Re: pre-HTML5 and the BOM

2012-07-18 Thread Leif Halvard Silli
Martin J. Dürst, Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:00:42 +0900: On 2012/07/17 23:11, Leif Halvard Silli wrote: Martin J. Dürst, Tue, 17 Jul 2012 18:49:47 +0900: On 2012/07/17 17:22, Leif Halvard Silli wrote: that a page with strict ASCII characters inside could still contain character entities/references

Re: UTF-8 BOM (Re: Charset declaration in HTML)

2012-07-18 Thread Martin J. Dürst
Hello Doug, On 2012/07/18 0:35, Doug Ewell wrote: For those who haven't yet had enough of this debate yet, here's a link to an informative blog (with some informative comments) from Michael Kaplan: Every character has a story #4: U+feff (alternate title: UTF-8 is the BOM, dude!)

Re: pre-HTML5 and the BOM

2012-07-18 Thread Martin J. Dürst
On 2012/07/18 16:35, Leif Halvard Silli wrote: Martin J. Dürst, Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:00:42 +0900: The best reason is simply that nobody should be using crutches as long as they can walk with their own legs. Crutches, in that sense, is only about authoring convenience. And, of course, it is a

Re: pre-HTML5 and the BOM

2012-07-18 Thread Leif Halvard Silli
Martin, Martin J. Dürst, Wed, 18 Jul 2012 10:05:40 +0900: On 2012/07/18 4:35, Leif Halvard Silli wrote: But is the Windows Notepad really to blame? Pretty much so. There may have been other products from Microsoft that also did it, but with respect to forcing browsers and XML parsers to

Re: pre-HTML5 and the BOM

2012-07-18 Thread Leif Halvard Silli
Martin J. Dürst, Wed, 18 Jul 2012 17:20:31 +0900: On 2012/07/18 16:35, Leif Halvard Silli wrote: Martin J. Dürst, Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:00:42 +0900: The best reason is simply that nobody should be using crutches as long as they can walk with their own legs. Crutches, in that sense, is only

Re: pre-HTML5 and the BOM

2012-07-18 Thread Martin J. Dürst
Hello Leif, I think that more and more, we are on the wrong mailing list. Regards, Martin. On 2012/07/18 18:47, Leif Halvard Silli wrote: Martin J. Dürst, Wed, 18 Jul 2012 17:20:31 +0900: On 2012/07/18 16:35, Leif Halvard Silli wrote: Martin J. Dürst, Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:00:42 +0900:

Re: pre-HTML5 and the BOM

2012-07-18 Thread Steven Atreju
Except that the internet is almost unusable without cookies and scripting, lynx(1) works very well, too, if the ncursesw library is linked against (and the terminal font supports Unicode characters). Funny that it writes garbage for |htmlbodypä.ü.ö./p/body/html but uses UTF-8 by default for

Fwd: Re: UTF-8 BOM (Re: Charset declaration in HTML)

2012-07-18 Thread Steven Atreju
Original Message Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 13:45:59 +0200 From: Steven Atreju snatr...@googlemail.com To: Doug Ewell d...@ewellic.org Subject: Re: UTF-8 BOM (Re: Charset declaration in HTML) Doug Ewell wrote: |For those who haven't yet had enough of this debate yet, here's a link

Re: pre-HTML5 and the BOM

2012-07-18 Thread Leif Halvard Silli
Steven Atreju, Wed, 18 Jul 2012 13:40:30 +0200: Except that the internet is almost unusable without cookies and scripting, lynx(1) works very well, too, if the ncursesw library is linked against (and the terminal font supports Unicode characters). Funny that it writes garbage for

RE: Fwd: Re: UTF-8 BOM (Re: Charset declaration in HTML)

2012-07-18 Thread Doug Ewell
Steven Atreju snatreju at googlemail dot com wrote: Funny that a program that cannot handle files larger than 0x7FFF bytes (laste time i've used it, 95B) has such a large impact. Notepad hasn't had this limitation since Windows Me. That was many, many years ago. -- Doug Ewell | Thornton,

Re: pre-HTML5 and the BOM

2012-07-18 Thread John W Kennedy
On Jul 18, 2012, at 4:21 AM, Leif Halvard Silli wrote: On my OS X 10.7 computer, then TextEdit does sniff UTF-8 (without the BOM). It does indeed have a sniffing feature, though it also appears to use the com.apple.TextEncoding extended attribute, when available (and which it, itself, will

Re: Fwd: Re: UTF-8 BOM (Re: Charset declaration in HTML)

2012-07-18 Thread Philippe Verdy
And those early versions of Notepad for 16/32-bit Windows were not even Unicode compliant (the support for Unicode was minimalist, in fact Unicode was only partly supported on top of the old ANSI/OEM APIs; without support for the filesystem, and lots of quirks at the kernel lelevel caused by