Hi Michael,

AFAIK, QT exposes accessibility information to UIA on Windows. They switched 
over from an MSAA implementation to UIA some time in the QT5 time frame: 
 So, using QT widgets in the VCL certainly would help with that, UIA 
implementation bugs in the Windows QT layer not withstanding of course. So, 
there are advantages of using QT on Windows where appropriate, but that also 
entails the danger of inheriting QT UIA bugs.

I don't know anything about GTK4, so cannot make any qualified statement.

The original advantages of IAccessible2 and GTK3 was that they were made to be 
very closely related to one another in terms of concepts. But with GTK4 and 
other frameworks becoming more prominent, this has only been in a maintained 
state for years, not really further developed, except for adding necessary 
missing pieces for new HTML widgets or markup. UIA, on the other hand, has 
turned out to be much more flexible especially with the latest enhancements 
published by Microsoft. Custom property sets etc., which allows for various 
annotations in MS Word, Excel etc. NVDA has a pull request for implementation 
of some of these newest UIA technologies into their support for MS Office here: 

So, in the long run, it is probably safest to indeed invest in switching to an 
UIA implementation. Note, however, that you may still need to do some work 
yourselves for the document specific stuff for Writer, Calc, and Impress 
specifically, since probably not everything is available in the QT libraries 
that you need.


-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Weghorn <m.wegh...@posteo.de> 
Sent: Thursday, June 9, 2022 9:01 AM
To: Marco Zehe <ma...@marcozehe.de>; accessibility@global.libreoffice.org
Cc: libreoffice...@lists.freedesktop.org; libreoff...@lists.freedesktop.org
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-accessibility] Re: ESC meeting minutes: 2022-05-26 
[IAccessible2 support in JAWS]

Hi Marco,

On 08/06/2022 13.09, Marco Zehe wrote:
> JAWS does support IAccessible2, but only if it needs to, like in Firefox, and 
> some parts of Chromium-based browsers. However, with the UI Automation 
> implementation for the latter becoming stronger, there might be a time when 
> JAWS moves to UIA for web content support in Chromium browsers. But you never 
> know what plans Vispero actually has for which version of JAWS, ZoomText, and 
> Fusion. All I notice is that, with Windows 11 having an even stronger UIA 
> implementation than 10, more things are being done through that interface 
> rather than traditional MSAA or IAccessible2 channels where possible. And as 
> has been said elsewhere, UIA properties and events are even very accessible 
> from within the JAWS scripting language, which makes this even more 
> compelling because the end user experience can be customized further. As 
> IAccessible2 is an extension of MSAA, and MSAA is largely deprecated by 
> Microsoft, it will probably never get the same treatment.

thanks a lot for that valuable input.

I have added a new sub-section for adding UIA support to the wiki page ( 
), mostly based on the above and more information from your other email about 
announcing slide content in Impress presentation mode ( 
https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/accessibility/msg01007.html ).

A probably rather crazy thought I once had was whether it would be a good idea 
to try to get rid of our custom a11y bridge on Windows in the long run after 
all, e.g. by switching to Gtk or Qt there as well (at least as one option). But 
that would certainly have to make sense not only from the a11y perspective but 
the UI as a whole and would probably be rather contentious.

(I have close to zero knowledge about Windows-specific bits in LO besides 
winaccessibility, so don't know whether there would be any value in even 
spending any time in looking into this any further at some point in time. And 
as of now, neither the gtk4 nor the qt5/qt6 VCL plugins in LO have proper a11y 
anyway, and the Gtk 4 library presumably doesn't have any a11y implementation 
for Windows yet either, even though the new a11y architecture [1] in Gtk 4 
should allow for one to be added at some


[1] https://blog.gtk.org/2020/10/21/accessibility-in-gtk-4/

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