Just in case this fails to post to the list, with which I've had
trouble lately:
Wait a minute, first you stated that Blinn's tennis team is all rich white
kids. Then , when your agenda is exposed, it's Blinndergarten??? You
can't have it both ways...
Sure he can. I probably know Blinn even
Wait a minute, first you stated that Blinn's tennis team is all rich white
kids. Then , when your agenda is exposed, it's Blinndergarten??? You
can't have it both ways...
Sure he can. I probably know Blinn even better than my friend Bret
does, since I grew up in the area. Here in Central Texas,
From: Lee Nichols [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Lee Nichols [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 13:13:48 -0600
To: Rich Harrington [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: t-and-f: The REAL athlete of the year
Sure he can. I probably know Blinn even better than my friend
You make my point about Lance vs Bonds. What is it about hitting a
fastball that makes it a more redeeming athletic endeavour than hitting
a bullseye? And I'm not putting down either.
Regards,,
Martin
Randall Northam wrote:
Aargh! I've put up with many other sports on this list - notably
Aargh! I've put up with many other sports on this list - notably
basketball, baseball and American Football, which no other country
other than the USA and Canada plays with any distinction - and is
therefore very, very parochial - but now we've got DARTS on the list
for heaven's sake.
To
1. Your opponent isn't moving the bullseye to cause you to miss;
2. The bullseye is substantially larger;
3. There is no need to react to the movement and differing speeds of the
bullseye;
4. There are far fewer great athletes throwing darts.
At 6:12 AM -0500 08.01.2003, Martin J. Dixon wrote:
From: Dave Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Dave Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 12:53:32 -0500
To: Martin J. Dixon [EMAIL PROTECTED], Randall Northam
[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: The REAL athlete of the year
1. Your opponent isn't
Let's not be so critical of Darts. This is truly one of the world's great
games. In fact, I was a member of a team in the early 1970's in Westwood
while in grad school at UCLA. I was the only non-Brit on the team of 8.
We played 301 and cricket exclusively. Not the cricket with the bats and
2. The bullseye is substantially larger
What game are we talking about here?
Regards,
Martin
Dave Johnson wrote:
1. Your opponent isn't moving the bullseye to cause you to miss;
2. The bullseye is substantially larger;
3. There is no need to react to the movement and differing speeds of the
Blinn's finest hour was one of its last. At the Texas Relays one year, the
USA 4x100 team was the featured attraction -- Carl Lewis and his crew. At
the end of the meet, they had a match race in the 4x4 with Blinn -- and
Blinn won by a nose. The times were actually a bit slower than Baylor ran in
Wait a minute, first you stated that Blinn's tennis team is all rich white
kids. Then , when your agenda is exposed, it's Blinndergarten??? You
can't have it both ways...
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Bloomquist, Bret
Sent: Wednesday,
Now here is a guy with a skill and we got him.
Two nights ago, Part beat Phil Taylor, who had won the world championship title
for eight years in a row.
http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/PEstory/TGAM/20030107/SDARTX/sports/sports/sports_temp/2/2/18/
ghill wrote:
Conversely,
My favorite quote from the darts article
Known on the circuit as Darth Maple for the dark Maple Leaf he wears on his shirt to
intimidate his opponents, Part described his game as consistent, dogged and
relentless.
Nothing like a picture of vegitation on your shirt to strike fear into the
- Armstrong is praised as being unique among cyclists to be training for
the TdF 7 months beforehand. Are all cyclists such wimps that such
training seems arduous? If a long distance runner isn't training virtually
year round, they're either not successful or considered a freak of
nature. I
I don't think other cyclists are losing to Lance in Le Tour because they're not
training hard. Apart from being the best cyclist in the world, Lance points toward
the Tour more than anyone else, it seems. Has he done the Giro (Tour of Italy) at all
before the previous four Tours? Lance will
When reading SI's Sportsman of the Year articles, I was struck by two items:
- Three of the first five SOYs were track and field athletes. I forget
when the last one won, but I think it may have been Mary Decker in 1983.
