Elon Musk says there's a 'pretty good chance' universal basic income will become reality
http://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-universal-basic-income-2016-11 Harry On Wed, Nov 23, 2016 at 2:41 PM, Brian Ahern <ahern_br...@msn.com> wrote: > This is neo-communism. > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* a.ashfield <a.ashfi...@verizon.net> > *Sent:* Wednesday, November 23, 2016 10:36 AM > *To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com > *Subject:* Re: [Vo]:More on automation and Martin Ford > > I'm very glad to see Ontario is thinking about giving UBI a trial. Not > only is a trial needed to see what the snags are, but the concept is so > alien to the GOP that right now they would never consider it. There has to > be some way of taking care of those made unemployed by AI and robotics. I > don't know of a better way of doing that. > > On 11/22/2016 8:20 PM, H LV wrote: > > From The Belleville Intelligencer > > 'Ontario is on the precipice of a three-year pilot to test out the concept > of a guaranteed basic income and residents have been invited to share their > views on the proposal online, as well as during several public > consultations ... > > 'It’s a consultation Ruth Ingersoll, executive director for Community > Development Council of Quinte, certainly plans to get in on. > ' > “I like the model and the idea of a basic income,” said Ingersoll, adding > it would relieve many of the barriers surrounding the complex Ontario > Disability Support Program (ODSP) and social assistance programs. “I think > basic income is a more dignified and respectful way to give people money > and it would give everybody an income floor.” > > 'Ingersoll also said she believes it would eliminate chronic cycles of > poverty exacerbated by the systems currently in place — having to liquidate > assets and prove they’re poor in order to receive assistance. > > '... A basic income would also open up more opportunities to those living > below the poverty line, like getting a post-secondary education or to > supplement part-time “precarious” work. > '... It goes beyond just money in the bank for Ingersoll, it also removes > a lot of anxiety and stress in people’s lives. > > '“Our poverty isn’t just with people on social assistance and ODSP, our > poverty is with the working poor as well. People are only able to find > part-time minimum wage jobs. > > '“We have people coming in our doors working two to three jobs just to > make ends meet.” > > 'A common argument against basic income is the worry it will incentivize > people to stay unemployed and live off the government. > > 'It’s a worry Ingersoll doesn’t share, saying she feels the opposite is > more likely. > 'Part-time work, added to a basic income, would allow people currently on > social assistance to live above the poverty line.' > > Read more ... > > http://www.intelligencer.ca/2016/11/18/can-guaranteed-basic-income-work? > <http://www.intelligencer.ca/2016/11/18/can-guaranteed-basic-income-work> > Can guaranteed basic income work? > <http://www.intelligencer.ca/2016/11/18/can-guaranteed-basic-income-work> > www.intelligencer.ca > What would you do if your income was taken care of? > > > > > > On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 5:39 PM, Jed Rothwell <jedrothw...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Quoting the article: >> >> "Yet figuring out how such a system [Universal Basic Income] could be >> afforded -- and not turn a country into a nation of slackers -- is unclear." >> >> >> As usual the author misses the point. If robots do all the work why >> should anyone care whether people turn into slackers? >> >> This sort of thinking has always been common. When writing was invented >> the ancient Greeks supposedly complained that young people no longer >> memorized The Odyssey. Now that we have computers, people complain that >> grade school students no longer learn how to write in script. I suppose >> that when automobiles became common, elderly people fretted that young >> people no longer knew how to ride horses. >> >> You cannot expect people to know how to use obsolete technology they do >> not use. Someday that will include all technology. People will hardly know >> how to tie their own shoes, never mind cooking or building a house. That >> will be a problem for our grandchildren. >> >> See Arthur C. Clarke's masterpiece "Profiles of the Future," chapters 12 >> and 13. Here is the end of chapter 13, describing a world in which all >> material goods are available in unlimited quantities for free: >> >> It is certainly fortunate that the replicator, if it can ever be built at >> all, lies far in the future, at the end of many social revolutions. >> Confronted by it, our own culture would collapse speedily into sybaritic >> hedonism, followed immediately by the boredom of absolute satiety. Some >> cynics may doubt if any society of human beings could adjust itself to >> unlimited abundance and the lifting of the curse of Adam—a curse which may >> be a blessing in disguise. >> >> Yet in every age, a few men have known such freedom, and not all of them >> have been corrupted by it. Indeed, I would define a civilized man as one >> who can be happily occupied for a lifetime even if he has no need to work >> for a living. This means that the greatest problem of the future is >> civilizing the human race; but we know that already. >> >> So we may hope, therefore, that one day our age of roaring factories and >> bulging warehouses will pass away, as the spinning wheel and the home loom >> and the butter churn passed before them. And then our descendants, no >> longer cluttered up with possessions, will remember what many of us have >> forgotten—that the only things in the world that really matter are such >> imponderables as beauty and wisdom, laughter and love. >> >> >> - Jed >> >> > >
