On 26.09.2009, at 18:33, Torsten Anders wrote:
For the record please find the final version of the code for
Helmholtz-Ellis notation in Lilypond attached.
Just a brief warning. This approach does not work with \afterGrace
(\grace is fine). There might be other corner cases...
Best
Torsten
On 27 Sep 2009, at 05:36, Graham Breed wrote:
Thanks for the explanation. I recall that: LilyPond has more than
one glyph-finding model. That was a problem with the key
signatures, I think, which could not use those from external fonts.
Lilypond has one glyph-finding model for accidentals,
Dear Community,
I have now defined a table for mictotones (I use the division of 12 of the
whole tone, which is not 100 percent just intonation).
The spacing, I guess, is ok, I only get problems, sometimes, at the
beginning of a measure.
I've defined for that the variable machplatz (makespace, if
Stefan Thomas wrote:
1. The new accidentals are also played via midi, which is great. But not,
when different accidentals are in a chord. Is there a possibilitie to change
this?
Yeah, you have to split it into separate contrapuntal lines.
I've used a contraption of include files so
On 26 Sep 2009, at 07:10, Graham Breed wrote:
I always get the error message:
stefansMikrotoene.ly:32:6: warning: Could not find glyph-name for
alteration -162/247
That says it's a warning, not an error, so it shouldn't stop
anything working. To get rid of it you have to define a valid
Hans Aberg wrote:
Isn't the lookup dynamic, so one only gets a warning when it actually
needs a glyph for an alteration? - But it is a good idea to define a
glyph for each alteration.
Yes, but we've overridden the glyph lookup to use strings
from external fonts. There's no need to define
Stefan Thomas wrote:
I don't understand why the distance between the barline and the cis
is better if it is a whole note but not, if it is a quarter note.
Well, the whole note has more room because it isn't sharing the measure
with any other notes.
But the barline
On 26 Sep 2009, at 11:01, Graham Breed wrote:
Isn't the lookup dynamic, so one only gets a warning when it
actually needs a glyph for an alteration? - But it is a good idea
to define a glyph for each alteration.
Yes, but we've overridden the glyph lookup to use strings from
external
On 25 Sep 2009, at 08:42, Graham Breed wrote:
For the code I have, pitch names are defined as:
HEPitchNames = #`(
(c . ,(ly:make-pitch -1 0 0))
(g . ,(ly:make-pitch -1 4 10/1023))
(edown . ,(ly:make-pitch -1 2 -75/1096))
(bflatseven . ,(ly:make-pitch -1 6 -162/247))
(d . ,(ly:make-pitch
On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 7:45 AM, Graham Breed gbr...@gmail.com wrote:
You install them wherever fonts go on your system. That may sound vague
but, of course, it depends on your system. I think there's a special folder
LilyPond looks in as well but I'd have to check the documentation to find
On 25 Sep 2009, at 13:13, Stefan Thomas wrote:
How many cents are an alteration of 10/1023?
I made some Haskell functions that compute these; I use Hugs http://haskell.org/hugs/
, but perhaps somebody can translate it to Scheme code.
For example, for E12276, LilyPond scale degree 4 (note G
On 26 Sep 2009, at 19:33, Torsten Anders wrote:
For the record please find the final version of the code for
Helmholtz-Ellis notation in Lilypond attached, ...
My editor says that the encoding of HE-Lily-header.ly isn't UTF-8, but
Mac OS Roman.
Hans
Dear Robin,
thanks for Your very good advice!
I made a success, but I'm still not totally happy.
By the way, what's the problem with the font-including?
It works properly, for me. I still have a problem with spacing.
I guess I have these problems, because I dont understand what the lines
Dear Hans,
On 26.09.2009, at 19:17, Hans Aberg wrote:
On 26 Sep 2009, at 19:33, Torsten Anders wrote:
For the record please find the final version of the code for
Helmholtz-Ellis notation in Lilypond attached, ...
My editor says that the encoding of HE-Lily-header.ly isn't UTF-8,
but Mac OS
Stefan Thomas wrote:
cis cis cis cis | % the sharp sign is too much left!
gis' gis gis gis | % the note and the sharp sign are too much right!
Well, erm, how far do we want to get into fine-tuning?
OK, it looks like you only want one glyph at a time.
Dear Stefan,
Sorry for my late reply.