- Armstrong is praised as being unique among cyclists to be training for
that's like saying that the only thing Mo Greene has going for him as a
sprinter is his speed.
gh
From: Bloomquist, Bret [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Bloomquist, Bret [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:13:16 -0500
To: track list [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: t-and-f: The REAL
From: Kurt Bray [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Kurt Bray [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 23:07:17 +
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: The REAL athlete of the year
Resent-From: ghill [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Resent-To: e. garry hill [EMAIL PROTECTED]
His team isn't as much use to him in the mountains either. Put the top guys on
each team in the same position and he would come out ahead. As I've said before,
read the book and all the SI stuff you can on him and watch the tour and you
would learn it isn't just yankee hype. He has traded places
I don't know enough about cycling to know if this is a stupid question,
but
perhaps one of the wheelie mavens can clarify: how much of Armstrong's
Tour
success does he owe to his team? In other words, if he traded places with
whomever you think is the No. 2 rider, would he still be in a class
In the interest of beating this into the ground ...
Yes, what if all Mo Greene had was speed. What if he had no ability to
receive a baton or pass a baton? He'd be pretty useless on a relay. What if
he couldn't get out of the blocks quickly enough? Even so, I don't think the
analogy applies.
From: Jim Gerweck [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Jim Gerweck [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 18:39:01 -0500
To: Ed and Dana Parrot [EMAIL PROTECTED], Athletics
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: The REAL athlete of the year
Resent-From: ghill [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Resent-To: gh
It went by me at the time, but, back when ghill was talking about Barry
Bonds' genes, it afterward occurred to me that sister (to Bobby) and aunt
(to Barry) Rosie was quite a helluva hurdler in her time.
Bill Allen
- Original Message -
From: ghill [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: track list [EMAIL
Bloomquist, Bret wrote:
They asked if the Game 6 loss would haunt him during the off-season. Why
would it haunt me? he grumbled. What does that have to do with me?
This is simply unacceptable from an athlete in a team sport. You're
measured by championships and he didn't win one.
Not totally a magnanimous gesture as this is the way all pro cycling teams
operate - spoils are usually divided. Note how Armstrong was able to give a
stage win to Heras for 'services rendered' . . .
But the original argument stands. There is still no athlete greater than
Armstrong. Cycling is
on 12/29/02 10:51 AM, Martin J. Dixon at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Contrast with Lance who gave his $360,000(?) winnings from the Tour to his 8
teammates.
that's accepted practice in pro-cycling. But then again, so is tipping the
baseball clubhouse attendants, which Bonds pointedly does not.
--
Bret, if you are experiencing pain during athletic competition something
is wrong. Stop. See a physician.
malmo
Yes. Too many people overlook this. The point has been made that
Armstrong is simply able to ignore pain than anybody else.
Not totally a magnanimous gesture as this is the way all pro cycling teams
operate - spoils are usually divided. Note how Armstrong was able to give
a
stage win to Heras for 'services rendered' . . .
Heras did not win a stage in 2002. He won several in the Vuelte (Tour of
Spain) and is
I love Lance, but what Tiger accomplished this year (winning the first 2
majors) was rarer than what Lance accomplished (winning his 4th straight).
Not so. Winning the first two majors (Masters and US Open) in the same year
has been accomplished five times:
1951 Ben Hogan
1953 Ben Hogan
1960
on 12/28/02 12:55 AM, Ed and Dana Parrot at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
he was great this year but needs to get his lifetime
average over .300 to even be in the ballpark of lifetime great hitter
consideration
Ed, you (and others) would have choked if you'd been listening to NYC sports
talk radio
I can understand Lance Armstrong, Tiger Woods, and Apolo Ohno being in the
top five and Tim Montgomery should have been right up there as a world
record breaker. The rest should be ranked below Montgomery.
The bias of the voters comes through again as they just totally overlook TF
as a
Then there's Bonds. A great hitter, maybe deserving of top five status.
But how can you seriously consider an athlete with a critical error in
the
most significant game of the year? If he hadn't focused on bulk to the
exclusion of all else, not only would he have likely played the field
You people catch the AP's AOY voting? I'm not trying to start an Armstrong
vs. Bonds discussion (even though they did get it wrong), but how about Tim
Montgomery as the only track guy? Tied with John Stockton and Adam
Vinatieri. Good to see that he beat Sam Hornish, though.
gh
Player
Just because there is all kinds of nonsense below the top doesn't mean that
they can't get lucky and get the number one right. The pick of almost every
list that I have seen. Only my personal opinion, but after coming back from
what he came back from and doing what he did, these awards are beneath
Overcoming adversity should have little if anything to do with the athlete
of the year pick. Once again we see the recognition of excellence twisted
by considerations that are irrelevent to excellence. I say this as a rabid
fan of Lance Armstrong and of grand tour bicycle racing. I don't agree
Sorry to continue to stray off track here. The adversity was just icing. He
deserved to win it anyway. He did do a little something extra after winning it
twice, he won it a third time AND a fourth. Armstrong's thoughts on the matter
are not relevant. He is not a normal human being. Ask the great
As a sports editor for a paper affiliated with the Associated Press, I had a
vote on this.
