Hello all,

This is the first time I've jumped in on a conversation, but David Bangs has made me quite cross. Well done Sarah for your stand. With regard to the statement that there is far more vandalism on private land 'kids, dogs, litter, and travellers notwithstanding...' is silly because this is precisely the problem with public land. I am interested that David thinks that old meadow is a valuable habitat because this form of grassland was created by farmers 'vandalising' the original habitat which might have been ancient forest, heathland, or shrub cover in the far distant past. Large tracts of old meadow were lost because the government forced farmers to plough it up during the second world war, and the rest of the vandalism was largely due to the pressure of successive agricultural policies, which are really not the farmer's fault. I could go on by pointing out that hedgerows are hardly a natural feature and largely the result of the enclosures, but we'd be here all day. Farmers and landowners are stewards of the land under our current sociopolitical system and that may not be to David's liking but it is what we have to work with and realistically isn't going to change in the near future. Accepting that isn't 'meek' it is pragmatic. There really isn't any benefit in conservationists standing on one side of an imaginary fence and throwing stones. That kind of behaviour impedes progress and prevents cooperation. I personally abhor all kinds of shootin', huntin' and fishin', and will speak out against those who undertake these activities, but I'm quite content to wander the many miles of public right of way across our green and pleasant land, and do not agree with a general right to roam. I also agree with Sarah that this subject is too big and not really suitable for this forum.

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