.
\usemodule[translate]
\translateinput[``][“]
\enableinputtranslation
Better use real quotation marks “ and ” or \quotation{…}.
Or \quotedblleft, \quotedblright, \quotedblbase, no name for 201F.
For the flowing text these are a bit too long to use and remember for
my taste though.
LaTeX
]
\translateinput[``][“]
\enableinputtranslation
Better use real quotation marks “ and ” or \quotation{…}.
Wolfgang
Why is it better? And why is it so difficult to just reinstall the
traditional TeX method of handling quotes
fixed it with the translation module. \usemodule[translate]
\translateinput[``][“]
\enableinputtranslation
Better use real quotation marks “ and ” or \quotation{…}.
Wolfgang
Why is it better? And why
On Mon, Oct 21 2013, john Culleton wrote:
Not every change is an improvement, IMO.
On Sat, Jul 27 2013, Mojca Miklavec wrote:
On the other hand many languages use different quotation marks and
using ``these'' is completely americanocentric. On top,
auto-replacement lead to inability
module. \usemodule[translate]
\translateinput[``][“]
\enableinputtranslation
Better use real quotation marks “ and ” or \quotation{…}.
Wolfgang
Why is it better? And why is it so difficult to just reinstall
Am 13.10.2013 um 05:07 schrieb Ciro A. Soto c...@kavyata.com:
When I use `` to open a quotation, I don't get the character for open
quotation, instead, I get the two single quotation character. (The closing
quotation works fine)
Is there any command to fix this? (the problem occurs
Am 13.10.2013 um 06:09 schrieb Ciro A. Soto c...@kavyata.com:
sorry, I just saw an old chain of messages about this question... I fixed it
with the translation module.
\usemodule[translate]
\translateinput[``][“]
\enableinputtranslation
Better use real quotation marks
When I use `` to open a quotation, I don't get the character for open
quotation, instead, I get the two single quotation character. (The closing
quotation works fine)
Is there any command to fix this? (the problem occurs in english or spanish)
thank you
ciro
Books you should read:
[image
A. Soto c...@kavyata.com wrote:
When I use `` to open a quotation, I don't get the character for open
quotation, instead, I get the two single quotation character. (The closing
quotation works fine)
Is there any command to fix this? (the problem occurs in english or
spanish)
thank you
ciro
Hi there,
I have a text in which I want the interlinear space in narrower
environments and the font size to be smaller.
I tried something like the sample below, but it doesn't work (no suprise
:-().
\startsetups[setups:narrow]
\setupinterlinespace[line=2.8ex]
\tfx
\stopsetups
Am 09.12.2012 um 19:42 schrieb Pablo Rodríguez oi...@web.de:
Hi there,
I have a text in which I want the interlinear space in narrower
environments and the font size to be smaller.
I tried something like the sample below, but it doesn't work (no suprise
:-().
I use \startquotation \stopquotation for longer quotations.
I want to globally change the font in this quotations (f.e. to garamond
or helvetica - my default is times new roman). How to make this?
Thanks
Huseyin
://wiki.contextgarden.net/Command/setupdelimitedtext
That means, you can use the style key as follows:
\setupdelimitedtext
[quotation]
[style=sans]
If you defined sans to be Helvetica, that's all you need, but this
depends on you document setup. You can also use \switchtobodyfont.
\setupdelimitedtext
Am 14.11.2012 00:49, schrieb ntg-context-requ...@ntg.nl:
\setuplanguage
[leftquotation=?,
rightquotation=?]
\define[1]\quotation
{\italic{\symbol[leftquotation]#1\symbol[rightquotation]}}
\starttext
\quotation{Whatever}
\stoptext
Thank you! And how about
Hello,
in the following example the space before the leading quotation mark (between 'f'
and 'g') is not colored:
\definebar[MyBar][color=green,rulethickness=2.8,order=background,offset=1.5,continue=yes]
\starttext
\MyBar{Abc def \quotation{ghi}.}
\stoptext
How to make the bar
On Tue, 2011-06-28 at 07:13 +0200, Peter Münster wrote:
On Tue, Jun 28 2011, Kip Warner wrote:
Is there any way to have ConTeXt not surround the link in the text with
quotation marks when using \about[some_node]?
