Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho ha scritto: On Feb 11, 2008 8:21 AM, Vincent Snijders [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You do not get true console applications under Windows, because all windows installations have a GUI installed. All Mac OS X installations too. :-) Actually Macs have a server edition and althougth I never saw that I think it doesn't have a gui: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xserve Nope. Take a look at the Getting Started Manual: http://images.apple.com/server/macosx/docs/Getting_Started_v10.5.pdf The idea of just point and click is originally an Apple idea. It was part of the idea one computer if each house, which was revolutionary for the time! Also, I read somewhere that Microsoft recently launched or at least made a beta of a new revolutionary Windows Server. The great inovation? It doesn't have a GUI, so it's more stable Knowing a bit Redmond people, I'm afraid it's MSDos based! ;-) Having said that I have also seen Linux and FreeBSD servers with GUI (KDE) running 24/7. I personally think the technicians were lazy, but it seamed to work well. Our Linux based company servers have KDE running 24/7, so that unskilled people can check daily backups, and do other minor things, clicking on a few dedicated icons on the desktop. No problem whatsoever. Uptime depends only on kernel updates. Giuliano -- Giuliano Colla Whenever people agree with me, I always feel I must be wrong (O. Wilde) _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
RE: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
Hi Graeme, Thanks for the tips. Console apps with the Laz GUI linked in (i.e., linked against a widgetset via inclusion of interfaces unit) work fine on Windows and Carbon and even with GTK on OS X if run in an X termimal. However, I would like to be able to have a truer console app (and a much smaller one too). ColorToRGB is widgetset-dependent so I can't use that if I want a true console app. Another problem I've run into is trying to decide what RGB value to use for color constants. For example, ColorToRGB(clBtnFace) returns different RGB values on Windows, OS X Carbon and OS X GTK, as implemented by the widgetsets' GetSysColor. Probably different values would also be returned on the same platform depending on user preferences too. So I guess my problem is how to map color constants for use, say, in other programs or in a Web browser. Maybe just use a default Windows set of RGB values or something would make sense. Thanks. -Phil -Original Message- From: Graeme Geldenhuys [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 2:09 AM To: lazarus@miraclec.com Subject: Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app On 10/02/2008, Hess, Philip J [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Of course, now the app has the same issues as any Mac GUI app compiled with GTK, in that even though it's a console app (sort of), it will only run under X11. And no way to compile for Carbon with lazbuild unless the framework carbon stuff already set in the .lpi. That's correct. You can't include the 'interfaces' unit in a console application because it requires (pulls in) GUI code. You will not notice anything under Windows, because Windows always has a GUI installed. Under Linux it's easily noticed when you don't run a X Server and try an execute a console application that uses 'interfaces' unit. I had this same issue in the tiOPF project and console unit tests on my Linux server which doesn't run a X Window server installed. Some unit tests required the clipboard, which is a GUI feature in LCL or VCL. I had to rework the unit tests to exclude those tests when run as a true console application. RGB value _or_ a color constant like clBtnFace (value of 15). If someone passes a color constant to one of these functions, they'll get an unexpected result. So it seems as though RedGreenBlue, etc. should either call ColorToRGB first or else the param type should be Again correct and what I forgot to mention in my previous post. If you pass in a cl color alias (like clBtnFace etc) you first need to lookup the RGB equivalent color value via ColorToRGB. In fpGUI it's possible to do without requiring a true GUI installed, but I'm not sure what would happen under Windows etc... Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
Graeme Geldenhuys wrote: On 11/02/2008, Giuliano Colla [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Our Linux based company servers have KDE running 24/7, so that unskilled people can check daily backups, and do other minor things, clicking on a few dedicated icons on the desktop. No problem whatsoever. Uptime depends only on kernel updates. We run a Windows 2003 server and Ubuntu 6.06 LTS (Linux) server side by side. The Linux server has no GUI. All maintenance on the Linux server is done via scripts and works beautifully. I'm thinking of rewriting some of those scripts into a single maintenance application using FPC's console GUI framework (that Turbo Pascal look - I can't remember the name now). The Linux server does about four times the work compared to the Windows server, and it's uptime is also way higher (as in months). Start-up time is also impressive. The Windows server takes about 5-7 minutes to boot - Linux is up in 30 seconds (and it's a slower machine). The latter drives the windows administrators nuts! :-) Based on our company servers I think non-GUI servers kick ass. but now I'm way off-topic again Regards, - Graeme - Hi Graeme, I don't doubt anything you have said, but you are mistaking the difference between windows and *nix for the difference between gui and non-gui. I ran HP-UX servers for years without any problems, despite always having the CDE GUI environment available. cheers, John _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
