I see what you mean and you may have noticed that I inserted phrases about constructive perception which refer to those mediations we have that manipulate what we sense.
But I need to say that for me there are no painterly innovations. Whatever can be done with paint, I'm aware of. I guess that's just the awareness one acquires after 50-60 years of intensee involvement with painting. I couldn't say that about other art media, say, in music, or architecture, where I could still be easily surprised. WC ________________________________ From: imago Asthetik <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Friday, April 3, 2009 3:48:30 PM Subject: Re: Judging the late Titian Mr Conger writes, "I agree that the impact of an artwork is immediate, which is almost the same as saying that a work of beauty is instantly felt. So in general I would agree with Miller that we don't need to know anything secondary to the artwork to feel its effect on us, our perception, assuming that perception is a constructed response to sensory events." I suppose that one of the things I would like to claim is that 'immediacy' = 'unrecognized mediation.' Reading a newspaper seems immediate, but there are a number of mediations, some physiological, some conceptual. I do not see how gazing at a painting would be any different. In fact, I would venture to say that painterly innovations transform the way we see by contesting various ways of structuring and conceiving of pictoral space, plane, colour, etc. Is that not one of Goodman's central arguments concerning 'realism'? In any case, nothing is truly 'immediate' and there is usually something ideological about claims to immediacy On Fri, Apr 3, 2009 at 5:22 PM, William Conger <[email protected]>wrote: > Well, I agree that the impact of an artwork is immediate, which is almost > the same as saying that a work of beauty is instantly felt. So in general I > would agree with Miller that we don't need to know anything secondary to the > artwork to feel its effect on us, our perception, assuming that perception > is a constructed response to sensory events. Where I do disagree with > Miller has to do with judging that perception in some public way, that is, > in a way that another can share, not in feeling necessarily, but in > reasonable terms. Think that judging does not require the experience of > beauty as the immediate emotional impact of a great artwork but is likely > enhanced by it. The personal experience of beauty cannot be shared except > through some analytic way and that is only "about" the experience and not a > replication of it. > WC > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Chris Miller <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Friday, April 3, 2009 9:26:21 AM > Subject: Re: Judging the late Titian > > Mr Asthetik asks: >Could you explain, Mr Miller, why artworks _should_ be > immediately intelligible? > > > Ideas of 'work' and of 'beauty' are indeed theoretical contrivances -- but > beautiful things can be made and enjoyably experienced without them. > (just > as birds can fly without a knowledge of aerodynamics). > > My own ideas of 'work' and 'beauty' are rather vaporous as theories go, > since > nothing is theoretically excluded. > > BTW -- although I do claim that "no other evidence is required to judge a > painting other than what is presented by the painting itself" --- I am > not > asserting that "everyone should everyone be able to immediately understand > a > work, be able to immediately feel its beauty" > > I would like to substitute the word ' eventually' for 'immediately' in the > above sentence -- although our lives are too short to understand and feel > the > beauty of more than a limited range of things. > > William and I disagree concerning what that project requires -- but I'll > have > to respond to that on another day. > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Click to find deals on color printers and inks. > > http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2231/fc/BLSrjnxQXxywG1LZG9NPk6rSbVwSFm > wdEIaS97lXGqsQnYMjuo36IdA0OdC/<http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2231/fc/BLSrjnxQXxywG1LZG9NPk6rSbVwSFm%0AwdEIaS97lXGqsQnYMjuo36IdA0OdC/>