\setupreferencing[left=, right=]
Thank you. That did it.
--
Kip Warner
Hey list,
Is there any way to have ConTeXt not surround the link in the text with
quotation marks when using \about[some_node]?
--
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com
signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message
On Tue, Jun 28 2011, Kip Warner wrote:
Is there any way to have ConTeXt not surround the link in the text with
quotation marks when using \about[some_node]?
\setupreferencing[left=, right=]
--
Peter
Hi all, Hans,
in lang-def.mkiv (line 623) and and lang-ita.mkii (line 101), we have
\installlanguage % the same as italian
[\s!la]
[\c!rightquote=\lowerrightsingleninequote,
\c!rightquotation=\lowerrightdoubleninequote,
...
This can't possibly be right (is there a language which has
On Sunday 01/05/2011 at 4:09 pm, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
Hi all, Hans,
in lang-def.mkiv (line 623) and and lang-ita.mkii (line 101), we have
\installlanguage % the same as italian
[\s!la]
[\c!rightquote=\lowerrightsingleninequote,
\c!rightquotation=\lowerrightdoubleninequote,
=\upperrightdoubleninequote]
I just had a look at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-English_usage_of_quotation_marks, and the only
language which has lowerdoubleninequote on the right of the quotation is
Hebrew, I assume because its RTL.
what do those latin manuscripts in you office use
Hi All,
I'm trying to create a command that will apply a consistent style to a
word or phrase. For example, when documenting source code, I'd like to
be able to mark variables with \Var{var_name}. Then if I want the
variable names to be in mono, I can \def\Var#1{\type{#1}}. No problem
Am 08.01.2010 um 17:27 schrieb Tad Ashlock:
Hi All,
I'm trying to create a command that will apply a consistent style to a word
or phrase. For example, when documenting source code, I'd like to be able to
mark variables with \Var{var_name}. Then if I want the variable names to be
in
What about:
\def\Var#1#2{'\type{#1}%
\directlua{
if #2 == , then
tex.sprint(#2')
else
tex.sprint('#2)
end}}
\Var{555}, hello \Var{666}. \Var{666}\par
On Fri, Jan 08, 2010 at 09:27:37AM -0700, Tad Ashlock wrote:
Hi All,
I'm trying to create a command that will apply a consistent style
Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
Am 08.01.2010 um 17:27 schrieb Tad Ashlock:Hi All,
\startluacode
function move_end_punctuation (text, punc, cmd_start, cmd_mid, cmd_end)
context(cmd_start .. text .. cmd_mid)
if string.find('.,!?', punc, 1, true) then
context(punc ..
the \quotation{} command:
==
\def\Var#1#2{\quotation{\type{#1}%
\directlua{
if #2 == , then
tex.sprint(#2})
else
tex.sprint(}#2)
end}}
==
resulting in:
==
! Too many }'s.
l.7 end}}
==
I also tried \bgroup...\egroup
On Fri, Sep 4, 2009, Aditya Mahajan wrote
On Thu, 3 Sep 2009, Robert Blackstone wrote:
Hi all,
In a text with some fairly long quotations I want to have these
quotations
without their quotation marks, not indented and set in small type.
To make context ignore indenting of a signle
On Fri, 4 Sep 2009, Robert Blackstone wrote:
On Fri, Sep 4, 2009, Aditya Mahajan wrote
On Thu, 3 Sep 2009, Robert Blackstone wrote:
Hi all,
In a text with some fairly long quotations I want to have these
quotations
without their quotation marks, not indented and set in small type
Hi all,
In a text with some fairly long quotations I want to have these quotations
without their quotation marks, not indented and set in small type.
Thanks to the ConTeXt wiki I found I could fulfill two of the three
requirements by using
\setupdelimitedtext[blockquote][style={\setupbodyfont[9pt
On Thu, 3 Sep 2009, Robert Blackstone wrote:
Hi all,
In a text with some fairly long quotations I want to have these quotations
without their quotation marks, not indented and set in small type.
Thanks to the ConTeXt wiki I found I could fulfill two of the three
requirements by using
Hallo,
isn't this a very old bug with \quotation and \placefigure?