Stefan wrote
I was able to try out the example. There is one not convincing for me:
The default accidental is an natural. But I would like to use fis
and ges as before.
You can easily switch to the standard Lily accidental treatment where
the HE
On 26 Sep 2009, at 22:26, Torsten Anders wrote:
For the record please find the final version of the code for
Helmholtz-Ellis notation in Lilypond attached, ...
My editor says that the encoding of HE-Lily-header.ly isn't UTF-8,
but Mac OS Roman.
Thanks for your feedback.
Do you have any
Dear Hans,
Thank you for your careful checking of this file.
On 26.09.2009, at 21:58, Hans Aberg wrote:
On 26 Sep 2009, at 22:26, Torsten Anders wrote:
For the record please find the final version of the code for
Helmholtz-Ellis notation in Lilypond attached, ...
My editor says that the
On 26 Sep 2009, at 23:58, Torsten Anders wrote:
Line 169 has spurious character A7 at the end. Looks like:
%% show the markup extend as box (for debugging)ß
Oops. Actually, I read this char as §, but it is certainly not
necessary there. Anyway, it is a comment. Do you have any problems
Hans Aberg wrote:
Thanks for the explanation. I recall that: LilyPond has more than one
glyph-finding model. That was a problem with the key signatures, I
think, which could not use those from external fonts.
Lilypond has one glyph-finding model for accidentals, and
the hooks to allow us to
Dear Graham,
in the meantime I found out, where I have to install the font on my kubuntu
machine.
I was able to try out the example.
There is one not convincing for me:
The default accidental is an natural. But I would like to use fis and ges as
before.
Wouldnt it a possibilitie to define new
Stefan Thomas wrote:
Dear Graham,
in the meantime I found out, where I have to install the font on my kubuntu
machine.
That's good.
I was able to try out the example.
There is one not convincing for me:
The default accidental is an natural. But I would like to use fis and ges as
before.
Dear Graham,
absolutely, I would like to define a list of notenames, for e.g. pitches
that are about 15cents lower, But I have no idea how to do it, when I use
the HE-font for the accidentals.
Off course, I had a look in makam.ly
and I found there
makamGlyphs = #`((1 . accidentals.doublesharp)
Stefan Thomas wrote:
Dear Graham,
absolutely, I would like to define a list of notenames, for e.g. pitches
that are about 15cents lower, But I have no idea how to do it, when I use
the HE-font for the accidentals.
For the code I have, pitch names are defined as:
HEPitchNames = #`(
(c .
Dear Graham,
thanks very much!
It doesn't seem to be very easy for my, but I guess, I will be able to do
it.
2009/9/25 Graham Breed gbr...@gmail.com
Stefan Thomas wrote:
Dear Graham,
absolutely, I would like to define a list of notenames, for e.g. pitches
that are about 15cents lower, But I
Dear Graham,
what I don't understand:
How many cents are an alteration of 10/1023?
2009/9/25 Graham Breed gbr...@gmail.com
Stefan Thomas wrote:
Dear Graham,
absolutely, I would like to define a list of notenames, for e.g. pitches
that are about 15cents lower, But I have no idea how to do
Stefan Thomas wrote:
what I don't understand:
How many cents are an alteration of 10/1023?
It's a fraction of 200 cents. So 200 * 10/1023 = 2000/1023
= 1.955... cents, which looks like a schisma.
Graham
___
lilypond-user
Ok, I've understood this now.
In the meantime, I tried to make my own microtone-uitchtable.
But, unfortunately, it doesn't work.
I always get the error message:
stefansMikrotoene.ly:32:6: warning: Could not find glyph-name for
alteration -162/247
I don't understand how to make use of the
On 25 Sep 2009, at 14:44, Graham Breed wrote:
what I don't understand:
How many cents are an alteration of 10/1023?
It's a fraction of 200 cents. So 200 * 10/1023 = 2000/1023 =
1.955... cents, which looks like a schisma.
From my computations, it corresponds choosing an approximation in
Dear Community,
I've already defined some microtonal pitchnames
But, unfortunately I have problems with the correct spacing.
Especially I don't understand why the distance between the barline and the
cis is better if it is a whole note but not, if it is a quartenote.
