Re: [obc] Sidewalk Cycling
Well Avery: CAN-BIKE teaches those exact same principles. However I find from teaching Kids CAN-BIKE that the eight year olds have a little trouble with the concepts. At eight years old your perception is just starting to develop. They cannot judge distance between moving objects, let alone the experience required to judge when to move left (unless there are no cars around). Therefore two questions: 1. Do you expect an eight year old to judge distance of a two ton object travelling at 40 km/hr? 2. How do you cycle with a child under eight? Peter McNichol Avery Burdett wrote: John Forester (Effective Cycling) believes virtually any grade 3 child can be taught, absorb and perform the following three fundamental concepts: 1. Ride on the right-hand side of the roadway, not on the left and not on the sidewalk. 2. How to yield to crossing traffic when reaching a superior roadway. 3. How to yield to overtaking traffic when moving laterally. Each child has his or her own individual cognitive and physical abilities, so knowledgeable cycling parents could start vehicular cycling instruction to their kids as early as five years of age on quiet residential streets. I did with my two sons - soon after they could balance on a two wheeler. It is not unreasonable for kids to be riding alone on residential streets near home with about a year's worth of supervised practice. Contemporaneously, they should be introduced to Forester's next two concepts: 4. Destination positioning at intersections. (i.e. getting to the proper place in preparation for a turn) 5. Speed positioning between intersections (e.g. passing a slower cyclist) Within a year or so they can be introduced (under supervision) to four lane roads, higher traffic densities and more complex traffic patterns. Forester source: http://www.johnforester.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Avery, I couldn't agree more that young children need to be supervised. For us parents, I was wondering at what developmental stages would you introduce the various aspects of vehicular cycling? As you say, vehicular road cycling starts the day they start to ride. Mom on a Bike Avery Burdett wrote: The children I refer to are ones that need adult supervision no matter where they ride. Children (under supervision of course) should be introduced to vehicular road cycling from the day they start to ride. -Original Message- From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent:Wednesday, September 05, 2001 9:19 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [obc] Lowell Green on CFRA There are many competent cyclist out there who may or may not belong to the many great cycling clubs and organizations this whole region has to offer. In saying that I noticed out of between 15 to 20 child cylist I saw riding home on their bikes, only one rode appropriately. The others rode on the sidewalk, did not look, turned left from the right side of the road, rode up the wrong side of the street. There are apporximately 100,000 school age child cyclist in this city. That would mean they outnumber OBC riders 100:1. Mom on a Bike Paul Lindsay wrote: Re: [obc] Lowell Green on CFRAThing is, a lot of cyclists are jerks. How many cyclists out there are actually following the rules of the road and behaving decently? Not many. We're used to riding with our OBC friends and on club rides and loops in the Gats when for the most part most cyclists are either incompetant commuters or bike path and sidewalk noodlers that are two eggs short of a dozen. Just a day or two ago I wrote an e-mail to one of the editors of the car magazine Wheels for tarring all cyclists with scorn and innuendo similar to the reported Lowell Green incident. This guy referred to all riders as suicyclists and was angry that we all bitch and complain about car drivers but don't follow the rules of the road ourselves. Such media people are dangerous. On the other hand, I think Michael's comments sound a bit 'elitist'. I think there are many commuters, bike path riders, and general tourist cyclists, equally competent and law-abiding as those of the OBC. And there are numerous times I have seen club members running lights and stop signs (somtimes wearing their OBC jersey). Paul L. -- To unsubscribe, send a blank message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Club Office: [EMAIL PROTECTED], (613) 230-1064 Web/mailing list: [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.cyberus.ca/~obcweb Newsletter: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.cyberus.ca/~obcweb/Newsletter -- To unsubscribe, send
Re: [obc] Sidewalk Cycling
Who teaches the car drivers that the child in the lane has rights to the lane. I have not allowed my 12 year old son to bicycle to school, because if he makes an inch difference mistake of where he should be in the straight through lane on Orleans Blvd, I will be visting him in CHEO. I have on off hours headed with him to his school and the car drivers are merciless in their determination for every inch of road. Just as an aside, in the bus lane on Montreal road, before 17:00 hrs some clown hit my cycle mirror with his car mirror, while stopped at a traffic light. Just some little Toyota with the whole family in the car, so obviously he was not in a hurry to get to the baby sitters to pick up the kids. Back to my son, his path would be all residential until he has to cross St. Joseph Blvd, there is a RT lane and straight through lanes, and if he miss judges the lane he will be toast by some insignificatn cager who is in a hurry; to cause an incident. FYI, I told Graydon at the Police Blitz meeting that we should corporately send a letter to the Chief of Police informing him that the citizens of this city would be in favour of no-leinency towards speeding in a 40k (or 60k)zone, ie. 41 is a ticket. And conversely let the cagers have there 20 k buffer on the 80k and over roadways. They do it anyways. 2001-09-08 5:32:55 AM, Perry McKenna [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I thought my two boys at the age of 6 and 7 to ride on the streets on not on the sidewalks and to assume the correct position when making turns. Now two years later we still have not ventured out of Stittsville, but have cycled down the busy Main Street. All of this under supervision. They are already comfortable having cars beside them and feel safer on the roads than on the sidewalks. As for large vehicles, or for that matter any vehicle moving at 40 to 60 k/h, I let them make the decision if they should proceed, by asking them to let me know if you can merge, turn or proceed If I am not comfortable with their decision, I tell them not to proceed and why. I think the key is to start riding in traffic in your residential area, and to progressively moved up to busier streets. Our next challenge will be riding to Kanata. Perry McKenna - Original Message - From: Peter McNichol [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2001 5:55 AM Subject: Re: [obc] Sidewalk Cycling Well Avery: CAN-BIKE teaches those exact same principles. However I find from teaching Kids CAN-BIKE that the eight year olds have a little trouble with the concepts. At eight years old your perception is just starting to develop. They cannot judge distance between moving objects, let alone the experience required to judge when to move left (unless there are no cars around). Therefore two questions: 1. Do you expect an eight year old to judge distance of a two ton object travelling at 40 km/hr? 2. How do you cycle with a child under eight? Peter McNichol Avery Burdett wrote: John Forester (Effective Cycling) believes virtually any grade 3 child can be taught, absorb and perform the following three fundamental concepts: 1. Ride on the right-hand side of the roadway, not on the left and not on the sidewalk. 