\starttext
\placefigure[left]{Bla}{\externalfigure[dummy][height=.3\textheight,wi
dth=.3\textwidth]}
\quotation{\input tufte }
\stoptext
Wolfgang
Am 21.05.2009 um 22:22 schrieb Wolfgang Werners-Lucchini:
Hallo,
isn't this a very old bug with \quotation and \placefigure?
\starttext
\placefigure[left]{Bla}{\externalfigure[dummy][height=.3\textheight,wi
dth=.3\textwidth]}
\quotation{\input tufte }
\dontleavehmode\quotation{\input tufte
Hi all,
the following minimal example demonstrates a problem with closing
quotation marks (both mkii and mkiv):
\setuplayout[width=3cm]
\starttext
\quotation{This is a \quote{test.}}
\stoptext
ConTeXt breaks a line between ' and . This shouldn't happen.
All best
Thomas
Hello,
is it volitional/known that there is no protrusion if one using \quotation{…}
(under mkiv)?
\definefontfeature[protrusion][default][protrusion=quality]
\definefont[test][Serif*protrusion at 24pt]
\setupalign[hanging]
\starttext \showframe \test\setupinterlinespace
\quotation{Hello
Am 10.03.2009 um 11:16 schrieb Andreas Harder:
Hello,
is it volitional/known that there is no protrusion if one using
\quotation{…} (under mkiv)?
You need a different method for quotations.
\setupdelimitedtext[quotation][method=font] or
\setupquotation[method=font]
Wolfgang
Thank you very much.
Curious, with \hfill\quotation{…} there is still no protrusion on the
right side (in regular text, without \hfill, it works as expected).
Andreas
___
If your question is of interest
Hi Hans,
can you add quotation marks (guillemets too) to the punctuation
table in font-ext.lua
I have also two antries I want in the pure table, they are
IDEOGRAPHIC COMMA U+3001
IDEOGRAPHIC FULL STOP U+3002
Wolfgang
Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
Hi Hans,
can you add quotation marks (guillemets too) to the punctuation
table in font-ext.lua
I have also two antries I want in the pure table, they are
IDEOGRAPHIC COMMA U+3001
IDEOGRAPHIC FULL STOP U+3002
just provide me the lines to add
Hans
On Wed, Sep 10, 2008 at 10:30 AM, Hans Hagen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
Hi Hans,
can you add quotation marks (guillemets too) to the punctuation
table in font-ext.lua
I have also two antries I want in the pure table, they are
IDEOGRAPHIC COMMA U+3001
IDEOGRAPHIC
Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
\def\delimitedtext[#1]%
{\bgroup
\pushdelimitedtext{#1}%
\doifelse{\delimitedtextparameter\c!method}\s!font
{\dofontdrivendelimited}
{\doifinsetelse{\delimitedtextparameter\c!location}{\v!paragraph,
\v!margin}%
Dear syndicate,
There is a bug in \quotation and/or \blockquote (pdf attached): there is a
spurious dbl-quote mark at the end of the par that only occurs when
\quotation is invoked.
Please advise, workarounds welcome :-)
Best wishes
Idris
% engine=luatex
On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 14:32:59 -0700
Idris Samawi Hamid [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Dear syndicate,
There is a bug in \quotation and/or \blockquote (pdf attached): there is a
spurious dbl-quote mark at the end of the par that only occurs when
\quotation is invoked.
Please advise
appear if you use singlecommand
quotations within a quotation environment.
The push and popdelimitedtext macros did not work correct in this case
and ConTeXt thinks there current environment is quotation and not
blockquote when it reaches the \stopblockquote command.
A group around the single
\stopquotation
Indeed, much more to the point :-)
The wrong right values did only appear if you use singlecommand
quotations within a quotation environment.
The push and popdelimitedtext macros did not work correct in this case
and ConTeXt thinks there current environment is quotation
On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 17:05:09 -0700, Wolfgang Schuster
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
There is a bug in here I think: ConTeXt validation gives
error in file qabas-test.tex at line 6 in column 3: missing } for {
error in file qabas-test.tex at line 10 in column 6: missing } for {
line 6 is
On Fri, 02 Nov 2007 04:01:25 -0600, Wolfgang Schuster
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
there is no perfect solution in ConTeXt because the \quotation and the
\start/stopquotation commands are defined with the same definition and
it is
not possible to disable the quote marks for the one and enable
2007/11/1, Thomas A. Schmitz [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Hi all,
the attached test file shows a problem with nested \quotation and
\quote commands: ConTeXt breaks the line after the first closing
quote. There shouldn't be a line break there.
Thanks!
Thomas
\definepapersize[test][width=7cm
},
after={\stopnarrower\blank[big]}]
===
Best wishes
Idris
Hi Idris,
there is no perfect solution in ConTeXt because the \quotation and the
\start/stopquotation commands are defined with the same definition and it
is
not possible to disable the quote marks for the one and enable
,
there is no perfect solution in ConTeXt because the \quotation and the
\start/stopquotation commands are defined with the same definition and it is
not possible to disable the quote marks for the one and enable it for the
other,
but you can use ConTeXt's mechanism for nested quotations and redefine the
other
Hi all,
the attached test file shows a problem with nested \quotation and
\quote commands: ConTeXt breaks the line after the first closing
quote. There shouldn't be a line break there.
Thanks!
Thomas
\definepapersize[test][width=7cm,height=3cm]
\setuppapersize[test][test]
\mainlanguage
Dear gang,
This has bugged me for years but I never said anything since the
workaround is so easy. OTOH I am working on something I'd like to share
with others and an official solution would be better:
\starttext
\input knuth
\startquotation
\input knuth
\stopquotation
\input knuth
\stoptext
Hi,
I need guillemots instead of lowerleftdouble- and
upperrightdoublequotes in the German environment.
On my minimal installation (Linux) I managed to change that by
editing the cont-sys.tex file in texmf-local/tex/context/user.
At work, on a Mac with gwTeX, nothing I tried had any effect:
]
\mainlanguage[de]
\starttext
\quote{Zitat}
\quotation{Zitation}
\stoptext
Steffen
On Tue, 6 Mar 2007 15:15:40 +0100, Jörg Hagmann wrote:
Hi,
I need guillemots instead of lowerleftdouble- and
upperrightdoublequotes in the German environment.
On my minimal installation (Linux) I managed
]
[leftquote=\guilsingleright,rightquote=\guilsingleleft,
leftquotation=\rightguillemot,rightquotation=\leftguillemot]
\mainlanguage[de]
\starttext
\quote{Zitat}
\quotation{Zitation}
\stoptext
Steffen
On Tue, 6 Mar 2007 15:15:40 +0100, Jörg Hagmann wrote:
Hi,
I need guillemots
\starttext
\quotation{This \quote{works} as expected.}
\startquotation
Closing double-quote is \quote{broken} here.
\stopquotation
\stoptext
--Mike Bird
___
ntg-context mailing list
ntg-context@ntg.nl
http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
Hi all,
there seems to be a bug with the \quotation command: ConTeXt doesn't
break the line after the closing quotes it generates. Here's a small
test file showing the problem (hope the utf-encoding makes it through
the mail):
...
I tried reading core
Hi all,
there seems to be a bug with the \quotation command: ConTeXt doesn't
break the line after the closing quotes it generates. Here's a small
test file showing the problem (hope the utf-encoding makes it through
the mail):
\enableregime[utf]
\setuppapersize[A5][A4]
\mainlanguage[deo
The \quote and \quotation macros surround text with quotation marks. These are made language dependent.In dutch the old way was an opening mark at the baseline and closing at the top of the letters; ConTeXt has been programmed this way.However, the lower quotation mark is less and less used
Hans van der Meer wrote:
The \quote and \quotation macros surround text with quotation marks.
These are made language dependent.
In dutch the old way was an opening mark at the baseline and closing
at the top of the letters; ConTeXt has been programmed this way.
However, the lower quotation
On 7/21/06, Hans van der Meer wrote:
The \quote and \quotation macros surround text with quotation marks. These
are made language dependent.
In dutch the old way was an opening mark at the baseline and closing at the
top of the letters; ConTeXt has been programmed this way.