Here the snippet:
\version
On 25 Sep 2009, at 21:59, Stefan Thomas wrote:
I've already defined some microtonal pitchnames
But, unfortunately I have problems with the correct spacing.
Especially I don't understand why the distance between the barline
and the cis is better if it is a whole note but not, if it is a
Stefan Thomas wrote:
Ok, I've understood this now.
In the meantime, I tried to make my own microtone-uitchtable.
But, unfortunately, it doesn't work.
I always get the error message:
stefansMikrotoene.ly:32:6: warning: Could not find glyph-name for
alteration -162/247
That says it's a
Dear Community,
I know that I am a little late in this discussion.
I wanted to try out theexample of Thorsten, I found at
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2009-09/msg00205.html
What I don't understand is: where do I have to have the files of the
HE-font?
And, is there a final
Stefan Thomas wrote:
Dear Community,
I know that I am a little late in this discussion.
I wanted to try out theexample of Thorsten, I found at
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2009-09/msg00205.html
What I don't understand is: where do I have to have the files of the
HE-font?
On 10 Sep 2009, at 12:14, Torsten Anders wrote:
I can actually play HE notation on a Tonal Plexus (http://www.h-pi.com/TPX28intro.html
), slowly, but I never practise :)
This, if one sticks to the key coloring, is in fact just five
translated keyboard of the layout I indicated. So if
Dear Robin,
Thank you very very much!! The notation is perfect now, I really owe
you something :)
I assume the designer of this accidental font inserted the space
before each sign on purpose: with a larger distance the signs are more
easy to read. I just checked: in the existing scores printed
Torsten Anders wrote:
I really owe you something :)
Well, it's Mark Polesky we both owe.
Without him, all small-time Schemers like me would still be
believing the very plausible explanation in (the 2.12) NR 5.3.4
of why \tweak cannot be used to modify accidentals.
Cheers,
Robin
Robin Bannister wrote Friday, September 11, 2009 6:15 PM
Torsten Anders wrote:
I really owe you something :)
Well, it's Mark Polesky we both owe.
Without him, all small-time Schemers like me would still be
believing the very plausible explanation in (the 2.12) NR 5.3.4
of why
Trevor Daniels wrote:
it seems like you're suggesting NR 5.3.4 is not correct.
I was talking about the 2.12 NR.
I understood its unqualified cannot to be the well-meaning advice:
- don't waste your time trying.
So I didn't.
But Mark questioned this in July,
and you updated the
Robin, you wrote Friday, September 11, 2009 8:32 PM
Trevor Daniels wrote:
it seems like you're suggesting NR 5.3.4 is not correct.
I was talking about the 2.12 NR. I understood its unqualified
cannot to be the well-meaning advice: - don't waste your time
trying.So I didn't.
But
On 10.09.2009, at 09:03, Hans Aberg wrote:
It seems to be that that staff indicates the Pythagorean tuning,
with accidentals to indicate offsets relative that. Right?
This uniform structure of the Helmholtz-Ellis and Sagittal notation
makes it possible to not only notate just intonation
On 10 Sep 2009, at 10:26, Torsten Anders wrote:
[Your mail does not cc to the list - added: seems relevant.]
t is part of the font
distribution itself at
http://music.calarts.edu/~msabat/ms/pdfs/HE-font-2009.zip
I also found
http://www.newmusicbox.org/72/HelmholtzEllisLegend.pdf
It seems to
On 10 Sep 2009, at 10:57, Torsten Anders wrote:
On 10.09.2009, at 09:03, Hans Aberg wrote:
It seems to be that that staff indicates the Pythagorean tuning,
with accidentals to indicate offsets relative that. Right?
This uniform structure of the Helmholtz-Ellis and Sagittal notation
makes
Dear Hans,
I understand you point about only 2 step sizes and your interested to
extend the number of steps available. I assume this approach is
particularly suitable for music that is primarily melodic (which is
the case for Persian and Turkish), and if you disregard ornamental
pitch
Dear Hans,
On 10.09.2009, at 10:13, Hans Aberg wrote:
[...] I tend to think that ETs and Pythagorean tuning, quarter-comma
meantone, and other diatonic pitch systems would be best notated by
departing from them, and then adding intermediate pitch accidentals
relative that.
