--- Devine, James [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
CJ writes: I object to the constant
crisis-mongering discourse of the
'analysts' and 'economists' at venture banks.
Charles, what is _your_ job? is there anything
associated with your job
which would encourage anyone to dismiss your
opionions
--- Mark Jones [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:owner-pen-l;galaxy.csuchico.edu]On
Behalf Of Charles Jannuzi
Sent: 04 November 2002 14:01
In Japan it is caused, it seems to me, by a
chronically overvalued yen--against the US
Did a weakening yen or a strengthening yen cause
the Asian crises of 1997-8. One account has it
that from 1995-6, the yen depreciated and this
cause the crisis. OTOH, another account--which I
posted on this list earlier this year--says that
the way the crisis developed is best accounted
for as a
Hi Joanne:
I agree with what I take to be your drift - the term American uttered
in some circles with a hatred, can be mis-used to 'blame all Americans,
for what the USA system has done. Point taken.
Agreed!
Hi Carrol:
I am not sure why you ask such a pointed question of a simple
statement. I know
Title: RE: [PEN-L:31851] RE: Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process
It's part of the new race to the
bottom, the downward harmonization of moral standards.
Jim
Don't forget that it was Churchill who first proposed gassing and
bombing
Iraq in 1919. The idea that there was ever an upward
Title: RE: [PEN-L:31856] Re: Roach on Asia
CJ writes: I object to the constant
crisis-mongering discourse of the
'analysts' and 'economists' at venture banks.
I asked:
Charles, what is _your_ job? is there anything
associated with your job
which would encourage anyone to dismiss
--- Devine, James [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
CJ writes: I object to the constant
crisis-mongering discourse of the
'analysts' and 'economists' at venture
banks.
I asked:
Charles, what is _your_ job? is there
anything
associated with your job
which would encourage anyone to
Whoa! I think that Jim could have done better than ask about Charles'
job. Charles' response is making things worse. Cool it, please. Jim was
correct that Roach should not be dismissed just because of his job, but he
could have made his point differently.
On Tue, Nov 05, 2002 at 07:35:44AM
Jim was
correct that Roach should not be dismissed just
because of his job, but he
could have made his point differently.
But you see, you are falling for Prof. Devine's
tactic. No one is arguing that Roach ought to be
dimissed only because he is in pay of venture
capital. Do you want me to
I did not imply that that was all that you said about Roach. Please, you
have a lot to contribute, don't waste your energy on anger.
On Tue, Nov 05, 2002 at 07:50:13AM -0800, Charles Jannuzi wrote:
Jim was
correct that Roach should not be dismissed just
because of his job, but he
could have
And I'll just post a lie-a-day from Roach til you
get tired:
Morgan Stanley's Roach said Japan's moment of
truth has arrived. In the eleven years since
Japan's economic bubble burst, no structural
reforms have taken place. If the country carries
out the necessary reforms, Japan could regain its
--- Michael Perelman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
I did not imply that that was all that you said
about Roach. Please, you
have a lot to contribute, don't waste your
energy on anger.
Yes, but you shouldn't let open spaces in your
words to let others infer it if it can be easily
avoided. I don't
Title: RE: [PEN-L:31864] Re: Roach on Asia
To set the record straight, I did read everything that CJ wrote about Roach. Much of it -- perhaps even all -- seemed valid, except for his making of the critique a personal thing. He started dismissing Roach as a venture banker once he discovered
The situation in health care varies from province to province as does the
political climate. My impression is that the majority of people are just
not that politically astute or active. Not because they are stupid but
because politics is just not a significant concern. Less and less people
even
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I think these things go in cycles. Back when the
US faced superpower competition from the USSR, both
sides had to try to look good internationally,
causing a temporary upward harmonization.
JD
I've been waiting for years to hear Jim Devine agree with me that the Soviet
Union was a Good
Title: RE: [PEN-L:31870] RE: RE: RE: Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process
I think these things go in cycles. Back when the
US faced superpower competition from the USSR, both
sides had to try to look good internationally,
causing a temporary upward harmonization.