My ballot was: Armstrong, Tiger Woods, Bonds. I would have had Montgomery
fourth. That's part of the problem here, however. You only get to pick three
and I just couldn't justify putting him ahead of any of
I just can't buy (in any kind of award-giving) the concept of somebody
getting athlete of the YEAR if any other year is taken into consideration.
Fact that it was a fourth win is as irrelevant as John Wayne winning the
lifetime body of work considerations Oscar for Rooster Cogburn. (And Ed
was
I'm not saying that he deserves it for the adversity angle or the fourth year in a
row angle. IMHO, he has deserved it for the last 4 years in a row taking each year
as a stand alone time frame. The other stuff is just making conversation. Ask his
peers to vote starting with Woods. He would win
Martin J. Dixon wrote:
Sorry to continue to stray off track here. The adversity was just icing.
He
deserved to win it anyway. He did do a little something extra after
winning it
twice, he won it a third time AND a fourth. Armstrong's thoughts on the
matter
are not relevant. He is not a normal
I see! There are obviously two important AOY criteria of which I was
unaware:
1. Must be an endurance athlete.
2. Like Cassius (the Shakespeare version, not the Louisville one), has to
have that lean and hungry look.
I'm not on any particular Bonds crusade, but I'd say that if at age 20 he
had
Conversely, Lance Armstrong could spend his next 302 incarnations and be
unable to hit a major league fastball out of the infield.
It's a skill you are born with kind of like juggling and holding your liquor. Not
so sure that it merits AOY honours. One could say that Paula is too stupid to
I love Lance, but what Tiger accomplished this year (winning the first 2
majors) was rarer than what Lance accomplished (winning his 4th straight).
Obviously rarity is not the only criteria, but I think you could make a
strong case for either one.
Then there's Bonds. A great hitter, maybe
I'm not on any particular Bonds crusade, but I'd say that if at age 20 he
had dedicated himself to being a cyclist he might have ended up
world-class.
Indeed, not sure that the quality of being too stupid to recognize pain
isn't the greatest requirement for a Tour de France type.
Excuse me?
Actually, Barry's track pedigree is far better than that. His father (Bobby,
also of baseball fame) was the No. 1 high school long jumper in the country
in '64 (Poly of Riverside, CA) at 25-3. Given that Barry was born 7/24/64,
Bobby was obviously a triple threat. :-)
To digress (a ton!), note
Actually they are tremondous jerks too - hence quadtuple threats - but
then again why this tremendous burst of power - steroids anyone? Why not
use athlete the way it was meant to be used in the first place - it deals
only with track field. Leo
-Original Message-
From: ghill
Does this mean that you fully expect Lance to be winning the sprinty time
trials in the Tour when he's 38+?
gh
From: Ed and Dana Parrot [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Ed and Dana Parrot [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 21:28:29 -0500
To: \Athletics\ [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re:
From: lacc7 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: lacc7 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 19:10:52 -0800
To: ghill [EMAIL PROTECTED], track list
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: The REAL athlete of the year
Actually they [the Bondses[ are tremondous jerks too - hence quadtuple
- Lance probably won't win the sprint time trial or the overall tour at age
38, so he will be less deserving of an athlete of the year award.
-I believe a Mr. Henderson stole 66 bases at age 39. Mr. Brock stole 56
bases at age 37 and 35 bases at age 38. This was about half of their normal
I am thrilled that Ronaldo got 9 votes. I would have expected him to get 2
in a AP AOY's voting, given that he competes (in Spain but) for a far away
country (Brazil), where some places don't even have decent hamburgers, in an
esoteric sport which almost amounts to unAmerican activity.
Uri
in all the chatter about the IAAF selection the last couple of days, i find it
interesting (but not surprising) that nobody has mentioned the man who will get my
vote as No. 1.
That would be Virgilijus Alekna.
gh
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