A completely
On 10 Sep 2009, at 11:45, Torsten Anders wrote:
I understand you point about only 2 step sizes and your interested
to extend the number of steps available. I assume this approach is
particularly suitable for music that is primarily melodic (which is
the case for Persian and Turkish), and
On 10 Sep 2009, at 12:14, Torsten Anders wrote:
[...] I tend to think that ETs and Pythagorean tuning, quarter-
comma meantone, and other diatonic pitch systems would be best
notated by departing from them, and then adding intermediate pitch
accidentals relative that.
A completely
Torsten Anders wrote:
Now, there is only a minor flaw now: the distance between a note and
the related accidentals is rather big. In fact, accidentals are more
close to the preceding note than the note they belong to.
I'm way out of my depth here,
but it looks like markup is appending
Don't forget to mention this publication where the Persian microtonal
accidentals were introduced,
which are the only ones that are standardized (and still absent in lilypond):
Vaziri, A. N., Dastur-e Tàr, Tehran, 1913.
Kees
- Original Message -
From: Joseph Wakeling
Dear Robin,
On 09.09.2009, at 00:08, Robin Bannister wrote:
Torsten Anders wrote:
Lilypond does not know about multiple-sign accidentals, so I
somehow have to create more horizontal space for these manually.
The following code tries to adjust this spacing automatically.
Thank you very
On 09.09.2009, at 23:21, Torsten Anders wrote:
PS: I attach the source of the examples above to the next mail:
mails with multiple attachments seem to be delayed by many hours...
Attached are the Lilypond source files for examples of the previous
mail.
Best
Torsten
--
Torsten Anders
[sorry for resending, but the mail text was somehow partially
turned into attachments ...]
Dear Robin,
On 09.09.2009, at 00:08, Robin Bannister wrote:
Torsten Anders wrote:
Lilypond does not know about multiple-sign accidentals, so I
somehow have to create more horizontal space for these
Torsten Anders wrote:
Thank you very very much for your help! The output is now almost
perfect as you can see see in the two examples below. The much
improved spacing of the first example is solely due to the code you
suggested.
Dear Torsten,
I'm really pleased to see your work on this as
Dear Joseph,
This notation is explain in detail in a paper that is part of the font
distribution itself at
http://music.calarts.edu/~msabat/ms/pdfs/HE-font-2009.zip
Several composers whose work is listed at http://plainsound.org
actively use this notation, including for large-scale
The Ab's sound horribly out of tune, as if they were meantone G#'s.
Kees
- Original Message -
From: Torsten Anders torstenand...@gmx.de
Date: Wednesday, September 9, 2009 4:27 pm
Subject: Re: Microtonal Helmholtz-Ellis notation in Lilypond: fine-tuning
To: lilypond-user@gnu.org
Dear
Torsten Anders wrote:
Lilypond does not know about multiple-sign accidentals, so I
somehow have to create more horizontal space for these manually.
The following code tries to adjust this spacing automatically.
But I haven't tested it with your font.
Dear Lilyponders,
Finally, I got some microtonal notation working in Lilypond that uses
a special font for the accidentals (i.e. not the usual Feta font),
please see the attached example PDF file. The full Lilypond code is
included at the end of this mail. This example shows a harmonic
seventh
Torsten Anders wrote:
However, I failed to do the same for chord tones.
Something like this?
%%
tweakAccidental =
#(define-music-function (parser location mkup mus) (markup? ly:music?)
(set! (ly:music-property mus 'tweaks)
(acons 'before-line-breaking
: Microtonal Helmholtz-Ellis notation in Lilypond: fine-tuning
To: lilypond-user@gnu.org
Cc: tun...@yahoogroups.com tun...@yahoogroups.com
Dear Lilyponders,
Finally, I got some microtonal notation working in Lilypond that uses
a special font for the accidentals (i.e. not the usual Feta font),
please see
Dear Kees,
On 07.09.2009, at 21:10, Kees van den Doel wrote:
Not sure if it will help you, but you can look at my solution for
microtonal notation in this package: http://people.cs.ubc.ca/~kvdoel/tmp/persian.zip
Thank you for sharing this example. If I am not mistaken, you used the
maqam
On 07.09.2009, at 19:57, Robin Bannister wrote:
Torsten Anders wrote:
However, I failed to do the same for chord tones.
Something like this?
Great, thank you very much!!
Now my remaining problem is the spacing. For example, can anyone
explain to me how to use the following snippet from
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