Here's a thought about though, and I hate security through obscurity, but it's worth pointing out. If there is a flaw in whatever software. If it's hosted in one place, it's easy to exploit and get everything. If it's hosted in 1000 places, you might get a few customers but there's no way you'll find all of them.
I agree, there's no sense in pushing someone to cloud vs local or whatever. It's funny how computers were all cloud, then all had to be local, and now everything has to be cloud, and back and forth. Ultimately it comes down to many other things than simply where the stuff is installed. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Wed, Oct 18, 2017 at 11:03 AM, Simon Westlake <[email protected]> wrote: > Experian is an interesting point. They were hacked because of a flaw in > Apache Struts. So, no matter where it's hosted, the flaw exists and can be > exploited. If you host it locally, you can't patch the software any > differently, you're reliant on the vendor. So the only difference is, do > you have better security in place than somebody else? Maybe. My experience > in dealing with people in general has been that they do not. > > I am not really trying to convince anyone of anything, it is not a right > and wrong answer. You want things locally, there are solutions. But I think > a lot of these examples aren't really that valid in most cases. > > If you can backup your data the same, then it makes no difference from a > backup perspective. > If you can't keep using the software without a licensing server being > available, then it makes no difference, unless your intention is to try to > reverse engineer the software and remove the licensing requirement. > If you are not implementing stronger security than the company who would > otherwise be hosting it for you, then you are worse off than you would be. > > If you want it locally because you are going to secure the hell out of it, > back it up better than the vendor, and you can keep using it if they go out > of business, then it's a good decision for you. > > I am really not pushing people to use cloud hosted stuff if they don't > want to though. Anyone's desire to host locally is perfectly valid. Sonar > is just the totally wrong product to look at if that's what you want. If > you need to hammer in a nail, there's a hammer store down the street, don't > come buy one of my wrenches and then yell at me because it sucks for > hitting nails. > > On 10/18/2017 9:53 AM, Josh Luthman wrote: > > Is no one going to bring up Experian and the cloud hosting all of your > data? That's a concern. > > If the "one" cloud hosting server has problems, your entire billing and > operational system goes down. > > Maybe it's simply the piece of mind that everything I have is within arms > reach. > > Like I said before, it all comes down to what people are actually buying. > No one needs a Ferrari when a Toyota well outlasts them in every objective > manner and yet people are buying them. > > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 <%28937%29%20552-2340> > Direct: 937-552-2343 <%28937%29%20552-2343> > 1100 Wayne St > <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+%0D+Suite+1337+%0D+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g> > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > On Wed, Oct 18, 2017 at 10:43 AM, James Howard <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Am I missing something here? What difference does it make if the >> software is cloud hosted or locally hosted if the license model is >> subscription either way? Mike might have been able to keep running it if >> he had a local copy but he wouldn’t have owned the license to do it legally. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* Af [mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Matt Hoppes >> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 18, 2017 9:13 AM >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Sonar >> >> >> >> That's my point Josh. Wisp mon was cloudy only, so when the acquisition >> occurred Mike has no choice but to go to sonar. With a local he hosted >> application he could choose to run the old Wispmon software until he >> decides he wants to upgrade to something. >> >> >> On Oct 18, 2017, at 09:22, Mike Hammett <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> IIRC, version 3 you could have some of their services (not billing) >> on-prem. Version 4 had an on-prem ability, due to the very reasons I >> stated... a VM on your host is no different than a VM on my host from an >> OS\application perspective. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Mike Hammett >> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> >> [image: http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png] >> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png] >> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png] >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png] <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> >> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> >> [image: http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png] >> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png] >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png] >> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> >> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> >> [image: http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png] >> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png] >> >> >> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From: *"Josh Luthman" <[email protected]> >> *To: *[email protected] >> *Sent: *Wednesday, October 