JD
Mark:
I've
RE: [PEN-L:31851] RE: Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process
- Original Message -
From: Devine, James
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED] '
Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2002 7:06 AM
Subject: [PEN-L:31860] RE: RE: Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process
It's part of the new race to the
bottom, the downward
Title: harmonization
(was: RE: [PEN-L:31872] Re: RE: RE: Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process)
I wrote:
I think these things go in cycles. Back when the US faced superpower
competition from the USSR, both sides had to try to look good
internationally, causing a temporary upward
At 04:44 PM 11/05/2002 +, you wrote:
I've been waiting for years to hear Jim Devine agree with me that the Soviet
Union was a Good Thing. At last! At last! The next step in his intellectual
evolution would be to acknowledge the indispensable role of Stalin in
defending the existence of the
Devine, James wrote:
The US/USSR competition obviously encouraged such horrible events as
the US war against Viet Nam and the USSR's invasion of Czechoslovakia.
But, as we discovered very clearly once the competition ended, it also
created an environment in which social democracy could
I think that there was indeed competition between the USSR and the US.
The USSR offered an alternative model to developing countries. The US
could not bully everybody willy nilly as they now can. They had to use a
few carrots along with their sticks.
Now the US no longer has to pretend that it
Title: RE: [PEN-L:31875] Re: harmonization
Somehow, Michael Perelman used his extra-sensory perception to channel my spiritual essence and gave a more concise version of what I would have said in response to what Louis Proyect writes below.
Jim Devine [EMAIL
At 04:44 PM 11/05/2002 +, you wrote:
I've been waiting for years to hear Jim Devine agree with me
that the Soviet
Union was a Good Thing. At last! At last! The next step in his
intellectual
evolution would be to acknowledge the indispensable role of Stalin in
defending the existence
Title: harmonization
er,
how did India gain since 1991? They weaponised their nukes? Built the Narmada
Dam? What?
Mark
-Original Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On
Behalf Of Devine, JamesSent: 05 November 2002
18:05To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'Subject:
Title: RE: [PEN-L:31879] RE: harmonization
I wasn't using a single-factor theory of India's development, which itself can't be reduced to a single variable. India gained after 1991 in terms of standard measures of economic development (e.g., GDP per capita) partly because the Cold War period
http://www.taipeitimes.com/news/2002/11/02/story/178063
WTO's new chief says sanctions are bad for global trade
BLOOMBERG, GENEVA
Disputes at the WTO that result in sanctions, such as a record US$4 billion
the EU was given permission to impose on the US, threaten to undermine the
trading
Devine, James wrote:
I had a similar experience. After falling off that fence, a friend
(now an ex-friend) has actually said that (paraphrasing), look at
what the US did to Afghanistan. Why can't Israel do the same kind of
thing?
Some Israelis say that they actually take more care about
Title: RE: [PEN-L:31882] Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process
I wrote:
I had a similar experience. After falling off that fence, a friend
(now an ex-friend) has actually said that (paraphrasing), look at
what the US did to Afghanistan. Why can't Israel do the same kind of
thing?
Doug
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:owner-pen-l;galaxy.csuchico.edu]On Behalf Of Doug Henwood
Sent: 05 November 2002 21:40
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:31882] Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process
Some Israelis say that they actually take more care
Mark, I agree with Doug here. I understand that Japanese assassins use
knives instead of sniper guns. The Israelis put some of their soldiers at
risk -- despite the viciousness of their policy. The US fights where its
personnel are at no direct risk.
This is in no way an apology for Sharon.
Mark wrote:
The next step in his
intellectual
evolution would be to acknowledge the indispensable role of Stalin in
defending the existence of the USSR againt imperialist attacks in the
1940s-1950s.
Joanna wrote:
I'd give the credit to the Soviet people.
Mark wrote:
then you'd
Title: FW: [Iww-news] Bush's Pal Returns Insider Trading Profits
--
From: steve zeltzer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 12:09:13 -0800
To: bawdn [EMAIL PROTECTED], TUDN [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [Iww-news] Bush's Pal Returns Insider Trading Profits
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:owner-pen-l;galaxy.csuchico.edu]On Behalf Of Michael Perelman
Sent: 05 November 2002 22:06
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:31885] Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process
Mark, I agree with Doug here. I understand that
I don't and wouldn't excuse Sharon. It is just that this robo-war seems
inexcusably cowardly. With the push for weaponizing space, it seems to be
an immense threat to the world.
Sharon is despicable. This bodes something even worse.
