On Fri, 03 Feb 2006 11:27:51 -0500, Harry Vennik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Op vrijdag 3 februari 2006 16:23, schreef Vivia Nikolaidou:
> But I think we'll not need many options. Just one: Show Personal
> Message. How they appear should depend on the skin only.

That's another idea (and then I can hack the skin :D) Disadvantage: skins
will have to be redone :(

The only thing mandatory would be adding it to the default skin. Other skins
will have it the same way by until someone changes it.


no, what if the default skin has it the way you don't want it to? how will you change that ? what if the other skin you chose has it different and you want the other behavior but still want that skin's pixmaps? no.. as I said, no skin options!

> For the default skin I'd prefer to have the PSM shown below the nick, in
> a somewhat smaller font, and in a lighter color (probably the grey of
> the CL border would do well).

Well, M$N shows it next to the nick, not below it... There tends to be a
huge disagreement on this one... but yeah, smaller font, lighter color,
and not grey :D (Maybe status color, just a bit grey-ish?) I'd add - not
bold either (sorry Youness) :)

I don't mind the exact color.
And indeed, bold isn't good for PSM I think. If using bold at all, then I'd
vote for having bold nick and non-bold PSM :-P


NO VOTE FOR THIS, it should stay consistent with the official client.. what if you have the nick bold instead, users will ask why the psm shows before.. we'll get "hey, amsn inverted psm and nick, it's a bug".. don't think about yourself, think about the users.. + most of the time, you say "it would be nice", but once it's done, I'm sure you'll say "arghh.. no, it's ugly, I'll revert to how it was before", then we introduced poor users questioning themself what the hell is happening + added options for nothing + lost time coding/discussing the subject!


> Also, the psm should have word-wrap, so you can always read the whole
> psm.

No, otherwise your CL will become huge. To read it all, look at the
tooltip or make your CL larger! I mean, we don't even have word-wrap on
nicknames, we truncate them instead... imagine now the default behavior:
nicks truncated and PSMs with word-wrap, wouldn't that be kind of
ridiculous?
Maybe I just don't like the nick truncating either... ;-) I just like to see it all at a glance, without have my CL so big that nothing else will fit on the screen at the same time. (And I don't care about it being long, just put
the mouse over the CL and use the scroll wheel no trouble....)
But I can imagine people disagreeing to this. It is just what you like. Maybe that would be a reason to vote for having all those options, but I think this
is just too unimportant for all that bloat. And having it clean is more
important to me than having it look exactly the way I'd prefer. And if I
really don't like something, I can always make my personal skin, isn't it?


no, not too much optins.. nick truncation is also something I don't like that much, but that's just the way it is if you don't want to maximize your window! anyways, I agree on one thing with you now : it's too unimportant for all the bloat! if you want it a specific way, you could code it and keep it local (that's what we always suggested to many users who wanted a certain behavior/look that we didn't feel it would fit it with our product/customers...)


(Wow, this makes a great idea drop into my mind! What about having a tool for making skins? Not difficult to make I think, and it will enable just anyone to customize amsn completely, just by selecting options, colors and pixmaps!)


I proposed that idea a long long time ago.. it was never done... if you search for it and by luck find it, then you'll probably see some feature list, and ideas on it...


And also, I never see PSM on the tooltip... Running 0.95 now, wanted to check
current cvs, but it seems cvs is still not working, so I can't checkout.


it's there.. on second line, not bold or anything.. should be fixed, but anyways, it's there.. in cvs anyways!

Unless we make this a third option for PSMs... :D I am still willing to
code this... Or make a PSM-customization plugin? Or better not let plugins
mess with the spaghetti-CL-code?
I don't think such a plugin is a good idea. We'll just have to choose what way
we'll have in the default skin.


the way it is now!!! the way M$N does it.. that's the whole idea behind amsn.. to mimic msn... so I did it the exact same way as M$ (apart from the truncation part) so it should stay as it is, this whole discussion is useless.. the whole thread started on global nicks.. but as I said, you should use it for "$psm - $nick" or "$nick ($psm)" or whatever.. not to play with newlines and make it perfect that way.. you customize the nick, not the whole application's look and feel with it... we just need to make the $psm italic/bold when found in the global/custom nicks...

