Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Adam Martin
Our contract that is signed by the client informs them of what versions we program for. We also ask what browser the vlient is using - i.e 5 is very very old and we never support it. On Thu, 08 May 2008 15:46:54 +1000, chris | chrisbuttery.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, I'm

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Jason Ray
As a web designer, you should test your website in both current and older browser versions (within reason!) - and get your friends to look at it on their systems as well. This will help you see if there are colour inconsistencies as well as coding ones. Unless you are designing for an intranet and

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread 8bits Media
Hi Chris, In some cases customers are locked into to using a particular browser because of the Standard Operating Environment within their company. If this isn't the case, you should try and convince your customer to upgrade to a newer browser. Other than that, if you have access to a

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Paul Birnstihl
Hi everyone, My first post also... Have a look at http://browsershots.org/ It's not perfect as it generates only static pics but there are a lot of browsers covered... chris | chrisbuttery.com wrote: Hi All, I'm relatively new to this group this is my first post. So here goes. My

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Rahul Gonsalves
On 08-May-08, at 11:16 AM, chris | chrisbuttery.com wrote: Do you have older browsers handy to test them with? Yes, and now you can too [1]! Multiple IEs allows you to run copies of various versions of IE, going all the way back to IE3. I have noticed that conditional comments do _not_

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Fuji kusaka
Hi Chris The best thing to do is to download Multiple Ie and install it on your machine. Quite small actually but really good to test. http://tredosoft.com/Multiple_IE Fuji On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 9:46 AM, chris | chrisbuttery.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, I'm relatively new to

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Michael Persson
Dear Chris, The only way is to develop the website for the most use browsers, IE6, and also respect the new softwares like FF and Safari browsers. IE5 dont support a lot of CSS at all and its not wort trying to fic the problem. You are not god but tell the client to get a deascent browser in

Re: [WSG] [OT] Full flash websites

2008-05-08 Thread Mark Harris
Michael Persson wrote: I find it bad to have to rebuild my computer to have the opportunity to have a deascent set of standard browsers. Does my clients have the same setup?? Ummm, aren't you building sites for your client's customers to use? It's the internet you have to match browsers

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Ben Buchanan
My question to you guys is how do you develop test your websites to ensure they are interpreted correctly by older more popular browsers ? Do you have older browsers handy to test them with? Personally I wouldn't support IE5 for a full design, it's just too old - for many reasons they should

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread chris | chrisbuttery.com
Hi All, Thanks so much for all the feedback. This is fantastic. I really appreciate it. Thanks again Chris Ben Buchanan wrote: My question to you guys is how do you develop test your websites to ensure they are interpreted correctly by older more popular browsers ? Do you have older

Re: [WSG] The Problem of adjacent links

2008-05-08 Thread Ian Chamberlain
I tend to use a good old unordered list for such things Bob. - Original Message - From: Designer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2008 10:03 AM Subject: [WSG] The Problem of adjacent links I have run into a problem with having two adjacent links

[WSG] The Problem of adjacent links

2008-05-08 Thread Designer
I have run into a problem with having two adjacent links at the top of a page. The WAI validator complains: 10.5 Until user agents (including assistive technologies) render adjacent links distinctly, include non-link, printable characters (surrounded by spaces) between adjacent links.

Re: [WSG] The Problem of adjacent links

2008-05-08 Thread Matthew Pennell
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 10:03 AM, Designer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 10.5 Until user agents (including assistive technologies) render adjacent links distinctly, include non-link, printable characters (surrounded by spaces) between adjacent links. [Priority 3] What is the current thinking on

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Léo Siqueira
Hello Chris, also u cant use this too: http://www.my-debugbar.com/wiki/IETester/HomePage. It IETester and this program have 4 versions of IE (5.5, 6, 7 and 8 beta 1). I use the Multiple IE too, but a have some unexpected problems when i try to view some site in IE 5.5 version !!! Enjoy !!!

