I don’t believe robots are going to watch vids as we do.  Understanding the 
syntax of human level vision is every bit as complicated as  - and utterly 
interrelated  with - understanding human language. Any idea that any machine is 
going to do either in other than an extremely long time is fantasy through and 
through – and involves an extreme failure to understand the nature of both. 
(I’ve no idea for example where Stephen Reed has got in the last years – but I 
can safely predict “nowhere AGI-wise”)

The importance for AGI of recognizing that image schemas structure all action 
is that they have PRACTICAL VALUE – they *can* be introduced and used to 
control simple actions on simple objects by simple robots in simple 
environments – which is where practical, realistic AGI will begin – e.g. 
industrial and domestic robots.

How can fluid outlines be introduced into current computer/robotic systems?  By 
 instructing robots to “manoeuver” – to “do something ALONG THESE LINES” – 
rather than to do something along a specific line – iow to explore the range of 
lines of movements of the robot’s  hands and other limbs in a given situation – 
explore, for example, the range of their grips and handling, or the range of 
their possible treads and steps.

Image schemas serve as loose GUIDELINES FOR ACTION- and from guiding simple 
actions they can go on to guide extremely complex courses of action.

A simple arrow can serve as an instruction to reach out for an object – a very 
simple journey. . It can and does also serve as an instruction to go from 
London to New York – a representation of a very complex journey.



From: Jim Bromer 
Sent: Monday, July 23, 2012 10:51 PM
To: AGI 
Subject: Re: [agi] Image schemas control all forms of action [Lakoff replies]

But, one of the things that you (Mike) haven't yet understood is that deriving 
usable information for an AGI program from video is just as difficult as 
deriving it from text or mathematics or a IO system that "rewards" a program, 
and so on.  If effective intelligence was as simple as watching a movie and 
associating some text or a phrase with an action that was recognized in the 
video then AGI would already be a done deal.  The problem is figuring out a way 
to get a computer to do complicated things like that reliably.  

There are some data objects in most IO media that are easy to discern.  Some of 
them (not all of them) can sometimes (not all the time) be used to reliably 
indicate that a 'conceptualizable' action is taking place (or a 
'conceptualizable' object is in a scene) but those moments of clarity are not 
dense enough to build a solid foundation for higher AGI.
Jim Bromer


On Mon, Jul 23, 2012 at 5:17 PM, Mike Tintner <[email protected]> wrote:



  From: George Lakoff 
  Sent: Monday, July 23, 2012 10:11 PM
  To: Mike Tintner 
  Subject: Re: [Cogling-L] The scope of image schemas

  Narayanan's X-schemas (or process schemas) characterize all events and 
actions and actually control physical actions. So you're right about that. We 
are now working on entity schemas, but we're not there yet. 

  George


  On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 at 11:34 AM, Mike Tintner <[email protected]> 
wrote:

    Lakoff:The idea behind image metaphors is simple. Images are structured by 
image
    schemas. A given image has multiple image schemas linked via neural binding
    to form a composite image schema ? or more than one. Metaphors map one
    image to another by mapping the source image schemas to the identical image
    schemas in the target

    George,

    Your exposition was v. useful. Can you/should you not extend the scope of 
image schemas? They structure presumably under

    *Images* : both

    *Verbal Images* &
    *Graphic/Photographic/Sensory Images*.

    and not just word images but :

    *Words/Language/Concepts" - period; *all words* are structured by image 
schemas, no?

    And from that one can one go on to argue - no? -  that they structure

    *Moves/Movement* - period - that, for example, our reaching for a cup is 
structured by a schema.

    After all, language is used principally to structure actions: "Hand me that 
cup" - "Go to the other room". It makes sense that image schemas should 
structure not just verbally-mediated action, but all action, however mediated. 
The same mirror neurons that respond to (image-schema-structured) verbal 
accounts of action, also respond when just watching direct sensory images of 
agents executing those actions.

    Concepts/schemas arguably structure all the actions of living creatures.

    Comments?

    P.S. Personally, I think it's helpful to think of image schemas as "[loose] 
outlines" - esp. in connection with actions. Comments?


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