18, 2017 8:20:17 AM >> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Sonar >> >> Wispmon was cloud only wasn't it? >> >> Josh Luthman >> Office: 937-552-2340 <%28937%29%20552-2340> >> Direct: 937-552-2343 <%28937%29%20552-2343> >> 1100 Wayne St >> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g> >> Suite 1337 >> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g> >> Troy, OH 45373 >> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g> >> >> >> >> On Oct 18, 2017 9:16 AM, "Josh Reynolds" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> He always has a choice. >> >> >> >> On Oct 18, 2017 7:14 AM, "Matt Hoppes" <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> He didn't have a choice. His cloud-based billing provider went out of >> business and sold to sonar. So he doesn't even really have the option of >> running old software, he's being forced to upgrade. >> >> >> On Oct 18, 2017, at 07:55, Josh Reynolds <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Please don't become a Sonar customer just to demonize them because you >> don't like their service model. >> >> >> >> Seriously. That'd be a super shitty thing to do. >> >> >> >> On Oct 18, 2017 6:52 AM, "Mike Hammett" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> I will be using it shortly as Sonar bought WISPMon. >> >> All of the major billing\OSS platforms with modern features are also >> cloud-based, so there's not really anywhere else to go. >> >> That's fine for you that it works that way, but many WISPs are increasing >> their use of on-premises virtualization. What about your monitoring, DNS, >> RADIUS, syslog, Unimus, mail, etc., etc. servers? >> >> >> >> Yes, my reasons do outweigh arbitrary reasons to keep it in a cloud >> environment. >> >> Actually, I've been fairly quiet on this particular issue and will be >> increasing my advocacy efforts in this regard to all billing\OSS platforms. >> As I said, it's the SFP port of the billing\OSS world. >> >> >> ----- >> Mike Hammett >> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> >> [image: http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png] >> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png] >> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png] >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png] <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> >> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> >> [image: http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png] >> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png] >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png] >> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> >> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> >> [image: http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png] >> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[image: >> http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png] >> >> >> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From: *"Darin Steffl" <[email protected]> >> *To: *[email protected] >> *Sent: *Tuesday, October 17, 2017 10:08:47 PM >> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Sonar >> >> I'm in agreement with Simon that it's much faster and reliable to host in >> the cloud than a server on site. It would cost me many more hours, hand >> holding, and worry if I had to host this server in my network. If I went on >> vacation and something happened, I'd be stressed. >> >> >> >> With sonar living in the cloud, there's less to worry about as it's >> hosted in a much more reliable datacenter than I could afford to build. >> It's also managed by sonar's team so if there's an issue, they take care of >> it. Stress free for me. >> >> >> >> I see why you might want to host it in house but those reasons do NOT >> outweigh all the benefits of letting sonar host it in the cloud for you and >> take care of the problems. >> >> >> >> Mike, if you don't like Simon's decision to leave it in the cloud, shut >> up and move on. There's no reason for you and Matt Hoppes to keep beating a >> dead horse and sound like a broken record. Use something else you're happy >> with and let the rest of us grow our business and make more $ while you two >> complain about a product you don't even use. Jeez ha >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Oct 17, 2017 8:31 PM, "Seth Mattinen" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> On 10/17/17 6:14 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: >> >> Expect repeated harassment until a good reason is presented or you >> capitulate. >> >> It's the SFP of the billing\OSS world. >> >> >> >> I always welcome my competitors to have external dependencies. When they >> try to hand wave their problems away as vendor or cloud problems it helps >> me gain new customers. >> >> ~Seth >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> *Total Control Panel* >> >> Login <https://asp.reflexion.net/login?domain=litewire.net> >> >> To: [email protected] >> <https://asp.reflexion.net/address-properties?aID=242260993&domain=litewire.net> >> >> From: 0100015f2fd4ae67-3368a041-7922-4df4-ad66-9902cceb04c4-000000 >> @amazonses.com >> >> Remove >> <https://asp.reflexion.net/FooterAction?ver=3&un-wl-sender-domain=1&hID=23984420883&domain=litewire.net> >> amazonses.com from my allow list >> >> *You received this message because the domain amazonses.com >> <http://amazonses.com> is on your allow list.* >> >> >> > > > -- > Simon Westlake > Email: [email protected] > Phone: (702) 447-1247 US / (780) 900-1180 CA > --------------------------- > Sonar Software Inc > The future of ISP billing and OSShttps://sonar.software > >