On Tue, Nov 05, 2002 at 10:30:10PM -, Mark Jones wrote:
Mark Jones wrote:
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:owner-pen-l;galaxy.csuchico.edu]On Behalf Of Doug Henwood
Sent: 05 November 2002 21:40
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:31882] Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process
Some Israelis say that they actually
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:owner-pen-l;galaxy.csuchico.edu]On Behalf Of Doug Henwood
Sent: 05 November 2002 22:44
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:31890] Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: dismantling due process
Of course not, you prick. Though I'm not the least
Yoshie:
Sorry - re lateness reply sorry to address you via PEN-L [I could not
easily see your address].
You asked for writers for Journal of Poverty speical issue re Latin
America.
Dr Jose Venturelli would be interested - he is very authoritative re
child helath poverty in Latin America.
See
Joanna wrote:
The short answer is that during WWII the soviet people fought against a
fascism whose explicit aim was their enslavement; in 1989, they were sold
out by Stalinist bureaucrats and black marketeers.
The shorter answer is that if Stalin had not sabotaged the revolutionary
James
You acknowledge in your note below, that there may be greater
inequality.
So what do these overarching figures showing improvement really mean
to progressives?
Incidentally I understand by the term 'welfare state' a rather more
substantive 'welfare' than has ever been provided. Perhaps the
Mark, I cannot believe that you really think Doug is an apologist for
Sharon. He overreacted and then you poured on more fuel. This sort of
behavor is destructive.
On Tue, Nov 05, 2002 at 11:00:43PM -, Mark Jones wrote:
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dear Joanna:
I do not intend to take issue with each substantive point that you make.
I am happy to do so if you choose to insist. I honestly do not think
that in this forum, it is likely to be of any use.
However, I do certainly take exception to an equation of Stalinism with
events up to 1989.
Title: RE: [PEN-L:31894] RE: RE: Re:harmonization
From: Hari Kumar --
James
You acknowledge in your note below, that there may be greater
inequality. So what do these overarching figures showing improvement really mean
to progressives?
growth of per capita GDP indicates that at least
On Tuesday, November 5, 2002 at 15:27:16 (-0800) Michael Perelman writes:
Mark, I cannot believe that you really think Doug is an apologist for
Sharon. He overreacted and then you poured on more fuel. This sort of
behavor is destructive.
Doug was not overreacting. Jones is an intellectual
Bill Lear wrote:
Doug was not overreacting. Jones is an intellectual bottom-dweller
who has no place on this list, nor on any other that has minimal
respect for evidence in debate. He has shown a tidy history of ad
hominem attack coupled with gross distortion of posters' stated
positions. In
Michael Perelman wrote:
Mark, I cannot believe that you really think Doug is an apologist for
Sharon. He overreacted
No Michael I didn't not overreact. This is the same fellow that
called me a killer of Afghan babies. He and his toxic sidekick thrive
on that sort of thing.
Doug
Doug Henwood wrote:
No Michael I didn't not overreact. This is the same fellow that called
me a killer of Afghan babies. He and his toxic sidekick thrive on that
sort of thing.
Who are you calling toxic? This is not LBO-Talk, Doug. If you want to
have a pissing contest with me, put me on
Dear Mark,
Akhmatova, one of the greatest poets of this century, would turn over in
her grave if she knew that her poetry was used in defense of Stalin. As for
the piece by Simonov, it is a typical piece of nationalistic clap
trap--having nothing whatsoever to do with the heroic and selfless
http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/asia/story/0,4386,153191,00.html?
RUN-UP TO 16TH PARTY CONGRESS
Qinghua mafia will call the shots
But a growing band of lawyers and economists could make a significant impact
in the years ahead
By Leslie Fong
NEWS ANALYSIS
TECHNOCRATS, many belonging to the
Ken's response on Canadians' reaction to cuts and proposed
privatizations of medicare, while I agree with what he said, leaves a
lot more unsaid. Let me summarize as briefly as I can.
1. In the early 1990's the federal government cut a lot out of the
transfers to the provinces to finance
Why Blair is an appeaser
Britain plays poodle partly because the US is stitching up the world's oil
supplies
George Monbiot Tuesday November 5, 2002 The Guardian
Tony Blair's loyalty to George Bush looks like slow political suicide. His
preparedness to follow him over every precipice
Of course it is doubtful that the US really disapproves of Israel's action.
Just going through politically correct motions.
Cheers, Ken Hanly
Do as we say, not as we do, U.S. affirms
Associated Press
Washington - The Bush administration renewed its opposition Tuesday to
Israel's
yes absurd is the word.