2. How to yield to crossing traffic when reaching a superior roadway. 3. How to yield to overtaking traffic when moving laterally. Each child has his or her own individual cognitive and physical abilities, so knowledgeable cycling parents could start vehicular cycling instruction to their kids as early as five years of age on quiet residential streets. I did with my two sons - soon after they could balance on a two wheeler. It is not unreasonable for kids to be riding alone on residential streets near home with about a year's worth of supervised practice. Contemporaneously, they should be introduced to Forester's next two concepts: 4. Destination positioning at intersections. (i.e. getting to the proper place in preparation for a turn) 5. Speed positioning between intersections (e.g. passing a slower cyclist) Within a year or so they can be introduced (under supervision) to four lane roads, higher traffic densities and more complex traffic patterns. Forester source: http://www.johnforester.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Avery, I couldn't agree more that young children need to be supervised. For us parents, I was wondering at what developmental stages would you introduce the various aspects of vehicular cycling? As you say, vehicular road cycling starts the day they start to ride. Mom on a Bike Avery Burdett wrote: The children I refer to are ones that need adult supervision no matter where they ride. Children (under supervision of course) should be introduced to vehicular road cycling from the day they start to ride. -Original
RE: [obc] Sidewalk Cycling
John Forester (Effective Cycling) believes virtually any grade 3 child can be taught, absorb and perform the following three fundamental concepts: 1. Ride on the right-hand side of the roadway, not on the left and not on the sidewalk. 2. How to yield to crossing traffic when reaching a superior roadway. 3. How to yield to overtaking traffic when moving laterally. Each child has his or her own individual cognitive and physical abilities, so knowledgeable cycling parents could start vehicular cycling instruction to their kids as early as five years of age on quiet residential streets. I did with my two sons - soon after they could balance on a two wheeler. It is not unreasonable for kids to be riding alone on residential streets near home with about a year's worth of supervised practice. Contemporaneously, they should be introduced to Forester's next two concepts: 4. Destination positioning at intersections. (i.e. getting to the proper place in preparation for a turn) 5. Speed positioning between intersections (e.g. passing a slower cyclist) Within a year or so they can be introduced (under supervision) to four lane roads, higher traffic densities and more complex traffic patterns. Forester source: http://www.johnforester.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Avery, I couldn't agree more that young children need to be supervised. For us parents, I was wondering at what developmental stages would you introduce the various aspects of vehicular cycling? As you say, vehicular road cycling starts the day they start to ride. Mom on a Bike Avery Burdett wrote: The children I refer to are ones that need adult supervision no matter where they ride. Children (under supervision of course) should be introduced to vehicular road cycling from the day they start to ride. -Original Message- From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent:Wednesday, September 05, 2001 9:19 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [obc] Lowell Green on CFRA There are many competent cyclist out there who may or may not belong to the many great cycling clubs and organizations this whole region has to offer. In saying that I noticed out of between 15 to 20 child cylist I saw riding home on their bikes, only one rode appropriately. The others rode on the sidewalk, did not look, turned left from the right side of the road, rode up the wrong side of the street. There are apporximately 100,000 school age child cyclist in this city. That would mean they outnumber OBC riders 100:1. Mom on a Bike Paul Lindsay wrote: Re: [obc] Lowell Green on CFRAThing is, a lot of cyclists are jerks. How many cyclists out there are actually following the rules of the road and behaving decently? Not many. We're used to riding with our OBC friends and on club rides and loops in the Gats when for the most part most cyclists are either incompetant commuters or bike path and sidewalk noodlers that are two eggs short of a dozen. Just a day or two ago I wrote an e-mail to one of the editors of the car magazine Wheels for tarring all cyclists with scorn and innuendo similar to the reported Lowell Green incident. This guy referred to all riders as suicyclists and was angry that we all bitch and complain about car drivers but don't follow the rules of the road ourselves. Such media people are dangerous. On the other hand, I think Michael's comments sound a bit 'elitist'. I think there are many commuters, bike path riders, and general tourist cyclists, equally competent and law-abiding as those of the OBC. And there are numerous times I have seen club members running lights and stop signs (somtimes wearing their OBC jersey). Paul L. -- To unsubscribe, send a blank message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Club Office: [EMAIL PROTECTED], (613) 230-1064 Web/mailing list: [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.cyberus.ca/~obcweb Newsletter: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.cyberus.ca/~obcweb/Newsletter -- To unsubscribe, send a blank message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Club Office: [EMAIL PROTECTED], (613) 230-1064 Web/mailing list: [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.cyberus.ca/~obcweb Newsletter: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.cyberus.ca/~obcweb/Newsletter -- To unsubscribe, send a blank message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Club Office: [EMAIL PROTECTED], (613) 230-1064 Web/mailing list: [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.cyberus.ca/~obcweb Newsletter: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.cyberus.ca/~obcweb/Newsletter -- Avery Burdett Ottawa, Ontario -- To unsubscribe, send a blank message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Club Office:
