Sorry william,
But that particular composition, to me ,feels contrived even if I
like it.
I think If he were alive today, he would agree that he struggled with
it, in it's creation. He was only a human not a God. A unique kind a
man that we don't have enough of. I'm a lowly a
On Apr 3, 2009, at 5:16 PM, William Conger wrote:
Clonker? What an unbelievable comment from an artist about a truly
great genius. None of us, no one living, for sure, can say
anything about any Titian so arrogantly summative as "clunker".
I can't let it go without crying out in anguish!
With words like clunker aimed at any Titian, I die a little and
and imagine myself among barbarians.
Some artists, some artworks, are truly beyond our -anyone's--
ridicule. Certainly Titian is one of them. If you think his work
is deficient then look to yourself for the deficiency.
I'm about as arrogant and ego-driven and haughty as any real artist
but in the face of artists like Titian, I examine his work to the
depths I can reach. Otherwise I hope for more insight. Never
would I dare to deride his achievements. It's a grand and vain
ambition to even try to match the least of his abilities.
See Delacroix's Journals for enlightening comments on the great
masters. If that's not enough, read Aurlius. Then Montaigne.
Then Cervantes. Then Van Gogh. Then even Mark Twain. Then weep
for your foolishness and beg the spirits of those giants to forgive
you lest they abandon you in the studio to fumbling darkness and
morbid silence.
WC
________________________________
From: armando baeza <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Cc: armando baeza <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, April 3, 2009 5:10:35 PM
Subject: Re: Judging the late Titian correction
Chris,
For me, seeing Dian and Actaeon by Titan ,for the first time, I also
come
away with the feeling that it's a 'clonker' regarless of who
painted it.
Compositionally , it is complicated an contrived, though done by a
master.
Every artist no matter how great has it's clonkers. to me, this is
one.
Picasso also had clonkers, but how can you beat these guys for
uniqueness ?
I happen to love this clonker.
On Apr 2, 2009, at 7:57 AM, Chris Miller wrote:
Before launching an attack on Titian's late work -- I thought I'd
take another
look on the internet -- and realized that it was only a few pieces
that I
can't stand -- especially those two that were recently in the news:
"Diana and
Actaeon" along with "Diana and Callisto" -- as shown here:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/7584902.stm
Do I really need to explain how jumbled these are? They should be
cut up to
protect the good areas from the bad.
(and I also can't stand the two statues in the background of his
last,
probably unfinished, painting, "Pieta")
Regarding the rest of William's assertions -- I do not agree that
"one who is
deeply informed about that artist and the literature examining him/
her" is
necessarily a better judge of aesthetic quality than anyone else --
although,
I would also not say that "most ordinary judgment is equal to the
most
informed"
We just have a different idea as to what qualifies as "most
informed".
I've been getting into the culture of Hindustani music a bit,
lately, and in
one memoir, the author wrote of an old man coming up to her and
her teacher
(a famous singer) and recalling a concert he had heard 30 years
earlier, and
then making a thoughtful, and very useful comment. He clearly was
knowledgeable about the art, but he was nothing like a professional
scholar.
Could a non-professional scholar make a good judgment about some
new findings
in microbiology or astrophysics? I don't know - perhaps - but it
seems less
likely, because a good judgment in those fields requires
familiarity with a
large body of evidence and theory -- while the only evidence
required to judge
a painting is presented by
the painting itself, and theory should be irrelevant except as a
way to
explain a judgment that's already been made.
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