.  I would also set nmap (if it can do this) to perform a SYN
 flood as it scans, to see if your server can withstand that basic DoS
 attack.  (Adding --syn to your TCP rules in iptables can prevent SYN
 flooding when used with SYN cookies.)  When you break in, find out
 why it worked and how it can be patched.
 
 Some things I would advise (I'm currently working on a server at the
 moment as well):
   - If the server is really important (or if you're paranoid), use
 the hardened-sources with PIE/SSP to prevent badly-written programs
 from arbitrarily executing code.
   - Enable SYN flood protection.  There's a kernel option somewhere
 about IPv4 SYN cookies, enable that, and couple it with --syn
 attached to your TCP rules in iptables.  It's a very popular denial-
 of-service attack.
   - Whenever you need to login or authenticate yourself, make the
 system delay five seconds after a bad password is entered.  This will
 make a brute-force attack much much slower (0.2 passwords/sec as
 opposed to millions passwords/sec without a delay, depending on your
 server's speed).
   - Make sure iptables is set to deny all traffic that isn't
 explicitly allowed.
   - Turn off any services you don't need.
   - Read through your logs every now and then.  I highly advise
 having the server burn them to a CD/floppy every now and then for an
 instant backup.  Get a log reader/parser, too.
 
 Naturally, hide the server in the attic or basement.  Chain it to
 something, or if it has a security slot, use a security cable.  Put a
 lock on the case door.  Unplug your floppy/CD drives if you're not
 using them.  As of this writing, there is no kernel option to keep
 your computer or its innards from walking away. :-)
 --
 Colin
 --
 gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
 


-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread Colin


On Aug 2, 2005, at 9:18 PM, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales wrote:


Hey Colin,

I was looking at the /etc/ssh/sshd_config file and found these:

LoginGraceTime 600
MaxAuthTries 6

Is the first one what you meant?

The second seems like an attempt to avoid brute force login.



Neither is what I was thinking of, but they're quite similar.   
LoginGraceTime means if nobody logged in within 10 minutes of the  
connection being opened, then it will be closed.  I don't know  
exactly what MaxAuthTries does, but I imagine after the sixth invalid  
login, the connection would  be closed.


I found this site, check it out.  It's for Red Hat (Gentoo is  
better!), but it's the same SSHd:

http://www.faqs.org/docs/securing/chap15sec122.html



Also, does Grub need any kind of password protection? I don't know if
it was Grub or Lilo that allowed root access unless password
protected. Am I mistaken?


GRUB does have some password protection, but it is optional and only  
needed IIRC if you want to boot something other than the default entry.



As you can see, I still have a lot to learn. ;)


Me too.  I'm waiting for some more hardware to arrive before I  
connect this server to the networks (it's primarily a NAT gateway  
with iptables, but also *for the LAN, not the Internet* runs Apache,  
ProFTPd, SSHd and rsyncd for Portage).

--
Colin
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread Willie Wong
On Tue, Aug 02, 2005 at 09:43:17PM -0400, Colin wrote:
 Neither is what I was thinking of, but they're quite similar.   
 LoginGraceTime means if nobody logged in within 10 minutes of the  
 connection being opened, then it will be closed.  I don't know  
 exactly what MaxAuthTries does, but I imagine after the sixth invalid  
 login, the connection would  be closed.
 

Yes, and if the failure reaches half the number, all further failures
will be logged. In the case of
  MaxAuthTries 6
It means that the first three failures will go unnoticed, the fourth
through sixth logged, and the connection closes after that. 

There is, unfortunately, not an option in sshd_config to allow for the
behaviour you specified, where after a password failure, the next
prompt comes up delayed by five seconds. Perhaps if should be put as a
feature request (=.

