On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 11:38 PM, Shaun McDonald
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 1 Jun 2008, at 22:52, Cartinus wrote:
On Sunday 01 June 2008 17:43:11 Karl Newman wrote:
The examples that keep being quoted are of 'towns' that straddle
state
boundaries in the US
I don't know any examples of
On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 11:52 PM, Cartinus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
For another less obvious example closer to Martijn van Oosterhout:
A Dutch waterschap is an administrative level that resorts directly below
the national government. Several of them straddle provincial boundaries. In
the
On Monday 02 June 2008 10:38:59 Martijn van Oosterhout wrote:
Most people ignore them because they are irrevelent to most people.
They make no laws, have no jurisdiction. In that sense they're more
like postcode boundaries: a fairly arbitrary division of area for the
purposes of optimising
Dave Stubbs wrote:
On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 11:38 PM, Shaun McDonald
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 1 Jun 2008, at 22:52, Cartinus wrote:
On Sunday 01 June 2008 17:43:11 Karl Newman wrote:
The examples that keep being quoted are of 'towns' that straddle
state
boundaries in the US
I don't know
On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 4:57 PM, Lester Caine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Dave Stubbs wrote:
On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 11:38 PM, Shaun McDonald
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 1 Jun 2008, at 22:52, Cartinus wrote:
On Sunday 01 June 2008 17:43:11 Karl Newman wrote:
The examples that keep being quoted
Cartinus wrote:
A powerstation and a gas distribution node are physical things (fenced off
areas) and not administrative entities, so this comparison is just weird
IMHO.
I think Martijn was referring to the areas served by a particular power
station or gas distribution node, not to the
On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:49 AM, Lester Caine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Martijn van Oosterhout wrote:
Do you have an example if such a jurisdictional anomoly? It would seem
to me that such a servant with two masters would have some rather
interesting problems.
The examples that keep being
On Sunday 01 June 2008 17:43:11 Karl Newman wrote:
The examples that keep being quoted are of 'towns' that straddle state
boundaries in the US
I don't know any examples of towns straddling state boundaries, but towns
straddling county boundaries are common enough to break the model.
Here is
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 11:20 PM, Lester Caine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Same applies to any of the country boundaries, do you draw high water line, or
the international demarcation out on the continental shelf.
And England and Ireland are part of Europe and the EU so do you include the
water
On 30 May 2008, at 00:19, Dave Stubbs wrote:
This strand of the discussion (below) though echoes the earlier
thread I
kicked off (but gave up pursuing because there seemed to be more
prejudice
than logic in the discussion) about the idea of numerically-based
properties
in the database
To: Bruce Cowan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
On 29 May 2008, at 13:31, Bruce Cowan wrote:
Seriously, the number system for borders is rather strange, surely there
must be a more obvious scale. I suppose this has
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 11:25 AM, Andy Allan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Other words *could* be mapped into the same numbers. But since we can
see quite clearly that there are more than 10 types of administrative
boundaries in the world, and different people have different opinions
as to which
elvin ibbotson wrote:
As I understand it the numbers are not the problem, it
arises from people not knowing which is the right number to use (eg.
England/Scotland border admin_level 2 or 4?). This is why I think
numbers are useful in the data but users should not have to know what
numbers to
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 1:23 PM, Martijn van Oosterhout
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Because 99% of applications don't care the slightest how the internal
subdivisions of some random country in the world compare to those in
england. All renderers care about is is boundary A more or less
important
://www.soc.org.uk/
SoC conference 2008:
http://www.abdn.ac.uk/cartographers08/
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sebastian Spaeth
Sent: 30 May 2008 14:17
Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
2008/5/30 Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Also suggest a compromise for now.
Good call. Steve for President. But of what country?...
I'll get me coat.
Dermot
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From: Sebastian Spaeth [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 30 May 2008 14:16:59 BDT
Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
elvin ibbotson wrote:
As I understand it the numbers are not the problem, it
arises from people not knowing which is the right
elvin ibbotson wrote:
I for one do not want to have to be flicking backwards and forwards
between wiki pages looking up the correct tagging convention when I am
trying to edit the map. I much prefer simply choosing from the options
Potlatch or JOSM present to me. Unfortunately, all to
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 4:43 PM, elvin ibbotson
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
From: Sebastian Spaeth [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 30 May 2008 14:16:59 BDT
Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
elvin ibbotson wrote:
As I understand it the numbers
Martijn van Oosterhout wrote:
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 3:57 PM, Andy Allan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Yes, for rendering decisions like X =5. That doesn't imply it's the
best approach for storing the data. Don't tag for renderers etc.
It's not tagging for renderers. It's tagging for anything
Lester Caine wrote:
Personally I've been viewing admin_level=0 as the world.
admin_level=1 should equal the continents
admin_level=2 for countries ( UNITED KINGDOM )
admin_level=3 ( or so ) for states/areas ( ENGLAND )
It seems like level 4 is already used as you describe for level 3.
Only
El Viernes, 30 de Mayo de 2008, Lester Caine escribió:
Personally I've been viewing admin_level=0 as the world.
Yeah, say that again when extraterrestrials invade us :-P
admin_level=1 should equal the continents
I'm against this definition. A continent is a geographical separation, not an
Iván Sánchez Ortega wrote:
El Viernes, 30 de Mayo de 2008, Lester Caine escribió:
Personally I've been viewing admin_level=0 as the world.