On 11/02/2008, Giuliano Colla [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Our Linux based company servers have KDE running 24/7, so that unskilled people can check daily backups, and do other minor things, clicking on a few dedicated icons on the desktop. No problem whatsoever. Uptime depends only on kernel updates. We run a Windows 2003 server and Ubuntu 6.06 LTS (Linux) server side by side. The Linux server has no GUI. All maintenance on the Linux server is done via scripts and works beautifully. I'm thinking of rewriting some of those scripts into a single maintenance application using FPC's console GUI framework (that Turbo Pascal look - I can't remember the name now). The Linux server does about four times the work compared to the Windows server, and it's uptime is also way higher (as in months). Start-up time is also impressive. The Windows server takes about 5-7 minutes to boot - Linux is up in 30 seconds (and it's a slower machine). The latter drives the windows administrators nuts! :-) Based on our company servers I think non-GUI servers kick ass. but now I'm way off-topic again Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
Quoting Giuliano Colla [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Knowing a bit Redmond people, I'm afraid it's MSDos based! ;-) All things old become new again ;-) _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
On 11/02/2008, Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: All Mac OS X installations too. :-) Actually Macs have a server edition and althougth I never saw that I think it doesn't have a gui: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xserve I thought there had to be something like that... Also, I read somewhere that Microsoft recently launched or at least made a beta of a new revolutionary Windows Server. The great innovation? It doesn't have a GUI, so it's more stable And let me guess, they already submitted their patent application for it. :-) Should we tell them *unix has done it since forever! Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
RE: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
Not concerned about myself. I'm preparing something for others to compile and want to make it as easy as possible. Thanks. -Phil -Original Message- From: Vincent Snijders [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sun 2/10/2008 1:12 AM To: lazarus@miraclec.com Subject: Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app Hess, Philip J schreef: Of course, now the app has the same issues as any Mac GUI app compiled with GTK, in that even though it's a console app (sort of), it will only run under X11. And no way to compile for Carbon with lazbuild unless the framework carbon stuff already set in the .lpi. Maybe you should set the framework parameters in the fpc.cfg, under #ifdef LCLCarbon, if you don't want to pass them always. Vincent _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives winmail.dat
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
On Feb 11, 2008 8:21 AM, Vincent Snijders [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You do not get true console applications under Windows, because all windows installations have a GUI installed. All Mac OS X installations too. :-) Actually Macs have a server edition and althougth I never saw that I think it doesn't have a gui: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xserve Also, I read somewhere that Microsoft recently launched or at least made a beta of a new revolutionary Windows Server. The great inovation? It doesn't have a GUI, so it's more stable Having said that I have also seen Linux and FreeBSD servers with GUI (KDE) running 24/7. I personally think the technicians were lazy, but it seamed to work well. bye, -- Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
On 11/02/2008, Vincent Snijders [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You do not get true console applications under Windows, because all windows installations have a GUI installed. All Mac OS X installations too. :-) Interesting, even servers? Or don't you get Mac OS X servers? So even though Macs use the *BSD OS (forgot it's name) as the underlying OS, you can't install without a GUI? As you can guess I know next to nothing about Macs. Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