Your best bet against brute forcing sshd is
  1) Not allowing password login at all
or
  2) Use some sort of IDS coupled with a firewall rule to block the
 particular host after multiple login failures. But even that
 won't stop a distributed brute force. But then again, if you are
 guarding a system that really demands that much security against
 a determined cracker, you really should consider NOT putting the
 system on the internet. 
or
  3) Maybe port-knocking? Note that just by running ssh on a 
 non-standard port, you probably are avoiding most of the 5||21p7
 kiddie attacks... again, only someone who really wants in on your
 system will take the effort to locate where sshd is listening. 

 I found this site, check it out.  It's for Red Hat (Gentoo is  
 better!), but it's the same SSHd:
 http://www.faqs.org/docs/securing/chap15sec122.html
-- 
It's easy to come up with new ideas; the hard
part is letting go of what worked for you two
years ago, but will soon be out of date.
-- Roger Von Oech
Sortir en Pantoufles: up 2 days,  9:25
-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales
Which IDS system do you recommend? I also need to worry about HTTP
auth brute force. Know any way to stop it from happening?

I've read about HoneyPots, which I can only assume is a decoy for an
attacker. Anyone knows how to set one up?

I have a feeling that there isn't much I can do if a pro actually
tries to break the system. All I can do is avoid the dummies from
doing it as well.

2005/8/3, Willie Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 On Tue, Aug 02, 2005 at 09:43:17PM -0400, Colin wrote:
  Neither is what I was thinking of, but they're quite similar.
  LoginGraceTime means if nobody logged in within 10 minutes of the
  connection being opened, then it will be closed.  I don't know
  exactly what MaxAuthTries does, but I imagine after the sixth invalid
  login, the connection would  be closed.
 
 
 Yes, and if the failure reaches half the number, all further failures
 will be logged. In the case of
   MaxAuthTries 6
 It means that the first three failures will go unnoticed, the fourth
 through sixth logged, and the connection closes after that.
 
 There is, unfortunately, not an option in sshd_config to allow for the
 behaviour you specified, where after a password failure, the next
 prompt comes up delayed by five seconds. Perhaps if should be put as a
 feature request (=.
 
 Your best bet against brute forcing sshd is
   1) Not allowing password login at all
 or
   2) Use some sort of IDS coupled with a firewall rule to block the
  particular host after multiple login failures. But even that
  won't stop a distributed brute force. But then again, if you are
  guarding a system that really demands that much security against
  a determined cracker, you really should consider NOT putting the
  system on the internet.
 or
   3) Maybe port-knocking? Note that just by running ssh on a
  non-standard port, you probably are avoiding most of the 5||21p7
  kiddie attacks... again, only someone who really wants in on your
  system will take the effort to locate where sshd is listening.
 
  I found this site, check it out.  It's for Red Hat (Gentoo is
  better!), but it's the same SSHd:
  http://www.faqs.org/docs/securing/chap15sec122.html
 --
 It's easy to come up with new ideas; the hard
 part is letting go of what worked for you two
 years ago, but will soon be out of date.
 -- Roger Von Oech
 Sortir en Pantoufles: up 2 days,  9:25
 --
 gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
 


-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread Willie Wong
On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 02:25:29AM +, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales 
wrote:
 Which IDS system do you recommend? I also need to worry about HTTP
 auth brute force. Know any way to stop it from happening?
 
 I've read about HoneyPots, which I can only assume is a decoy for an
 attacker. Anyone knows how to set one up?
 
 I have a feeling that there isn't much I can do if a pro actually
 tries to break the system. All I can do is avoid the dummies from
 doing it as well.
 

Beats me there? Guys? Thoughts?

I don't run an enterprise server. I am just a student q=. All I care
about is not having my own server rooted by script kiddies to serve
warez. 

With that said, since I found most IDS too powerful for my needs and
difficult to configure (too steep a learning curve for my limited
needs), I just code my own IDS in perl q=. 

I just have scripts that parse the server logs and look for trigger
conditions, at which time it blocks off the offending site or the
entire service for a set amount of time necessary. Pretty standard way
to deal with things I believe. 

But then, since you are really into security, perhaps you need better
systems. 