Yeah, say that again when extraterrestrials invade us :-P
we can always have -ve number ;)
admin_level=1 should equal the continents
I'm against this
Martijn van Oosterhout wrote:
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 10:17 PM, Lester Caine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I'm not bothered that these levels are numbers, it is just that the CURRENT
numbers do not allow for ALL of the levels as THIS list suggests.
I still think there is a place for continents
According to Mapnik, Scotland and Wales have declared independence, and
Northern Ireland is part of the Republic of Ireland. Did I miss something?
Lucas
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] On Behalf Of Juan Lucas
Dominguez Rubio
Sent: 29 May 2008 07:57
To: talk@openstreetmap.org
Subject: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
According to Mapnik, Scotland and Wales have declared independence, and
Northern Ireland is part of the Republic of Ireland. Did I miss
something
2008/5/29 Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Scotland and Wales are countries.
Only in the same traditional folk-consciousness way that Bavaria or
Hessen are. So while it's certainly an important thing to reflect on
the map, the boundaries between the UK components (sub-countries?)
shouldn't
: Juan Lucas Dominguez Rubio; Steve Chilton
Asunto: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
France and Germany share the same currency, Iceland has no army, Australia and
England share the same head of state, Scotland has its own Parliament with
certain devolved powers
2008/5/29 Tom Chance [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Let's not get carried away! Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are countries
with national borders, so those should be shown the same as any other
national border.
Well, in a UK context, NI is actually a province, and isn't Wales a
principality?
: jue 29/05/2008 11:20
Para: Juan Lucas Dominguez Rubio; talk@openstreetmap.org
Asunto: RE: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
Scotland and Wales are countries.
Don't think the border between N Ireland and Rep of Ireland has been digitised
yet.
Cheers
STEVE
Steve Chilton
On 29 May 2008, at 11:41, Dermot McNally wrote:
2008/5/29 Richard Fairhurst [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Dermot McNally wrote:
2008/5/29 Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Scotland and Wales are countries.
Only in the same traditional folk-consciousness way that Bavaria or
Hessen are.
2008/5/29 Richard Fairhurst [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Dermot McNally wrote:
2008/5/29 Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Scotland and Wales are countries.
Only in the same traditional folk-consciousness way that Bavaria or
Hessen are.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom
thinks it's a bit
2008/5/29 Dermot McNally [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
2008/5/29 Tom Chance [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Let's not get carried away! Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are
countries
with national borders, so those should be shown the same as any other
national border.
Well, in a UK context, NI is
On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:57 AM, Juan Lucas Dominguez Rubio
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
According to Mapnik, Scotland and Wales have declared independence, and
Northern Ireland is part of the Republic of Ireland. Did I miss something?
The NI border hasn't been put into the OSM database.
As for
2008/5/29 Dave Stubbs [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
The NI border hasn't been put into the OSM database.
It has. I've been tweaking bits of it for months now. Look for ID 24428706.
This is just an indication of the conflicted definition of country,
nation, and national. The borders are in the OSM DB as
On Thu, 2008-05-29 at 08:57 +0200, Juan Lucas Dominguez Rubio wrote:
According to Mapnik, Scotland and Wales have declared independence,
and Northern Ireland is part of the Republic of Ireland. Did I miss
something?
Give it a few years, then it will be true.
Seriously, the number system for
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Dermot McNally wrote:
|
| But the clue here is that we're discussing the appropriate use of
| boundary tagging, specifically a thing we call admin_level. I guess
| none of us will disagree that Germany and the UK get to exercise a
| higher level of
On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 12:53 PM, Dermot McNally [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
2008/5/29 Dave Stubbs [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
The NI border hasn't been put into the OSM database.
It has. I've been tweaking bits of it for months now. Look for ID 24428706.
This is just an indication of the conflicted
Shaun McDonald wrote:
Seemingly a lot of people seem to regard the UK as England. It's
not the first time someone's asked me what it's like in England.
Until about 6 weeks ago I was unable to tell them because I had
never lived in England until then.
Same thing with Sweden! Foreigners
BTW, Juan, you should probably avoid suggesting to Irish people that
they live on a British island ;)
Just imagine the protests at the State of the Map
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Forgot to hit reply all ;)
Shaun McDonald wrote:
On 29 May 2008, at 13:31, Bruce Cowan wrote:
On Thu, 2008-05-29 at 08:57 +0200, Juan Lucas Dominguez Rubio wrote:
According to Mapnik, Scotland and Wales have declared independence,
and Northern Ireland is part of the Republic of Ireland. Did
On Thu, 2008-05-29 at 14:26 +0100, Robert (Jamie) Munro wrote:
I've always thought that England / Scotland / Wales / Northern Ireland
forming the UK are pretty similar to the 50 states forming the USA - I
think it would be reasonable to use the same markings on the default map
to divide them.
PROTECTED]
Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
On 29 May 2008, at 13:31, Bruce Cowan wrote:
Seriously, the number system for borders is rather strange, surely
there
must be a more obvious scale. I suppose this has been mentioned before
Surprised no one has posted this link yet:
http://qntm.org/?uk
A nice Venn diagram of the UK. :)
Beau
On 5/29/08, Robert (Jamie) Munro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Dermot McNally wrote:
|
| But the clue here is that we're discussing the
This strand of the discussion (below) though echoes the earlier thread I
kicked off (but gave up pursuing because there seemed to be more prejudice
than logic in the discussion) about the idea of numerically-based properties
in the database mapped to human-friendly language in editors and
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