KaKaRoTo


Vivia

> Op vrijdag 3 februari 2006 14:24, schreef Vivia Nikolaidou:
> > BAD, BAD idea to add a $nick\n$psm to the global nickname!
> >
> > First: the \n appears even if there is no psm set.
> >
> > Second: the state appears on the new line.
> >
> > Third: imagine opening a chatwindow with that contact.....
> >
> > So I prefer to completely drop the idea, sorry Youness. Karel talked
> > about a check if the \n is the last character, but chatwindows will
> > still look UGLY.
> >
> > I'm thinking about adding maybe a "PSM Options" section to the
> > Appearance tab, with 1) "Global / custom nicknames override PSM" 2)
> > "Show PSM on a new line" and maybe 1-2 more. I can code it just by
> > myself so don't worry, but I really see no other solution (Yes, I
> > prefer PSMs on a new line too!)
> >
> > Vivia
> >
> > On Tue, 31 Jan 2006, Youness Alaoui wrote:
> > > On Tue, 31 Jan 2006 02:17:16 -0500, Lz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > i'd go for the add and option thing.
> > > >
> > > > I have the "show emails instead of nicknames" option turned on, so
> > > > i can't
> > > > see PSM'S on CL at all. That way i could see them :P
> > >
> > > global/custom nicks already support PSMs in them.. + they support \n
> > > and \t too
> > > now.. scroll down to read my answer to Vivia...
> > >
> > > > On 1/30/06, Vivia Nikolaidou <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > First of all: GREAT WORK Youness :) looks much better! I thought
> > > > > it was
> > > > > impossible when I tried to do the same thing... :)
> > >
> > > thanks! but it was easy actually :P only it needed a little bit of
> > > code refactoring.. don't be afraid to move code around and remove/add
> > > arguments to an already existing method (example, before we were
> > > sending the 'nickname' (what to show, so nickname\npsm) to ShowUser > > > which would draw everything for a single user.. but that was stupid.. > > > I moved the code to ShowUser and removed the '$user_name" argument as > > > it's not needed! without that code refactoring, it wouldn't have been
> > > easy!
> > >
> > > > > Second:
> > > > >
> > > > > http://amsn.sourceforge.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=423&highlight=
> > > > >
> > > > > ------------
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, most people want the PSM next to the nickname and not below
> > > > > it, but
> > > > > this person has a point... I had to face this problem too locally
> > > > > because
> > > > > I shrink the aMSN window... So I can see two solutions:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1) we add an option :D :D :D :D
> > >
> > > no..
> > >
> > > > > 2) we make the custom/global nicks able to contain newlines AND
> > > > > show the
> > > > > psms in italics... will need more work of course, and most people
> > > > > won't
> > > > > think of doing it this way - personally, forget about it, I
> > > > > cannot do this
> > > > >
> > > > > :)
> > >
> > > the idea was to automatically show the PSM in italic, can't show it > > > differently.. + newlines are possible already.. just copy a newline
> > > from somewhere and paste it in that entry :P but I think we should
> > > add a 'newline inserter' like in the nickname/psm/FC4 entries.. if
> > > it's not there already
> > >
> > > > > And, of course, 3) ignore this request :)
> > >
> > > we will ignore it.. at least, I will.. you can not ignore it by
> > > simply answering that guy that we are ignoring it :P (in short,
> > > answer him with my reasons here, and ignore the request itself)..
> > > the reason is simple.. we're an M$N clone, so we reproduce M$
> > > behavior... I just tested, opened M$ 7.5, set a PSM, and ohh, how
> > > horrible, yes, it gets cropped out! well, that's NORMAL! if you want
> > > to see it, you maximize your window.. I know in linux, you usually
> > > don't maximize windows, and in windows, you can't work without
> > > maximimizing them.. but hey, that's just how it is! if we ever accept > > > this request, we'd better also accept queries like : "ohh, I made my > > > CL 2 pixels wide because I want all my apps in the same desktop, but > > > I can't read anyone's nicknames, it's all cropped out, can you make
> > > it so that it's wrapped instead? and I can see one character per
> > > line.. I don't care if I scroll down for hours to read one nick..."
> > >
> > > anyways, my proposition for this request is this :
> > > make PSM bold/italic in the tooltip (code refactoring anyone ?:P) AND > > > it seems that now, the nick is trimmed, the status is not, the PSM is > > > not.. it should be, not AND psm trimmed, status not... but I'll have
> > > to check how M$ does it..
> > >
> > > KKRT
> > >
> > > > > What does everyone think?
> > > > >
> > > > > Viv
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Lz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]).
> > > > http://elezeta.bounceme.net
> > >
> > > --
> > > KaKaRoTo
> > >
> > >
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> > ---
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> > "Where is the life that we have lost in living?
> >  Where is the wisdom that we have lost in knowledge?
> >  Where is the knowledge that we have lost in information?"
> >
> > OEO;
> >
> >
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---

"Where is the life that we have lost in living?
 Where is the wisdom that we have lost in knowledge?
 Where is the knowledge that we have lost in information?"

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