2011/9/20 Horace Heffner <hheff...@mtaonline.net>:
> I am familiar with multivariate regression analysis.
> It is of comparatively little use when there are missing
> critical variables.
Therefore you must MEASURE the critical variables. ALL of them. This
much I require common sense.
> Your approach will tell us nothing about the army tank.
We are not interested about the tank, but only for the Prius. If we
are going to studying the tank, we must make ALL appropriate
measurements for the tank to establish proper correlation. This much I
require common sense.
> Best to simply *directly* measure the fuel consumption
> for each vehicle don't you think?
No it is not the best way, because we have big uncertainties for
measuring fuel consumption in the long run. But we can measure the
momentary fuel consumption very accurately. Up to two or three
significant digits. Therefore we must use these short tests to
establish correlation for steam pressure and total enthalpy.
This is simplest method for doing long run tests such as 24 hour / 27
kW power output, what is just too high power level for any reasonable
sub-boiling water calorimetry.
2011/9/20 Horace Heffner <hheff...@mtaonline.net>:
>
> On Sep 20, 2011, at 10:14 AM, Peter Heckert wrote:
>
>> Am 20.09.2011 19:49, schrieb Horace Heffner:
>>>
>>> I think my conclusion was good: "None of this indicates for sure whether
>>> Rossi has anything of value or not. Maybe he does. The continued failure to
>>> obtain independent high quality input and output energy measurements
>>> prevents the public from knowing.
>>
>> There is one thing that was unfortunately ignored in allmost all public
>> discussions:
>>
>> In all demonstrations, January demo, Essen Kulander demo, 3 Ny Teknik
>> demos, the electrical input energy was not enough to heat the water to 100°
>> Celsius. (I dont know aout the Krivit demo)
>> There was without doubt some considerable boiling in all experiments and
>> so the COP should be larger than 2.
>> This is mass flow calorimetry.
>> There /must/ be more energy than the /measured/ electrical energy.
>> So there is something, lets hope it is not a trick.
>>
>> Peter
>>
>
> I don't recall at all that there was not enough power to boil the water in
> the initial tests. (My memory is not very good though!)
Please review reports before you start trolling discussion with your
misconceptions, because you are so [*censored*] that you do not need
to bother to check MEASURED FACTS out.
And to refresh your memory, in Krivit's demonstration first of all, it
lasted about 15 minutes and there was not made any measurements expect
electric current was measured. But that value was also useless,
because voltage was not measured. Any any reasonable scientific
discourse we ignore data that is based on non-measured allegations in
favor of measured data. I admit that data could be better, but that is
all we have.
So, please, check at least facts before you are trolling the
discussion. It seems that you derive all your opinions from Krivit's
demonstration, but you fail to understand that that test is useless
because there was not measured any values. Also in that time Rossi had
already perfected new self-sustaining E-Cat. Perhaps this was the
reason, why he did not show Krivit a working E-Cat, because that model
was already obsolete. Rossi has only shown latest development versions
of his E-Cat's in demonstrations.
===
Peter, sorry about that above message content but you are correct. We
can calculate from the steam pressure, that K&E's E-Cat was producing
ca. 2 kW energy. As input was ca. 310 volts the COP was ca. 6.4x or
something similar (uncertainties are quite high with that
demonstration). This is what Rossi promised. Too bad that K&E failed
to measure the enthalpy more properly, e.g by doing several water trap
and steam sparging tests.
December test was most best suited. In that demonstration 1200 W
electric heater heated E-Cat only ca. 20°C (I do not remember
accurately) in 30 minutes. Later when excess heat production was
kicked in, water temperature rose into 60°C just in five minutes or
so. That means that total heating power was boosted by six fold more
than electric input. And later of course E-Cat was running
self-sustaining for 15 minutes. In December demonstration we had
clearly the best data available, and from that data we can make
calculations with at least one significant number.
But I have several times told to Horace if he bothered to look up the
report and see the data by himself, but he have refused to even look
the data available. This kind of attitude is very sad from him.
–Jouni