And the awareness of this is growing year by year, as the sophistication of
modern information systems means that all economic and political
information is always analysed in context.
The necessary step of imagination is becoming smaller and smaller.
The step of
The assassination in the Yemen is grim, not of course because it has never
been done before, but because they do not even try to cover it up.
At least the British government tried to conceal its assassinations of the
IRA,
What is happening is much more important than a bitter exchange
Another British led imperialist firm. British Airways, has just had its
chief executive call for a level playing field between Europe and the USA
The context was the EU's ruling that individual deals by European airlines
with the USA is unfair competition. BA was saying that it is better that
Momentous agreement yesterday to form a free trade area between Asean and
China by 2012.
Even though there will be pitfalls and China has its areas of
vulnerability, this is a signal that China is moving ahead of Japan as a
focus of economic activity in eastern Asia.
Chris Burford
This article from Tuesday's Guardian by the radical journalist Jonathan
Friedland, warns liberals and socialists in the UK not to under-estimate Bush.
If the early results are confirmed that the election is going Bush's way, I
hope US subscribers will not sink into mere cynicism. Resistance
My God. Every post I have seen on this thread is toxic. Lou, you know
better and so does Doug. I should throw Bill Lear into the mix. Doug
made a perfectly reasonable statement, as I said before. Please cut the
flaming.
On Tue, Nov 05, 2002 at 07:32:06PM -0500, Louis Proyect wrote:
Doug
joanna bujes wrote:
Why did Stalin sign on to the Nazi-Soviet Nonagression Pact? It only
bought time for the Nazis - that is why they wanted this pact so
badly!.
I don't think all that highly of Stalin (and Mark himself at one time or
another has made some of the points you make), but
Title: RE: (many times) dismantling dueprocess
joanna bujes wrote:
Why did Stalin sign on to the Nazi-Soviet Nonagression Pact? It only
bought time for the Nazis - that is why they wanted this pact so
badly!.
Carrol Cox:
I don't think all that highly of Stalin (and Mark himself at one
This is my reply, which Portside promised to run, to a recent open letter by Manning Marable and Fran Piven in behalf of Carl McCall and the WFP.(circulate widely)
stanley aronowitz
RESPONSE TO MARABLE AND PIVEN: VOTE FOR ARONOWITZ AND A REAL ALTERNATIVE
My good friends Manning Marable and
Michael Perelman wrote:
My God. Every post I have seen on this thread is toxic. Lou, you know
better and so does Doug. I should throw Bill Lear into the mix. Doug
made a perfectly reasonable statement, as I said before. Please cut the
flaming.
My theory is that Mark Lou are a
The person who used to occupy the office next to mine hated the USSR. He
did not speak to me for a long time after the Soviets went into
Afganistant.
Yet he insisted that the pact saved the USSR. It gave Stalin time to move
essential industries toward Asia.
Jim wrote:
It should be mentioned
Nobody looks good in this. Let's just drop it.
On Tue, Nov 05, 2002 at 09:54:53PM -0600, Carrol Cox wrote:
Michael Perelman wrote:
My God. Every post I have seen on this thread is toxic. Lou, you know
better and so does Doug. I should throw Bill Lear into the mix. Doug
made a
a very recent book by alain gresch (on the arab israeli conflict) says something to the effect that you cannot argue politics with nationalist who think that people are immutable or transcend history or religious folk who think that god has given them the land.
Going back to Mark's note on how
Jim wrote:
what kind of rationality? in economics, rationality typically
means trying to attain a specific goal.
You are wrong Jim.
In economics, rationality means that preferences are complete
and transitive. Of course, since that definition is too broad,
economists then go into this or that
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:owner-pen-l;galaxy.csuchico.edu]On Behalf Of joanna bujes
Sent: 06 November 2002 00:49
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I grew up reading Russian authors writing about this same
experience;
however, it was possible for me to distinguish
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:owner-pen-l;galaxy.csuchico.edu]On Behalf Of Michael Perelman
Sent: 06 November 2002 03:29
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:31913] Re: Re: Re: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re:
dismantling due process
My God. Every post I have
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:owner-pen-l;galaxy.csuchico.edu]On Behalf Of Sabri Oncu
Sent: 06 November 2002 06:34
To: PEN-L
Subject: [PEN-L:31920] Re: dismantling due process
I object to this kind of rationality and hence my objection to
Doug's calling Lou
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