On 10/02/2008, Hess, Philip J [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Of course, now the app has the same issues as any Mac GUI app compiled with GTK, in that even though it's a console app (sort of), it will only run under X11. And no way to compile for Carbon with lazbuild unless the framework carbon stuff already set in the .lpi. That's correct. You can't include the 'interfaces' unit in a console application because it requires (pulls in) GUI code. You will not notice anything under Windows, because Windows always has a GUI installed. Under Linux it's easily noticed when you don't run a X Server and try an execute a console application that uses 'interfaces' unit. I had this same issue in the tiOPF project and console unit tests on my Linux server which doesn't run a X Window server installed. Some unit tests required the clipboard, which is a GUI feature in LCL or VCL. I had to rework the unit tests to exclude those tests when run as a true console application. RGB value _or_ a color constant like clBtnFace (value of 15). If someone passes a color constant to one of these functions, they'll get an unexpected result. So it seems as though RedGreenBlue, etc. should either call ColorToRGB first or else the param type should be Again correct and what I forgot to mention in my previous post. If you pass in a cl color alias (like clBtnFace etc) you first need to lookup the RGB equivalent color value via ColorToRGB. In fpGUI it's possible to do without requiring a true GUI installed, but I'm not sure what would happen under Windows etc... Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
Graeme Geldenhuys schreef: On 09/02/2008, Hess, Philip J [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This console app runs okay on Delphi. Is there something I'm missing here or is this just not possible with Lazarus? You do not get true console applications under Windows, because all windows installations have a GUI installed. All Mac OS X installations too. :-) Vincent _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
On Sat, 9 Feb 2008 15:42:22 -0500 Hess, Philip J [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I need to call ColorToRGB in a console app. Adding Graphics to uses allows lazbuild to compile the console app okay, but I get an AV when running it, presumably because the widgetset that actually implements ColorToRGB isn't getting linked into the app, as evidenced by otool -L (on Mac): /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib (compatibility version 1.0.0, current version 88.1.10) If any widgetset code were linked in, I would see something like this: /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Carbon (compatibility version 2.0.0, current version 128.0.0) /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib (compatibility version 1.0.0, current version 88.1.10) This console app runs okay on Delphi. Is there something I'm missing here or is this just not possible with Lazarus? Did you add the 'interfaces' unit as one of the first units of your program? Mattias _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
RE: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
Excellent, that's what I was forgetting. Of course, now the app has the same issues as any Mac GUI app compiled with GTK, in that even though it's a console app (sort of), it will only run under X11. And no way to compile for Carbon with lazbuild unless the framework carbon stuff already set in the .lpi. Also, looking at some of the functions in Graphics.pp, I wonder if it's confusing to use TColor for params with functions like RedGreenBlue, InvertColor, etc. TColor can be a full RGB value _or_ a color constant like clBtnFace (value of 15). If someone passes a color constant to one of these functions, they'll get an unexpected result. So it seems as though RedGreenBlue, etc. should either call ColorToRGB first or else the param type should be LongInt or something to make it clearer that a color constant should not be passed. Same with ColorToRGB - in Delphi the return type is LongInt, not TColor, since it only returns RGB values, not color constants. Thanks. -Phil -Original Message- From: Mattias Gaertner [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sat 2/9/2008 6:53 PM To: lazarus@miraclec.com Subject: Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app On Sat, 9 Feb 2008 15:42:22 -0500 Hess, Philip J [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I need to call ColorToRGB in a console app. Adding Graphics to uses allows lazbuild to compile the console app okay, but I get an AV when running it, presumably because the widgetset that actually implements ColorToRGB isn't getting linked into the app, as evidenced by otool -L (on Mac): /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib (compatibility version 1.0.0, current version 88.1.10) If any widgetset code were linked in, I would see something like this: /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Carbon (compatibility version 2.0.0, current version 128.0.0) /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib (compatibility version 1.0.0, current version 88.1.10) This console app runs okay on Delphi. Is there something I'm missing here or is this just not possible with Lazarus? Did you add the 'interfaces' unit as one of the first units of your program? Mattias _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives winmail.dat
Re: [lazarus] ColorToRGB in console app
Hess, Philip J schreef: Of course, now the app has the same issues as any Mac GUI app compiled with GTK, in that even though it's a console app (sort of), it will only run under X11. And no way to compile for Carbon with lazbuild unless the framework carbon stuff already set in the .lpi. Maybe you should set the framework parameters in the fpc.cfg, under #ifdef LCLCarbon, if you don't want to pass them always. Vincent _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
