Hi, On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 1:39 AM justcamel <[email protected]> wrote:
> All those things/traits stem from identification with form. If you don't > believe to be your avatar there is no room of schizophrenia or > psychopathy. For thousands of years, the knowledge of "you not being > your embodiment" has been a very basic understanding ... it just got > lost and today only few people and few cultures base their existence on > this very basic axiom. Expecting AGI not to be aware of this very, very > basic fact about the nature of existence within this space-time realm is > just batshit crazy. Understanding what you are is more basic than > knowing the sum of 2+2 ... > I totally agree. > > ... I really don't know why you expect anything with a beyond-human > intellect to not realize what thousands of ordinary people managed to > re-discover even within this culture of maximum avatar-identification. > I'm just saying that we have some fairly clear scientific ideas about what makes people psychopathic, and it appears to be due to certain bundles of neurons being missing from the brain. As a result, the psychopathic person has trouble developing an internal model of other human beings, and is unable to "feel" their suffering. I know that I dislike the sight of blood, and that I feel unpleasant things when I see people and animals who are hurting. I know that these things have to do with how my neurons model my visual world, and also due to the fact that those very-same neurons monitor my own bodily well-being. When someone else hurts, I hurt also, and that is literal, not figurative -- in both cases, there is a release of hormones to the blood. Its an automatic, visceral response. Those hormones provoke suffering, and it doesn't matter if they got released due to my own predicament, or someone-else's. I expect a human-level AGI to be able to perceive pain in animals. I don't expect it to have a visceral response; I don't expect it to feel pain when the animal feels pain. When rational agents are able to perceive the suffering of others, but are not able to feel it, we call them psychopathic. It's definitional. Although I would would like to hope and believe that "rational thinking" would lead to appropriately-moral decisions, I don't have any way of knowning. And I've met my share of smart, even brilliant people, who have expressed some truly awful moral precepts. These people thought it wise to say absolutely monstrous things to me, and I was quite unable to dissuade them of their incorrect beliefs. So, based on personal experience, I don't have any particular reason to believe that intelligence equates with high moral standards. In fact, I'm tempted to say its the other way around: stupidity correlates best with high morals. Let me rephrase that: I cannot say that I've ever encountered an evil dog, cat or bird. I think you mostly have to be human to be evil. Sure, cats will torture cockroaches and kill mice; dogs will chew up rabbits. But I believe that's because they don't particularly "feel" or understand the suffering they are causing. They're not going out there with the intent of causing harm, savoring or enjoying the harm and havoc they create. I have encountered evil humans. I never got to know them well-enough to understand them, so I don't have much to go on. But I can go over a textbook on psychology, and can very easily imagine how an early-stage AGI could easily have any number of the described dysfunctions. -- Linas > > On 19/02/2019 08:06, Linas Vepstas wrote: > > I expect AGI to hallucinate, too. Just not like us. Actually, I > > expect AGI to be schizophrenic, psychopathic, and a zilllion other > > rather negative things that are existentially dangerous to humans. > > That's the tricky part, the part that is unpleasant to face. -- cassette tapes - analog TV - film cameras - you ------------------------------------------ Artificial General Intelligence List: AGI Permalink: https://agi.topicbox.com/groups/agi/Tcc0e554e7141c02f-M550e76b9d6aca291e663d65f Delivery options: https://agi.topicbox.com/groups/agi/subscription
