RE: [ActiveDir] Migration Tool

[Rich Milburn]

Title: Message

I’ve never used Aelita, but after reading this I suspect that many software vendors try to land the sale and run… until you ask for some functionality when they then say “oh, well, you can sorta get that to work, but if you really want to do ____ you really need this “_____ Add-On Pack” to do it.� I have seen and heard exactly what you described from other vendors, and it used to p*** me off that they sold us millions of $$ of software then wanted to sell us more while we were still trying to make their highly configurable but doesn’t do much out of the box software work – esp because we didn’t have the money for servers and people to run it much less field services!!   Sorry but like I said I’ve been there too and feel your pain.� It amazes me though when I read here that several of you bought migration tools ($$hundreds of thousands of $$ maybe) and then you sysadmins wrote VBSCRIPTS to make up for the products’ shortcomings.� VBSCRIPTS!� Something’s not right there… I bet that’s why there are so many products – someone sees this situation, starts a software company to build the product no one else seems to be able to, then somewhere it gets derailed by the same problem all the other companies had???� (wait, what was that, did someone say outsourcing?)   Things that make you go hmmm   From: deji Agba [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2003 2:13 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Migration Tool   This is one classic reason why a vendor should try as much as possible to go beyond the first step of "closing the sale". I swore off this vendor a long time ago, and I have never looked back since. The technical difficulties we encountered with their products are just too numerous to recount here. I know products do not always live up to their promises, but I had expected that this vendor would at least commit to supporting the shortcomings of its product with some degree of interest and dedication. When a company makes impressive sales presentation, then come back after hooking the customer to: 1.Promise that "that feature will be in the next 2 release", or 2.Argue that "we did not say it would do that", or 3.Say that the only Engineer that knows about the feature is in training for the next 2 weeks while the customer is putting out fires in the middle of a project, or 4.Tell the customer "if you have an in-house programmer/developer, they can write a tool to make THAT feature work", or 5.Blame their Sales People for misunderstanding the ability of their products, or 6.A combination of any of the above then, I say that vendor is not worthy of being recommended. My impression of this particular vendor is that, as soon as they close the sale, they don't care about you anymore and they don't care about what you think of their product, because -in their opinion - you've already bought it and you are not going to buy it again anytime soon, at least not for the same project. So, like a predator, their attention is shifted to the next prey.   Sorry for the rant, but my blood still boils anytime I hear anyone mention this vendor's product.   Sincerely, D�j� Ak�m�l�f�, MCSE MCSA MCP+I www.akomolafe.com www.iyaburo.com Do you now realize that Today is the Tomorrow you were worried about Yesterday?  -anon   From: Byron Fackenthall Sent: Fri 11/14/2003 8:57 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Migration Tool My company chose to use Aelita but we ran into a major snag.� The tool was only able to migrate about a hundred workstations at a time.� With 35,000 workstations to migrate we were not pleased.� The problem came when we tried to reboot the machines after the move to the new domain. We started with small groups but as the groups got larger the tool was unable to reboot all the machine.� We had to write our own VBScript to do the reboot.� They have professional services but they think that fixing any deficiencies in their tool should be a billable cost. I feel they should pay me for all the suggestions I have had about fixing their product.   -----Original Message----- From: Ellis, Debbie [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 10:39 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Migration Tool   Our migration is very simple, and basic.   -----Original Message----- From: Morley, Scott [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 11:06 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Migration Tool   The vendors I've dealt with (Quest/Aelita) both wanted Prof Services.....initially I felt the same way.  Unfortunately, the products are made for people to do simple migrations.  If your migration gets complicated (i.e. simple=migration within a single maintence cycle) then you need to dig into the products.  THeir prof services provides the backdoors and the undocumented features to make life easier.  In most cases, the documentation provided looks nice and clean, but is utterly deviod of any serious technical content.   I've evaluated both products and my descision was based upon the lesser of two evils....really!      Scott Morley MCSE 2000/4.0, Exchange 2000/5.5, MCT, CCNA, CNE, CNI Senior Systems Engineer/Architect Global Messaging Services, Starwood Technology Center Starwood Hotels and Resorts, Worldwide   Phone: 781-348-7120   Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival. - W. Edwards Deming -----Original Message----- From: Myrick, Todd (NIH/CIT) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 10:41 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Migration Tool We have used Bindview, I am surprised to hear Bindview only wants to sell professional services... Bindview has a tools division, and the Professional Services Division.  Chip Dibias is on reader on the site and works for Bindview.  He might be someone you should talk to maybe clear this up...   Aelita is pretty good.  They can do NT4 to AD, AD to AD, and Exchange 5.5 to Exchange 2K, pretty well.  They like to sell tools, but also offer professional services.   My recommendation is to hire the professionals to come in and manage it like a project.  That way you build from the Vendors experience, and also put a serious dollar figure on the migration to get people to move their asses, instead of BWM about breaking stuff.   Todd -----Original Message----- From: Ellis, Debbie [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 6:27 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [ActiveDir] Migration Tool My� company has decided not to use ADMT.� We are in the market for a migration tool.� We checked with Bindview and were told they do not sell their products without also selling "Professional Services" . We are not interested in Professional Services.� Can any of you recommend a� good migration tool.� We will also be migrating Exchange 5.5 to Exchange 2003 later on. </   This electronic message transmission contains information from the Company that may be proprietary, confidential and/or privileged. 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