However
of whitespace between paragraphs and also narrower. I'd like
to setup some form of quotation paragraph style to use. I started out with
\startquotation but I do not want quotes, so now I use startnarrower, but
what I need is a paragraph style. Maybe another font (1pt smaller) is nice
too. And noindenting
indentation, but here I want a
small amount of whitespace between paragraphs and also narrower. I'd like
to setup some form of quotation paragraph style to use. I started out with
\startquotation but I do not want quotes, so now I use startnarrower, but
what I need is a paragraph style. Maybe
a fragment of a book which contains amongst others a
discussion (Plato's Protagoras to be precise). Normally, my book has no
whitespace between paragraphs and small indentation, but here I want a
small amount of whitespace between paragraphs and also narrower. I'd like
to setup some form of quotation
Alan Bowen wrote:
\quote and \quotation generate an unwanted space after the closing
quote or quotation mark.
To see the problem, try
\starttext
(\quote{Hello world!})
(\quotation{Hello world!})
\stoptext
Is this old news or an artefact of recent changes?
It is definately recent
Taco Hoekwater wrote:
It is definately recent because it did not happen in 20060202.
There is a missing percent sign in the new core-mis.tex:
--- core-mis.tex.orig 2006-02-06 10:20:00.514036364 +0100
+++ core-mis.tex2006-02-06 10:20:16.690357309 +0100
@@ -595,7 +595,7 @@
\or
Thanks, Taco, Hans.
Alan
On Feb 6, 2006, at 5:26 AM, Hans Hagen wrote:
Taco Hoekwater wrote:
It is definately recent because it did not happen in 20060202.
There is a missing percent sign in the new core-mis.tex:
--- core-mis.tex.orig 2006-02-06 10:20:00.514036364 +0100
+++ core-mis.tex
\quote and \quotation generate an unwanted space after the closing
quote or quotation mark.
To see the problem, try
\starttext
(\quote{Hello world!})
(\quotation{Hello world!})
\stoptext
Is this old news or an artefact of recent changes?
Best, Alan
Alan Bowen wrote:
Peter, Willi, and Hans�
I have incorporated your suggestions for getting better looking long
quotations, and all is now working very well indeed. Many thanks to
you all.
Alan
PS For the record, here is what I have now�just in case someone down
the line runs into the
Hans—
I have not wiki-ed anything before, so this was a first try and I
think it worked. At least it shows up on my user page.
Best, Alan
On Nov 9, 2005, at 7:30 AM, Hans Hagen wrote:
Alan Bowen wrote:
Peter, Willi, and Hans�
I have incorporated your suggestions for getting better
-spacing and (unwanted) indentation in the first
line of the quotation in the footnote: this quotation should look the
same as the one in the body text.
I realize that I could fix this simply by inserting a \noindent in
the footnote, for instance. But I am trying to reduce the amount of
thinking
, but fails in the footnotes. I have
appended some encoded text that shows the problem. Note the poor
line-spacing and (unwanted) indentation in the first line of the
quotation in the footnote: this quotation should look the same as the
one in the body text.
I realize that I could fix
, but fails in the
footnotes. I have appended some encoded text that shows the problem.
Note the poor line-spacing and (unwanted) indentation in the first
line of the quotation in the footnote: this quotation should look the
same as the one in the body text.
I realize that I could fix
the poor line-spacing and (unwanted) indentation in the first
line of the quotation in the footnote: this quotation should look the
same as the one in the body text.
I realize that I could fix this simply by inserting a \noindent in
the footnote, for instance. But I am trying to reduce
Willi Egger wrote:
Hi Alan,
I tried your code. I made the extract to be typeset in red.- Indeed a
poor spacing.
I withdrew the \godown[0.10pc]. The result looked fine to me. Then I
replaced the \godown by \blank[halfline], the result was again o.k.
Finally the \godown[0.10pc] was replaced
Hey, please don't take the famous lorem ipsum for Latin, or those
knowing Latin will be offended... This is just random gibberish
looking slightly Latin :-)
Thomas
On Oct 21, 2005, at 6:56 PM, Peter Rolf wrote:
please, *no* more latin examples.
Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
Hey, please don't take the famous lorem ipsum for Latin, or those
knowing Latin will be offended... This is just random gibberish looking
slightly Latin :-)
Oeps. Now I know why I didn't get the Latinum :)
Peter
Thomas
On Oct 21, 2005, at 6:56 PM, Peter Rolf
Among printers this Latinate gibberish (which was “taken” from
Cicero) was known as “greeked text” or as “printers’ Greek”—which is
really nonsense and yet another reason not to pay attention to it!
Alan
On Oct 21, 2005, at 1:40 PM, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
Hey, please don't take the
Peter, Willi, and Hans—
I have incorporated your suggestions for getting better looking long
quotations, and all is now working very well indeed. Many thanks to
you all.
Alan
PS For the record, here is what I have now—just in case someone down
the line runs into the same problem. A.
On Thu, 14 Apr 2005, Patrick Gundlach wrote:
after a \quotation no line break is possible. For what reason?
Is this a bug or a feature? (I'd consider this as a bug).
Me too. Workaround: \quotation{...}\hbox{}
Cheers, Peter
--
http://pmrb.free.fr/contact
Patrick Gundlach wrote:
Hello out there,
after a \quotation no line break is possible. For what reason?
Is this a bug or a feature? (I'd consider this as a bug).
or an oversight or ..
some testing shows me that the last word in a quotation cannot be hyphenated
(i'll correct that); since
Peter Münster wrote:
On Thu, 14 Apr 2005, Patrick Gundlach wrote:
after a \quotation no line break is possible. For what reason?
Is this a bug or a feature? (I'd consider this as a bug).
Me too. Workaround: \quotation{...}\hbox{}
\def\rightboundarycharacter#1#2%
{\prewordbreak %\nobreak
Hello out there,
after a \quotation no line break is possible. For what reason?
Is this a bug or a feature? (I'd consider this as a bug).
--
\starttext
\tracingparagraphs=1
\tracingonline=1
\pretolerance -1
\tolerance 1
\quotation{Foo bar baz
Patrick Gundlach wrote:
Hi,
[...]
but ... what is wrong with that?
The question is, do the struts affect the typesetting (kerning)?
no, that is, spacing between and the rest is a matter of additional kerns anyway
Hans
-
Ulrich Dirr wrote:
Patrick Gundlach wrote:
Hello Hans and Ulrich,
[...]
Woran arbeiten Sie? wurde Herr K. gefragt. Herr K. antwortete:
Ich habe viel Mhe, ich bereite meinen nchsten Irrtum vor. (B.
Brecht) Aber Hallo! \quotation{all right \quote{there} we go}
\stoptext
hm, what do
Patrick Gundlach wrote:
Hello Hans and Ulrich,
[...]
Woran arbeiten Sie? wurde Herr K. gefragt. Herr K. antwortete:
Ich habe viel Mhe, ich bereite meinen nchsten Irrtum vor. (B.
Brecht) Aber Hallo! \quotation{all right \quote{there} we go}
\stoptext
what exactly is the unwanted effect
Patrick Gundlach wrote:
Hello Hans,
what exactly is the unwanted effect?
struts inserted before quotation marks that prevent kerning(?).
Can you send me a test file?
--
\mainlanguage[de]
% same effect with:
%
% \setuplanguage
Hi,
[...]
but ... what is wrong with that?
The question is, do the struts affect the typesetting (kerning)?
Patrick
--
ConTeXt wiki: http://contextgarden.net
texshow-web: http://texshow.contextgarden.net
List archive: http://archive.contextgarden.net
Hello Hans and Ulrich,
[...]
Woran arbeiten Sie? wurde Herr K. gefragt. Herr K. antwortete:
Ich habe viel Mhe, ich bereite meinen nchsten Irrtum vor. (B.
Brecht) Aber Hallo! \quotation{all right \quote{there} we go}
\stoptext
hm, what do other german users experience/think?
I experience
Patrick Gundlach wrote:
Hello Hans and Ulrich,
[...]
Woran arbeiten Sie? wurde Herr K. gefragt. Herr K. antwortete:
Ich habe viel Mhe, ich bereite meinen nchsten Irrtum vor. (B.
Brecht) Aber Hallo! \quotation{all right \quote{there} we go}
\stoptext
hm, what do other german users
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