aloha, rob!
you stated:
QUOTE
> Alex simply asked if this would be useful. I think the fact that
> context menus have existed for at least 15 years, and screen
> reader users haven't been asking for some way to know when
> they're present, is a sign that this feature isn't needed.
UNQUOTE
perhaps it hasn't been asked for because users don't know the
"proper" terminology -- just because a feature hasn't been
requested by its proper name doesn't mean that there isn't a
need for it... i for one, as a screen reader user WANT to know
when context menus are present, gregory.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
CYNIC, n. A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are,
not as they ought to be. Hence the custom among the Scythians of
plucking out a cynic's eyes to improve his vision.
-- Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Gregory J. Rosmaita, [email protected]
UBATS - United Blind Advocates for Talking Signs: http://ubats.org/
-------------------------------------------------------------------
---------- Original Message -----------
From: "Rob Gallo" <[email protected]>
To: "'Andres Gonzalez'" <[email protected]>, "'David Bolter'"
<[email protected]>, "'Richard Schwerdtfeger'" <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected]
Sent: Tue, 6 Apr 2010 09:25:03 -0400
Subject: Re: [Accessibility-ia2] hascontext state
> So, if those buttons show no visual indicator that there is a
> context menu, that means the application author didn't think its
> users, blind or sighted, needed to be told that one exists.
>
> And I don't think that David or Alex is "suggesting" anything.
>
> Thanks,
> RG
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected]
> [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of Andres Gonzalez Sent: Monday, April 05, 2010 7:08 PM
> To: David Bolter; Richard Schwerdtfeger Cc: accessibility-
[email protected]
> Subject: Re: [Accessibility-ia2] hascontext state
>
> I think haspopup and hascontext should be differentiated when
> possible, as Alex and David are suggesting. Even if the opened
> menus behave the same from a screen reader point of view, the
> keystrokes/mouse invocation is different. Also, there are visual
> appearance differences that can be relevant for some users. For
> instance, buttons with a Context menu give ZERO visual feedback
> until you right-click/Shift-F10. Buttons with popup menus show a
> down-arrow triable and are activated with left-click/spacebar/enter.
>
> Best regards,
>
> --Andres.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [email protected]
> > [mailto:[email protected]]
> > On Behalf Of David Bolter
> > Sent: Monday, April 05, 2010 12:04 PM
> > To: Richard Schwerdtfeger
> > Cc: [email protected]
> > Subject: Re: [Accessibility-ia2] hascontext state
> >
> > Hi Rich.
> >
> > I am referring to content as well (well, also XUL). I had thought
> > there was more distinction between (right vs left mouse button)
> > context menus and popups, but I see now they are commonly discussed
> > with the same meaning. We don't expose has popup for the default
> > browser context, no :)
> >
> > XUL has three ways of connecting popup content:
> > 1. Plain popup (uses attribute "popup") 2. Context popup (uses
> > attribute "context") 3. Tooltips
> > (https://developer.mozilla.org/en/XUL_Tutorial/Popup_Menus)
> >
> > Alexander noticed we could expose 1 and 2 separately if folks wanted
> > us to... but maybe it isn't that important. What do others think?
> >
> > cheers,
> > David
> >
> > On 05/04/10 2:24 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
> > > David,
> > >
> > > When a page author creates their own context menu is when
> > you should have
> > > haspopup. The style gide says to use the same key strokes I
> > believe. That
> > > essentially would steal the strokes from the browser.
> > >
> > > I am referring to has popup in content and not the browser
> > mapping. You
> > > don't generate haspopup for the browser context menu now do you?
> > >
> > > Rich Schwerdtfeger
> > > CTO Accessibility Software Group
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > David Bolter
> > > <david.bol...@gma
> > > il.com>
> > To
> > > Sent by:
> > [email protected]
> > > accessibility-ia2 tion.org
> > > [email protected]
> > cc
> > > nuxfoundation.org
> > >
> > Subject
> > > Re:
> > [Accessibility-ia2] hascontext
> > > 04/05/2010 11:35 state
> > > AM
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Even though we could expose haspopup when we know there is
> > a context menu
> > > I'm not as sure we should since the way to invoke it is
> > different. The user
> > > would hear has popup, click (space bar) the widget and find
> > no popup (since
> > > it is a right click, menu key, shift-f10 that normally
> > invokes the context
> > > menu).
> > >
> > > cheers,
> > > David
> > >
> > > On 05/04/10 11:57 AM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
> > >
> > > I understand the use case ... A button may have a
> > drop down menu and
> > > a
> > > context menu but would argue that having multiple
> > pop-up menus of any
> > > form
> > > on an element is confusing. It would be better to simply have
> > > haspopup. and
> > > require the author to have one menu.
> > >
> > > Rich
> > >
> > > Rich Schwerdtfeger
> > > CTO Accessibility Software Group
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "Rob Gallo"
> > >
> > > <rga...@freedomsc
> > >
> > > ientific.com>
> > > To
> > > Sent by:<[email protected]>,
> > > "'Alexander
> > > accessibility-ia2 Surkov'"
> > >
> > > [email protected]<[email protected]>
> > >
> > > nuxfoundation.org
> > > cc
> > >
> > > [email protected]
> > > tion.org,
> > "'Hans Hillen'"
> > >
> > > 04/05/2010 08:26<[email protected]>,
> > >
> > > AM "'Marco Zehe'"
> > > <[email protected]>
> > >
> > > Subject
> > > Re:
> > [Accessibility-ia2]
> > > hascontext
> > > state
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I don't think there is a difference between a
> > "context" menu and a
> > > "pop-up"
> > > menu. There are no roles distinguishing between
> > these two types of
> > > menus.
> > > And even saying they are two types of menus is
> > specious. Some menus
> > > emanate
> > > from the menu bar, and some do not. But after that,
> > they're all the
> > > same.
> > >
> > > I am one user among many, but I don't feel a need for this.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > RG
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: [email protected]
> > >
> > [?mailto:[email protected].] On
> > > Behalf Of
> > > Pete Brunet
> > > Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 2:18 PM
> > > To: Alexander Surkov
> > > Cc: [email protected];
> > Hans Hillen; Marco
> > > Zehe
> > > Subject: Re: [Accessibility-ia2] hascontext state
> > >
> > > That seems like a good idea. What do others think? -Pete
> > >
> > > Alexander Surkov wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi.
> > >
> > > It might be handy to have hascontext state to
> > indicate the
> > > accessible
> > > has associated context menu. I realize it's
> > very usual for
> > > sighted
> > > users to right mouse click everywhere checking
> > for context
> > > menu.
> > > However it sounds it's not very comfortable
> > for AT users to
> > > press
> > > shift+F10 on every element. This leads AT
> > users might not know
> > > there
> > > is context menu. If we would have hascontext
> > state then the
> > > thing must
> > > be much easier since AT could announce the context menu
> > > presence like
> > > it happens for popup menus. What do you think?
> > >
> > > Thank you.
> > > Alex.
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Accessibility-ia2 mailing list
> > [email protected]
> > https://lists.linux-foundation.org/mailman/listinfo/accessibility-ia2
> >
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------- End of Original Message -------
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