Finally, if you are just working with the SSH portion of the brute
forcing problem, /. had an article about it a few weeks back. There
were MANY IDS systems posted in the comments that specifically works
with openssh. 

HTH, 

W

 2005/8/3, Willie Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
  On Tue, Aug 02, 2005 at 09:43:17PM -0400, Colin wrote:
   Neither is what I was thinking of, but they're quite similar.
   LoginGraceTime means if nobody logged in within 10 minutes of the
   connection being opened, then it will be closed.  I don't know
   exactly what MaxAuthTries does, but I imagine after the sixth invalid
   login, the connection would  be closed.
  
  
  Yes, and if the failure reaches half the number, all further failures
  will be logged. In the case of
MaxAuthTries 6
  It means that the first three failures will go unnoticed, the fourth
  through sixth logged, and the connection closes after that.
  
  There is, unfortunately, not an option in sshd_config to allow for the
  behaviour you specified, where after a password failure, the next
  prompt comes up delayed by five seconds. Perhaps if should be put as a
  feature request (=.
  
  Your best bet against brute forcing sshd is
1) Not allowing password login at all
  or
2) Use some sort of IDS coupled with a firewall rule to block the
   particular host after multiple login failures. But even that
   won't stop a distributed brute force. But then again, if you are
   guarding a system that really demands that much security against
   a determined cracker, you really should consider NOT putting the
   system on the internet.
  or
3) Maybe port-knocking? Note that just by running ssh on a
   non-standard port, you probably are avoiding most of the 5||21p7
   kiddie attacks... again, only someone who really wants in on your
   system will take the effort to locate where sshd is listening.
  
   I found this site, check it out.  It's for Red Hat (Gentoo is
   better!), but it's the same SSHd:
   http://www.faqs.org/docs/securing/chap15sec122.html
  --
  It's easy to come up with new ideas; the hard
  part is letting go of what worked for you two
  years ago, but will soon be out of date.
  -- Roger Von Oech
  Sortir en Pantoufles: up 2 days,  9:25
  --
  gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
  
 
 
 -- 
 gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list

-- 
A nice box of chocolates can provide your total daily intake of calories
in one place.  Now, isn't that handy?
Sortir en Pantoufles: up 2 days, 12:06
-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list



Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread Rumen Yotov
Hi,
Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales wrote:

Which IDS system do you recommend? I also need to worry about HTTP
auth brute force. Know any way to stop it from happening?

I've read about HoneyPots, which I can only assume is a decoy for an
attacker. Anyone knows how to set one up?

I have a feeling that there isn't much I can do if a pro actually
tries to break the system. All I can do is avoid the dummies from
doing it as well.

  

..SNIP...
For a long time using 'prelude+snort' easy to set up and use, all are in
portage and there is a guide to setup.
Or just snort alone. Simpler easier.
HTH. Rumen



smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature


Re: [gentoo-user] Testing how secure a server is...

2005-08-02 Thread kashani

Colin wrote:


Want to know how secure your server is?  Try and hack it!

A good port scanner like nmap should be a basic check of your  
firewall.  I would also set nmap (if it can do this) to perform a SYN  
flood as it scans, to see if your server can withstand that basic DoS  
attack.  (Adding --syn to your TCP rules in iptables can prevent SYN  
flooding when used with SYN cookies.)  When you break in, find out  why 
it worked and how it can be patched.


I'd like to put forth a few words of caution.

	Depending on the complexity of your environment aggressive security 
scans can be fairly detrimental to your services stability. Make sure 
you inform the other admins if any that a scan will be taking place and 
do it in off hours. While most Internet facing applications today are 
pretty good about handling a scan internal custom built applications or 
newly released appliances are not.
	I once had massive load balancer failures across three geographic sites 
because of an unauthorized port scan by out new security director. Yes 
they shouldn't have locked up when send a weird packet, but we'd have 
avoided quite a bit of downtime if we had known what to look for.


kashani

--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list