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Alan Cocks
I haven't used the Tredosoft version of multiple IEs,but I did use an earlier incarnation of the same approach in 2005, withIE4, IE5.0 and 5.5 among the browsers I tested. The results were notencouraging. This approach is much more lightweight than having to first downloadmultiple virtual

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Krystian - Sunlust
IE5 ? Each time I hear about IE5 I want to laugh, honestly, IE6 is old, and most companies that actually create revenue in our modern times use Vista and IE7, who would worry/use IE5? My friend who I just finished designing website for is using IE6 but his computer is like 2-3 years old, what kind

Re: [WSG] The Problem of adjacent links

2008-05-08 Thread Mike at Green-Beast.com
Hi Bob, I have run into a problem with having two adjacent links at the top of a page. You can use a list as someone mentioned, you can also add a hidden character. Example: div id=sitelink p [a href=sitemap.htmlSite Map/a span | /span a

Re: [WSG] The Problem of adjacent links

2008-05-08 Thread Rahul Gonsalves
On 08-May-08, at 2:33 PM, Designer wrote: The WAI validator complains [...] Do you have to build a WAI-validating site? If you don't have to, I would suggest ignoring that guideline, as it doesn't necessarily enhance accessibility for visitors. I would suggest using :focus to provide

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Ted Drake
libraries, government organizations, military, and other large organizations have locked down computers that don't allow installation of fire fox. They also have purpose built web applications that only run in IE6 that are critical for their day to day jobs. That is a major reason for the

Re: [WSG] The Problem of adjacent links

2008-05-08 Thread Stuart Foulstone
From a usability/accessibility point a view. The most common separator used in such circumstances (and therefore that most expected by screen-reader users) is the vertical bar. i.e. IF you add extra characters for accessibility, use the ones they are familiar with (usability). Addition:

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Robert O'Rourke
Krystian - Sunlust wrote: IE5 ? Each time I hear about IE5 I want to laugh, honestly, IE6 is old, and most companies that actually create revenue in our modern times use Vista and IE7, who would worry/use IE5? My friend who I just finished designing website for is using IE6 but his computer is

[WSG] Images

2008-05-08 Thread Likely, James A.
I have a quick question and would like your thoughts. I am working with a team of coders that code images like: img src=/images/18-digestive-diseases-2col.jpg alt=Digestive Diseases border=0 height=150 width=388 / My question is, do you need the border, height, and width or should that be done

Re: [WSG] Images

2008-05-08 Thread toneee
Hi James, By specifying the dimensions in the markup, you're helping the browser to know what space is taken up while it is fetching the files. This means the page doesn't jog up and down as images are loaded. Cheers, Tony -Original Message- From: Likely, James A. [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: [WSG] Images

2008-05-08 Thread Mike at Green-Beast.com
Hi James, do you need the border, height, and width or should that be done in the style sheet or is it needed? Exactly what Tony said regarding width and height, they're beneficial. Lose the border attribute, though. That should be done in the style sheet as you suspected. Cheers. Mike

Re: [WSG] Older Browsers

2008-05-08 Thread Michael Horowitz
I don't think it is worth the time an effort to support old browsers like IE 5. There aren't enough users who are surfing the web using such old equipment to be worth the development time and expense. There is always another browser to test. I think we need to focus on the major ways people

Re: [WSG] The Problem of adjacent links

2008-05-08 Thread Ben Buchanan
What is the current thinking on this? How can I do this WITHOUT putting any characters in there? I don't emwant/em any characters in there! You could put the two links into a list. That would separate them into two disctinct elements without requiring punctuation. I'm not 100% sure of the

RE: [WSG] Images

2008-05-08 Thread Elizabeth Spiegel
Personally I would place the border in the CSS (although unless the image is a link, it's surely unncessary), but the height and width in the HTML. My reasoning is that these will (or at least may) vary for each image, and I can't see the benefit of giving every image its own id just so that you

Re: [WSG] :: CSS Code Formatting ::

2008-05-08 Thread David Hucklesby
On Tue, 6 May 2008 19:19:24 +0530, Amrinder wrote: I was reading this article on Smashing Magazine which shows how to increase code readability, http://www.smashingmagazine.com/2008/05/02/improving-code-readability-with-css- styleguides/ but I have listened to Andy Clarke over Lynda.com

Re: [WSG] The Problem of adjacent links

2008-05-08 Thread David Hucklesby
On Thu, 8 May 2008 15:52:38 +0100 (BST), Stuart Foulstone wrote: From a usability/accessibility point a view. The most common separator used in such circumstances (and therefore that most expected by screen-reader users) is the vertical bar. How about a border?